Transfer portal part 2

[Centerstream]

Once you have put in the transfer rule you can't go back. The NCAA doesn't want more lawsuits, and that would happen immediately if they tryed to go back to sitting out.

The NCAA has changed rules in the past, the "no dunking allowed" rule was reversed because it was the right thing to do for one.
What do you mean by "doesn't want more lawsuits"? Were lawsuits filed against the NCAA for the previous transfer rules?

And this discussion need not go any further because even though I offered an opinion on how to fix the issue, I believe that the NCAA is going to stick with what they got.

 

[IceColdCard]

You can add Louisville to that list as well. I mean if it works go for it!

This is what AAU coaches are talking about currently. The Portal is making life hard on high school kids.

I get it, Louisville had a rep for transfers at one point. That is an outdated narrative. If the players were that worried about being recruited over, why did three players choose to come BACK for their COVID year? One of those players gave up minutes for Engstler last year and still came back.

Remember the list that was floating around of McDonald All Americans from a couple of years ago that all transferred? Guess who didn't, Cochran and Van Lith from Louisville. Time to update the poster child for Transfer U. They are no different than any other school operating in this new reality.

 

[sweetspot]

Well, you need more than a couple years to change a narrative. NC State won the ACC in consecutive years but no one's anointing them as a blue blood.

 

[triaddukefan]

Well, you need more than a couple years to change a narrative. NC State won the ACC in consecutive years but no one's anointing them as a blue blood.

State is definitely a red blood though.

 

[maccca3232]

I am unconvinced that 1100 (and counting) players made initial mistakes, are homesick, or faced a coaching change. Most just want to play more and think they won't under their present circumstances.

Of the 1108 I have in the my spreadsheet. Once 1 May deadline passes I will make publicly available in google sheet.

• 311 (28%) are grads
• 178 (16%) didn't log a minute last year, so just looking to play.

There could be some overlap but that accounts for almost half.

From table below the trend is the better the production the less likely to hit transfer portal.

Purple = Efficiency
Green = Minutes per Game
Orange = Win Shares (per Her Hoops Stats subscription website)

 

[ThatCG1801]

Blackwell recently started following multiple Ole Miss players on Instagram. I even noticed she was following the official Ole Miss WBB Instagram account over the weekend, but seemingly unfollowed it today. Maybe she unfollowed because too many people were catching on before it was announced. On Twitter, Coach Yo indicated she landed a big time transfer as well.

This got me curious so I looked. She is following Coach Yo. She is not following Dawn. I didn't notice her following Baylor's HC, either, but I could've missed it. Your eyes start to cross scrolling thru the list after a minute.

I was kind of surprised to hear she was ever interested in South Carolina coming from Mizzou. I would hope individual players can see past ugliness between two teams but I'm sure what she heard about us long before she ever even had a thought of the portal wasn't complimentary. That tension between the two programs goes back to the days of Sophie Cunningham and there is absolutely no love lost between us and them.

 

[MSSportsGuy]

The NCAA could easily fix this but there are pros and cons for the fix. The reason why the immediate eligibility came into the discussion was because, previously, a player that transferred had to sit out a year unless they were granted a waiver by the NCAA. Waivers weren't the norm but for some schools it appeared the opposite was true.
So the easy fix is to reinstate the one year sit out with only one exception, graduates with eligibility remaining.

I agree, I never understood why any waiver was approved unless it was extreme circumstances and I mean extreme. Players who sat out were allowed to receive a scholarship, practice, take part in many team activities, and also likely receive the benefits of being on the team within the campus environment. They were not allowed to play in games and that's about it.

I'm also a little aggravated at the coaches who are seeking to grab players in the portal over working with an existing roster or incoming recruits to make them better. A coach can't or shouldn't ignore a perfectly good player in the portal but not at the expense of a player who may just need some additional coaching or development.

Many people are enjoying this year to see who leaves and who goes where. I am not, mainly because it shows how deeply flawed the system really is.

 

[oldude]

I agree, I never understood why any waiver was approved unless it was extreme circumstances and I mean extreme. Players who sat out were allowed to receive a scholarship, practice, take part in many team activities, and also likely receive the benefits of being on the team within the campus environment. They were not allowed to play in games and that's about it.

I'm also a little aggravated at the coaches who are seeking to grab players in the portal over working with an existing roster or incoming recruits to make them better. A coach can't or shouldn't ignore a perfectly good player in the portal but not at the expense of a player who may just need some additional coaching or development.

Many people are enjoying this year to see who leaves and who goes where. I am not, mainly because it shows how deeply flawed the system really is.

I have always felt that bringing in transfers over recruited players presents all kinds of issues for any program. But your post made me think about an additional consequence of the process. Coaches that rely heavily on the portal are becoming lazy.

Rather than investing 2+ years to recruit a player out of HS, and then another year or two developing that individual into a capable college basketball player, coaches can spend a couple weeks evaluating experienced college players in the portal, bring a few in, and they’re done.

No coach, not even Tara at Stanford, is immune from the ease of filling a hole in the roster by tapping into the portal. The problem with that is that many 2nd tier players never fully develop under a system that requires young players to immediately make an impact out of HS or get cast aside.

I think of McCowan at MSSt or Stokes & Chong at UConn. They all stuck around for 4 years, developed significantly as players, ultimately making it to the pros. Today, those types of kids are at risk of getting lost among the super seniors and immediately eligible transfers who relegate them to basketball purgatory.

 

[baggerbob]

I have always felt that bringing in transfers over recruited players presents all kinds of issues for any program. But your post made me think about an additional consequence of the process. Coaches that rely heavily on the portal are becoming lazy.

Rather than investing 2+ years to recruit a player out of HS, and then another year or two developing that individual into a capable college basketball player, coaches can spend a couple weeks evaluating experienced college players in the portal, bring a few in, and they’re done.

No coach, not even Tara at Stanford, is immune from the ease of filling a hole in the roster by tapping into the portal. The problem with that is that many 2nd tier players never fully develop under a system that requires young players to immediately make an impact out of HS or get cast aside.

I think of McCowan at MSSt or Stokes & Chong at UConn. They all stuck around for 4 years, developed significantly as players, ultimately making it to the pros. Today, those types of kids are at risk of getting lost among the super seniors and immediately eligible transfers who relegate them to basketball purgatory.

These AAU programs are going to have to start teaching their players basic basketball skills, or they won't get scholarships at division 1 schools.
Players that have played in college have film that coaches can watch for complete details, and not highlight film.

 

[oldude]

These AAU programs are going to have to start teaching their players basic basketball skills, or they won't get scholarships at division 1 schools.
Players that have played in college have film that coaches can watch for complete details, and not highlight film.

I wouldn’t count on AAU coaches doing very much teaching of basic basketball skills. At the AAU level it’s all about featuring top offensive players, period. Some HS coaches do a decent job. But it falls on college coaches to refine players out of HS, unless they decide it’s easier to just pluck players out of the portal.

 

[TC22]

Come to Ole Miss! We will recruit over you in the transfer portal every year!

Does Coach Yo even recruit high schoolers?

 

[dws3665]

Does Coach Yo even recruit high schoolers?

Yes, and then they transfer out 1-2 years later*.

* Unless they are Madison Scott**.

** So far.

 

[GCKSFN4L]

The biggest losers when it comes to the transfer portal are high school kids. Maybe not the top 50-100 kids but everyone else is seeing their offer list dwindle down because there's a more experienced player with no wait time to take a roster spot from them.

 

[LwrcasefaN]

If someone enters the portal, then they are also vacating a roster spot. So just entering the portal doesn't translate into fewer opportunities for hs kids. If you're entering the portal AND using year 5...that is different. I would still argue that the vast majority of players exercising year 5 aren't program changers or starters, but role players. Most hs recruits would be bench players or role players in year one at the best schools anyway.

 

[Dynastic]

Tanning destination.

No brainer : Miami > Fresno

 

[nwhoopfan]

I would still argue that the vast majority of players exercising year 5 aren't program changers or starters, but role players.

Mya Hollingshed returned to Colorado for a 5th year and just went #8 in the WNBA Draft. Ashley Joens is returning to Iowa St. for a 5th year. That took me zero seconds to think of 2 very big exceptions. I'm sure there are many, many more

edit--and Cate Reese returning to Arizona for a 5th year

 

[Dynastic]

Lol Warren and Coach Abe, a match made in heaven.

Looks and sounds like a tag team in the WWE!

 

[bballnut90]

I agree, I never understood why any waiver was approved unless it was extreme circumstances and I mean extreme. Players who sat out were allowed to receive a scholarship, practice, take part in many team activities, and also likely receive the benefits of being on the team within the campus environment. They were not allowed to play in games and that's about it.

I'm also a little aggravated at the coaches who are seeking to grab players in the portal over working with an existing roster or incoming recruits to make them better. A coach can't or shouldn't ignore a perfectly good player in the portal but not at the expense of a player who may just need some additional coaching or development.

Many people are enjoying this year to see who leaves and who goes where. I am not, mainly because it shows how deeply flawed the system really is.

I agree with the sentiment and prefer when we see kids stay 4 years and develop into great players (ex. McCowan, Henderson) but the reality in today's day and age is that coaches are getting paid big bucks to win, and winning takes precedent over developing players. Plus when coaches lose players to transfer, they need to compensate for that by taking in transfers. Raiding the portal has been a huge factor for most of the recent championship teams.

The next few years we'll have an influx of grad transfers since everyone has been gifted an extra 5th year and very few players good enough to make it in the WNBA, so we likely have 3 more years of this circus.

 

[LwrcasefaN]

Mya Hollingshed returned to Colorado for a 5th year and just went #8 in the WNBA Draft. Ashley Joens is returning to Iowa St. for a 5th year. That took me zero seconds to think of 2 very big exceptions. I'm sure there are many, many more

edit--and Cate Reese returning to Arizona for a 5th year

Out of a thousand +? Sure. But each year...how many incoming are program changers? Not a lot...so what % of incoming recruits are impacted? Nothing to match the groaning if you ask me. There are other places to consider...and if there aren't well what does that tell you?

 

[BRS24]

 

[TC22]

Mya Hollingshed returned to Colorado for a 5th year and just went #8 in the WNBA Draft. Ashley Joens is returning to Iowa St. for a 5th year. That took me zero seconds to think of 2 very big exceptions. I'm sure there are many, many more

edit--and Cate Reese returning to Arizona for a 5th year

And Victaria Saxton, SC, for a 5th year.

 

[nwhoopfan]

And Victaria Saxton, SC, for a 5th year.

And Mikesell at Ohio St. And Juhasz at UConn. I suspect if I looked at everybody's rosters, and everybody in the portal, I would come up with a very impactful list of 5th year players in both '21-'22 and '22-'23. It's definitely more than just a few.

 

[LwrcasefaN]

And Mikesell at Ohio St. And Juhasz at UConn. I suspect if I looked at everybody's rosters, and everybody in the portal, I would come up with a very impactful list of 5th year players in both '21-'22 and '22-'23. It's definitely more than just a few.

I didn't say it was a few. I said it wasn't the vast majority. If you kept searching...would it get to 100...which would be 10% of a thousand...and there's more than a thousand? The narrative seems to be that it's crushing incoming Frosh. I'm not buying it. Some yes. Most of these kids moving to other teams aren't threatening some waiting in the wings superstar. I've never even heard of most of them. Almost every team has 2ish on the move on average. Most of these folks jumping around are changing venues for more playing time and certainly not with the intention that they are some missing critical piece to elevating a program. If that were the case....they wouldn't be on the move. It's their prerogative, and it looks BUSY, but looking at the big impact...I don't see it.

 

[southie]

Where was she this past season?

 

[Dwilliams02]

Where was she this past season?

Right. This one is a bit interesting and confusing. Lol

 

[sweetspot]

Wild if true

 

[tigers4ever]

Mya Hollingshed returned to Colorado for a 5th year and just went #8 in the WNBA Draft. Ashley Joens is returning to Iowa St. for a 5th year. That took me zero seconds to think of 2 very big exceptions. I'm sure there are many, many more

edit--and Cate Reese returning to Arizona for a 5th year

Both LSU players that were drafted were 5th year seniors and both improved their draft stock by playing a 5th year.

 

[southie]

Wild if true

Well, if she's already in San Antonio, she could reunite with Joni at Texas A&M or come to Austin and join the Texas program.

 

[PoppaBear]

Aijha Blackwell is visiting Baylor this week.

 

[shiverz45]

Well, if she's already in San Antonio, she could reunite with Joni at Texas A&M or come to Austin and join the Texas program.

Wild if true

I thought she was done since she didn't play last season. She is a good point guard.