editor of FSU board on FSU to Big 12

[Dann]

i swear, i just can't laugh hard enough. its keeps getting better and better.

From Dan Wetzel, Yahoo Sports:

"The first shock to the system hit Wednesday, when the ACC came to terms with ESPN on a 15-year, $3.6 billion agreement that sure sounded good in the press release. Each school was supposedly getting an additional $4 million a year. The average would be $17.1 million annually. Not bad, it seemed.

The reality was bad, however. The initial bump in television revenue is actually just over $1 million a year, sources said, and a total in the $12 million range next season. The deal is back loaded so the bigger money comes in escalator provisions that, considering how broadcast rights keep growing, probably will be below market by the time any sizeable gains are realized.


That additional $4 million per school, per year? That won't come until 2021, nine years in, sources said.


Privately, almost everyone was troubled by the deal.

Furthermore, there was consternation over the length of the deal, which could favor ESPN. Some wondered if it wasn't agreed upon just to save face, the later money making it look like the ACC landed a windfall in today's dollar.

The deal is done though. The only option is to further expand to 16 teams and force renegotiations. Unless that means adding Notre Dame (highly unlikely) there is no one available that would improve the value of the league.""

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/n...12.html#more-id

 

[johnhuskies95]

If FSU was winning ACC titles now the way they were in the 90's, does anyone think they would really be trying to change conferences?

 

[UConnDan97]

i swear, i just can't laugh hard enough. its keeps getting better and better.

From Dan Wetzel, Yahoo Sports:

"The first shock to the system hit Wednesday, when the ACC came to terms with ESPN on a 15-year, $3.6 billion agreement that sure sounded good in the press release. Each school was supposedly getting an additional $4 million a year. The average would be $17.1 million annually. Not bad, it seemed.

The reality was bad, however. The initial bump in television revenue is actually just over $1 million a year, sources said, and a total in the $12 million range next season. The deal is back loaded so the bigger money comes in escalator provisions that, considering how broadcast rights keep growing, probably will be below market by the time any sizeable gains are realized.


That additional $4 million per school, per year? That won't come until 2021, nine years in, sources said.


Privately, almost everyone was troubled by the deal.

Furthermore, there was consternation over the length of the deal, which could favor ESPN. Some wondered if it wasn't agreed upon just to save face, the later money making it look like the ACC landed a windfall in today's dollar.

The deal is done though. The only option is to further expand to 16 teams and force renegotiations. Unless that means adding Notre Dame (highly unlikely) there is no one available that would improve the value of the league.""

[URL='http://sports.yahoo.com/news/n...12.html#more-id[/quote']http://sports.yahoo.com/news/n...12.html#more-id[/URL]

Yes! YESSSS!!!!! And I love the part that says "which could favor ESPN." Yeah, no $#it it favors ESPN!

 

[Dann]

nothing says the house is burning down like your school pres getting out of bed at 11pm to put out a statement just so the school can get thru the weekend without the campus burning down.

WATCH OUT!!!!!!
you might get what you're after
Big 12 babies, strange but not a stranger
Nelsons an ordinary guy
Burning down the ACC

Hold tight, wait 'til the ACC's over
Hold tight, we're in for nasty weather
There has, got to be a Bi6 way
Burning down the ACC

Here's your ticket pack your bags
Time for jumpin' overboard
FSU isn't here
Clemson enough but not too far,
Lville you know where you are
Fightin' fire with fire, huah

All broke, hey you might need a paycheck
Shakedown, dreams walking in boston daylight
twenty million dollars a year
Burning down the ACC

It was once a basketball league, just Duke and UNC
Gonna come in first place
Pitt and SU what did you expect
Gonna burst into flames
Go ahead

Burning down the ACC
My ACC, is out of the ordinary
That's right, don't want BC to hurt nobody
Some things, sure can sweep me off my feet
Burning down the ACC

No visible means of support and you have not seen nothin' yet
ESPN you
I don't know what you expect staring into the TV set
Fightin' fire with fire, huah

Yea
Burning down the ACC
Burning down the ACC
Burning down the ACC

 

[RS9999X]

https://twitter.com/#!/danwetzel

Dan Wetzel ‏ @DanWetzel
ACC TV deal so backloaded, sources say schools only get $1 mill bump next year. Won't be $4 mill until 2021

The last contract I saw had a 6% escalator every year. It would look something like this. Note the last three years. That's the extension over the old contract and makes up most of the increases.



Year 1 - 11.00 - mil
2 - 11.66 - mil
3 - 12.36 - mil
4 - 13.10 - mil
5 - 13.89 - mil
6 - 14.72 - mil
7 - 15.60 - mil
8 - 16.54 - mil
9 - 17.53 - mil
10 - 18.58 - mil
11 - 19.70 - mil
12 - 20.88 - mil
13 - 22.13 - mil
14 - 23.46 - mil
2027 - 15 - 24.87 - mil
average - 17.07 - mil

 

[HartbeatHusky]

The last contract I saw had a 6% escalator every year. It would look something like this. Note the last two years. That's the extension over the old contract and makes up most of the increases.



Year 1 - 11.00 - mil
2 - 11.66 - mil
3 - 12.36 - mil
4 - 13.10 - mil
5 - 13.89 - mil
6 - 14.72 - mil
7 - 15.60 - mil
8 - 16.54 - mil
9 - 17.53 - mil
10 - 18.58 - mil
11 - 19.70 - mil
12 - 20.88 - mil
13 - 22.13 - mil
14 - 23.46 - mil
2027 - 15 - 24.87 - mil
average - 17.07 - mil

That's amazing. This actually means that the NBE deal could allow our members to make the same as, if not more than the ACC schools, over the next 3 or 4 years if we can get 13-14M per school. It's a big if, but the ACC won't be competing with the Big 4 until 2027 and by then who knows how much they'll be making. If this is true I think the ACC is going to experience a mass exodus. Blood is in the water for sure.

 

[observer]

Miami needs to be invited to go...if FSU bolts, the Big 12 will have the option of cherry-picking one of almost any of the remaining schools in the ACC. Don't think they'd want Miami.

If, and a big IF, FSU goes to the Big 12 what would Miami add other than another team in Florida? Just like the SEC does not seem to want to add teams from states in which they already have teams why would the Big 12 be willing to do so?

 

[HartbeatHusky]

If, and a big IF, FSU goes to the Big 12 what would Miami add other than another team in Florida? Just like the SEC does not seem to want to add teams from states in which they already have teams why would the Big 12 be willing to do so?

I think it's a little different in the SEC because they already have that entire contiguous southeastern region of the US. I don't know that the B12 would want Miami, but it is a huge media market that would help the Big 12 solidify itself as a presence in Florida and a good brand name for a conference that is rebuilding.

 

[observer]

@dennisdoddcbs: FSU news ... http://post original url/iFjYZMDG

Posted: 11:22 pm May 12, 2012

FSU says "misinformation" spread about ACC contract
By Dennis Dodd | Senior College Football Columnist

Florida State's president reacted late Saturday saying "misinformation" was spread about ACC Contract:

"Florida State University regrets that misinformation about the provisions of the ACC contract has unnecessarily renewed the controversy and speculation about University's athletic conference alignment. Florida State respects the views of the Chair of its Board of Trustees that, of course, any university would examine options that would impact university academics, athletics or finances. At the same time, Florida State is not seeking an alternative to the ACC nor are we considering alternatives. Our current commitments remain strong."

What the Chair of the FSU BOT said could mean something or not much at all. As trustees the members of the FSU Board have an obligation to always consider options and opportunities for FSU just like a corporate board has the obligation to actively consider options for the corporation. Remember in the last round of ACC expansion there were allegations that the representatives of the departing schools on the Board of the BE violated their fiduciary duty to the BE by working to move their schools to the ACC. Bottom line, a board of any entity always should consider alternatives and if they do not they are remiss in the discharge of their fiduciary duty. Whether the Chair of the FSU Board was just venting remains to be seen but what he said does not automatically mean that FSU will depart for another conference.

 

[Fishy]

If, and a big IF, FSU goes to the Big 12 what would Miami add other than another team in Florida? Just like the SEC does not seem to want to add teams from states in which they already have teams why would the Big 12 be willing to do so?

Why did the ACC add Miami? They were just another team in Florida, right?

Just a quick observation about Observer....fear has rolled into ACCville a ways ahead of schedule. The barbarians may not be at the gates, but the realization that there be barbarians and that they be coming for the gates one of these days has dawned on him.

 

[RS9999X]

The difference between the ACC contract and the rewrite with SU and Pitt during the first 12 years (assuming a 6% escalator)
Year 1 1.8 - mil
2 1.9 - mil
3 2.0 - mil
4 2.1 - mil
5 2.2 - mil
6 2.3 - mil
7 2.5 - mil
8 2.6 - mil
9 2.8 - mil
10 3.0 - mil
11 3.1 - mil
12 3.3 - mil
The real money is in years 13, 14 and 15. The extension assumes media rights will double in 12 years from 11 mil in year 1 to 22 mil after year 12

13 22.13 - mil
14 23.46 - mil
15 24.87 - mil

 

[RS9999X]

The FSU President is vulnerable. He's begging the Boosters to cover shortfalls and fund projects. The
Boosters appear to be on board with a move from the ACC.

 

[Dann]

new cbs article

by monday the acc will be crisp

 

[WallStreetHusky]

Why did the ACC add Miami? They were just another team in Florida, right?

Just a quick observation about Observer....fear has rolled into ACCville a ways ahead of schedule. The barbarians may not be at the gates, but the realization that there be barbarians and that they be coming for the gates one of these days has dawned on him.

But if he squeezes his eyes closed really, really tightly and just ignores those bad men at the gate, maybe they will go away.......he is going to be toes up still clutching the presidents statement about how they need to stay for the academics....

 

[junglehusky]

The FSU fans are pissed. The home schedule next year has 5 games against non-football powers:
They are insulted and think attendance will take a hit again next year.

Murray State
Savannah State
Wake
BC
Duke
------------------------
Clemson
Florida

Spetman said sagging ticket sales in football is a key piece of the shortfall. The budget projects a drop of $550,000 in ticket sales compared to 2011-2012.

The average crowds of 66,293 for Samford, Brigham Young and Wake Forest in 2010 are 15 percent lower than the crowds for the first three home games of the 2009 season (Miami, Jacksonville State and South Florida), and the announced 61,674 tickets distributed for the 2010 Wake Forest game was the lowest in nearly 18 years, going back to a 1992 game against Tulane.

Total attendance has decreased every year since 2008, the last of eight consecutive years in which FSU averaged 80,000 or more for home games. Now, FSU has gone five consecutive home games without drawing as many as 70,000, dating to last year.

Well the conference home schedule is a league issue, I do remember some ink being spilled on the matter. So I can see the fanbase being pissed about that. But the nonconference patsies... I feel no pity for the program, that's the doing of the (previous) coach and AD. Aside from the scheduling issues (though it's related), as far as the attendance / interest problems, you have to look at the coach and athletic director as being on the hook for that. Would FSU fans be more excited to play Iowa State, Kansas, and Texas Tech? I don't know...

 

[The Funster]

I'm going to wait and see. On the one hand, FSU does appear to get a regular screwing from the ACC schedule makers. The boosters and fans have a good reason to be pissed about it, too. On the other hand, you have the chairman of the BOT, who may be on the way out, perhaps capitalizing on the disgruntleness for his own well being.

I have been critical of Swofford from the beginning of this recent realignmnet merry go round. While others were calling him a visionary for poaching Pitt and Cuse, I've been far less complimentary. Moving for Pitt and Syracuse was a mistake. They have football pasts when the ACC needed programs with football futures. He made safe moves, negotiated a safe TV deal and reopened that TV and made it even safer.

He's not a bad commisioner but he is no where near visionary or "ahead of the curve". He's also doing his job which is to serve Tobacco Road.

FSU could go. It would be a panic move but they could go. Clemson might too. However, I don't see NCSt or Vtech going. I don't think their legislators ever allowing that.

I'd also be leery of UConn moving to the ACC under Swofford's leadership. The ACC is a better spot than the BE now but there may be a better opportunity later. What that is, I don't yet but the ACC under Swoffords good old boy network is kind of like going to the classic safety school.

 

[WhaleEER]

Savannah State is the replacement gave for WVU backing out of the game @FSU.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

If FSU and Clemson leave, every schools is going to try to get out. Several are already trying.

I think the TV contract was so far below market because ESPN and the ACC knew they were losing schools.

 

[observer]

But if he squeezes his eyes closed really, really tightly and just ignores those bad men at the gate, maybe they will go away.......he is going to be toes up still clutching the presidents statement about how they need to stay for the academics....

FSU may or may not leave the ACC; just as any school may or may not leave a conference. What my posts have been primarily directed at is the idea that schools will just jump willy nilly from one conference to another whenever a few more dollars are available. There is more to it than that.

Reasons for FSU to leave are basically more money in the current TV contract.

Reasons for FSU to stay in the ACC: cost of ACC withdrawal fee (20 million); additional costs of travel in Big 12 (have seen estimates of 2-3 million per year); having to give up playing either Miami (unless Miami also goes to the Big 12) or Florida because Big 12 has 9 conference games and if FSU played both would have room for only one patsy per year; hardship on athletes and their academics due to longer travel for conference games; hardship on fans as far as travelling to Big 12 away games as opposed to ACC games; academics (of course, only a factor in my simplistic analysis...FSU is really a football team with a University attached to it so who other than a few misguided souls gives a hoot about academics); easier path to BCS championship/playoff thru ACC than Big 12

A wash; being Texas' b*tch or that of Tobacco Road. Probably better in the ACC because despite the issues about this to date no ACC teams have left the ACC while Texas managed to drive away a good chunk of the Big 12 in the last two years. Devil you know as opposed to the one you don't.

Now I do not have any high level sources, imagined or otherwise, just what i think are common sense arguments. Can people conjure up the death of the ACC? Sure and maybe the Mayans are right and none of this will really matter.

 

[Dann]

FSU may or may not leave the ACC; just as any school may or may not leave a conference. What my posts have been primarily directed at is the idea that schools will just jump willy nilly from one conference to another whenever a few more dollars are available. There is more to it than that.

Reasons for FSU to leave are basically more money in the current TV contract. they get to create there own eastern division to play every year, thats miles ahead of play duke and wake ever year.

Reasons for FSU to stay in the ACC: cost of ACC withdrawal fee (20 million); the b12 will ront 10 o that 20. additional costs of travel in Big 12 (have seen estimates of 2-3 million per year)they would be in a division with wvu/clem/gt/lville/tcu/miami for example, thats not a travel issue at all. also the b12 has in place travel $$ makeups where a school like wvu will get an extra amount or travel costs to texas if things stay as there are right now. anything rumor wise you see on travel is bs.; having to give up playing either Miami (unless Miami also goes to the Big 12) or Florida because Big 12 has 9 conference games and if FSU played both would have room for only one patsy per year both would be easy to keep on the schedule, miami in division and florida as there big ooc game; hardship on athletes and their academics due to longer travel for conference games not an issue with a eastern division fsu gets to mold, your reaching for thoughts to why not...; hardship on fans as far as travelling to Big 12 away games as opposed to ACC games same as last comment; academics (of course, only a factor in my simplistic analysis...FSU is really a football team with a University attached to it so who other than a few misguided souls gives a hoot about academics)if the acc is torn apart, what academics? b12 isn't bad btw, it has some aau schools, its not like its cusa; easier path to BCS championship/playoff thru ACC than Big 12 b12 is harder, but that also gets you a bid or sure, winning the acc doesn't mean you would get a bid if bama/tex/usc/tosu all won there conf's. can't get left out like that, major butthurt then. making your own division as su would they would have a good looking path to play ok/tex most years in the ccg(the way they view it).

A wash; being Texas' b*tch or that of Tobacco Road.texas makes more $$ and atleast cares about fball, bacco road cares about bball, thats a different in bitch*s Probably better in the ACC because despite the issues about this to date no ACC teams have left the ACC while Texas managed to drive away a good chunk of the Big 12 in the last two years. Devil you know as opposed to the one you don't.

Now I do not have any high level sources, imagined or otherwise, just what i think are common sense arguments. Can people conjure up the death of the ACC? Sure and maybe the Mayans are right and none of this will really matter. i am the death cartoon from family guy when it comes to the acc

 

[Sean]

Speculation of this being the end of the ACC seems far too biased, to me. If FSU and one of Clemson/Miami leave, I think it's far more realistic that the ACC snaps up Uconn/Rutgers, essentially rebuilding the Big East in the ACC. Louisville would also be a possibility, although it might be just as likely that they get the final big 12 spot, with Rutgers or UConn then being left in the cold.

The ACC's strong foundation in North Carolina, Virginia, Maryland makes it far too viable to just disappear. They'd be much better off taking UConn/Rutgers to complete their geographic footprint, and formally kill off the Big East.

 

[observer]

Of course, how could I have been so mistaken. Half of the ACC is just going to go with FSU to the Big 12. Makes total sense.

Just a complete mistake to stay in a stable conference; better to join a conference that has lost four members in the last two years.

And Maryland is going to join the Big 10. You know, the Big 10 that expands at the speed of a glacier and could have taken MD at any time before.

And that means the ACC is gone as a place for UConn to land and what is left of the ACC grovels to join the NBE.

Wait, hold on a sec. Just saw a flock of pigs fly by my wiindow so anything is possible.

 

[WallStreetHusky]

FSU may or may not leave the ACC; just as any school may or may not leave a conference. What my posts have been primarily directed at is the idea that schools will just jump willy nilly from one conference to another whenever a few more dollars are available. There is more to it than that.

Reasons for FSU to leave are basically more money in the current TV contract.
I don't know Obs., if I have to be someone's beyotch regardless, I am going for the best paying pimp. Also, I think at least the Horns and OU at least have football as their priority. FSU shares more philosophically with them than the Lords of Tobacco Road.
Reasons for FSU to stay in the ACC: cost of ACC withdrawal fee (20 million); additional costs of travel in Big 12 (have seen estimates of 2-3 million per year); having to give up playing either Miami (unless Miami also goes to the Big 12) or Florida because Big 12 has 9 conference games and if FSU played both would have room for only one patsy per year; hardship on athletes and their academics due to longer travel for conference games; hardship on fans as far as travelling to Big 12 away games as opposed to ACC games; academics (of course, only a factor in my simplistic analysis...FSU is really a football team with a University attached to it so who other than a few misguided souls gives a hoot about academics); easier path to BCS championship/playoff thru ACC than Big 12

A wash; being Texas' b*tch or that of Tobacco Road. Probably better in the ACC because despite the issues about this to date no ACC teams have left the ACC while Texas managed to drive away a good chunk of the Big 12 in the last two years. Devil you know as opposed to the one you don't.

Now I do not have any high level sources, imagined or otherwise, just what i think are common sense arguments. Can people conjure up the death of the ACC? Sure and maybe the Mayans are right and none of this will really matter.

I don't know Obs, if I have to be someone's beyotch regardless, I am going for the best paying pimp.

Also, the Horns and OU would at least share football as the main priority with FSU, unlike the Lords of Tobacco Road.

 

[HartbeatHusky]

Speculation of this being the end of the ACC seems far too biased, to me. If FSU and one of Clemson/Miami leave, I think it's far more realistic that the ACC snaps up Uconn/Rutgers, essentially rebuilding the Big East in the ACC. Louisville would also be a possibility, although it might be just as likely that they get the final big 12 spot, with Rutgers or UConn then being left in the cold.

The ACC's strong foundation in North Carolina, Virginia, Maryland makes it far too viable to just disappear. They'd be much better off taking UConn/Rutgers to complete their geographic footprint, and formally kill off the Big East.

I honestly think that if the B12 can get FSU they would have almost no incentive to stop there. I think that Miami, Clemson, and one more would be pretty easy pickings for them at that point. Losing 4 schools to the B12 I think would leave the ACC very vulnerable to the B!G and SEC. Hell, losing 2 schools would weaken them significantly. They really better hope they don't lose anyone.

 

[johnhuskies95]

Of course, how could I have been so mistaken. Half of the ACC is just going to go with FSU to the Big 12. Makes total sense.

Just a complete mistake to stay in a stable conference; better to join a conference that has lost four members in the last two years.

And Maryland is going to join the Big 10. You know, the Big 10 that expands at the speed of a glacier and could have taken MD at any time before.

And that means the ACC is gone as a place for UConn to land and what is left of the ACC grovels to join the NBE.

Wait, hold on a sec. Just saw a flock of pigs fly by my wiindow so anything is possible.

It seems to me that you really don't want the ACC to lose any members.

 

[junglehusky]

If FSU and Clemson leave, every schools is going to try to get out. Several are already trying.

I think the TV contract was so far below market because ESPN and the ACC knew they were losing schools.

The way I would phrase it: if FSU and Clemson leave, several ACC schools will evaluate leaving, some of whom will establish contact with other conferences. Depending whether the SEC wants NCSt. or if the B1G wants UVa/UMd, and how badly they want to add them would determine whether the ACC implodes immediately. I would guess that if 2+ schools don't decide to leave within a year after FSU makes it's decision, the ACC would get a GOR agreement written and invite UConn and rutgers.

The other factor is whether these schools trust each other. Nobody in theBE trusts each other today (Louisville is being upfront about wanting out, and id guess if things get serious between us and the ACC Herbst would make a similar disclosure...) If NCSt forms an exploratory committee what will UNC do? What if Maryland makes overtures but no other conferences are interested? It's easy to say the while thing collapses, but maybe they stagger along like the BE has. I don't know what will happen.

Sent from my SGH-T679 using Tapatalk 2

 

[junglehusky]

Everybody wants more TV money, but not every school is going to be able to get what they want.

Sent from my SGH-T679 using Tapatalk 2

 

[ConnHuskBask]

I think the TV contract was so far below market because ESPN and the ACC knew they were losing schools.

Throughout this whole mess, this is something I actually agree with you on.

ESPN knows exactly what is going on and I think they negotiated the ACC deal picturing UConn/Rutgers in the place of Clemson/FSU, while the Big12 was negotiated with more money knowing that FSU/Clemson would be coming in later.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Throughout this whole mess, this is something I actually agree with you on.

ESPN knows exactly what is going on and I think they negotiated the ACC deal picturing UConn/Rutgers in the place of Clemson/FSU, while the Big12 was negotiated with more money knowing that FSU/Clemson would be coming in later.

I think Clemson/FSU for UConn/Rutgers still gets the ACC close to $20MM and might even leave the Tier 3's. I think more departures are anticipated.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

The way I would phrase it: if FSU and Clemson leave, several ACC schools will evaluate leaving, some of whom will establish contact with other conferences. Depending whether the SEC wants NCSt. or if the B1G wants UVa/UMd, and how badly they want to add them would determine whether the ACC implodes immediately. I would guess that if 2+ schools don't decide to leave within a year after FSU makes it's decision, the ACC would get a GOR agreement written and invite UConn and rutgers.

The other factor is whether these schools trust each other. Nobody in theBE trusts each other today (Louisville is being upfront about wanting out, and id guess if things get serious between us and the ACC Herbst would make a similar disclosure...) If NCSt forms an exploratory committee what will UNC do? What if Maryland makes overtures but no other conferences are interested? It's easy to say the while thing collapses, but maybe they stagger along like the BE has. I don't know what will happen.

Sent from my SGH-T679 using Tapatalk 2

The think about the ACC is there are a handful of programs that every other conference would want: UNC, UVa, maybe VTech to a lesser extent. There are others like Maryland, GTech, Miami, FSU, NC State and Clemson that could be very valuable and accretive to the right league. So when a league with these properties gets a deal that is so far below what similar schools are getting, there will be departures. And probably more than just Clemson and FSU.