Olympic Team Announced

[ochoopsfan]

Currently the make up Team USA is 6 Power Forwards/Centers and 6 Point Guards/Shooting Guards.

Ariel Atkins, Sue Bird, Tina Charles, Napheesa Collier, Skylar Diggins-Smith, Sylvia Fowles, Chelsea Gray, Brittney Griner, Jewell Loyd, Breanna Stewart, Diana Taurasi, A'ja Wilson

I have seen several of the teams play in qualifying or pre- tournament, or "friendly" games and besides Cambage on Australia I dont think there is a "big" that the 6 we have, have to worry about. I might have made up Team USA with 7 pg/sg/w and 5 bigs, but I have no problem with the 6/6 split.

 

[bbsamjj]

It's actually not based on her size; it's more based on my general sense that no one has ever called her defense abilities standout (and she's never made a WNBA all defense team). But I am fine being corrected on Gray's defensive capabilities; I do maintain in the year 2021, you don't want to count on Bird/Taurasi/Diggins-Smith to shut anyone down. And I think even with Gray, Atkins adds a lot of defensive capabilities to the perimeter.

 

[baggerbob]

I know a few of you also follow the U.S. National Women's Soccer Team that just announced their 18-person roster on Wednesday. That announcement was followed very closely because the roster size is down from 23 in the World Cup and the preliminary matches have only two days between them. I've cut and pasted an article from the excellent soccer writer, Dan Lauletta on two personnel decisions that also involved inuries:

"Injuries, as they often do, also played into roster decisions. Forward Tobin Heath was injured playing for Manchester United in January and has not played in a competitive match since. Middie Julie Ertz was injured in mid-May and also has yet to play since. Both were included on the roster, which brings up unpleasant memories from 2016. Megan Rapinoe had torn her ACL in December 2015 and (then Coach/Manager Jill) Ellis took her to the Olympics despite no game action in between. After not being able to even play in the group stage, Rapinoe made a brief appearance in the quarterfinal, a game Ellis badly mismanaged that ended in defeat (on penalty kicks).

"Ertz and Heath still have two games ahead of the Olympics to get some base back into them, but with a short roster and tight schedules, there is a lot riding on the pair being healthy enough to withstand the rigors of the event."

U.S. Coach Vlatko Andonovski, who makes the personnel decisions, decided to bring not one, but two, of the starters from the World Cup, despite the fact that U.S. Soccer -- like basketball -- has depth galore. BTW, Coach A. named 4 alternates, which include one at each position.

The only official public comments on Nneka's omission (from Coach Staley) have mentioned her physical condition. No one knows the true extent of her (or DT's) injury -- or those of Ertz and Heath -- but U.S. Soccer is rolling the dice twice on its vets. Hoops split the difference (unless the Nneka decision was based on more than health).

dude, her sisters, coach, and those who know her well tweeted or said in interviews, that it was not due to her injury. Politics. Stunning Olympic snub of Nneka Ogwumike about basketball politics, not talent

Let's be honest, you have Griner, Fowler, Charles, Stewart, Wilson, and Collier who are playing, and better then Nneka who is injured. There is only 120 minutes for the frontcourt. That's 20 minutes if spread equally. Wilson, and Stewart will get at least 25 apiece. There isn't room for another frontcourt player.

 

[UcMiami]

I find it interesting how USA basketball based on their listing of the NT sees Collier - her position is listed as G/F which to my thinking means they see her as the only wing/3/SF selected to the roster and suggests that Nneka was not actually in competition for the same roster spot with Collier. I do think it came down to a sixth guard or a 6th forward/center and they chose a sixth guard in Atkins.

EDD is listed as G/F as was Augustus and Angel, and DT has been listed as such previously as well. In 2012 Parker was listed as F/C/G and Stewart has been listed as F/C

 

[cardfan]

Let's be honest, you have Griner, Fowler, Charles, Stewart, Wilson, and Collier who are playing, and better then Nneka who is injured. There is only 120 minutes for the frontcourt. That's 20 minutes if spread equally. Wilson, and Stewart will get at least 25 apiece. There isn't room for another frontcourt player.

Nneka will be playing for the Sparks next week. Again, injury is not the issue. She earned a spot on the team for numerous reasons which Ann Killion perfectly outlined in her article.

 

[UConnCat]

 

[baggerbob]

Nneka will be playing for the Sparks next week. Again, injury is not the issue. She earned a spot on the team for numerous reasons which Ann Killion perfectly outlined in her article.

Nneka was not going to play much on this team, so adding her was not an option.

 

[Dawson]

Legend

 

[Aluminny69]

If Maya Moore were still playing, there would be six Huskies on the team. That's half the team! Am I wrong?

 

[LwrcasefaN]

Summary...everyone would pick a different team...for one reason or another. AND...someone would argue that someone got snubbed. You could have a 20 team roster...and the same would apply. There's TWELVE. That's it. Support them or not. They will most likely still win. Any TEAM event faces these same decisions. Other countries and even other American teams wish they had this problem. Last thing...I think if people (I'm talking Peters, Parker and Fisher types) want to tweet that someone was snubbed, then at least include who you would remove. It's only fair that they face the same critiquing albeit it won't be as passionate because they aren't in the position to choose 12 players out of a very talented pool. Peters irks me the most because....I could argue for most of her WNBA career...she was probably taking someone's spot on the Lynx when she won an WNBA title. I was shocked that Grant was selected on the men's side. I don't see the same passionate arguments and conspiracies that he or anyone else took someone else's spot. I suspect a lot of the difference is that the best women don't make millions making the Olympics a bigger deal. The best men will decline in a minute because....they are not trying to get hurt.

 

[LwrcasefaN]

If Maya Moore were still playing, there would be six Huskies on the team. That's half the team! Am I wrong?

Would you select her? Who would you remove? This selection process isn't the same as picking US sprinters in individual events. There's a committee because...opinions vary. My point is...no matter who anyone chooses...they will be wrong to some other people.

 

[DeeHusky]

Ariel Atkins is the one they should’ve left off. She plays well sometimes and sometimes she just okay. Very streaky player.

 

[UConnCat]

https://www.nhregister.com/sports/a..._source=post original url&utm_medium=referral

Miller deferred to Callan when asked about the decision earlier this week by ESPN. Without specifically mentioning Ogwumike, Miller said it's “really, really difficult” to build the ideal roster.

“There’s so many great players, and ultimately you’re trying to put together the best team possible to allow the coaching staff to have success,” Miller said. “Every coaching staff every four years is a little bit different in their desires of how to build a team and what their preferences are. You try as a committee to understand the philosophical beliefs of that coaching staff.”

 

[mbr33ct]

Sorry if what I'm about to say was talked about, just coming in this thread cold. If Bird and Taurasi were not on team, would that make room for Nneka to make the team, or is the problem with the other 3 UConn players on the team?

 

[UConnCat]

Unfortunately this is part of the problem. There is a trend of thought that regardless of who the USA picks for the team it is not going to make a difference-USA will get gold. This fosters a lack of accountability from USA basketball in the selection process. When Syklar Diggins was cut USA basketball met with her to explain where she fell short. The 2016 omission of Parker was justifiable in simple basketball terms, i.e. there were better players at the position (Stewie and EDD) for the basketball things this team was trying to do: AKA @meyers7 "pure" basketball explanation. In 2016 there was also a player (Catch) who was willing to take a lesser role. This lack of accountability by USA basketball created a void with people creating their own explanations citing unnamed teammates and anonymous sources. In search of an explanation Geno and the personality of Parker became the low hanging fruit for the lazy to harvest-neither of which should have had anything to do with the omission of Parker in 2016. Parker didn't suddenly have a personality transplant in 2016 and Geno had won gold with Parker being very productive in 2012.

Today there is still lack of accountability by USA basketball and the lazy have turned on Dawn. Neka has been a solid citizen so there is not much for the lazy to harvest with regards to her personality. But the lazy is never easily deterred so guilt by association (teammate of Parker and Amanda Zahui B-who had the nerve to push Pheesa) will have to suffice. The lazy have also determined there has to a UCONN angle to the omission of Neka-there isn't.
It appears from both Derek Fisher and Dawn's statements that there might have been some "miscalculation or miscommunication " on when Neka would be fully heathy that may have factored into the decision to exclude her. If that was truly the case that explanation should be coming from USA basketball not Dawn. Saying you miscalculated or miscommunicated will never fully satisfy the lazy but it does demonstrate some level of accountability which USA basketball is severely lacking.

Inquiry for USA basketball and USA basketball only: Please provide a basketball explanation as to why Ariel Atkins is on my 2020 Olympic team and Neka is not.

I have a different take on this. USA Basketball is accountable. How? Results. Isn't that the ultimate in accountability for any organization? USA Basketball wins consistently and impressively on the world stage. The worst anyone says about USA Basketball is that there is politics (exists to some extent in every human endeavor) and that every 4 years it "snubs" a player. Then, a few weeks later, USA Basketball proceeds to win gold in impressive fashion. At some point there will likely be another 2006 World Cup (Australia next year?) and all the Twitter naysayers will trace that loss back to UConn, Geno and the snubs. That's just the way it is. USA Basketball will regroup as it did after the 2006 loss and move on.

I don't see the value in having Carol Callan or anyone from USA Basketball address why one player is chosen over another. I also doubt the players want that decision-making aired publicly. Also, where do you draw the line? Is it just the latest "snub" that needs to be explained? Or should USA Basketball go down the list and explain why others didn't make the team? Who asks? The media? Should Carol Callan take questions on twitter? To what end? As was the case with Parker in 2016, discussion of Nneka will eventually fade and USA Basketball will move on to Tokyo. I say that not to minimize Nneka's disappointment but that's where the focus needs to be. Nneka can then decide whether she wants a future with USA Basketball starting with next year's World Cup.

If a player wants to know why she didn't make the team then she deserves to be told why by USA Basketball. If that players chooses to share that information publicly then that is her right.

Also, you say Catchings "was willing to take a lesser role" in 2016. I'm not sure where that comes from but I guarantee you Catchings was disappointed with how little she played in 2016.

 

[CL82]

Oh yeah, you knew Candace had to say something before she's on the TV coverage and has to play nice.

Mmm, does she though?

 

[wolfe613]

dude, her sisters, coach, and those who know her well tweeted or said in interviews, that it was not due to her injury. Politics. Stunning Olympic snub of Nneka Ogwumike about basketball politics, not talent

not sure if I got this name right but Deborah Peters claiming Uconn bias and a lot of people might be basing off her article

 

[fang]

Mmm, does she though?

A little snark may leak out, but NBC always wants the Olympics to be all sunshine and lollipops, lest the bottom line takes a hit.

 

[CL82]

A little snark may leak out, but NBC always wants the Olympics to be all sunshine and lollipops, lest the bottom line takes a hit.

We shall see.

 

[UConnCat]

 

[Vowelguy]

I have a different take on this. USA Basketball is accountable. How? Results. Isn't that the ultimate in accountability for any organization? USA Basketball wins consistently and impressively on the world stage.

In a general sense I'm gonna disagree here. They could've selected my (deceased) grandmother and they'd still win gold. That doesnt make it right/fair.

And as someone in the corporate world, "results are all that matter" sounds a bit too close to the "our company has been successful so it doesnt matter that we dont have any women, Blacks, Hispanics, etc in lead positions."

I dont know enough about the Nneka situation or the merits of the other players to weigh on this particular matter, but I dont think winning a gold would mean that they did everything right.

 

[UConnCat]

In a general sense I'm gonna disagree here. They could've selected my (deceased) grandmother and they'd still win gold. That doesnt make it right/fair.

Absurd.

And as someone in the corporate world, "results are all that matter" sounds a bit too close to the "our company has been successful so it doesnt matter that we dont have any women, Blacks, Hispanics, etc in lead positions."

Right, which is why I made the next two statements: "The worst anyone says about USA Basketball is that there is politics (exists to some extent in every human endeavor) and that every 4 years it "snubs" a player." That's a far cry from engaging in the type discrimination you mention in your example. Has anyone said anything close to that about USA Basketball?

 

[The CDR-Ret]

If Maya Moore were still playing, there would be six Huskies on the team. That's half the team! Am I wrong?

You are NOT wrong, and she [Maya] would have been tremendous alongside Tina/Sylvia, Stewie/Wilson, Sue/Jewell, and DT for the majority of the minutes.

That would be like Dawn & Geno generally have used - a primarily eight person rotation until the game is well in hand, and this year's team should do it without Maya (hopefully) before half-time, if not in the first ten minutes against most teams.

 

[CocoHusky]

I have a different take on this. USA Basketball is accountable. How? Results. Isn't that the ultimate in accountability for any organization? USA Basketball wins consistently and impressively on the world stage. The worst anyone says about USA Basketball is that there is politics (exists to some extent in every human endeavor) and that every 4 years it "snubs" a player. Then, a few weeks later, USA Basketball proceeds to win gold in impressive fashion. At some point there will likely be another 2006 World Cup (Australia next year?) and all the Twitter naysayers will trace that loss back to UConn, Geno and the snubs. That's just the way it is. USA Basketball will regroup as it did after the 2006 loss and move on.

I don't see the value in having Carol Callan or anyone from USA Basketball address why one player is chosen over another. I also doubt the players want that decision-making aired publicly. Also, where do you draw the line? Is it just the latest "snub" that needs to be explained? Or should USA Basketball go down the list and explain why others didn't make the team? Who asks? The media? Should Carol Callan take questions on twitter? To what end? As was the case with Parker in 2016, discussion of Nneka will eventually fade and USA Basketball will move on to Tokyo. I say that not to minimize Nneka's disappointment but that's where the focus needs to be. Nneka can then decide whether she wants a future with USA Basketball starting with next year's World Cup.

If a player wants to know why she didn't make the team then she deserves to be told why by USA Basketball. If that players chooses to share that information publicly then that is her right.

Also, you say Catchings "was willing to take a lesser role" in 2016. I'm not sure where that comes from but I guarantee you Catchings was disappointed with how little she played in 2016.

I would be inclined to believe how the results was achieved is far more significant than the result itself for any organization and the principle of fairness is paramount in the how. A CEO who achieves record profits but does not treat his employees fairly and ethically is a common example. USA basketball has always had to make tough decisions about the selection of the national team. Silence, moving on or even a gold medal result does not serve USA basketball well. How is Neka supposed to decide if she wants a future with USA basketball next year if she does not know where she fell short this year? While it would be entirely impractical to hold a press conference to talk about everyone who didn't make the team it entirely practical to talk about the players that did and to address the selection process and thinking. Since the selection is made by committee there is no need to single anyone out, Carol Callan for example. What/who were some of the tougher decisions facing the committee? It appears that the committee decide to carry an extra guard vs a forward could you tell us what went into that thinking? The NCAA tournament selection committee routinely does this and tells you why in the opinion of the committee one team had a better resume and was worthy of selection and where another might have fallen short in competitive basketball terms such as strength of schedule, quality wins etc. Besides Parker and Neka there are also other non selections that merit explanation. Not that I have dog in this hunt as they are both ND but the selection or Jewel over Arike is also very curious. If we want to base it strictly on results in Arike two seasons in WNBA, Arike has twice exceeded Jewel best scoring WNBA season. Did Jewel get the nod over Arike because she will have 2 Seattle Storm teammates in Stewie and Sue on this Olympic team? Silence is what allows everyone to imagine their own explanations for the selection as I just did directly above. BTW I don't have to use my imagination as to why USA opted for an extra guard since two of the guards (expected starters) will be playing in their 5th Olympics.
I not looking forward to that point in the future you mention because I still scared by the 2004 Men's Olympic team. Prior to those Olympics this kind of thinking was pervasive. That thinking was, USA men were going to win gold. How could USA not win gold when the roster was loaded with future HoF players and a coach who had won both an NCAA and NBA championship as a head coach. The selection of these teams matter, the coach matters , more transparency by USA basketball is needed and matters very much.

 

[baggerbob]

I would be incline to believe how the results was achieved is far more significant than the result itself for any organization and the principle of fairness is paramount in the how. A CEO who achieves record profits but does not treat his employees fairly and ethically is a common example. USA basketball has always had to make tough decisions about the selection of the national team. Silence, moving on or even a gold medal result does not serve USA basketball well. How is Neka supposed to decide if she wants a future with USA basketball next year if she does not know where she fell short this year? While it would be entirely impractical to hold a press conference to talk about everyone who didn't make the team it entirely practical to talk about the players that did and to address the selection process and thinking. Since the selection is made by committee there is no need to single anyone out, Carol Callan for example. What/who were some of the tougher decisions facing the committee? It appears that the committee decide to carry an extra guard vs a forward could you tell us what went into that thinking? The NCAA tournament selection committee routinely does this and tells you why in the opinion of the committee one team had a better resume and was worthy of selection and where another might have fallen short in competitive basketball terms such as strength of schedule, quality wins etc. Besides Parker and Neka there are also other non selections that merit explanation. Not that I have dog in this hunt as they are both ND but the selection or Jewel over Arike is also very curious. If we want to base it strictly on results in Arike two seasons in WNBA, Arike has twice exceeded Jewel best scoring WNBA season. Did Jewel get the nod over Arike because she will have 2 Seattle Storm teammates in Stewie and Sue on this Olympic team? Silence is what allows everyone to imagine their own explanations for the selection as I just did directly above. BTW I don't have to use my imagination as to why USA opted for an extra guard since two of the guards (expected starters) will be playing in their 5th Olympics.
I not looking forward to that point in the future you mention because I still scared by the 2004 Men's Olympic team. Prior to those Olympics this kind of thinking was pervasive. That thinking was, USA men were going to win gold. How could USA not win gold when the roster was loaded with future HoF players and a coach who had won both an NCAA and NBA championship as a head coach. The selection of these teams matter, the coach matters , more transparency by USA basketball is needed and matters very much.

You shouldn't have used Loyd as an example, she was on the 2018 World Cup team, and played as many minutes as any of the starters.
She was a lock to be on the team as much as Stewie was.

 

[CocoHusky]

You shouldn't have used Loyd as an example, she was on the 2018 World Cup team, and played as many minutes as any of the starters.
She was a lock to be on the team as much as Stewie was.

Our (UCONN) Stewie? Jewel might have played more minutes but she didn't player better than Neka who was also on that 2018 World Cup team. In 2018 Arike was the darling of college basketball complete with appearances on Helen and Dancing with the Stars and she was also receiving praises from Kobe. It might have had something to do with Arike hitting those two buzzer beaters to secure ND a championship-something that Jewel had failed to do in 3 FF appearances. If you want to use the the Janet Jackson argument aka "what have you done for me lately": Arike lead WNBA in scoring last season Jewel was 14th. This WNBA season Arike is 5th & Jewel is 9th. Don't get me wrong, a strong performance on 2018 World cup team should definitely give you great consideration for 2021 Olympic team. I just don't think Jewel performance was strong enough to be consider a "lock" for selection and she not on Stewie's level.

 

[UcMiami]

I think there is a difference between what the USA basketball says publicly and their conversations with the pool players selected and not selected. I am pretty sure USA basketball had a long talk with Nneka as they reportedly did with Diggins-Smith when she was not selected to a roster and as I suspect they did with Parker.

Whether the athlete agrees/listens is not the responsibility of the committee.

People get upset when coaches call out team members for issues after a game and after a season and most coaches just keep their mouths shut in public and keep the criticism for the locker room or the office. Same for GMs and coaches on personnel decisions for pro teams.

He's a selfish SOB and I don't want him on my team isn't often heard when a 'star' get traded or cut - 'he is a great player and we are just moving in a different direction as a team' is the standard response.

 

[bbsamjj]

I think there is a difference between what the USA basketball says publicly and their conversations with the pool players selected and not selected. I am pretty sure USA basketball had a long talk with Nneka as they reportedly did with Diggins-Smith when she was not selected to a roster and as I suspect they did with Parker.

Whether the athlete agrees/listens is not the responsibility of the committee.

People get upset when coaches call out team members for issues after a game and after a season and most coaches just keep their mouths shut in public and keep the criticism for the locker room or the office. Same for GMs and coaches on personnel decisions for pro teams.

He's a selfish SOB and I don't want him on my team isn't often heard when a 'star' get traded or cut - 'he is a great player and we are just moving in a different direction as a team' is the standard response.

I think this issue that Chiney brought up on twitter (and Derek Fischer reiterated) is that if they did indeed have a long talk with Nneka, this would be the second/third time they've had the talk with her. And apparently the talk in the past wasn't "you're not good enough," it's...wait your turn, you're very important to us, we see a big future for you on the team. So to be told that, and to do everything right (win a WNBA MVP, be on the WNBA all defensive teams, and show up whenever USA calls and perform well) and STILL get left off definitely feels unfair...even if I understand it from a purely basketball perspective.

We'll never know exactly what conversations were had by Parker and USA basketball, but according to Candace, she felt blind-sighted. The most positive spin, which Voepel wrote about at the time, was: "Some will say it's strictly strategic: that the U.S. team somehow felt it had a surplus of what Parker does, and despite her being on the short list of "best in the world," she was the odd woman out."

 

[LwrcasefaN]

We can say it, but people in the selection process...and even reporters can't, but some players no matter how good they are...they aren't good teammates. I was a big Rhyne Howard fan her freshman year. I don't know what has happened to her since, but I wouldn't select her in a pickup game. Her attitude is just horrible! FOR ME...Candace is on this list. Jamelle Bailey.

 

[hoophuskee]

And apparently the talk in the past wasn't "you're not good enough," it's...wait your turn, you're very important to us, we see a big future for you on the team.

I am not arguing. And I want to add I don't follow the WNBA much - so to further that I am not arguing. . . But is that what they said in bold? Just curious how do you know this? I haven't read all the tweets and the links. So this was reported that this was said? Where? From an article? From a tweet?

This first part of your statement - when they said "wait your turn"- do you know what the basketball reasons were?

And the 2nd of "we see a big future for you"-- for someone that had to "wait their turn" in which she had to wait her turn for a reason - is it possible some others exceeded certain criteria they were looking for vs what Nneka brings?

So for a committee person or persons to say "we see a big future for you"-- how can that ever be said? If they didn't put Parker on way back -- how can anything ever be so guaranteed that your time will ever eventually come?

All I'm saying is that I would think there were was some defined basketball discussions with Nneka - much more than the broad comments you've made above that I highlighted. Those comments are so broad overall they don't have much/any basketball meaning.