OT- Kasongo To Oregon

[djct1999]

You must have seen this, you have been all over the forum adding ignorant comments after all...Kasongo stated that Uconn was leading yesterday.

right........we were leading up until 20 minutes ago, then he decided to go to oregon...........ignorance is bliss, you seem to be the happy one. i see the truth for what it is. this recruiting period has been troubling, not promising. keep telling yourself lubin was our top choice and all these other kids weren't.

 

[djct1999]

You have no idea what is naive or real or fantasy. You make a judgment without real information and act like you know something. This whole thing is about dealing with the fact that our coach is doing the best he can and when every one of these kids want to play right away, they will make decisions that are based on more than which is the better program. The AAU influences have shown to be a big wild card in the whole process as well. Rakim may well turn out to be much better than Kasongo. Maybe both will be very good. Whatever the reasons, this might be a good time to stand by our team, our new players and our coach.

yes, and lets give them trophies at the end of the year for trying. get real. this is high major basketball. 3 national championships and 4 final four basketball. you dont get applause for trying. you get applause for landing recruits and winning titles. do schools like kentucky, kansas, duke, or even syracuse get behind their program for missing recruits to lesser programs?

 

[upstater]

right........we were leading up until 20 minutes ago, then he decided to go to oregon...........ignorance is bliss, you seem to be the happy one. i see the truth for what it is. this recruiting period has been troubling, not promising. keep telling yourself lubin was our top choice and all these other kids weren't.

Wait a second. You're here saying Kasongo is better than Lubin? Based on what? Both of these kids did not have top offers. It was UConn for one, and Oregon and UConn for the other. Both are not ranked very high, and both have had scouts say similar things about them.

 

[CAHUSKY]

I think it's just the tarnish, in general. We look like a program in decline. Sure, we won the title in 2011, but that was with a different coach, and we haven't been outside of the NCAA first round since.

Amazing we haven't got out of the first round in the ten opportunities since. Oh wait, we've only been to the tourney once since. Not really a viable sample size to predict our demise.

 

[ctchamps]

I feel like awfully dissapointing would be if we only landed Lubin and that's it. I don't get the logic of not counting hamilton. but I guess this is recruiting , every time we miss on someone there'll be doubt places on Ollie's abilities.

People were saying JC should have retired during the 2010 season!

 

[ConnHuskBask]

In what world is Oregon a "decent" program? Compared to who? Rutgers?

3 NCAAT Tourney Appearances in the past decade.
4 Sweet 16s in program history.
1 Regular season title in over half a century.

Who's their best NBA Alum, Luke Ridnour?

There's probably 50 programs in America where I'd say, oh well, I guess that makes sense.

This is just downright puzzling.

 

[djct1999]

Wait a second. You're here saying Kasongo is better than Lubin? Based on what? Both of these kids did not have top offers. It was UConn for one, and Oregon and UConn for the other. Both are not ranked very high, and both have had scouts say similar things about them.

I am saying we signed Lubin after the staff was less than confident on its chances with Kasongo. If you can't land a kid like that on his official, your chances are slim. The verdict is still out on who is the better player. But what is well documented is in the past 6 weeks, we have lost out on "targets" to NC State, VCU, Oregon, and even Providence. The scouts don't have to say much on that. The truth hurts. To pretend it doesn't is a joke.

 

[upstater]

I think it would be foolish to panic now. But I also think it would be foolish to ignore some of the patterns we're starting to see.

A few years ago, UConn had to settle for a bunch of Plan Bs after losing out to the UNCs and Kentuckys of the world. Losing out to middling programs like Oregon and VCU and NC State is worrisome and makes you question this staff's ability to close. If UConn had been recruiting a guy like Larrier from the beginning, and Kansas or Kentucky swooped in at the last minute, you can bet you a* he would have jumped at those offers. Ollie and co., on the other hand, couldn't convince a kid from the Bronx to follow in Kemba's footsteps. I'm not trying to make a huge deal about one recruit, and I'm definitely not trying to ignore the context (who * wouldn't wanna play for this guy?) ... but, as Fishy mentioned, it's part of a concerning trend.

I still think next year's recruiting class will give us a much better picture of the direction the program is heading in. UConn should be ranked consistently high all season (the fact they won't be preseason top 10 is a freakin' joke, but they'll be there soon enough), Ollie will have more time to prove himself and separate himself from Calhoun's shadow, and the stain of being relegated to the AAC will wear off at least a little.

If, after a nice tournament run, UConn is still losing out to crap programs like NC State and Providence, well, then it's time to panic. But I don't think we should be pretending it's all rainbows and daisies, either.

Uhm, wait a second.

UConn lost recruits in 2010 to Tennessee and Baylor, which is the same thing as losing them to NC State and Oregon. Actually, it's worse, since Oregon is selling Nike/facilities, and NC State is at least a 2 time national champion in the top conference. And, oh yeah, UConn lost a recruit to NC State as well that year. They lost kids to Memphis and Missouri as well.

The kid they did land, Jeremy Lamb, was the #43 ranked shooting guard on ESPN, behind many kids who were ranked below the top 200 on other services.

Lamb, Giffey, Olander all contributed.

We're not going to catch lightning in a bottle again and have that much help in one unheralded class, but it's not like this is greatly different than the 2010-2011 class.

 

[Fishy]

Have you ever heard of 5* recruits Daniel Hamilton or Rodney Purvis?

Hamilton - no question, a pure win.

We had to lose Purvis once before getting him off the bounce - if he's coming out of high school this year, we don't get him.

 

[upstater]

I am saying we signed Lubin after the staff was less than confident on its chances with Kasongo. If you can't land a kid like that on his official, your chances are slim. The verdict is still out on who is the better player. But what is well documented is in the past 6 weeks, we have lost out on "targets" to NC State, VCU, Oregon, and even Providence. The scouts don't have to say much on that. The truth hurts. To pretend it doesn't is a joke.

You're getting way too caught up in what Kasongo's posse is interested in. As of this morning, the kid wanted UConn but mentioned he had conflicts. There is nothing you can do in such a situation.

 

[mauconnfan]

yes, and lets give them trophies at the end of the year for trying. get real. this is high major basketball. 3 national championships and 4 final four basketball. you dont get applause for trying. you get applause for landing recruits and winning titles. do schools like kentucky, kansas, duke, or even syracuse get behind their program for missing recruits to lesser programs?

Why even bother? Your pattern is noting more than that of a whiny bit*h!

 

[aceboon]

djct1999 has to be freescooter

 

[RMoore1999]

Hamilton - no question, a pure win.

We had to lose Purvis once before getting him off the bounce - if he's coming out of high school this year, we don't get him.

Maybe, maybe not.

I'm as frustrated as the next guy that the recruits promoted here and elsewhere have elected to go elsewhere.

Purvis has 3 years of eligibility left. I'd like to see the list of years under JC where we recruited 2 guys with 7 years of eligibility that were more highly touted than these 2.

KO's been the coach for less than a year now (thanks to warde lacking the stones to give KO the contract day 1).

Is it too much to ask that we maintain some patience and analyze a full recruiting cycle or two before we push the panic button?

 

[UConNick]

Actually just messaged Kasongo in Facebook lol. Not expecting a reply, but I was honestly interested in what Oregon did that we didn't , so that's exactly what I asked him. Because clearly, something doesn't quite add up in his recruitment.

 

[Fishy]

KO's been the coach for less than a year now (thanks to warde lacking the stones to give KO the contract day 1).

Is it too much to ask that we maintain some patience and analyze a full recruiting cycle or two before we push the panic button?

I'd say that we push it ASAP.

We're kind of in no-man's land right now - football is lost and men's hoop really needs to carry the U (again). We can't exist permanently in the AAC and if we fall off in men's hoop, we may find ourselves permanently relegated like Houston was back in the day.

Patience is too expensive for us these days.

We have the right coach, but we might not have the right pieces around him - given everything he's got on his plate and given the learning curve that he's on, he really needs a dead-nuts recruiter on the staff. Way, way too many swings and misses right now.

 

[UConn990411]

Tom Moore, anyone?

(Yeah, I know it will never happen, but he would be the perfect assistant for this team.)

 

[Dogbreath2U]

yes, and lets give them trophies at the end of the year for trying. get real. this is high major basketball. 3 national championships and 4 final four basketball. you dont get applause for trying. you get applause for landing recruits and winning titles. do schools like kentucky, kansas, duke, or even syracuse get behind their program for missing recruits to lesser programs?

What is a big time fan? Someone who acts offended when there are some disappointments? Or perhaps someone who knows that there are no guarantees and stays loyal to the team/program that has brought so much joy and fun to this state? What are you going to do if we don't sign another recruit? Seriously, what will you do? Bitch and whine? Demand Ollie be fired? What? Perhaps Calhoun should have been fired prior to 1999....he just could not win the big one, just wasn't bigtime. Maybe Ollie will have to build up his own rep over a longer stretch of time. I can understand fans being disappointed and even frustrated, but offended? Outraged? No, can't see that. That's bs entitlement. Stay ten toes in even when the going gets tough and give KO a real chance to guide the program through this rough period of conference realignment and transition from a HOF coach. That is reasonable and what is needed.

 

[RMoore1999]

I'd say that we push it ASAP.

We're kind of in no-man's land right now - football is lost and men's hoop really needs to carry the U (again). We can't exist permanently in the AAC and if we fall off in men's hoop, we may find ourselves permanently relegated like Houston was back in the day.

Patience is too expensive for us these days.

We have the right coach, but we might not have the right pieces around him - given everything he's got on his plate and given the learning curve that he's on, he really needs a dead-nuts recruiter on the staff. Way, way too many swings and misses right now.

"We can't exist permanently in the AAC" -- TOTALLY AGREE.

Relative at least to where resided the last 30 years, the AAC is the definition of a PIGSHOW.

And men's hoops remains our calling card (as it would have even had the Pasqualoni train wreck not occurred).

I just don't buy that the failure of a bunch of offers to materialize into commitments over a 4-month period justifies the Chicken Little coop to dominate the Yard...

 

[Hoophound]

Who have been UConn's great recruiters (H. Dickerman)?

I would say Tom Moore, Howie, Hobbs and Clyde Vaughn. Vaughn was a major loss to the program.

 

[Fishy]

I would say Tom Moore, Howie, Hobbs and Clyde Vaughn. Vaughn was a major loss to the program.

Someone call Vaughn and tell him that we're totally cool with the hooker thing now.

 

[champs99and04]

I'd say that we push it ASAP.

We're kind of in no-man's land right now - football is lost and men's hoop really needs to carry the U (again). We can't exist permanently in the AAC and if we fall off in men's hoop, we may find ourselves permanently relegated like Houston was back in the day.

Patience is too expensive for us these days.

We have the right coach, but we might not have the right pieces around him - given everything he's got on his plate and given the learning curve that he's on, he really needs a dead-nuts recruiter on the staff. Way, way too many swings and misses right now.

What about the New Big East? Could UConn exist permanently there? I realize it's not exactly a reasonable alternative, but I'm just wondering what you think the sustainability there is.

 

[BUHusky]

There is no doubt that the AAC is not helping UConn with recruiting, but it's not like the PAC-12 is the ACC, B1G, or even old Big East when it comes to the quality of basketball. The PAC-12 can barely get 2 teams to qualify for the NCAA tournament of late. That's a fact. Even after Louisville leaves, the AAC will still have a better overall basketball product than the PAC-12. Anybody who knows anything about college basketball basketball would take UConn, Memphis, Cincy, and Temple over the top 4 in the PAC-12 any day of the week. And if SMU and Houston can gain some traction in basketball, even better. The PAC-12 is a football conference and that's never going to change.

And good luck with exposure in the PAC-12 vs. the AAC. East coast bias aside, while the AAC may be the bottom dweller in ESPN's portfolio, it's still freaking ESPN. Casual sports fans still flip to ESPN, ESPN2, ESPNU, ESPNews when channel surfing. These same people couldn't tell you what FS1 stands for if you asked them, let alone on what channel FS1 is. The new Big East might drive some college basketball ratings for FS1 (though probably not), but there is no way PAC-12 basketball is going to move the needle at that network.

While the PAC-12 kills the AAC in terms of TV contract $$$, long term stability, and all those despressing numbers that school presidents and ADs care about (that's a topic for the conference realignment board), it's basketball product is still consistently one of the worst in the BCS. No recruit who cares about their future in basketball should ever go to a PAC-12 school not named UCLA or Arizona.

Good luck to Ray. Not sure what he's looking for, but I hope he finds it...

 

[upstater]

What about the New Big East? Could UConn exist permanently there? I realize it's not exactly a reasonable alternative, but I'm just wondering what you think the sustainability there is.

It's a question of money. The money difference between the BE and AAC is not wide especially when you take into account UConn's tier 3 rights and football which adds to licensing. So, moneywise, there's little difference at all.

 

[Fishy]

What about the New Big East? Could UConn exist permanently there? I realize it's not exactly a reasonable alternative, but I'm just wondering what you think the sustainability there is.

Short term, for hoops, far better - that league has a little bit of gravitas that the AAC doesn't. They can sell the name, the history and the Garden.

The sole recruiting pitch this conference has is, "we play UConn!" and we can't freaking use that.

Long term, though, the new Big East is remaindered when the big fish leave the small. In ten or twenty years, they'll be playing for smaller stakes. We're not with the big fish yet, but at least we have a shot.

 

[upstater]

There is no doubt that the AAC is not helping UConn with recruiting, but it's not like the PAC-12 is the ACC, B1G, or even old Big East when it comes to the quality of basketball. The PAC-12 can barely get 2 teams to qualify for the NCAA tournament of late. That's a fact. Even after Louisville leaves, the AAC will still have a better overall basketball product than the PAC-12. Anybody who knows anything about college basketball basketball would take UConn, Memphis, Cincy, and Temple over the top 4 in the PAC-12 any day of the week. And if SMU and Houston can gain some traction in basketball, even better. The PAC-12 is a football conference and that's never going to change.

And good luck with exposure in the PAC-12 vs. the AAC. East coast bias aside, while the AAC may be the bottom dweller in ESPN's portfolio, it's still freaking ESPN. Casual sports fans still flip to ESPN, ESPN2, ESPNU, ESPNews when channel surfing. These same people couldn't tell you what FS1 stands for if you asked them, let alone on what channel FS1 is. The new Big East might drive some college basketball ratings for FS1 (though probably not), but there is no way PAC-12 basketball is going to move the needle at that network.

While the PAC-12 kills the AAC in terms of TV contract $, long term stability, and all those despressing numbers that school presidents and ADs care about (that's a topic for the conference realignment board), it's basketball product is still consistently one of the worst in the BCS. No recruit who cares about their future in basketball should ever go to a PAC-12 school not named UCLA or Arizona.

Good luck to Ray. Not sure what he's looking for, but I hope he finds it...

Pac12 on FS1 with games starting at 10 pm is a very hard sell for TV viewers. And you're right about the B12. It has Arizona, UCLA and maybe Stanford and Oregon. Washington and Cal. are middling at best. Washington St., Oregon St., USC, Arizona St., Utah and Colorado are awful. That's 6 bad teams. 2 middling. 2 that are good. 2 that are excellent. Probably better than the AAC but not that much. And low exposure.

 

[champs99and04]

It's a question of money. The money difference between the BE and AAC is not wide especially when you take into account UConn's tier 3 rights and football which adds to licensing. So, moneywise, there's little difference at all.

Recruiting wise, I would have to figure it's more appealing to play Georgetown, Butler, Villanova, and St. Johns than Temple, Houston, Cincy, and Memphis. Granted, the New Big East isn't exactly the BIG or ACC, but it's at the very least the A-10 on steroids and at best the third best conference in basketball projecting forward over the next couple years. Next year, the disparity between the AAC and Big East won't be wide, but it will be interesting to see what happens in the future, given, as you said, there is little difference in terms of money. I suppose it depends almost entirely whether these schools can keep their current coaches that elevated them to their current status. They aren't exactly off to a great start in that department with Stevens bolting before coaching a game in the league, but then again any coach, at any program would be tempted by the opportunity of coaching the Celtics. It will be interesting to keep an eye on the trajectory of the two leagues over the next few years.

 

[SirHypeAlot]

if we don't get D Rob ill officially be panicking. these misses are definitely becoming a trend.

I'm still stung by Abu. Legit all in on him and we lost him to NC STATE!

 

[Pudge]

Please stop whining.

We will be fine. Once Rakim committed, I think RayK was difficult: anyone else? And Abu? I think Rakim has the ability to be as good (but Abu was local). We will have a good class. Not our best. But as much as we can say we need a Star Recruiter; I think a really stellar year under Kevin Ollie this season places in another stratosphere. Produce.

What do we need? I agree that a Cassell & Robinson (given our other components) are highly prioritized. And a 2015 PG.

 

[ColoradoUCFan]

If we have a strong year on the court it will take care of recruiting. Plain and simple.

 

[DogMania]

First off, I'm disappointed that Kasongo didn't choose us over Oregon, but unlike most here, I'm not panicking and still assess our program as I have been the last few months. I've been saying all along that our conference is killing us and the staff has to overcome that with every recruit. They were able to do so with 5* Hamilton and with the less heralded Lubin, just a few days ago. KO can no longer tell recruits that they'll be playing one elite conference program after another, nor can he tell them they'll get to play multiple games at MSG in NYC.

We'll probably never know for sure why we lost Ray to the Ducks, but I have my suspicions. I'll get to those in a moment.

Every recruiting battle has its unique twists and turns. I think the conference situation was a major impact with Abu. The Old Big East UConn would have landed him.

I think the OBE UConn might have been enough to sway Larrier (Bronx NY) our way, but his relationship with Smart and VCU's recent success was more than enough to trump the AAC UConn. KO can no longer tell northeast recruits that they'll get to play whole slew of games close to home (No PC, SJU, SHU, Nova or SU) and no MSG. Hum...are we the only AAC team in the northeast?

Getting back to what I suspect were the driving forces behind Kasongo's decision I think they are as follows:

1. I have a strong feeling those advising him were pro-Oregon and they wore him down. The following three gave them fodder for their pro-O campaign.

2. Those influences probably pointed to a crowded front court (Brimah, Facey, Nolan) that go even more crowded with the verbal from a similar player in Lubin and possibly the addition of the 3/4 combo Robinson who has been high on UConn. Even though we might not land him, I'm sure the pro-Oregon influences pointed him out even though Robinson is likely to play more 3 than 4, not to mention that there's no guarantee we'll land him in the first place.

3. Oregon's coach told him had a good shot at starting as a freshman there, something that I doubt that KO would have told him. PT is earned at UConn and I wonder if landing Lubin gave the Oregon influences extra fuel for the fire. I can imagine someone telling him, "You are our top priority for the 4. UConn just picked up a similar player in Lubin. If you go there, you'll be just another body while at Oregon, you're our guy." Remember there were rumors that Ray felt pressure. I wonder if KO told him that Lubin was coming in for a visit the following weekend, not to mention other bigs (Swift & Colson) after that and that he'd take whoever said yes first. Once Lubin accepted, KO probably told him that they would still take both, providing more negative fodder for the other side.

4. AAC issue may have been a factor in that if we were the OBE-UConn, an elite program in an elite conference, might have been able to overcome 1, 2 & 3. Like it or not, the 3 biggest selling points that won us our share of recruiting battles are no longer valid. Not only are we no longer part of what was considered the best high major hoops conference, we're not even in a major conference. We no longer have the head coach that was credited for leading us to 3 NCs and putting a whole slew of players in the NBA. As much as we think we're elite and have an elite coach in KO, there is a mountain of negative recruiting casting a perception that UConn is no longer an elite program. Never mind a clean slate for UConn and KO, there's a growing perception that UConn's stock is going down, evident by all the recruiting battles we seem to be losing. Granted we can point to Purvis and Hamilton, that our stock is still high, but other than landing the unheralded Lubin (who I think is going to be very good player) the staff has been swinging and missing for the last few months.

That fact that we were leading till the very end with Kasongo, tells me that 1,2 & 3 were likely the bigger issues, and if we had not landed Lubin, maybe he would have chosen us over the Ducks. It's too bad. I had hopes that we could put one scary big in there after another and in some cases play both at the same time. I had visions of being like that MD team with Baxter and Wilcox that abused us back-in-the-day. I think we were all greedy. We didn't want just one Troutman, but two, and why not?!?!

I still don't think it's time to panic. There are some real obstacles to overcome and just as they were able to overcome them with Purvis, Hamilton and Lubin, they'll be able to do the same with 2 or 3 more recruits. I would not be shocked if we end up landing our PG in Cassell at the end of this week, land Swift or Colson for that 2nd Big in this class and maybe in the end, KO will land Robinson who both he and his family seem to really like KO. As much as we all would have loved to see both Lubin and Kasongo eat a ton of minutes in our 2014 frontcourt and beyond, all it means is that Lubin and the returning bigs will just get more minutes and we'll be just fine.

Maybe I'll be proven wrong, but I think UConn is going to have a big time 2013-14 season that will take this team to at least the S-16 if not E-8 and beyond. The 2015 recruits will take notice and KO will pull in some big timers making us all forget about all this crap. Keep in mind that the Squid and Pasner have been able to recruit their share of highly ranked recruits at Memphis, a program that has not come close to the success that UConn has had, there is no reason why KO can't begin to win more of these recruiting battles even though the AAC issue will have to be something to overcome by continued success and the strong Husky brand.