Maryland’s $157 million counterclaim: ACC recruited B1G schools | Page 12 | The Boneyard

Maryland’s $157 million counterclaim: ACC recruited B1G schools

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West Virginia has been a hell of a football program. These cats won three BCS games - Clemson was gift compared to the other two.

Don't kid yourself - they'd have hip-checked everything but FSU into the weeds if the ACC had the stones to invite 'em. Unfortunately, they were a terrible academic institution a year before being a terrible academic institution no longer mattered.
 
WVU is also the same team that Syracuse beat three straight years with the last game in the Pinstripe bowl in 2012, the team that hapless Maryland murdered 37-0 this year.

WVU has won the big bowl game against Clemson but has also lost bowl games to FSU, North Carolina, NC State, Virginia, and Georgia Tech. The 2009 bowl where a 6-6 FSU beat the Eers by double digits, the 2010 bowl, where NC State's defense shut them down to 7 points, the 2012 bowl where Syracuse beat them by 24 points, are not indicative of a team that would have "hip checked" the rest of the ACC

Yeah, West Virginia had some good years with Pat White and Steve Slayton, but that high level of success was fairly short lived.
 
So? SU was'nt a bad team with Nassib the last couple of yrs and they had the stones(ability) to jump up and bite most decent team's and for WVU the desertion of RR created enough disruption to make them a bit unstable since! A state about the size of a good sized city does itself and the ONBE proud with their better than moderate accomplishments with what they had. Too bad FSU could'nt do more during that period with all the talent and support and stability they had? Underacheived? Understatement or the ACC would have been looked at more respectfully.
 
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billybud said:
Clemson has had its up and downs...They did win a national championship in 1981...they have been on an up the last several years.

Many of us southerners automatically put Ohio State in the "over rated" category.

As an FSU guy, I have been to two of our three games with Ohio St....it seems like 16 points is the differential.

And, the Buckeyes losing nine of ten to the SEC hasn't helped that impression....since NickyGaspipe was talking "impression".
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Yet no one gives the OBE any credit for having a winning record against the SEC in the BCS era(since 98) not to mention espin's shameless boosting of an overrated ACC FB the last 8 or so yrs ??
 
btstimpy said:
What's underwhelming and "a Joke" is Ohio State's constantly being "overrated" every year. Their bowl record since 1990 is 8-14. Not impressive. But yet every year they start in the top 5 only to flop. But not really a flop when you know they are "overrated". What rock do the AP voters crawl out from every year with the same result every year? The playoff system has gotten here just in time to keep up from watching more blow out losses by Ohio State in the National Championship due to their rolling through an overrated league to get there. Michigan used to be the same way, but they have fallen recently.
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Funny? The same could have been said about Clemson and FSU until FSU finally got it together this yr and mark my words UM at OSU(as much as I hate him) is really hauling in primo talent the last 2 yrs and will be in the NC picture soon!!
 
Mr. Conehead said:
Interesting, thanks. I have never been to USC nor Columbia myself; but, I have been to Charlestown twice and have enjoyed that city. One of the few small/midsize cities that is walkable and a lot of culture, history, and bars to check out.
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I Agree, absolutely feel the history thereabouts...Savannah too, I love the moss on the tree's and antebellum home's.
 
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billybud said:
Clemson beat Ohio State pretty handily in the bowl...beat LSU in the bowl before that..

Do not give me that "oops, WVU scored again" crapola..unless you also admit the Clemson just beat one of the best of the Big Ten. And the year before beat a BCS bowl LSU.

It is Ohio State who is not a heavy weight...losing 9 of ten games with the SEC...losing every match that they have played with FSU...
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Ohio ST? I never brought up OSU?But my nephew went to WV and converted mom's house into eer's follower's. I hate them(OSU) esp since UM arrived!! Most arrogant HC in CFB and thats saying something.
 
SouthronCross said:
We'll just agree to disagree on WVU.

Its not just the travel for them, man. Its the increase in competition, too. In all those years in the Big East, they only won the title outright on two occasions, so, it wasn't like they were dominating the league every year. Any objective fan could see that they were going to struggle in the Big 12, but, way too many folks bought into that hype coming off of the Orange Bowl, that they did not see their major deficiencies on defense.

I think they will right the ship, but, it'll be a few years before they seriously contend for the Big 12 title.
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Everyone knocks the BE, but they fail to see how good the BE was in OOC games and in bowl games. Compared to the ACC, they were so much better.

Read up: http://www.teamspeedkills.com/2010/4/26/1444886/sec-dominates-bcs-automatic
 
upstater said:
Everyone knocks the BE, but they fail to see how good the BE was in OOC games and in bowl games. Compared to the ACC, they were so much better.

Read up: http://www.teamspeedkills.com/2010/4/26/1444886/sec-dominates-bcs-automatic
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In the ACC its not "fail" but refuse to admit they were rated lower by the most objective observers!! Thats why espin and not the market has to keep(pay) to prop them up to try to compete with the Big3(excluding shakey12 and ACC) but at least the Big12 has a legitimate Texas market w/o needing to rely on holding up their sponsor(espin)!!
 
upstater said:
Everyone knocks the BE, but they fail to see how good the BE was in OOC games and in bowl games. Compared to the ACC, they were so much better.

Read up: http://www.teamspeedkills.com/2010/4/26/1444886/sec-dominates-bcs-automatic
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That article is a narrow timeframe. But, I don't think that the ACC missed on the value of Big East football programs. The ACC has added a bunch of former Big East programs. And should the ACC further expand, it will probably be with other programs from the former Big East including possibly UConn.
 
NickyNewark said:
In the ACC its not "fail" but refuse to admit they were rated lower by the most objective observers!! Thats why espin and not the market has to keep(pay) to prop them up to try to compete with the Big3(excluding shakey12 and ACC) but at least the Big12 has a legitimate Texas market w/o needing to rely on holding up their sponsor(espin)!!
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It's not hard to prop up a league with the undisputed Football National Champion, the Orange Bowl Champion, 11 schools with 7 or more wins in 2013, 11 bowl teams in 2013, and the league that sweeps basically all the college football individual awards including the Heisman Trophy in 2013. ESPN should be happy to prop that up every day. When the NFL has its draft this spring, that league might just place the second most players into the NFL again following only the SEC, who is recognized as the best football league and also an ESPN league.
 
upstater said:
Errrg, I really don't give a whit about ohio St. Nowhere near an OSU fan.
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I know. UConn and Penn State. But while we're talking about the media overrating teams, why not bring up the King?
 
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btstimpy said:
It's not hard to prop up a league with the undisputed Football National Champion, the Orange Bowl Champion, 11 schools with 7 or more wins in 2013, 11 bowl teams in 2013, and the league that sweeps basically all the college football individual awards including the Heisman Trophy in 2013. ESPN should be happy to prop that up every day. When the NFL has its draft this spring, that league might just place the second most players into the NFL again following only the SEC, who is recognized as the best football league and also an ESPN league.
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Isn't that even more of an indication of how badly the ACC has performed until this yr?(the fact the NFL has found all that talent there recently?)@No the sponsor is tired of Swoffy going to the proverbial well so often after signing a bad contract!! Isn't the idea of a good contract to make money?
 
btstimpy said:
I know. UConn and Penn State. But while we're talking about the media overrating teams, why not bring up the King?
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I think Ohio State is overrated indeed. I also give props to FSU, but Clemson is just one of those teams I rarely believe in.
 
Nicky, Nicky....

FSU has the nation's longest consecutive year bowl streak at 32....Teams like Texas, Florida, Michigan, Ohio State, USC, etc can't go back ten years.

FSU also has won six straight bowl games consecutively (also a nation leading streak for BCS schools)...

In the BCS era (the last 16 seasons)...FSU has won two National Championships and has ended up year end ranked (AP Top 25) in 13 of the 16 years.

For FSU, "lost years" means something different from some other teams.
 
NickyNewark said:
Isn't that even more of an indication of how badly the ACC has performed until this yr?(the fact the NFL has found all that talent there recently?)@No the sponsor is tired of Swoffy going to the proverbial well so often after signing a bad contract!! Isn't the idea of a good contract to make money?
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The ACC has done a lot of things to improve the contract. If you look all the teams are getting about $23.5 million per school this year right in line with everyone else and ahead of the Big XII. The ACC needs a network, and to get that they need to keep performing. For this year, the ACC has the Men's Soccer National Champion, and the Football National Champion. AND as of today, the ACC has the #1 ranked Men's Basketball Team, Men's Lacrosse Team, Men's Tennis Team, and Baseball Team. Hopefully all of these too will win national championships this year. It will help the cause.
 
I agree they have improved this year,,,that why I prefaced comments "until this yr" but the ACC's problem is mostly the conflicting interest's espin has in your footprint sharing w/the SEC and the network that's partly espins.
 
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btstimpy said:
The ACC has done a lot of things to improve the contract. If you look all the teams are getting about $23.5 million per school this year right in line with everyone else and ahead of the Big XII. The ACC needs a network, and to get that they need to keep performing. For this year, the ACC has the Men's Soccer National Champion, and the Football National Champion. AND as of today, the ACC has the #1 ranked Men's Basketball Team, Men's Lacrosse Team, Men's Tennis Team, and Baseball Team. Hopefully all of these too will win national championships this year. It will help the cause.
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You should add the school who won the field hockey and women's basketball national champs to that list. We can forward inquiries to the appropriate folks.
 
A few interesting comments, in my opinion, from OSU AD Gene Smith that were published in the Columbus Dispatch yesterday regarding the topic of this thread and the desire of the B1G for an east coast presence.
http://buckeyextra.dispatch.com/content/stories/2014/02/02/smith-sees-progress-wants-more.html

Q: When you look at Rutgers and Maryland, they haven’t set the world afire and Rutgers has had its issues with coaches and its AD. Do you still feel those are good additions?

A: I do. We could have gone a number of ways. I think it was great for the league and really good for Penn State. People haven’t focused on that enough. Penn State was sitting out there like an appendage. Anybody could have plucked them. The ACC could have plucked them.

The other one was the lock up a little bit of the East Coast with television. We’re doing that. We’re going to Navy next year. We’re playing in the Ravens stadium

A few questions come to my mind and unfortunate, in my opinion, that the reporter did not follow up further on the answer given by Gene Smith.

What other ways could the B1G have gone or have been (are being) discussed?

How much consideration was (or is) Penn State giving to a move to the ACC?

Is locking up a "little bit of the East Coast" sufficient or does the B1G desire an even greater East Coast presence and how would that be accomplished?
 
billybud said:
WVU is also the same team that Syracuse beat three straight years with the last game in the Pinstripe bowl in 2012, the team that hapless Maryland murdered 37-0 this year.

WVU has won the big bowl game against Clemson but has also lost bowl games to FSU, North Carolina, NC State, Virginia, and Georgia Tech. The 2009 bowl where a 6-6 FSU beat the Eers by double digits, the 2010 bowl, where NC State's defense shut them down to 7 points, the 2012 bowl where Syracuse beat them by 24 points, are not indicative of a team that would have "hip checked" the rest of the ACC

Yeah, West Virginia had some good years with Pat White and Steve Slayton, but that high level of success was fairly short lived.
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You can't really play that game of who beat who. Or, if you want to play that game, you should have invited UConn for its football, because Uconn had a winning record against Syracuse, Pitt, and Louisville.
 
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B1GALUM said:
A few interesting comments, in my opinion, from OSU AD Gene Smith that were published in the Columbus Dispatch yesterday regarding the topic of this thread and the desire of the B1G for an east coast presence.
http://buckeyextra.dispatch.com/content/stories/2014/02/02/smith-sees-progress-wants-more.html

Q: When you look at Rutgers and Maryland, they haven’t set the world afire and Rutgers has had its issues with coaches and its AD. Do you still feel those are good additions?

A: I do. We could have gone a number of ways. I think it was great for the league and really good for Penn State. People haven’t focused on that enough. Penn State was sitting out there like an appendage. Anybody could have plucked them. The ACC could have plucked them.

The other one was the lock up a little bit of the East Coast with television. We’re doing that. We’re going to Navy next year. We’re playing in the Ravens stadium

A few questions come to my mind and unfortunate, in my opinion, that the reporter did not follow up further on the answer given by Gene Smith.

What other ways could the B1G have gone or have been (are being) discussed?

I think it was very much public knowledge that Jim Delany wanted UNC and UVA. It would've pushed the B1G into the South, and, helped destroy the ACC at the same time. I do think that he underestimated just how committed both schools were to keeping the league together.

I also believe that he was giving serious consideration to UConn. But, their not being AAU was/is a roadblock. Which makes no sense to me. The B1G knew full well that Nebraska was going to lose their AAU status after they joined, but, they voted to accept them ayway. Which means to me that the AAU designation is not as all important as they would lead you to believe.

I still think he might want Texas, but, UT does not play well with others. So, they're going to be a tough sell, IMHO.

How much consideration was (or is) Penn State giving to a move to the ACC?

At first, I might've said 'not much at all,' until Wisconsin AD Barry Alvarez pointed out that UMD and Rutgers gave PSU the eastern rivals that they'd wanted ever since they'd joined the B1G.

Just maybe PSU DID talk to ACC folks through backchannels. Just maybe they did feel like the B1G did not have their back when the Jerry Sandusky case was settled. I honestly do not know.

I have read on their boards that some of their older alumni did like the idea of joining the ACC, but, it was not in numbers great enough to even make a blip on the radar screens of their powers-that-be. Their younger alumni and students are 100 percent B1G supporters. Its the league that they grew up with, and, they like the football culture that they B1G has, and, that the ACC just cannot match leaguewide.

Is locking up a "little bit of the East Coast" sufficient or does the B1G desire an even greater East Coast presence and how would that be accomplished?
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I think that the B1G still desire a much larger east coast presence, and, that UMD and RU are a way to sort of get their feet wet. At this point, at least, having a little east coast presence is better than having none at all.

TBT, Delany has multiple ways he can go. He could still try and pry UNC and UVA loose from the ACC, but, thats a longer term proposition now that the ACC has its own GOR. Or, he could go and get Oklahoma and Kansas from the Big 12, which would all but end that league. Or, he could be really bold, and, grab Missouri from the SEC, and, maybe get a single Big 12 team, like OU.

Just thinking aloud...
 
SouthronCross said:
I think that the B1G still desire a much larger east coast presence, and, that UMD and RU are a way to sort of get their feet wet. At this point, at least, having a little east coast presence is better than having none at all.

TBT, Delany has multiple ways he can go. He could still try and pry UNC and UVA loose from the ACC, but, thats a longer term proposition now that the ACC has its own GOR. Or, he could go and get Oklahoma and Kansas from the Big 12, which would all but end that league. Or, he could be really bold, and, grab Missouri from the SEC, and, maybe get a single Big 12 team, like OU.

Just thinking aloud...
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Despite Delany's wishes, I do not think UNC and UVA were ever nor will ever really be options for the B1G. It seems to me the interest has never been reciprocal despite speculation to the contrary. Due to geography, history, rivalries it is hard to envision any defections, with or without a GOR, from the southern core of the ACC: UVA, VT, UNC, NC State, Duke, WF, Clemson, Georgia Tech, FSU, Miami. The ACC could exist and thrive with just these members as part of a ten team conference if the emerging super conferences ever implode.

I think Delany and the B1G, if they want more of a presence in NYC and the East Coast, may have and still do need to consider UConn as one of the "number of ways". The conventional wisdom is that conference realignment is over; however, there have been enough B1G ADs who have spoken about the idea and even ideal of a 16 team conference - even after the ACC GOR - that it seems more is to come. A play for OU and KU to bring a football and basketball brand as well as pacify Nebraska as the western "appendage" of the B1G is certainly a consideration and more likely, in my opinion, than any more additions from the ACC. This seems to conflict though with the goal Delany has stated on multiple occasions of the B1G being a bi-regional conference. The eyes of the B1G, if you will, seem focused eastward and not westward.
 
Here's the rub for future expansion of any ilk....there aren't enough loose ends left.

If the Big 12 wants to expand, there's Cincinnati and nothing. I doubt they're going to want to go slumming for the fourth or fifth best programs in Florida and Brigham Young is like adding a square peg in a world of round holes.

The ACC wants to expand, there's UConn and nothing. Forget Cincinnati.

If the Big Ten wants to expand, there's UConn and nothing. Missouri would have to be pretty happy with their current digs and everything else is encumbered with a grant of rights.
 
upstater said:
One thing about Uconn women's basketball, it makes more money for UConn than college baseball teams, college hockey, many men's college basketball teams, etc.
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It should....Women's basketball at UConn is a big deal...the second sport after men's BB.
 
billybud said:
It should....Women's basketball at UConn is a big deal...the second sport after men's BB.
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So, are you still on your Syracuse beat WV kick? Still think that's relevant? If so, explain why UConn's record against the 3 ACC additions means little to you.
 
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