OT: Patriots

[champs99and04]

Couple of ancillary observations/opinions:

1. I hate the Patriots, but if your reason for disliking them is that they have a lot of bandwagon fans, then I don't think that's a very good reason. This type of thing happens literally every time a team begins to win a lot. Living in the Boston area like a lot of us do, you're immersed in it, so it seems worse...but it's really not. The Patriots were a big deal to a lot of people - myself included - before Brady and they will be a big deal afterwards. The people who leave games in the fourth quarter and boo the team at halftime of a tie game are s***y fans in my opinion, but there are a lot of good ones, too.

2. The spygate/deflategate stuff is pretty tough to have an educated fair/opinion on, no matter who you are. Seems to me a lot of conflicting stories/evidence. They got punished very hard for the deflategate thing, so I've pretty much dropped that. With spygate...who the hell knows.

3. Belichick is probably the greatest coach of all-time and Brady might be the best quarterback of all-time. I have no idea what type of person either of them is off the field, but with Belichick, even Patriots fans have to admit the guy is kind of a d*** a lot of the time. I don't like when guys like Popovich get lumped in with Belichick...the better comparison would be somebody like Saban where you wonder if they have the ability to feel joy. Personally, I don't dislike him for it, but I can understand how others do.

Brady...nothing but class off the field, but his on-field demeanor is sort of bratty. And, no fault of his own, but he and Peyton are emblematic of an era of football that's frustrating for defense-first guys like me. They're protected to the extent that you wonder if they're real football players.

Rooting against the Patriots is really fun. They are the perfect villains. Some of that is self-inflicted, a lot of it is a product of circumstance. Wherever you fall, I don't think everything always has to be perfectly pure or perfectly evil. The perception is that the Patriots are cheaters. And, while it's hard to have an objective opinion as a self-described Patriots hater, I like to think they bare responsibility for some of that perception. I feel the same way about UConn. A lot of it, though, is our insistence on portraying everything in black and white when it hardly ever is. Sometimes it's OK to just admit you don't know...and with the Patriots, I don't. Will that stop me from needling the Patriots fans I know in real life? No, but that's what fans do.

4. What I do (think) know is that Russell Wilson is really, really good. He reminds me a lot of what Brady was on those first couple Patriots Super Bowl teams. It's still fair to wonder if he can carry a mediocre defense like Brady/Peyton did for so many years, but I think the guy is unfairly discounted just because of his defense. Also, I question how anybody could define Drew Brees as an elite quarterback but not Wilson/Roethlisberger/Newton/Palmer.

Hopefully some of that makes sense.

 

[mauconnfan]

Couple of ancillary observations/opinions:

1. I hate the Patriots, but if your reason for disliking them is that they have a lot of bandwagon fans, then I don't think that's a very good reason. This type of thing happens literally every time a team begins to win a lot. Living in the Boston area like a lot of us do, you're immersed in it, so it seems worse...but it's really not. The Patriots were a big deal to a lot of people - myself included - before Brady and they will be a big deal afterwards. The people who leave games in the fourth quarter and boo the team at halftime of a tie game are s***y fans in my opinion, but there are a lot of good ones, too.

2. The spygate/deflategate stuff is pretty tough to have an educated fair/opinion on, no matter who you are. Seems to me a lot of conflicting stories/evidence. They got punished very hard for the deflategate thing, so I've pretty much dropped that. With spygate...who the hell knows.

3. Belichick is probably the greatest coach of all-time and Brady might be the best quarterback of all-time. I have no idea what type of person either of them is off the field, but with Belichick, even Patriots fans have to admit the guy is kind of a d*** a lot of the time. I don't like when guys like Popovich get lumped in with Belichick...the better comparison would be somebody like Saban where you wonder if they have the ability to feel joy. Personally, I don't dislike him for it, but I can understand how others do.

Brady...nothing but class off the field, but his on-field demeanor is sort of bratty. And, no fault of his own, but he and Peyton are emblematic of an era of football that's frustrating for defense-first guys like me. They're protected to the extent that you wonder if they're real football players.

Rooting against the Patriots is really fun. They are the perfect villains. Some of that is self-inflicted, a lot of it is a product of circumstance. Wherever you fall, I don't think everything always has to be perfectly pure or perfectly evil. The perception is that the Patriots are cheaters. And, while it's hard to have an objective opinion as a self-described Patriots hater, I like to think they bare responsibility for some of that perception. I feel the same way about UConn. A lot of it, though, is our insistence on portraying everything in black and white when it hardly ever is. Sometimes it's OK to just admit you don't know...and with the Patriots, I don't. Will that stop me from needling the Patriots fans I know in real life? No, but that's what fans do.

4. What I do (think) know is that Russell Wilson is really, really good. He reminds me a lot of what Brady was on those first couple Patriots Super Bowl teams. It's still fair to wonder if he can carry a mediocre defense like Brady/Peyton did for so many years, but I think the guy is unfairly discounted just because of his defense. Also, I question how anybody could define Drew Brees as an elite quarterback but not Wilson/Roethlisberger/Newton/Palmer.

Hopefully some of that makes sense.

Makes good sense for sure - well stated for the most part. #1 is in question due to the fact you probably have not lived it personally over the last few years where people who you played golf with, worked with, socialized with went from hardly discussing their team to liking their team to delusional about their teams overnight. To the point of everything was the best and no one was as good, not a player not a team. So while you can't dislike a team for their bandwagon fans you can for the way they suddenly react right before your eyes.

I agree especially on the Brady "bratty" thought. No doubt he's changed also over the years. From the 6th round draft choice (or whatever) to expecting to get every call and whining about it. Having said that, the best QB we've seen since Montana and Marino left the field no doubt.

 

[mauconnfan]

I also remember the 3 weeks when Marc Bulger was the best QB in football back in 2003.

Now we know you know nothing outside of your little Patriot hole. The Bulger/Wilson comparison is hilarious up, geezus you're whacked when this stuff comes up.

 

[upstater]

Now we know you know nothing outside of your little Patriot hole. The Bulger/Wilson comparison is hilarious up, geezus you're whacked when this stuff comes up.

I just stated a fact. I didn't say the two are exactly the same. From such points, you either become a Bulger or enter into the star realm. But he's definitely not there yet. You give him too much credit. He could easily become an Eli. Great start, great wins, Super Bowl, but then isn't consistent enough to get to the superstar level.

Going on a great stretch of football is just not enough. It's gotta be sustained like Brees, Brady, Peyton and Rodgers have sustained it.

What is truly bizarre from the haters on this thread is that I gave a ranking of QBs and you have people saying it is a horrible ranking, yet no one offers their own. We have people admitting that they don't watch much football and then also making fun of the list. If you got your own list, go ahead and give it.

 

[mauconnfan]

I just stated a fact. I didn't say the two are exactly the same. From such points, you either become a Bulger or enter into the star realm. But he's definitely not there yet. You give him too much credit. He could easily become an Eli. Great start, great wins, Super Bowl, but then isn't consistent enough to get to the superstar level.

Going on a great stretch of football is just not enough. It's gotta be sustained like Brees, Brady, Peyton and Rodgers have sustained it.

What is truly bizarre from the haters on this thread is that I gave a ranking of QBs and you have people saying it is a horrible ranking, yet no one offers their own. We have people admitting that they don't watch much football and then also making fun of the list. If you got your own list, go ahead and give it.

Don't care to be honest everyone has their thoughts. Your guy is the best no doubt then there's a bunch of others. I like mine so I'm good!

 

[upstater]

Couple of ancillary observations/opinions:

1. I hate the Patriots, but if your reason for disliking them is that they have a lot of bandwagon fans, then I don't think that's a very good reason. This type of thing happens literally every time a team begins to win a lot. Living in the Boston area like a lot of us do, you're immersed in it, so it seems worse...but it's really not. The Patriots were a big deal to a lot of people - myself included - before Brady and they will be a big deal afterwards. The people who leave games in the fourth quarter and boo the team at halftime of a tie game are s***y fans in my opinion, but there are a lot of good ones, too.

2. The spygate/deflategate stuff is pretty tough to have an educated fair/opinion on, no matter who you are. Seems to me a lot of conflicting stories/evidence. They got punished very hard for the deflategate thing, so I've pretty much dropped that. With spygate...who the hell knows.

3. Belichick is probably the greatest coach of all-time and Brady might be the best quarterback of all-time. I have no idea what type of person either of them is off the field, but with Belichick, even Patriots fans have to admit the guy is kind of a d*** a lot of the time. I don't like when guys like Popovich get lumped in with Belichick...the better comparison would be somebody like Saban where you wonder if they have the ability to feel joy. Personally, I don't dislike him for it, but I can understand how others do.

Brady...nothing but class off the field, but his on-field demeanor is sort of bratty. And, no fault of his own, but he and Peyton are emblematic of an era of football that's frustrating for defense-first guys like me. They're protected to the extent that you wonder if they're real football players.

Rooting against the Patriots is really fun. They are the perfect villains. Some of that is self-inflicted, a lot of it is a product of circumstance. Wherever you fall, I don't think everything always has to be perfectly pure or perfectly evil. The perception is that the Patriots are cheaters. And, while it's hard to have an objective opinion as a self-described Patriots hater, I like to think they bare responsibility for some of that perception. I feel the same way about UConn. A lot of it, though, is our insistence on portraying everything in black and white when it hardly ever is. Sometimes it's OK to just admit you don't know...and with the Patriots, I don't. Will that stop me from needling the Patriots fans I know in real life? No, but that's what fans do.

4. What I do (think) know is that Russell Wilson is really, really good. He reminds me a lot of what Brady was on those first couple Patriots Super Bowl teams. It's still fair to wonder if he can carry a mediocre defense like Brady/Peyton did for so many years, but I think the guy is unfairly discounted just because of his defense. Also, I question how anybody could define Drew Brees as an elite quarterback but not Wilson/Roethlisberger/Newton/Palmer.

Hopefully some of that makes sense.

3. Brady does go after refs more than most, but as for being protected, the facts at football outsiders show that Brady, Manning and Roethlisberger get fewer calls per hit than any other QBs. Brady has been hit very hard this year, all year long, and he has one roughing the passer call. There are FO studies that show this has been the case for years. The only other explanation is that players lay off him because they think he's protected so he doesn't get the calls. But then you'd also have to explain why Peyton and Roethlisberger don't get many calls. In Brady and Manning's case, I just think they get rid of the ball so fast that when players hit them they are still engaged with linemen, as opposed to running free when other QBs hold onto the ball too long. This came up first a few years ago when Vick complained about not being protected like other QBs. The reason he isn't protected is the same as with Roethlisberger, they just don't give mobile QBs outside the pocket the same protection. Plus, even the so-called Tom Brady rule is misnamed. The rule was put in after Carson Palmer was hit in the knees.

4. Brees has been doing it for a very long time and consistently. The only one he could be compared to is Roethlisberger. The other guys simply don't have his track record. And as for Palmer, he's been bad for a long while, while Brees hasn't gone through that. Look at Brees' numbers. They are otherwordly. He is going to the Hall of Fame. Brees is top 5 in NFL history in stats.

The ranking was not for just this year, obviously. If it were just for this year, Cam Newton would be #1.

 

[Jerry1714]

Modern day "A" list, in no particular order

Brady
Cam
Ben
Palmer
Rogers
Brees

"A-", but playing very well in recent weeks which is why I even mention them

Wilson
Cousins (go ahead, go boneyard on me, but he's been great for a few weeks now, look it up)
Dalton

The fact you have Kirk Cousins and Andy Dalton anywhere near a list of A players tells me you know less about football then I do about women's basketball

 

[mauconnfan]

The fact you have Kirk Cousins and Andy Dalton anywhere near a list of A players tells me you know less about football then I do about women's basketball

For modern day, if Cam is listed anywhere near the Top 15 prior to this breakout season it's ridiculous. If its this year ok, but any other year he's nothing.

 

[8893]

IMO the ranking of players is useless and inherently biased unless you state what statistics your rankings are based on and over what time period. Are you weighing championships, or just individual stats? I think it matters.

But I wasn't looking for rankings so much as the bases upon which @upstater was deeming certain QBs "stars," or upon which @intlzncster was deeming certain athletes "popular."

In keeping with my belief that perception is reality, I think that national player endorsements is about as good a gauge as any of the athletes who are perceived to be "stars," and of those who are perceived to be "popular." What other reason would an entity have for paying millions simply to be associated with a given player? The belief has to be that the player is popular nationally, very well-liked, and believed to be a "star."

No matter what source you use for endorsement listings, it is always surprising to me that a player with Brady's impressive accomplishments is not higher up the list, because he would probably lead any comprehensive performance metric by a long shot. And it matches my own perception of him, because I can't recall seeing him in any ad campaigns except some Tag Heuer print ads. Meanwhile, Rodgers and Peyton are everywhere, and Eli, Brees and Romo get a lot of commercial attention, too. Interesting.

 

[mauconnfan]

Brady and late hits is another topic. Seen the flag fly when it shouldn't have for him and visa versi. Not a big deal anyway he'll whine and all will be fine. Too cry about how he is mistreated is laughable.

What isn't laughable is the Huskies have a big game in Texas tonight and we're worried about breaking down QB's. Let's finish this and move on to what matters

 

[Jerry1714]

For modern day, if Cam is listed anywhere near the Top 15 prior to this breakout season it's ridiculous. If its this year ok, but any other year he's nothing.

Even if you are solely looking at this year listing Cousins or Dalton is still ridiculous, so is including Big Ben and his 18 TDs and 14 picks and leaving off Eli and his 33 TDs and 14 picks playing with a lot less talent on offense.

Big Ben is a top 5 QB in the league, Eli is top 7, Dalton and Cousins are not in the top 10, Cousins is not in the 15 even.

Looking at the last 2 games, which Cousins has thrown almost 1/3 of his TDs this year and putting him on the A- list is just stupid.

 

[intlzncster]

I hesitate to post a reply to such a quality, balanced post, but as a Patriots fan, I'm going to. I did that just for you @mauconnfan This isn't even a rebuttal so much as commentary.

2. The spygate/deflategate stuff is pretty tough to have an educated fair/opinion on, no matter who you are. Seems to me a lot of conflicting stories/evidence. They got punished very hard for the deflategate thing, so I've pretty much dropped that. With spygate...who the hell knows.

I, and a lot of other Pats fans, don't care if people post opinions on Spygate. What we object to is antiPats guys making claims that just aren't true eg they taped the Rams walk through. There was never any tape, the journalist who made the claim was forced to retract and it nearly killed his career. ESPN said the same thing, and was forced to offer an on air apology. The story was fabricated. Not only that, but consider this: it has been confirmed that the Rams walk through consisted of red zone formations only. Number of times the Rams were in the red zone in the Super Bowl? Two. Number of times they scored? Two. Clearly that mythical tape helped the Patriots out immensely. This is only one example. There are many.

And bear in mind they were punished egregiously for Spygate, which represented Roger Goodell trying to be Cock of the Walk, more than anything. His subsequent actions show this over time.

Brady...nothing but class off the field, but his on-field demeanor is sort of bratty. And, no fault of his own, but he and Peyton are emblematic of an era of football that's frustrating for defense-first guys like me. They're protected to the extent that you wonder if they're real football players.

Yes, people who say Brady is a dick off the field are idiots. The guy had 6 months of txt messages combed through and the WORST thing he said was calling a pool company 'morons', jokingly no less. If any of us had our txts looked through in the same fashion, we'd be absolutely butchered in a public arena.

On the field, the thing we Pats fan object to is the hypocrisy of other fans. I watch a lot of football, probably more than most, and damn near every quarterback bitches to the officials. Some are worse than others, and it's usually the best establish veterans: Manning, Brady, Brees, Rivers, Rodgers...etc. They are trying to get a call so that they can win. It's simply competitiveness. AntiPats fans just looking for Brady to do things. They are not objective. It's kind of like when you buy a car, you start noticing them everywhere on the road. This is known as the Baader-Meinhof phenomenon.

Look, there's a reason quarterbacks are protected above all other players. It is 100% because the owners want them to be. They are the most important, most indefensible, highest paid athletes on the roster (unless you are the idiot Dolphins). They represent the biggest investment an owner makes. They are the face of the franchise, and the stars of the league. Just the way it goes. And I'm a defense first guy too.

4. What I do (think) know is that Russell Wilson is really, really good. He reminds me a lot of what Brady was on those first couple Patriots Super Bowl teams. It's still fair to wonder if he can carry a mediocre defense like Brady/Peyton did for so many years, but I think the guy is unfairly discounted just because of his defense. Also, I question how anybody could define Drew Brees as an elite quarterback but not Wilson/Roethlisberger/Newton/Palmer.

Russell Wilson, as I've said before, is a phenomenal young quarterback. Yes, he's had the defense, and the god-like running back. Brady too had the defense early in his career. What Wilson has done with not amazing talent at receiver, is amazing. And his cool, calm demeanor, and cerebral play in high pressure situations is the mark of a great QB. He'll be interesting to watch as time moves on.

Again, great post on your part.

 

[intlzncster]

What is truly bizarre from the haters on this thread is that I gave a ranking of QBs and you have people saying it is a horrible ranking, yet no one offers their own.

I'm not going to rank them, as I think it's nitpicking at that point, but here's my general categories.

Elite:

Brady
Peyton
Rodgers
Brees
Roethlesberger

Next level (ascending):

Newton
Wilson
Palmer

Very Good:

Eli (first in this category imo)
Rivers
Matt Ryan
Flacco

 

[Jerry1714]

I'm not going to rank them, as I think it's nitpicking at that point, but here's my general categories.

Elite:

Brady
Peyton
Rodgers
Brees
Roethlesberger

Next level (ascending):

Newton
Wilson
Palmer

Very Good:

Eli (first in this category imo)
Rivers
Matt Ryan
Flacco

Good list, Peyton is obviously not elite right now, but he was.

One thing I think is strange is how easily everyone forgets Andrew Luck.

I would get rid of Ryan and put in Luck and get rid of Peyton and I think you have the top 11 in the league, the order can be debated, but those are the best 11 QBs in the league right now

 

[intlzncster]

For modern day, if Cam is listed anywhere near the Top 15 prior to this breakout season it's ridiculous. If its this year ok, but any other year he's nothing.

While I get the sample size is not high yet on Cam, you need to look at it in context. As I said before, I watch a LOT of football (too much for my own good). I've watched Cam improve every single year to the point where he is a very dangerous in-pocket quarterback. The problem w most running QBs is that, when in trouble, their first instinct is to escape (run), instead of shifting in the pocket like Brady/Manning/etc. This is a VERY tough habit for these guys to break, as they've been doing it all their lives; most never do it. Wilson has done it. Roethlesberger, while never a true run first QB, has made the same progression. And Cam has definitely done it.

This year is not a flash in the pan for Cam. He is playing w very few weapons on offense, he pretty much IS the offense. The only other truly notable player is Greg Olsen. Cam is without a doubt the MVP this season, no matter what happens in the playoffs. He is accurate, big arm, can make all the throws, very hard to bring down, and a devastating runner. And the reason he's made the jump this year is because he has become a very cerebral quarterback, not just acting on instinct and athleticism.

I used to really dislike the guy and his game, but now I have great respect for what he can do. All that's left is for him to prove it, both in crunch time and over the long hall.

 

[intlzncster]

Good list, Peyton is obviously not elite right now, but he was.

One thing I think is strange is how easily everyone forgets Andrew Luck.

I would get rid of Ryan and put in Luck and get rid of Peyton and I think you have the top 11 in the league, the order can be debated, but those are the best 11 QBs in the league right now

Absolutely right on Peyton at this very moment, I just put him in there out of respect.

I totally forgot about Luck actually (again, good call). My bad. I'd put him in that third category, with the most upside of that group. But if he cant get rid of that gunslinger mentality, he won't move up. The only guy I've ever seen be able to pull that off is Favre, and Luck is not Favre.

 

[upstater]

Brady and late hits is another topic. Seen the flag fly when it shouldn't have for him and visa versi. Not a big deal anyway he'll whine and all will be fine. Too cry about how he is mistreated is laughable.

What isn't laughable is the Huskies have a big game in Texas tonight and we're worried about breaking down QB's. Let's finish this and move on to what matters

And where did you read that? I dont see mistreatment. In fact, I wrote the opposite. I wrote the lack of calls are probably because he gets rid of the ball quick when rushers are still engaged with blockers. People rarely come through free on him to deliver the shots that bring calls from refs, so the low hit-to-flag ratio is explainable.

 

[8893]

Hey, I was just trying to provide a metric, as jersey sales are an exact match to how popular a player is.

Neither one is a perfect match. My problem with jersey sales is that it is only a gauge of popularity among people who would actually purchase a player jersey, and an official one at that. I think that is a very, very small percentage of NFL football fans. Personally, I have not owned a player jersey since I was a preteen. I have dozens of NFL football fans among my family and friends and I can count on one hand those whom I have known to have a player jersey in recent decades.

I agree with you about the choice factor for endorsements, but it's not like Brady is avoiding them--and it's not like Peyton, Eli, Brees or Rodgers needs the money, either. No, they do not have supermodel wives who earn more than them, but I don't buy the narrative that Brady is not about the money (in fact, I believe in the adage that holds that the opposite is true for people who profess that).

My overall point remains a very simple one: Brady is a great QB with an undeniable legacy as one of the best ever to play the game, but that does not mean that he deserves to be canonized as many Pats fans seem to believe. I believe that, rightly or wrongly, a lot of people don't like the guy, and Pats fans seem to be more touchy about that basic, simple, human fact than I have ever observed with any other fan base about any other player in my lifetime.

 

[intlzncster]

Neither one is a perfect match. My problem with jersey sales is that it is only a gauge of popularity among people who would actually purchase a player jersey, and an official one at that. I think that is a very, very small percentage of NFL football fans. Personally, I have not owned a player jersey since I was a preteen. I have dozens of NFL football fans among my family and friends and I can count on one hand those whom I have known to have a player jersey in recent decades.

I agree with you about the choice factor for endorsements, but it's not like Brady is avoiding them--and it's not like Peyton, Eli, Brees or Rodgers needs the money, either. No, they do not have supermodel wives who earn more than them, but I don't buy the narrative that Brady is not about the money (in fact, I believe in the adage that holds that the opposite is true for people who profess that).

My overall point remains a very simple one: Brady is a great QB with an undeniable legacy as one of the best ever to play the game, but that does not mean that he deserves to be canonized as many Pats fans seem to believe. I believe that, rightly or wrongly, a lot of people don't like the guy, and Pats fans seem to be more touchy about that basic, simple, human fact than I have ever observed with any other fan base about any other player in my lifetime.

Yeah, you are correct in that I shouldn't have used the words 'exact' there, as it's not true. It's a biased sample for sure. Same as Probowl fan votes, for which Brady is number one in the NFL. Those only represent people who are willing to vote. And some ardent fans vote all day. But the fact is, Brady is at or near the top of all these flawed metrics, so that has to tell you at least something.

I don't believe Brady has ever said he's not about the money, or that he has taken less money in order to win. I'm just observing his actions there.

I have no problem with others not liking Brady, as again, there's a large subsection of people who just don't like a winner. People often prefer the underdog (which oddly, Brady has been much of his life). Also, I just don't think people can relate to Brady. He's a super human quarterback, chiseled good looks, rarely fails, married to a rich supermodel, lovely family, high fashion 'icon', revered in his home area, and apparently a great guy all around. He's pretty much the prototypical perfect guy. To top it all off, most guys' wives want to sleep with him or or divorce their husbands and remarry him; Hell, I know some straight dudes who would marry the guy. Who can relate to that? I can't.

But that said, how could you NOT canonize Brady as a player? By what metric could you not? People STILL call him a 'system' QB or 'nothing without Belichick'. It's ridiculous by any objective measure.

 

[upstater]

Neither one is a perfect match. My problem with jersey sales is that it is only a gauge of popularity among people who would actually purchase a player jersey, and an official one at that. I think that is a very, very small percentage of NFL football fans. Personally, I have not owned a player jersey since I was a preteen. I have dozens of NFL football fans among my family and friends and I can count on one hand those whom I have known to have a player jersey in recent decades.

I agree with you about the choice factor for endorsements, but it's not like Brady is avoiding them--and it's not like Peyton, Eli, Brees or Rodgers needs the money, either. No, they do not have supermodel wives who earn more than them, but I don't buy the narrative that Brady is not about the money (in fact, I believe in the adage that holds that the opposite is true for people who profess that).

My overall point remains a very simple one: Brady is a great QB with an undeniable legacy as one of the best ever to play the game, but that does not mean that he deserves to be canonized as many Pats fans seem to believe. I believe that, rightly or wrongly, a lot of people don't like the guy, and Pats fans seem to be more touchy about that basic, simple, human fact than I have ever observed with any other fan base about any other player in my lifetime.

His wife is in the branding business. There is a night and day difference between Brady's endorsements pre-Giselle and post-Giselle. It's pretty easy to see the type of things he was doing before he met her and what he is doing now.

He is doing Uggs and Movado by design because she knows the industry. Since meeting her, the only thing he's done I can think of that's sports related is Under Armour, and that's recent.

 

[upstater]

Yeah, you are correct in that I shouldn't have used the words 'exact' there, as it's not true. It's a biased sample for sure. Same as Probowl fan votes, for which Brady is number one in the NFL. Those only represent people who are willing to vote. And some ardent fans vote all day. But the fact is, Brady is at or near the top of all these flawed metrics, so that has to tell you at least something.

I don't believe Brady has ever said he's not about the money, or that he has taken less money in order to win. I'm just observing his actions there.

I have no problem with others not liking Brady, as again, there's a large subsection of people who just don't like a winner. People often prefer the underdog (which oddly, Brady has been much of his life). Also, I just don't think people can relate to Brady. He's a super human quarterback, chiseled good looks, rarely fails, married to a rich supermodel, lovely family, high fashion 'icon', revered in his home area, and apparently a great guy all around. He's pretty much the prototypical perfect guy. To top it all off, their wives want to sleep with or remarry with the guy. Who can relate to that? I can't.

But that said, how could you NOT canonize Brady as a player? By what metric could you not? People STILL call him a 'system' QB or 'nothing without Belichick'. It's ridiculous by any objective measure.

From what I see and hear, I think it's because he's thought of as effeminate. "Brady is a Lady." A pretty common chant in Buffalo, Pittsburgh and New York. And even if he's the most effeminate QB in the league, that means next to nothing when it comes to toughness on the field and ability to throw.

Then you have the causal or non-football fans who don't really have the time or inclination to wade into deflategate (who can blame them) who think a ball might actually weigh 2 pound less from having air taken out, and his image takes a big hit with them.

 

[intlzncster]

Brady and late hits is another topic. Seen the flag fly when it shouldn't have for him and visa versi. Not a big deal anyway he'll whine and all will be fine. Too cry about how he is mistreated is laughable.

What isn't laughable is the Huskies have a big game in Texas tonight and we're worried about breaking down QB's. Let's finish this and move on to what matters

This is the Baader-Meinof phenomenon.

Also, go Huskies.

 

[intlzncster]

From what I see and hear, I think it's because he's thought of as effeminate. "Brady is a Lady." A pretty common chant in Buffalo, Pittsburgh and New York. And even if he's the most effeminate QB in the league, that means next to nothing when it comes to toughness on the field and ability to throw.

It doesn't help that he does 'effeminate' fashion shoots, in one of which he was cradling a goat. I hung my head at that one.

Then you have the causal or non-football fans who don't really have the time or inclination to wade into deflategate (who can blame them) who think a ball might actually weigh 2 pound less from having air taken out, and his image takes a big hit with them.

But it actually increased his jersey sales!

Must...mention....jersey....sales....hahahha

 

[8893]

I would never have described Brady as effeminate, but I do think he's a bit of dandy with very metrosexual appearance.

It's not like Eli is the picture of manliness, either; but he seems to have more of a little boy appearance than anything else.

 

[Husky25]

Even if you are solely looking at this year listing Cousins or Dalton is still ridiculous, so is including Big Ben and his 18 TDs and 14 picks and leaving off Eli and his 33 TDs and 14 picks playing with a lot less talent on offense.

Big Ben is a top 5 QB in the league, Eli is top 7, Dalton and Cousins are not in the top 10, Cousins is not in the 15 even.

Looking at the last 2 games, which Cousins has thrown almost 1/3 of his TDs this year and putting him on the A- list is just stupid.

Since the Patriots romp, Kirk Cousins has had 6 out of 7 well above average games (only Carolina was a stinker), which also coincides with his own emerging, hard-to-cover TE in Jordon Reed.

For the year, Cousins will throw for over 4,000 yards (3,990 as we speak). He has completed near 70% of his passes and has a near 100.0 passer rating. Since the Saints game, he has a 121 passer rating and since the game vs. Tampa (the "YOU LIKE THAT!!" game and a stretch that includes the Pats game) his passer rating is 114.

That said, he is 27, in his first full season as a starter, and if he has broken through, there is only a 7 game stretch to support it. In other words it is a tiny sample size during a contract year. However in my opinion, to say that he is not in the top 15 of QB's going forward basically means you don't watch much football beyond your favorite team, and/or are going purely off legacy. Cousins is certainly knocking on the door of the Top 10.