OT - A-Rod | Page 3 | The Boneyard

OT - A-Rod

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superjohn said:
Yankee fans don't like ARod and know he's a fraud, Red Sox fans worship at the feet of Ortiz and won't admit he's a fraud. I can't stand AROD but he was always an unbelievable ballplayer even before PED's, I certainly can't say the same for Ortiz.
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Exactly.
 
Big Yankee fan here. Still it is easy for me to see why Ortiz is liked more than fellow cheater A-Rod. Outside of last year, I think most Yankee fans liked Ortiz more. No one hated A-Rod better than Yankee fans.
It is not just the PED use, it was always his being too full of himself. I take A-Rod at his word now. He is mending relationships. More important for him than his 700 homers. Good for him.
 
superjohn said:
None of them are cheaters? As a gym goer since I was in high school I always have trouble with people saying it's not cheating and you still have to put all the hard work in the gym that someone who isn't using does. With setroids you are able to lift more weight with less work put in. You can grow and maintain freakish muscles without putting in nearly as much effort as someone like me who doesn't take the easy way. I also disagree that baseball gives two sharts about health concerns. There isn't some new info about health concerns related to steroids. MLB knew exactly what was going on and loved the ratings too much to care. They didn't all of a sudden have a conscience, Congress got involved.
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Not disagreeing. Point is, it wasn't against the rules of baseball. Therefore, it was not cheating.
 
HuskyHawk said:
Not disagreeing. Point is, it wasn't against the rules of baseball. Therefore, it was not cheating.
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Robbery and extortion isn't against the rules of baseball either. Steroids and PEDs are illegal in the United States. You don't need to make rules in baseball when there are already state and federal laws prohibiting them
 
superjohn said:
It is illegal but wasn't illegal in baseball. Selig was the worst.
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methodology said:
Robbery and extortion isn't against the rules of baseball either. Steroids and PEDs are illegal in the United States. You don't need to make rules in baseball when there are already state and federal laws prohibiting them
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And the Andro that McGwire bought at GNC? Many of the prohibited PEDs are not illegal steroids themselves. Hell, using Sudafed will trip the test.
 
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HuskyHawk said:
And the Andro that McGwire bought at GNC? Many of the prohibited PEDs are not illegal steroids themselves. Hell, using Sudafed will trip the test.
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You are aware Mac was on roids not andro when part of the bash brothers in Oakland?
 
methodology said:
You are aware Mac was on roids not andro when part of the bash brothers in Oakland?
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No, he wasn't. Not according to any reports I saw. Canseco was on roids.
 
HuskyHawk said:
No, he wasn't. Not according to any reports I saw. Canseco was on roids.
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Canseco although a slime ball has been the most honest and forthcoming about the usage of steroids in baseball when he played. Mac was on roids keep living in denial
 
7774 said:
Not sure how I'm a for laughing at all your ridiculous comments. I mean, you guys can't seriously wonder why Ortiz is more well liked or different than A-Rod right? The mirror picture, the multiple weird shirtless photo shoots, trying to slap the ball out while going to first, the Cameron Diaz popcorn thing, etc., etc. It's like German scientists went into the lab and created the first ever robot. Definitely an awesome player though.
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Thanks finally some input, awful as it is, finally something from you. Amazing.

Funny thing is we know he's more well liked than ARod. Guess for such an intelligent, maybe easily the most on the board just ask you, you can't read too well huh? But hey you're entertainment value is worth not blocking your spew.
 
superjohn said:
Yankee fans don't like ARod and know he's a fraud, Red Sox fans worship at the feet of Ortiz and won't admit he's a fraud. I can't stand AROD but he was always an unbelievable ballplayer even before PED's, I certainly can't say the same for Ortiz.
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Before the PED's? So little league?
 
mauconnfan said:
Thanks finally some input, awful as it is, finally something from you. Amazing.

Funny thing is we know he's more well liked than ARod. Guess for such an intelligent, maybe easily the most on the board just ask you, you can't read too well huh? But hey you're entertainment value is worth not blocking your spew.
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You literally said in this thread that there is no difference between ARod and Ortiz. I'm glad in the last hour or 2 you managed to have an epiphany as to the differences that make Ortiz more likable.

I also don't know why you keep bringing up this false narrative that I think I'm super intelligent. I'm super intelligent compared to you, which is true for anyone with basic average intelligence.
 
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7774 said:
You literally said in this thread, on this page, that there is no difference between ARod and Ortiz. I'm glad in the last hour or 2 you managed to have an epiphany as to the differences that make Ortiz more likable.

I also don't know why you keep bringing up this false narrative that I think I'm super intelligent. I'm super intelligent compared to you, which is true for anyone with basic average intelligence.
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Hmmmm.... There is no difference in ARod and Papi, their both frauds and that's what I meant, not how well liked they were. But who cares I disagree with you and that makes me happy, tells me on the right side of this argument.

And once again your intelligence comeback - really pitiful but that's who you are. Your friend must be proud!;)
 
superjohn said:
None of them are cheaters? As a gym goer since I was in high school I always have trouble with people saying it's not cheating and you still have to put all the hard work in the gym that someone who isn't using does. With setroids you are able to lift more weight with less work put in. You can grow and maintain freakish muscles without putting in nearly as much effort as someone like me who doesn't take the easy way.
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Do you know steroid users? I'm not trying to be snide, I'm curious. The guy I work out with trains a number of guys on gear and I don't think they're taking any sort of easy route. They can just break through the ceiling that's imposed on natty guys. You can take all the tren etc. in the world and if you don't bust your *** you're still going to look like trash. Their capacity for work might be greater but I don't think it's any kind of shortcut.

Personally, I don't particularly give a **** who's on steroids and who isn't. That white lineman for the Broncos, I can't remember his name, was a walking poster boy for gear after coming off his suspension and no one seems to care. James Harrison is 275 at 6-0, carries no fat, and runs like a deer. Alllll natural.

I don't know what makes baseball so sanctified.
 
mauconnfan said:
Hmmmm.... There is no difference in ARod and Papi, their both frauds and that's what I meant, not how well liked they were. But who cares I disagree with you and that makes me happy, tells me on the right side of this argument.

And once again your intelligence comeback - really pitiful but that's who you are. Your friend must be proud!;)
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LOL, so superjohn makes a post stating that he'll never understand the love affair with Ortiz, and you respond to agree with that post, saying there is no difference between he and ARod, but you weren't talking about how well liked they are.

You're always the best.
 
It's easy to see why Ortiz is more liked than A-Rod. A lot of it is as simple as the fact that Ortiz didn't play for most hated franchise in American sports (at the time, anyway, I think they were), and in fact, actually played a herculean role in taking them down (my sense is that, nationally, a lot of people are sick of the Red Sox, but when they won their first, I think a lot of people were rooting for them).

There is no way to defend A-Rod in certain respects, and again, I say that as somebody who liked him. The Arroyo swipe was an egregious violation of the game...the action itself was one thing (I can see it being rationalized as instinctual movement in the moment) but the way he tried to play dumb afterwards was just extremely cheapish and insulting to everyone's intelligence. He was the walking manifestation of fraudulence, somebody who tried to manipulate you at every turn, whether it was with his portrayal of a personality that none of his teammates or coaches could every verify (Joe Torre basically could not state with sufficient vigor how pampered he was) or getting busted for cheating twice, even after he sincerely pledged rehabilitation after the first time.

I will take up for him in this regard: all along, it seemed he was trying to compensate for something. He was a phony, but he was a phony because he was ridden with deep-rooted insecurity that probably stemmed from issues he had with his father as a child. His cheating appeared to reflect an addiction to perfection that anybody who watched him work would testify to. And for his flaws, he moved to third for Jeter, even when everything indicated it should have been the other way around. His love for the game was genuine, perhaps in a way that could not comprehend anything less than that (I always remember the passage from Torre's book in which A-Rod was incredulous that Jeter didn't have the baseball package).

I don't care to regurgitate the details of Ortiz's failed test. Sox fans will probably point out that it was administered under murky circumstances, and Yankees fans will express with conviction that he is a genocidal cheater. The media has been light on him, but they were light on Pettitte, too. Perhaps, in regards to A-Rod, some of the outrage is correlated with the fact that he could have gone down as the best to ever play...there was never that with Ortiz. Then again, people hated A-Rod before the steroids, and I won't argue with those people.

Maybe the better comparison is A-Rod to Manny. Manny was every bit the offender A-Rod was when it came to failed tests, and his off-field blunders rose to far greater levels of severity than A-Rod's. Yet...Manny is one of my favorite players of all-time, and if that demonstrates a certain hypocrisy that is consistent with many sports fans, then maybe that underscores what this all actually is...entertainment. Even as somebody who doesn't like baseball as much as other sports, the '03 and '04 ALCS's are two of the pantheon sporting events of my lifetime. A-Rod, Ortiz, and Manny were obviously prominently involved, so it's tough, as they depart the game, for me to grade them as anything other than flawed figures to greatly, greatly enhanced our experience as fans.
 
7774 said:
LOL, so superjohn makes a post stating that he'll never understand the love affair with Ortiz, and you respond to agree with that post, saying there is no difference between he and ARod, but you weren't talking about how well liked they are.

You're always the best.
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To the easily fooled and gullible unwashed masses, there's a big difference between ARod and Ortiz. To those of us with a pulse and the ability to see through Ortiz's bull sheet, there's no difference at all.
 
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7774 said:
LOL, so superjohn makes a post stating that he'll never understand the love affair with Ortiz, and you respond to agree with that post, saying there is no difference between he and ARod, but you weren't talking about how well liked they are.

You're always the best.
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"Don't get me started he's a great guy...." Does that in any way say he's more well liked than ARod. It speaks to Papi, as a person or in the case I feel, a fraud. You can think it meant amongst the world, but it didn't so take your arrogance and FO.
 
bballgrda said:
If anything this makes me like him more. How can you not appreciate some quality gamesmanship? You play the game to win.
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You clearly never played baseball. That's the lowest level of gamesmanship
 
BigErnMcCracken said:
Do you know steroid users? I'm not trying to be snide, I'm curious. The guy I work out with trains a number of guys on gear and I don't think they're taking any sort of easy route. They can just break through the ceiling that's imposed on natty guys. You can take all the tren etc. in the world and if you don't bust your *** you're still going to look like trash. Their capacity for work might be greater but I don't think it's any kind of shortcut.

Personally, I don't particularly give a **** who's on steroids and who isn't. That white lineman for the Broncos, I can't remember his name, was a walking poster boy for gear after coming off his suspension and no one seems to care. James Harrison is 275 at 6-0, carries no fat, and runs like a deer. Alllll natural.

I don't know what makes baseball so sanctified.
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Yes, I'm friends with some competitive bodybuilders. They will tell you diet and roids are more important than actual training. Of course you have to lift heavy to get really big but it's so much easier on gear. They can just crank out sets of light weight shrugs and their traps are going to pop like crazy. They curl just the bar and their arms are going to get a crazy pump while I curl sets of 135 and can't get the same pump. Of course if you take gear and don't lift you are going to look like cr@p and be unhealthy but you're nuts if you don't think the muscle building benefits are huge. I don't have a problem with anyone doing it and you can't compete in the sport of bodybuilding without it but to say it's not a shortcut is ridiculous, of course it is.
 
The sport of baseball in particular seems to have a way of humbling most of the biggest tools, and A-Rod was certainly one of them imo. More than the PEDs and mirror-kissing, I resent that he and Boras forever altered the trajectory of the sport and made it more about rooting for laundry than anything else when they negotiated that ridiculous contract with the Rangers, which had so many repercussions that it changed the landscape forever. Yes, the Rangers were a willing participant, and the owners in general are not people for whom my heart bleeds, but in the end the fans got screwed because we've been paying for it ever since. You simply can't bring your family to a game anymore without spending hundreds of dollars, and that's a real shame imo. It's not all his fault, of course, but he and Boras together were the perfect storm that was needed in order for that to occur.

That said, he was humbled and it was nice to see him get a chance to redeem himself. I'm a fan of redemption. He was one of the best ever to play the game, with or without PEDs, and he's a shockingly good announcer/color commentary guy. I hope that we get to see him have a second career in that capacity. He certainly doesn't need the money, but I think he seeks adoration and respect more than anything, and assuming he's aware of the overwhelmingly positive reactions to his stint as a commentator I expect that we will see him behind the mic by next season, if not sooner.
 
mauconnfan said:
"Don't get me started he's a great guy...." Does that in any way say he's more well liked than ARod. It speaks to Papi, as a person or in the case I feel, a fraud. You can think it meant amongst the world, but it didn't so take your arrogance and FO.
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This seems to be random words strung together. Are you now saying that you don't think Ortiz is more likable than ARod? I really can't tell.
 
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7774 said:
This seems to be random words strung together. Are you now saying that you don't think Ortiz is more likable than ARod? I really can't tell.
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I'm sorry I don't sit there and think out perfect paragraphs for you to enjoy, they are random thoughts imagine that? or can't you a**wipe? Geez you're a rotten POS. But for that reason alone I won't block you because I need some idiot to throw crap at sometimes when the workday is closing. Thank you for that, you're my Boneyard waste water treatment plant 77-74. Keep it coming.
 
The X Man said:
The irony of you calling someone a POS is amusing
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This reply has such a negative impact on me I'm hurt. By the way, who are you? LOL

Again anyone who would stick up for 77-74 (most of the time, I've admitted to my faults and have overreacted to his assaults on mine and everyone else's intelligence) isn't anyone I'd be friends with. So like 77-74 I am sure your friend also is proud of you X Man. Thank you for caring.
 
8893 said:
You simply can't bring your family to a game anymore without spending hundreds of dollars, and that's a real shame imo.
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What are you talking about, yes you can.
 
mauconnfan said:
This reply has such a negative impact on me I'm hurt. By the way, who are you? LOL

Again anyone who would stick up for 77-74 (most of the time, I've admitted to my faults and have overreacted to his assaults on mine and everyone else's intelligence) isn't anyone I'd be friends with. So like 77-74 I am sure your friend also is proud of you X Man. Thank you for caring.
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You're an old man who likes to fight on the internet. That's a definition of a loser
 
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