Coach K

[temery]

this place is full of pftcommenters my goodness the takes are on fire and flagrant

It's April Fools Day. We just wanted to see how many would buy it.

 

[intlzncster]

Not a good coach, eh? Well, K did draw up this doozy of an inbounds play. I'm sure you remember it.

That was uncalled for. A low blow. I don't even know if you get to win the argument for posting that.

 

[intlzncster]

It's April Fools Day. We just wanted to see how many would buy it.

If only I could buy into that, sadly...

 

[MexicoHusky]

I dont understand how they won so many games. Zion, Reddish and Barret were good. Everyone else was very average.

 

[MexicoHusky]

Also, the original post is a bit silly. He's an old dude. Coaches get tired too. He's done plenty in his careeer.

 

[RayIsTheGOAT]

I dont understand how they won so many games. Zion, Reddish and Barret were good. Everyone else was very average.

Typically having 3 top 10 NBA picks and a great coach takes you pretty far.

 

[DogMania]

Yeah and when LeBron was a rookie at 19 in the NBA he averaged 20.9 points, 5.5 rebounds, 5.9 assists and 1.6 steals per game. Thats against NBA talent. Zion can hardly do that against college competition. Is Zion a great athlete? Absolutely. Is he a great basketball player? Lmao no.

The media hyped this guy as a generational basketball player. Generational basketball players don't get blocked multiple times and have 5 turnovers in the game their team loses 2 "rounds" short of the finals.

Yeah and when LeBron was a rookie at 19 in the NBA he averaged 20.9 points, 5.5 rebounds, 5.9 assists and 1.6 steals per game. Thats against NBA talent. Zion can hardly do that against college competition. Is Zion a great athlete? Absolutely. Is he a great basketball player? Lmao no.

The media hyped this guy as a generational basketball player. Generational basketball players don't get blocked multiple times and have 5 turnovers in the game their team loses 2 "rounds" short of the finals.

Are you kidding me!?!? You obviously haven't watched many of his games. The kid can do it all at a very high level. In one of the earlier tournament games he threw this unbelievable one handed bounce pass from the top of the key that hit around mid Court, bounced right into the hands of a streaking teammate for Breakaway dunk. He takes guys off the dribble in traffic and finishes in the paint at an unbelievable rate. He can knock down the three ball at a solid clip for a big guy that takes very few each game. Imagine if he was taking more from outside and got some sort of rhythm? But of course, as someone pointed out, K probably wins this game if he deployed a game plan that kept Zion's ass inside the paint most of the time where he's a beast and is almost unstoppable when he gets the ball there.

As for Coach K being overrated, I kind of agree with the original post in this thread. K wins a crap load of every year, but he does it with a lot more talent than most teams have. I've always wished that someone could figure out some sort of analytical analysis using player rankings along with postseason success to see what coaches have done more with less and less with more. I think Jim Calhoun has to go down as the Coach that has done more with less when you look at his postseason success with rosters that weren't full of highly ranked recruits. He'd land one Burger AA every year or so, but still the rest of the roster with a bunch of moderately top 100 recruits ranging between 35 to a 125.

As for K's results in this year's tournament, you have to take two things into consideration that worked against him. One is Cam Reddish wasn't exactly 100%. If he was, don't you think he would have made up the two points that would have put Duke over the top against MSU?

The second is, this game should never have taken place in the elite eight. What in the world was the selection committee thinking, placing the top number two seeded team against the top number one seeded team? This game should have at least been in the final four or maybe even in the championship game. With that said, it does seem that Coach K again was outcoached when it counted most. They were fortunate to get by UCF and Virginia Tech.

I must admit, I'm conflicted as to my assessment of what he accomplished this season, since he needed to coach up freshman, granted very talented ones, into a final four caliber team in just one season. And there didn't seem to be a lot of depth on that team either, which usually has disastrous results in the NCAA tournament.

One thing I've always wondered, what a coach like Jim Calhoun could have done with the type of talent Coach K has had year after year?

Lastly, I'd be remiss to mention that Coach K went up against and lost to one of the best coaches ever when it comes to doing more with less. Coach Izzo has always been excellent at finding under ranked recruits and coaching them up to be very good players by the end of the season. He always seems to have a rough start to the season but gets his players playing their best basketball come March. Granted he does get some highly ranked players, but without looking closely at this over the years, his recruiting classes are nothing like the recruiting hall that Duke, UNC, UK and KU pull in year after year.

 

[The Viking]

It's OK to say that he's a terrific Hall of Fame coach just as it's OK to say that if your life is on the line and you had to pick one coach to win one game, he would not be the coach you pick.
I know who I'd take.

 

[BuffaloHusky]

Alabama in football and Duke (as well as Kentucky) have a similar issue... they are mediocre in playoff games they are favored in and I'm not accounting for point spread... only wins. I realize some of this is because they are so consistently great and tend to have more big games against great opponents but there is no question that Duke was out coached yesterday again when the Duke talent on the floor was significantly superior.

 

[tzznandrew]

If he even matches Doncic? Luka is having a better rookie year than Lebron had.

"Okay okay. Maybe he's not LeBron. But if he doesn't at least match Kareem's rookie year, he's not a good basketball player."

 

[SubInATub]

It's OK to say that he's a terrific Hall of Fame coach just as it's OK to say that if your life is on the line and you had to pick one coach to win one game, he would not be the coach you pick.
I know who I'd take.

View attachment 41673

3-0 when it really matters.

 

[billybud]

I could just retitle thiis thread and change the coach from "K" to Izzo...

Naismith HOF'r...one NC, eight Final Fours...

 

[jibsey]

He has built a recruiting juggernaught. Imagine if you will that we have just one of his top 3 players and what our team could have done. It’s like starting in the first inning with a 5-0 lead.

 

[gtcam]

If you are a Dookie you feel this team underperformed
But you have to look at the team and while the team is made up of McD's they are still freshmen and it's tough playing against a team of experienced, tourney tested players
Duke got very lucky the previous 2 game and should never have gone this far.
I think The Squid did a better job coaching his 1 and dones this year than K

 

[MexicoHusky]

Typically having 3 top 10 NBA picks and a great coach takes you pretty far.

True. It didn't this time. That team was not really great.

 

[Inyatkin]

What's crazy is how all the talk about the evils of the one-and-done and how it's ruining the sport have disappeared since K got better at it than Calipari. You heard this stuff incessantly when all the best players were going to Kentucky, and you don't hear a word about it now that they go to Duke

 

[Husker Husky]

I wish I could find that image of the Coach K play board where he's drawing up a play. But instead of listing the players names, he has: McDonald's All American 1 with the ball as McDonald's All American 2 runs off a screen by McDonald's All American 3 while McDonald's All American 4 sets a secondary screen etc.

 

[whosurdaddy2720]

Haven’t read the entire thread so I apologize if this has been said.

Coach K clearly is an excellent coach and possibly the GOAT considering his entire career and resume. But it’s not ludicrous to suggest that K has been vastly overrated based on his most recent work.

Just two final fours over the past 15 YEARS considering the absolute talent haul they’ve had at Duke is absolutely doing less with more! K is an all time great but in the last decade he has come up short many more times than he has gone the distance. And by short I don’t even mean Elite 8. Lehigh? Mercer?? South Carolina in the 2nd round???

It’s becoming very clear that K has lost a step. That’s hard to argue.

 

[tzznandrew]

Haven’t read the entire thread so I apologize if this has been said.

Coach K clearly is an excellent coach and possibly the GOAT considering his entire career and resume. But it’s not ludicrous to suggest that K has been vastly overrated based on his most recent work.

Just two final fours over the past 15 YEARS considering the absolute talent haul they’ve had at Duke is absolutely doing less with more! K is an all time great but in the last decade he has come up short many more times than he has gone the distance. And by short I don’t even mean Elite 8. Lehigh? Mercer?? South Carolina in the 2nd round???

It’s becoming very clear that K has lost a step. That’s hard to argue.

This is a reasonable take. That's not what the OP said, nor what led this thread down the rabbit hole.

I posted a link to PASE (performance against seed expectation): in other words, how many wins, on average, has a team with a 1 gotten historically (I think 3.3?), and how many wins does your team actually have.

It only goes back to 2000 and K is one of the worst since then. Just abominable. (Calhoun and KO are, in contrast, Top 10).

Has K lost a step? It seems like he may have. That's a different discussion, though. And in that time that he has slowed (2000-present) he still has as many titles as JC and Roy (3), more than anyone else, and 4 Final Fours. In other words, still a damn successful coach.

 

[superjohn]

I dont understand how they won so many games. Zion, Reddish and Barret were good. Everyone else was very average.

This entire thread is ridiculously absurd but any criticism of them not being that good or overrated is on K for this season. They have the most talented college player in a decade, another top 3 pick, and a top 10 pick. Those average guys are all 5 stars.

 

[tzznandrew]

This entire thread is ridiculously absurd but any criticism of them not being that good or overrated is on K for this season. They have the most talented college player in a decade, another top 3 pick, and a top 10 pick. Those average guys are all 5 stars.

There's a big gap between saying K underachieved this year and saying he sucks as a coach.

Still, again, I'd take underachieving like this (E8 loss to a team that probably should have been a 1) than some of their other underachievements (Mercer, Lehigh), or UConn's (E8 loss to an 11 seed).

 

[mauconnfan]

Coach K is a great coach. I do get some of what people are saying but it's a tough time to coach these new kids and the way they play. Problem is they get them for one year so there's no molding them you just throw them out there and hope they listen a little while using their gifts, not easy.

For me Zion is a great kid, great freshman player and unbelievably gifted athlete - incredible to say the least. Having said lots to work on. He's a turnover machine when people actually cut him off and make him make plays, hard to do mind you but will be easier at the next level. He looks Barrett in the eyes when they talk so someone is lying about how tall they are LOL. He can't shoot but he's a beast. Will be interesting to watch him in NBA - is it even better for him the way the game is played or tougher because of bigger tougher guys and athletes? I'm not calling it as I don't know but he got away with a ton this year bullying through people to finish, not sure it will be the same or not with the players or the refs in the NBA. I think you almost have to take him #1 but I'm not sure it will work out as it should.

 

[superjohn]

There's a big gap between saying K underachieved this year and saying he sucks as a coach.

Still, again, I'd take underachieving like this (E8 loss to a team that probably should have been a 1) than some of their other underachievements (Mercer, Lehigh), or UConn's (E8 loss to an 11 seed).

Obviously, this is the dumbest thread in the history of the boneyard but there is no mistaking he underachieved with this team. K went all in and had a generational talent, with 2 other top picks and a roster laden with 5 stars. They were heavy favorites to win all season and it took a miracle and favorable calls for them to get through the second round, sweet 16 turned into a coin flip, and he didn't make it to the final 4. They didn't run any offense or develop the rest of the team, everything was just a clear out for Barrett and Zion going left. The one thing that Duke fans can kill K for is always putting the ball in Barrett's hand at the end. You have the biggest freak we've ever seen and he wasn't used when it matters. Barrett got the ball at the end in almost every close game and always choked.

 

[The Funster]

After 1-1/2 pages, I couldn't read anymore. The idea that K is an average coach is way over the top. I don't like him, he has advantages that most coaches don't, and the hype surrounding him makes me vomit in my mouth but he is a great coach.

 

[CallMeBruce]

Zion is overrated as a BASKETBALL player. Unbelievable athlete, probably one of the best pure athletes in the world. Guy is s tank, soft hands and can jump through the roof.

Lacks basketball skills. Haven't really watched him until this tournament and it seemed like he got blocked about half the time he went to the hoop, shoots the 3 ball at a subpar rate. Had a lot of turnovers. Disappears on the defensive end if a highlight reel block isn't in play. Once he gets into the NBA where every player he faces is 6'6" or taller, he is going to struggle hard.

"I haven't watched this player, but my opinion about him is very smart."

Buddy, log off.