Irish fan on why UConn belongs in the ACC

[Pat125]

I'm never going to engage you on academics again. Without research, there is nothing to teach.

My grad school experience was quite good. And I went to some crappy AAU school. Go figure.

 

[SAMCRO]

Most of the ACC is used to the bowl pecking order thing. Notre Dame will have to follow the same rules as everyone else regarding record. A 6-6 Notre Dame team can't bump any 8-4 team. It could bump a 7-5 team though. But the positive is that the presence of Notre Dame has added bowl access to better bowls.

It sounds all so familiar bstimpy. All these same things were quoted back in '05 by BE fans. Seriously, you're invoking the spirits of SU, Pitt, WVU, RU, and UConn posters circa 2005.

 

[SAMCRO]

Animosity for what? We get 0 money from the football part of the ACC TV deals. We play 5 ACC teams per year in football. We play every team in the ACC home and away over a 6 year period. We have to go to Duke and Wake Forest just like we have to go to Miami and Florida State. Even Florida State will get a boost in ticket sales when we are on the schedule.

Bowls are going to mean less starting this fall with a 4 team playoff. If FSU is in a playoff and Miami in the Orange, nobody with power or sense is going to care that ND goes to the Sun Bowl ahead of Georgia Tech.

So you're telling me the BE schools had no animosity towards ND over the past 10 years? Honestly? As for bowls meaning less, I believe they'll mean the same as years past to everyone save the 4 (last year 2) schools not playing for the NC.

 

[SAMCRO]

Louisville won the Fiesta Bowl when Howard Schnellenberger was coach. I think most fans know what is meant today when you use BCS bowl - you mean major bowl, one of the big ones. Louisville has won 3 of them. And not back in the 1920s to the 1950s when the BUG was self-professedly the best football in the land.

You would know better than I do how much down talking of Louisville was done by ACC fans, but I wasn't down talking Louisville when it won the Fiesta or the Orange. Perhaps it is a soft spot for the hometown of Paul Hornung, but I like the Cards. And I know good football teams when I see them. Bobby Petrino had a couple of teams his first stop in Louisville that could have beaten us by 30.

Here is my prediction about Louisville football. It will help ACC football more than Maryland football will help BUG football, and it will also have larger attendance than Maryland.

Well if we're going beyond BCS era, why stop with UL winning in '91. Cuse won it in '93 and Pitt won it in '79. Shoot, the ACC owns the Fiesta Bowl. Still wasn't a BCS game. And I'm not knocking UL's accomplishments either, they've done great for themselves in athletics and are probably in the top 2 of ACC FB teams right now behind FSU, but there is no need to pad your point by 'finessing' your argument with sketchy non-facts. We both agree UL is a good football program.

 

[NickyNewark]

But the ACC puts ND in both the Northeast (as I define it, a Western Pa. guy) and the Southeast (where ND has emphasized it wants to be for exposure and recruiting purposes).

The Big Ten does not put ND in Boston, Atlanta or Miami. The ACC affiliation in football (and playing basketball, baseball and other sports there regularly) does.

Jack Swarbrick is on record as saying that ND wants exposure/games in a number of metro areas in the Northeast and Southeast.

ND can get into NYC and Washington by playing "neutral site" and Shamrock Series games in the former and Navy (and Shamrock Series' "home away from home" games)in the latter.

ND obviously covers the Midwest with six home games in South Bend per year.

Look at ND's future schedules I posted in this thread. ND wants to play in pro stadiums and/or big exposure venues in the Northeast.

BC and ND are going to play in Fenway Park. ND is going to play Army in Yankee Stadium and Syracuse at Met Life. ND will play Temple at Lincoln Field, etc...

ND will play Pitt at Heinz Field as an ACC opponent. ND will play Navy (and others) in Fed Ex Field in Washington, DC. I bet we see ND games at Gillette in the future.

ND's recruiting is being more concentrated in the Virginia Tidewater, the Carolinas, Georgia and Florida.

QB Everett Golson is from South Carolina. Possible first round picks Stephon Tuitt and Louis Nix are both from Georgia. Both stud running backs on the current roster (Greg Bryant and Tarean Folston) are from Florida. Look at the current roster and see the players from ACC territory. ND wants more recruits from the Southeast.

The Irish want the exposure of playing fairly regularly in the Southeast to counter the negative recruiting of "ND is so far away, your parents will never see you play in person" that ND gets from Georgia, Alabama, Florida, etc..

The Big Ten is of absolutely no help in this area. ND's leaders are concerned about being pigeon holed as a Midwest program in a mainly Midwest conference. That is one reason (of many) why the Big Ten holds absolutely no appeal to ND.

With the Northeast, Midwest and Southeast covered, ND then covers the Southwest with games against Texas, Oklahoma and Arizona State (as well as Shamrock Series "home" games at Jerry Jones' palace in Dallas and in the Alamodome in San Antonio) and the West with games against BYU, Southern Cal and Stanford.

ND wants to play football games in all areas of the country. The ACC helps with that where the Big Ten does not and cannot. ND has no interest in regular games against schools like Indiana, Iowa, Minnesota or Wisconsin (check the last time ND played any of them),

The teams u mention and many other similar institutions they refuse to play except on there terms is one of the very reasons so many root against them....I grew up in a IC home where ND was idealized but even many of Irish heritage are learning to hold their nose at them for there arrogant stubborness(Italians and Slav's too)!

 

[NotreDameJoe]

They have everything to do with academics. As I questioned in another thread, why do schools participate in big time athletics? Most run off of a deficit and it's against most of the mission statements of these schools. If it was just about student life, why couldn't they just go to the D3 model and spend much less money in the process?
Why, then, do schools participate when most university presidents could care less what happens in sports? Advertising their schools to a broader range of Gen Ed students. Academics.

Don't believe stats about how most D1 football teams lose money. Sports keeps the alumni in touch with their alma mater which leads to Tshirt sales and donations. Presidents know damn well what the alumni care about. Their lip service about distracting from academics is just to maintain their bowtie credibility.

 

[NickyNewark]

So you're telling me the BE schools had no animosity towards ND over the past 10 years? Honestly? As for bowls meaning less, I believe they'll mean the same as years past to everyone save the 4 (last year 2) schools not playing for the NC.

Bowls are still going to be VERY popular despite a 4 team playoff except to the 4 teams participating....I enjoy watching the rare OOC bowl match up's more than a couple of quasi-pro type factories of whom maybe pay for play cheating type questionable programs!

 

[NotreDameJoe]

Please remind me again as to the great accomplishments of Syracuse and Pitt, throw in BC for that matter. I don't think there is a lot of difference among all schools listed in your post. Re: ND? ND does what's best for ND. They bring precious little to the ACC's olympic sports and play football on their terms. No other P-5 conference was willing to let them do that.

The former Big12 commish was vocal in his recruitment of ND as a non-football member. That's what moved Swofford to change, as he previously had said "all or nothing" in re: Notre Dame.

 

[TerryD]

The teams u mention and many other similar institutions they refuse to play except on there terms is one of the very reasons so many root against them....I grew up in a IC home where ND was idealized but even many of Irish heritage are learning to hold their nose at them for there arrogant stubborness(Italians and Slav's too)!

The Shamrock Series games are ND HOME GAMES moved from South Bend to San Antonio, Dallas, Chicago, New York, etc...

It is nobody's business but ND's. Those are ND home games. They were always away games for the opponent.

Navy WANTS to play its home games versus ND at Fed Ex. They control the ticket sales. More money than at its 30,000 on campus stadium. The ND and Army games make up most of Navy's athletic budget.

Army WANTS to play ND at Yankee Stadium. More exposure. Syracuse's AD is the one who pushed for the Cuse/ND games to be at Met Life Stadium.

ND is not putting a shotgun to anyone's head to play at these venues. Rutgers and UConn turned ND down for games at Met Life and Gillette Stadium.

It was understood why. No hard feelings. Next team up.

 

[NickyNewark]

How's Swofford's ACC Network coming along? Delaney and the BTN are printing money..... printing it in big friggin stacks. If that's running a league into the ground, sign me up.

Stimp, you are giving me flashbacks to when the OBE got raided the first time and lost VT, UM, and BC (this was when the ACC company line was "like minded academic institutions"). BE then added USF, UC, AND UL and all the BE message boards were squawking about how the BE would be better off, had brought in better on the field schools, BE had ND for Olympic sports, etc, etc.... BE fans were wrong then, and you're... well, let's all check back in about 7-10 years and see where things stand. My gut tells me between now and then there will be a lot of ACC animosity towards ND and people will be scratching their heads over the UL selection.

Right Samcro ask stimpy why in comparison to the B1G the ACC's stadiums appear empty? Maybe no one cares?Remember most of the ACC schools play second fiddle to SEC in there own footprint!!

 

[NickyNewark]

I do want to see the ACC offer UConn. I quite frankly don't know what they are waiting on. I mean I don't and I do. It all has to be orchestrated to get more money from ESPN. Adding 5 teams at once would generate less money than 2 at a time base on how the contract with ESPN is structured. I don't think that anyone that has been added was a bad addition though. You will see no articles about the ACC making mistakes like you just read about the Big Ten making a mistake by taking Rutgers over UConn or last year's articles about the Big XII making a mistake taking West Virginia over Louisville.

Mistake? W/O RU UConn isn't even contigenous?Or under consideration at the time. There u go again playing RU against UConn....classic divide and conquer...do you think BY fans are stupid? You act like you're here to educate and bless us. First you thought Temple was a better add to any conference than RU....you certainly know how to do 1 thing though..make enemies,of course smoothly! I listen to nothing u say buttkis!

 

[Seaa Blue]

It was understood why. No hard feelings. Next team up.

Says Lucy to Charlie Brown.

 

[NotreDameJoe]

And I couldn't stand forking over $800 a month for a run down one bedroom when half that much in the Midwest will get you covered parking and a complex swimming pool. And people care about college football.

" $ 800 a month " ? There are no 1 bedroom Apt's in Boston... " rundown " or otherwise at that rate. You'd get the ability to rent a cardbox box to sleep in under a Storrow Drive overpass at this rental rate ( ..haha).That said, everybody chooses for themselves where to live, and what they want to charge others to live there, and others to pay to live there. Personally, given a choice, I'd much prefer to live in a small Apt in Boston than a mammoth Apt out in South Bend, Indiana,... like I said, I've been to South Bend twice too. But to each his own, of course.

Boston should be compared to Chicago, Worcester vs Ft Wayne, Norwood vs Naperville.

It's the entire region in general. In the Midwest there is a huge drop off in rents once you get out of the affluent parts of the big city. It drops off in MA too but the floor is much higher. Play around on Zillow imagine you are a first time home buyer (probably looking at a satellite town) and you'll see the $ difference.

 

[Stray_Dog]

Except for university exposure, Louisville's market presence means nothing for The ACC right until 2027, when their contract is up. There is no ACCN, and ESPN probably won't be giving The ACC more money. If the rumors are true and Louisville kept The ACC together, it was the right move.

...and if that rumor is true...how fragile is that conference when a conference is willing to blow apart should one or two schools not get what they want. ...And lets not forget there will soon be another elephant in the room -ND!

 

[NotreDameJoe]

The Shamrock Series games are ND HOME GAMES moved from South Bend to San Antonio, Dallas, Chicago, New York, etc...

It is nobody's business but ND's. Those are ND home games. They were always away games for the opponent.

Navy WANTS to play its home games versus ND at Fed Ex. They control the ticket sales. More money than at its 30,000 on campus stadium. The ND and Army games make up most of Navy's athletic budget.

Army WANTS to play ND at Yankee Stadium. More exposure. Syracuse's AD is the one who pushed for the Cuse/ND games to be at Met Life Stadium.

ND is not putting a shotgun to anyone's head to play at these venues. Rutgers and UConn turned ND down for games at Met Life and Gillette Stadium.

It was understood why. No hard feelings. Next team up.

There will always be Envy masquerading as a legitimate grievance. We've read plenty about how schools agree to contracts and then cry about how unfair they are.

...and if that rumor is true...how fragile is that conference when a conference is willing to blow apart should one or two schools not get what they want. ...And lets not forget there will soon be another elephant in the room -ND!

Like PSU wanting out of the BUG10 if some of their old east coast rivals didn't get in?

 

[Stray_Dog]

How do you arrive at the conclusion that UConn's fans are better than Lousiville's. Based on a rating in NYC? So a game without UConn would have had no viewers? There is no way to make the conclusions you are jumping to based on the data.

hmmm, it would have viewers sure! But lets demonstrate the data that supports that they were UCOnn viewers....the exorbitant cost of the tickets themselves and who was buying them. ASK if any ISU fan selling their tickets had a hard time getting rid of them, ask if they made a profit? It was record breaking and those tickets were going to a proven UConn fan-base! But please, please ignore this logic and how this logic supplements support to the hypothesis that this is because UConn was present in NYC... And if you want please ignore that ticket sales have something to do with eyeballs in front of TV sets and the demographics breaking down the location of those eyeballs. I want to hear the better math computation from the community college??? Please educate me!

 

[MSNDfan]

UConn blows away the schools the ACC added in WINNING, in MARKET, does adequately in ACADEMICS. The ex-BE schools want to see UConn's programs die. BC especially. And that's why this is happening.

Football drives the bus, and UConn does not blow away Louisville in any sense dealing with football.

People who are johnny come lately to big time college football tends to think that history does not matter. But it does to college football fans. And Pitt and Syracuse have history to go with enough winning the past 20 years to top UConn in football attractiveness as well.

So you're telling me the BE schools had no animosity towards ND over the past 10 years? Honestly? As for bowls meaning less, I believe they'll mean the same as years past to everyone save the 4 (last year 2) schools not playing for the NC.

As this board highlights, though not to the degree any WVU board does, some BE fans clearly blame ND for all their failures.

 

[MSNDfan]

There will always be Envy masquerading as a legitimate grievance. We've read plenty about how schools agree to contracts and then cry about how unfair they are.



Like PSU wanting out of the BUG10 if some of their old east coast rivals didn't get in?

Barry Alvarez made that rather clear.

But the funny thing is that the east coast rivals who always meant the most to Penn State are Pitt and Syracuse.

 

[Adios]

ND has to join as a full member before any ACC-related proposal even looks worthwhile, very long-term.

 

[MSNDfan]

The Shamrock Series games are ND HOME GAMES moved from South Bend to San Antonio, Dallas, Chicago, New York, etc...

It is nobody's business but ND's. Those are ND home games. They were always away games for the opponent.

Navy WANTS to play its home games versus ND at Fed Ex. They control the ticket sales. More money than at its 30,000 on campus stadium. The ND and Army games make up most of Navy's athletic budget.

Army WANTS to play ND at Yankee Stadium. More exposure. Syracuse's AD is the one who pushed for the Cuse/ND games to be at Met Life Stadium.

ND is not putting a shotgun to anyone's head to play at these venues. Rutgers and UConn turned ND down for games at Met Life and Gillette Stadium.

It was understood why. No hard feelings. Next team up.

I think we should try to get Duke to play us in NYC. Duke has a large basketball following there, and playing ND there in football could help grow its football fan base.

 

[upstater]

Don't believe stats about how most D1 football teams lose money. Sports keeps the alumni in touch with their alma mater which leads to Tshirt sales and donations. Presidents know damn well what the alumni care about. Their lip service about distracting from academics is just to maintain their bowtie credibility.

Tshirt sales and donations are counted as athletic department revenues. Also, ever heard of an AD bond out for the building of a football stadium or other facility? How do you imagine those are built?

 

[Seaa Blue]

Like PSU wanting out of the BUG10 if some of their old east coast rivals didn't get in?

Barry Alvarez made that rather clear.
But the funny thing is that the east coast rivals who always meant the most to Penn State are Pitt and Syracuse.

For the record.

Alvarez:

"Jim felt that someday, if we didn't have anyone else in that corridor, someday it wouldn't make sense maybe for Penn State to be in our league," Alvarez told the board, according to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. "That they would go into a league somewhere on the East Coast. By doing that, it keeps us in the Northeast corridor."​

Delany:

Asked last month whether he had any concern about losing teams from the Big Ten, Delany said, "No. Not in my view. But I do think that you need to build, and this build really solidifies the expansion we've done in the past. We've done one in the East, we've done one in the West [Nebraska in 2010]. I would say the driving force is demographics, but when you look at it, you can't help but think this is good for Penn State as well."​

 

[upstater]

Football drives the bus, and UConn does not blow away Louisville in any sense dealing with football.

People who are johnny come lately to big time college football tends to think that history does not matter. But it does to college football fans. And Pitt and Syracuse have history to go with enough winning the past 20 years to top UConn in football attractiveness as well.


As this board highlights, though not to the degree any WVU board does, some BE fans clearly blame ND for all their failures.

You don't watch much college football if you believe Pitt and Syracuse have done much winning in the past 20 years.

Cuse is 1-6 against UConn in the last 7 games. most of those have been blowouts. ND didn't beat UConn either. Not bad for a "johnny-come-lately" which is, oh by the way, the best basketball school in the nation over the same period that you tout Cuse's and Pitt's winning losing.

 

[Fishy]

I think we should try to get Duke to play us in NYC. Duke has a large basketball following there, and playing ND there in football could help grow its football fan base.

lol.

Seriously - good luck with that plan.

We get grief, but those f---ers couldn't put 30,000 in their stadium if they gave away handjobs.

 

[kibblesnbits]

I'm never going to engage you on academics again. Without research, there is nothing to teach.

I took my younger daughter this year to visit 10 highly regarded academic schools this year, including two in the ACC. Every one of them spoke about opportunities for undergraduate participation in research as it has become a huge component (along with study overseas programs) in recruiting a high quality student body. We didn't go to UVa, but I'll guarantee they promote it too.