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Coach K

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Williamson’s passing is also considered pedestrian. He’s averaging 2.3 assists per game, and his decision making and distribution aren’t considered elite.

“He has three cards, and he needs to add two — shooting and quick decisions with the ball,” Gallagher said. “When NBA people overlooked Luka Doncic, they undervalued skill, passing and shot making. That’s what Zion does not have. Zion is going to have a great career, the question is whether he can add those two cards.”

His passing isn't elite but it's a lot better than most give him credit for. Part of it was Duke's mess of a roster and Barrett's dominance of the ball. Zion wasn't in a position to showcase his passing all that often. Also, to be fair, who needs to pass all that often when you shoot 69% from the floor! I think we'll see he's a far better passer once he gets to the NBA. He had some insane one-handed passes in transition, threading the needle for 30' for a layup. I think it's most important that he looks to pass, the ball doesn't stick in his hand, and he's a pretty good decision maker.
 

The Funster

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Geez, I'd rather see Zion play TE in the NFL than anything in the NBA.

I think he can develop a shot but at 285 I can't see him being a good perimeter defender and at 6'7 he's going to have trouble defending down low. I think he'll be a very good NBA player but I'd be hesitant to pick him #1.
 
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All that matters is that Coach K had a roster with 3 top 10 picks and couldnt even get them to a final four. The dude has been to 2 final fours in the past 15 years. 2 in 15! It’s hard to get to a final four, but when Duke has the most talent every year and the “GOAT” coaching, he should be getting to more than 2 final fours in 15 years. This is obviously a homer take, but if you give Jim Calhoun that talent, he is retiring with at least 7-8 rings.

We had our share of talented teams that didn't win titles or underachieved ('94-'96, '06, '12). Hell, our one experience with a one-and-done talent was a bit of a disaster.
 
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We had our share of talented teams that didn't win titles or underachieved ('94-'96, '06, '12). Hell, our one experience with a one-and-done talent was a bit of a disaster.
I wouldnt include 2012 in that list. We were coming off of a championship and had expectations of repeating. Shabazz wasn’t really Shabazz yet, and Drummond was not Anthony Davis
Let me ask you this. If you have a list of UConn and Dukes 10 most talented teams, how many of those 10 would be Duke and how many would be UConn? It would probably be 7 Duke and 3 UConn teams.
 
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I wouldnt include 2012 in that list. We were coming off of a championship and had expectations of repeating. Shabazz wasn’t really Shabazz yet, and Drummond was not Anthony Davis.

That team underachieved. We were #4 in the preseason polls and tied with Syracuse in the Big East preseason poll as the favorites to win the Big East. We finished 8-10 in conference play (tied for 9th) and only won one game in the tournament. They had chemistry issues to the extent that we'd never seen under Calhoun. In terms of an entire season, that team was by far the biggest disappointment of the Calhoun era. The other teams (90s, 2006) just came up short in the end but still had great seasons.
 
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Geez, I'd rather see Zion play TE in the NFL than anything in the NBA.

I think he can develop a shot but at 285 I can't see him being a good perimeter defender and at 6'7 he's going to have trouble defending down low. I think he'll be a very good NBA player but I'd be hesitant to pick him #1.

Out of curiosity, who are you taking ahead of him? Because this kid seems like the biggest no brainer since at least Anthony Davis.
 
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Out of curiosity, who are you taking ahead of him? Because this kid seems like the biggest no brainer since at least Anthony Davis.

The hilarity is that this is a pretty weak draft after Zion. It is no-brainer. I don't feel comfortable taking any of the other prospects at #2. Morant, Culver, and RJ all have pretty big question marks.
 
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He had recruits ranked 1,2,3 and couldn't get to the final 4. This is a massive miss for K
 
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Nobody here says that obviously, but I swear ive seen posts like that on the Syracuse board

I don't care what angry, bitter trolls say. No one serious thinks Calhoun is anything but an all-time great coach, obviously. Bringing him into that conversation (which was already ridiculous) so you can explain to this board how great he is makes the board look foolish.
 

intlzncster

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Are you kidding me!?!? You obviously haven't watched many of his games. The kid can do it all at a very high level. In one of the earlier tournament games he threw this unbelievable one handed bounce pass from the top of the key that hit around mid Court, bounced right into the hands of a streaking teammate for Breakaway dunk. He takes guys off the dribble in traffic and finishes in the paint at an unbelievable rate. He can knock down the three ball at a solid clip for a big guy that takes very few each game. Imagine if he was taking more from outside and got some sort of rhythm? But of course, as someone pointed out, K probably wins this game if he deployed a game plan that kept Zion's ass inside the paint most of the time where he's a beast and is almost unstoppable when he gets the ball there.

As for Coach K being overrated, I kind of agree with the original post in this thread. K wins a crap load of every year, but he does it with a lot more talent than most teams have. I've always wished that someone could figure out some sort of analytical analysis using player rankings along with postseason success to see what coaches have done more with less and less with more. I think Jim Calhoun has to go down as the Coach that has done more with less when you look at his postseason success with rosters that weren't full of highly ranked recruits. He'd land one Burger AA every year or so, but still the rest of the roster with a bunch of moderately top 100 recruits ranging between 35 to a 125.

As for K's results in this year's tournament, you have to take two things into consideration that worked against him. One is Cam Reddish wasn't exactly 100%. If he was, don't you think he would have made up the two points that would have put Duke over the top against MSU?

The second is, this game should never have taken place in the elite eight. What in the world was the selection committee thinking, placing the top number two seeded team against the top number one seeded team? This game should have at least been in the final four or maybe even in the championship game. With that said, it does seem that Coach K again was outcoached when it counted most. They were fortunate to get by UCF and Virginia Tech.

I must admit, I'm conflicted as to my assessment of what he accomplished this season, since he needed to coach up freshman, granted very talented ones, into a final four caliber team in just one season. And there didn't seem to be a lot of depth on that team either, which usually has disastrous results in the NCAA tournament.

One thing I've always wondered, what a coach like Jim Calhoun could have done with the type of talent Coach K has had year after year?

Lastly, I'd be remiss to mention that Coach K went up against and lost to one of the best coaches ever when it comes to doing more with less. Coach Izzo has always been excellent at finding under ranked recruits and coaching them up to be very good players by the end of the season. He always seems to have a rough start to the season but gets his players playing their best basketball come March. Granted he does get some highly ranked players, but without looking closely at this over the years, his recruiting classes are nothing like the recruiting hall that Duke, UNC, UK and KU pull in year after year.

Dog coming in hot from the clouds! Good to see a post from DogMania.
 

intlzncster

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. This is obviously a homer take, but if you give Jim Calhoun that talent, he is retiring with at least 7-8 rings.

I honestly don't know about that. I'm not sure JC would thrive with a bunch of 1 and dones. JC molded men. Put them through the crucible. Broke themdown. Made them tough as nails. But that took time. I'm not sure one year and then full turnover of the roster is conducive to his style of coaching.
 
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He is unique. He is a great prospect. He is also fat. Maybe he slims down to 265. Walk and chew gum.

Would you take Zion over say, Joel Embiid, Giannis or Anthony Davis? Those guys all have length on them, Zion is a 6-foot-7 PF.

He is going to kill 1-on-1 in the NBA. And in transition will dunk.

But, I watch a ton of NBA, his length bothers me. Wasn't he 1-of-9 against Fall? Struggled to get the shot over him. It is his motor, relentlessness that I love about him. The kid plays harder than anyone else on the floor.

Just saying there are questions about his length and his jump shot as well as his handle. He has to be a perimeter 4 in the NBA. There are no longer low post power forwards anymore.

We would expect this player to be first team all nba with the hype? Right? That's a high bar.
You intimated he isn't unique, that's why my response. He's a lot more explosive than Larry Johnson pre injury. The only comparison I can come up with is Barkely but Zion is even more athletic and explosive than Barkley and young Barkley is one of the most freakishly explosive and powerful players ever. Barkley played mean as hell, not sure Zion has that, few players do. A cross between Barkley and Blake is all I can really come up with. So much of the stuff being thrown around by posters is just ridiculous though. People are calling him unskilled, his athleticism won't stand out because there are so many great athletes in the NBA etc.

The idea he's fat is crazy, you don't know how muscle and fat work if you think Zion is fat.
 
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I'm not a Duke fan but who are you to tell them they don't?
Like I said, they think they do and at some level probably do have a lasting bond, but time and battles are what creates somet
Looks like Team USA is kicking the tires on some non-unique fat kid who can’t pass.

Zion Not Good, May Only Play For Best Basketball Team on Planet
fits the criteria, only Duke players get that form of recognition. See Laettner as the misfit on the dream team
 
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Zion in the pros will be down 25-30 pounds and he’ll be unbelievable.
 
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Zion in the pros will be down 25-30 pounds and he’ll be unbelievable.
I don't think he should. He's not fat in the least and that size is what makes him so insanely unique. He's not that tall and his wingspan isn't too long. Being bigger and more athletic than everyone is a big part of what makes him such a freak.
 
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K took four freshman pretty far...the teams that made the Final Four seem to be upper classmen driven.

I can imagine this Dule team if they were playing together in another two years as juniors....
 
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. . . but at 285 I can't see him being a good perimeter defender . . .
What does weight have to do with it?
The guy is super quick, has great vertical, and great anticipation. I think he's going to be a phenomenal perimeter defender.
If you're thinking that this guy is "bulky" or something, because of his total weight, I'd have to disagree - everybody not named "Zion" at his height and weight would be suspect. Not him. He's super quick. I think he will be a great rebounder, defender, and inside scoring threat.
20 years ago, I'd say he'd have a shot at being the MVP of the league.
We're up to what? 30 threes a game attempted, per team? That's probably moving toward 40. Which will be 45% or so of all shots taken.
He struggled with the college 3 and has a flat shot.
If he gets the NBA 3 up to close to 40%, he's going to be the best offensive player in the league, easily.
I'm very curious, and I hope he does it.
Love guys who can dominate inside and out.
 
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Michael Jordan's 3 pointer percentage hit was under 20% for his first four years...
 
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Michael Jordan's 3 pointer percentage hit was under 20% for his first four years...
Yeah, but that was a very different league, more akin to LeBron's first few years than to anything we've seen in the last 10.
 
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You intimated he isn't unique, that's why my response. He's a lot more explosive than Larry Johnson pre injury. The only comparison I can come up with is Barkely but Zion is even more athletic and explosive than Barkley and young Barkley is one of the most freakishly explosive and powerful players ever. Barkley played mean as hell, not sure Zion has that, few players do. A cross between Barkley and Blake is all I can really come up with. So much of the stuff being thrown around by posters is just ridiculous though. People are calling him unskilled, his athleticism won't stand out because there are so many great athletes in the NBA etc.

The idea he's fat is crazy, you don't know how muscle and fat work if you think Zion is fat.

I certainly now know how fat works and Zion is NOT fat. The dudes a brick wall of muscle, obvious by the fact not too many moved him at all near the basket. And very few stood up to his pounding.
 

pj

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This thread is a great insight into future posts, and tells you how quickly these people will turn on any coach if they aren't winning at a clip higher than the greatest coaches of all time. I mean, what happens if Danny Hurley takes this team from where it is now to three straight E8s and makes a Final Four, but no title? Then they get upset early the next year? They'll be calling for his head.

Some of us remember Jim Calhoun 1986-1998. 3 E8s in 1990, 1995, 1998, not one Final Four.

We supported him then, we'll support Danny now. It's about quality basketball.
 
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Some of us remember Jim Calhoun 1986-1998. 3 E8s in 1990, 1995, 1998, not one Final Four.

We supported him then, we'll support Danny now. It's about quality basketball.
Oh, I know some of us remember. But that board is not this board. Not by a longshot.
 

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