OT: Giants | Page 12 | The Boneyard

OT: Giants

And Belichick.
Exactly. Trade Belichick for the Gints number 1 plus a few other goodies. Next man up for the coaching staff and front office. Better a year too early than a year too late. It's the Patriot Way!
 
Regarding Patricia, the Pats defense is bizarre statistically

yards per attempt - 31st best
points allowed - 5th best
Pct of drives ending in a score - 6th best
Turnovers -25th best
Sacks - 10th best
Penalties - 24th best

So Negatives:
Give up yards
Don't create turnovers
Create penalties

Positives
Sack the QB
Don't allow points

Not sure if they simply go with a bend but don't break approach - if they just are really tough in the Red Zone - whatever. I don't watch a lot of Pats games.

He's a very smart guy, he's been working under Belicheck for awhile. Considering Gettleman wants to become old school tough in the trenches, play northeast football, I can see why tehy might hire him. He's from NY, has that Northeast mentality, has a degree in aeronautical engineering so he's not an "idiot", hopefully he would be smart enough to know clock management.

I guess he's OK for me as long as he finds a quality offensive coordinator. The bottom line for me is this draft is absolutely huge for this franchise. The draft, along with what Gettleman does to this roster before preseason is the biggest story of the year for the franchise, more than the head coach.
 
Regarding Patricia, the Pats defense is bizarre statistically

Not sure if they simply go with a bend but don't break approach - if they just are really tough in the Red Zone - whatever. I don't watch a lot of Pats games.

This has been the same kind of statistic since Belichick arrived in New England. It doesn't change much. Bottom 3rd of the league in yardage given up, top third in points.

It's a combination of bend-but-don't-break, tough red zone D, and having Brady leading one of the top offenses (i.e. Time of Possession, opposing teams must play from behind and thereby rack up passing yards).
 
For HC, I think my preference is Shurmur. He only has 2 yrs as HC of the Browns, so I'll give him a pass. He lead a very injured Vikings offense to a first round bye. Schwartz couldn't do anything with a talented Lions roster. I like McDaniels. Not sure on Patricia. Belichick isn't happening and Im not really into Saban.

So with that said, Im hearing that Shurmur and Keenum could be a package deal. Now...im not sold on Keenum, but im curious as to what kind of deal he would get/want. A lot depends on how he plays in the playoffs. If he would take a shorter term deal with reasonable money Id have to consider it. If that's the case they could trade down and address the other glaring issues like OL LB and RB.
 
The 'favorite', 'all signs point to', 'early leader' rumors for coaching searches have about as much validity as Flugar's rumors about horse trading.

I think it's all click bait.

So far the leaders were: Schwartz, Schumur, Wilks and now Patricia. The media guys really covering their bases here.

About a week ago I sent some friends a text.

“No way in the world would I ever hire Patricia as a head coach”


I should have known what that would lead too.
 
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Seeing rumors or Saban and Patricia. Those who are supposedly in the know around New England say that Patricia is the more Belichick like guy over McDaniels. Very smart. It seems clear that Detroit wants him. He might prefer NY.

Well, he is an actual rocket scientist by trade.
 
About a week ago I sent some friends a text.

“No way in the world would I ever hire Patricia as a head coach”


I should have known what that would lead too.

I'm not sold on Patricia either. I don't know a damn thing about the inner workings of the Patriots, but he just screams coordinator to me.

If you're a team like the Lions with an established QB, I think it may not be a bad choice, but with the Giants likely drafting a rookie QB, I'd think you'd want someone with a bit more experience.

To me, it seemed like Pat Shurmur may not have been a bad choice given the QBs he's worked with along with prior HC experience. Sure his record wasn't good with Cleveland, but who's is?
 
Regarding Patricia, the Pats defense is bizarre statistically

yards per attempt - 31st best
points allowed - 5th best
Pct of drives ending in a score - 6th best
Turnovers -25th best
Sacks - 10th best
Penalties - 24th best

So Negatives:
Give up yards
Don't create turnovers
Create penalties

Positives
Sack the QB
Don't allow points

Not sure if they simply go with a bend but don't break approach - if they just are really tough in the Red Zone - whatever. I don't watch a lot of Pats games.

He's a very smart guy, he's been working under Belicheck for awhile. Considering Gettleman wants to become old school tough in the trenches, play northeast football, I can see why tehy might hire him. He's from NY, has that Northeast mentality, has a degree in aeronautical engineering so he's not an "idiot", hopefully he would be smart enough to know clock management.

I guess he's OK for me as long as he finds a quality offensive coordinator. The bottom line for me is this draft is absolutely huge for this franchise. The draft, along with what Gettleman does to this roster before preseason is the biggest story of the year for the franchise, more than the head coach.

As for this season's stats, you might consider a few more details. Like looking at the last ten games. Then considering who they are playing out there. The secondary is strong. The D line is young and has come on late in the year. All three of their best LBs missed much of the season (they may have VanNoy in this week). He's done it with guys cut midseason by other teams.

I think Patricia is definitely the better HC candidate than Josh, although both may get jobs. Josh has a loaded roster to work with.
 
If it's the #2 pick this year? Hmmmm, LOL. I'd say BB and Brady have one more good year in them, so I wouldn't make the trade either. If this were offered in 2019, I'd jump on it. You can have your 4 years of BB so the Patriots can replenish.

I'd take that next year if we get to keep Patricia. Honestly, I'd trade Brady for another first rounder+ and sign Jimmy G as a free agent. Team would be loaded.
 
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Regarding Patricia, the Pats defense is bizarre statistically

yards per attempt - 31st best
points allowed - 5th best
Pct of drives ending in a score - 6th best
Turnovers -25th best
Sacks - 10th best
Penalties - 24th best

So Negatives:
Give up yards

Don't create turnovers
Create penalties

Positives
Sack the QB
Don't allow points

Not sure if they simply go with a bend but don't break approach - if they just are really tough in the Red Zone - whatever. I don't watch a lot of Pats games.
This has been the same kind of statistic since Belichick arrived in New England. It doesn't change much. Bottom 3rd of the league in yardage given up, top third in points.

It's a combination of bend-but-don't-break, tough red zone D, and having Brady leading one of the top offenses (i.e. Time of Possession, opposing teams must play from behind and thereby rack up passing yards).

It's usually not this lopsided in terms of yards. They had a string of really bad games early in the year on D, the first 5 or 6 or so, that has skewed the results. But they aren't usually in the Top half of the NFL in this category anyway.

One extenuating circumstance with this Pats D is that it is very patchwork. A lot of these guys are relative no namers, outside some in the defensive backfield. They jettisoned a ton up front on the D line and lost a lot at linebacker (incl their best defender - Hightower IR). Their best linebacker is freakin Kyle Van Noy, and he hasn't played in 6 weeks.

But they don't care too much about yards in general. They basically care about not getting beat by the big play, and force the other team to make play after play, looking for mistakes.

They don't care about actual sacks. They care about pressures. Pressure the QB while holding their lane integrity. Very rarely do they ever just let a great pass rusher loose to ad-lib his way to the QB. That's why a guy like Chandler Jones gets so many sacks with the Cardinals vs the Pats. He got some with the Pats, but only within the structure.

Belichick's philosophy is that the only stats that matter in terms of consistent winning are points and turnovers. Red Zone is everything. Turnovers they are usually good at, but in the end, the focus is on turnover differential. Pats are 11th in that category.
 
If it's the #2 pick this year? Hmmmm, LOL. I'd say BB and Brady have one more good year in them, so I wouldn't make the trade either. If this were offered in 2019, I'd jump on it. You can have your 4 years of BB so the Patriots can replenish.

Honestly, I think BB is going to go a lot longer than people think. I don't think he'd be happy doing anything else. I won't be surprised at all to see him coach into his 70's. I know he said he wouldn't in passing a while ago. But when he comes up to it, I don't think so.

I think he's too important.

I'd like to see Brady actually regress before I say he has 1 good year in him left. The guy was playing with a bad achilles and shoulder the last portion of this year. He struggled a bit (for him), when he did.

But yeah, Jimmy G came along 3 years too early.
 
It's usually not this lopsided in terms of yards. They had a string of really bad games early in the year on D, the first 5 or 6 or so, that has skewed the results. But they aren't usually in the Top half of the NFL in this category anyway.

One extenuating circumstance with this Pats D is that it is very patchwork. A lot of these guys are relative no namers, outside some in the defensive backfield. They jettisoned a ton up front on the D line and lost a lot at linebacker (incl their best defender - Hightower IR). Their best linebacker is freakin Kyle Van Noy, and he hasn't played in 6 weeks.

But they don't care too much about yards in general. They basically care about not getting beat by the big play, and force the other team to make play after play, looking for mistakes.

They don't care about actual sacks. They care about pressures. Pressure the QB while holding their lane integrity. Very rarely do they ever just let a great pass rusher loose to ad-lib his way to the QB. That's why a guy like Chandler Jones gets so many sacks with the Cardinals vs the Pats. He got some with the Pats, but only within the structure.

Belichick's philosophy is that the only stats that matter in terms of consistent winning are points and turnovers. Red Zone is everything. Turnovers they are usually good at, but in the end, the focus is on turnover differential. Pats are 11th in that category.

Nailed it. And the NY Daily News seems to think Matt Patricia is headed to NY. All signs point to Patriots DC Matt Patricia as next Giants coach
 
I'd take that next year if we get to keep Patricia. Honestly, I'd trade Brady for another first rounder+ and sign Jimmy G as a free agent. Team would be loaded.

Jimmy G is going to get franchised by the 49ers, but if he were available I still have concerns about his durability. Guy took one big hit and separated his shoulder. Not to mention Jimmy G's great run (7 tds and 5 ints) is not the greatest run ever.
 
I would. I'm inclined to believe that trading Jimmy G at below market value was a BB hissy-fit. It would be a win-win, Pats have their succession plan and BB has a new challenge.

The majority of that ESPN article didn't pass the smell test for me. Especially that bit. BB's about as emotionless as you can get with roster decisions. And Kraft hasn't made a football decision since he's been there.

I think 3 years from now, assuming health, you'll see BB, TB, and Kraft still working together. jmo though
 
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The majority of that ESPN article didn't pass the smell test for me. Especially that bit. BB's about as emotionless as you can get with roster decisions. And Kraft hasn't made a football decision since he's been there.

I think Kraft made one here. BB wanted to keep JG and cut TB12 loose. Kraft said no freakin' way.
 
I would. I'm inclined to believe that trading Jimmy G at below market value was a BB hissy-fit. It would be a win-win, Pats have their succession plan and BB has a new challenge.

I think it was likelier a bad gamble.

First of all, there were many articles 2 months ago about how the 49ers paid too much. But secondly, Hue Jackson complained that the front office never offered the Patriots anything for Garoppolo, and that they knocked off for the day after lunch at the deadline. But the 3rd factor in all this, even if they had made an offer, they made it with the Houston texans pick, which was closer to pick #20-22 at the time (the deadline came before D. Watson was injured), and at the time, the 49ers were winless and their pick was #34.
 
But secondly, Hue Jackson complained that the front office never offered the Patriots anything for Garoppolo, and that they knocked off for the day after lunch at the deadline.

The Plain Dealer said that the Browns will willing to offer more but never got the chance.
 


hmm If I'm the Giants, I'd want a guy who's great at developing QBs as they likely have to draft one or two, unless they get a guy like Keenum or Kirk. Don't think either are worth the money though. The roster's got some holes anway, so paying a lot of money for a QB who's not Top 8 or so makes no sense.

I wouldn't go in the Pats direction, but if I had to, I'd choose McDaniels over Patricia, just because of the offensive mind and his skill at working with QBs (TB isn't the only guy he's worked with - see Jimmy G et al).
 
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Giants’ coaching search is down to three
The next head coach of the Giants will be Josh McDaniels, Matt Patricia or Pat Shurmur, with no surprise candidate looming, and at this point all three are very much in the mix.

Steve Wilks, the Panthers’ defensive coordinator, did not make the cut after the first round of interviews, according to someone with knowledge of the Giants’ thinking. Steve Spagnuolo, the Giants’ defensive coordinator, and Eric Studesville, the former Broncos’ running backs coach and assistant head coach, are not being considered for the head-coach position.
 
Giants’ coaching search is down to three
The next head coach of the Giants will be Josh McDaniels, Matt Patricia or Pat Shurmur, with no surprise candidate looming, and at this point all three are very much in the mix.

Steve Wilks, the Panthers’ defensive coordinator, did not make the cut after the first round of interviews, according to someone with knowledge of the Giants’ thinking. Steve Spagnuolo, the Giants’ defensive coordinator, and Eric Studesville, the former Broncos’ running backs coach and assistant head coach, are not being considered for the head-coach position.

Don't want it to be Patricia cause I want to keep him more than McDaniels. What he does with limited defenses every year is awesome. Tom can run the offense.
 
Don't want it to be Patricia cause I want to keep him more than McDaniels. What he does with limited defenses every year is awesome. Tom can run the offense.

I don't want it to be Patricia either the backwards hat wearing chubby dude looks to me to be a defensive puppet of a great D mind in Belichick. And of the other 2 only one would not be an ex-BB assistant, who's assistants carry an awful record after the leave Foxboro.

No matter, I think I prefer McDaniels, great offensive mind (concerned he had Brady makes life a lot easier) and young enough to have learned his lesson from his first opportunity.
 
I don't want it to be Patricia either the backwards hat wearing chubby dude looks to me to be a defensive puppet of a great D mind in Belichick. And of the other 2 only one would not be an ex-BB assistant, who's assistants carry an awful record after the leave Foxboro.

Fat shamer. lol

I think the assistants not doing well is a bit overstated, as the sample size is tiny; so saying all future assistants will do the same doesn't hold any water. Mangini/Crennel/Weiss are all failures.

Bill Obrien hasn't done amazing, but the Texans have been crushed by a rash of injuries to key guys (JJ Watt every damn year; half their defense; Watson) over the past few years. And saddled with $70m Brock Osweiler there for a bit. Watson will likely help his fortunes considerably. They think enough of BO that they are currently trying to extend his contract.

Nick Saban, while poor at Miami--Miami is show in and of itself-- has been ridiculous at the college level.

McDaniels was not a success, but he only got 1.5 years to do anything. His biggest failure was at personnel. Where he was awful. He had no QB, which is his fault, having famously drafted Tebow. He was given too much control as a young coach. It'll help to not have to deal with that side, and to focus solely on running the team on the field. He also went in as the big swingin dick, when he wasn't. He's said since, that he's been "humbled" by that experience, and I think that won't be the case in the future.

There's good and bad. But that's to be expected. There's a lot that goes into the outcome, from owner, to GM picking players, to scouting, to having a QB etc that impacts a coaches success.

What you do know is that the guy won't have BB's ability to find those players to fit the system. You've gotta rely on the new GM to do that.
 
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