OT: Celtics / Cavs megadeal
- Thread starter JSM1970
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OK that settles it.
the Q
Yowie Wowie. We’re gonna have so much fun here
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Turning Marcus Thorton into IT was not a win? Trading Troy Bell for Perkins was not a win? Turning Chucky Atkins and Chris Mihm into the pick which was used on Rondo was not a win? Trading Jeff Green and Wally for Ray Allen and Glen Davis was not a win?
Are you JSMs brother?
ESPN is the worst sports recourse for good analysis, do yourself a favor find someone else to be brainwashed by.
Absolutely not.. Cavs are still the best team in the East.. I think the Wizards are even better on paper now, since the Cs gave up their 2 best defenders in Crowder and Bradley. Boston is relying a lot now on Jaylen Brown (good player but not a guy you wanna be hanging your hat on) and Tatum (will be good I think but again, not a guy you wanna be relying on in the playoffs at this point)
the Q
Yowie Wowie. We’re gonna have so much fun here
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Did you not see I mentioned an article that started with about 2014? So bringing in stuff from 2003 or 2004 does nothing.
No.. their starting lineup is IT, JR Smith, LeBron, Love, Thompson. Crowder will play with LeBron in lineups but he won't start.
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Boston is 2/1 to win the East, Wizards are 10/1.
So? Like I said, I don't wanna be depending on rookies and 2nd year players when playoff time comes. On paper, I'll take Wall/Beal/Porter over the Cs top 3 options.
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So the article is bad and pointless. Cool, thanks for sharing it.
2 biggest trades which can be judged since 2014 are turning Marcus Thorton into IT. WIN. And turning Rondo into Crowder. Win.
HuskyHawk
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Did everyone just forget that they picked up Hayward? I don't think either Tatum or Brown are in the starting lineup.
I'm guessing here, but I think Ainge saw enough from Marcus Smart last season when IT got hurt, to want to find him minutes. Rozier has shown he can play. I think they will expect Smart to cover some of Irving's defensive weaknesses.
Brown is a pretty good defender on the wing as well, and his shooting should be improved. It's a very versatile team, which is what Steven's wants.
My main concern is rebounding and interior defense. Ainge is going to need to add someone else.
the Q
Yowie Wowie. We’re gonna have so much fun here
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No the point was about THIS rebuild.
Which is relevant. You just choose to ignore it.
Danny has made a lot of trades. When he wins he wins big, but doesn't win nearly as often as we think, and he got hammered on this one.
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Trade is a nearly a wash to me. I give the slight edge to the Cavs because of Crowder and the draft pick (which they will screw up). Neither team can beat Golden State, but if the Knicks do the smart thing and buy out Melo...
Last season
Kyrie: 47.3% FG, 40.1% 3PT, 5.8 Dimes, PER of 23
IT: 46.3 FG, 37.9%, 5.9 Dimes, PER 26....and he wasn't playing off Lebron.
That is at best a wash to me because of the Lebron factor. Nether is a good defender, though IT shows a little more effort.
Last season
Kyrie: 47.3% FG, 40.1% 3PT, 5.8 Dimes, PER of 23
IT: 46.3 FG, 37.9%, 5.9 Dimes, PER 26....and he wasn't playing off Lebron.
That is at best a wash to me because of the Lebron factor. Nether is a good defender, though IT shows a little more effort.
You think the Celts are the loser on this trade?
IT is 5' 9 and Kyrie is 6' 1 how are people overlooking this?
nelsonmuntz
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This was a bad trade for the Celtics. I am not clear that Irving is a significant improvement from Isiah Thomas straight up. I get the salary dump with Crowder, but including the draft pick was just awful. Furthermore, the value of Irving was dropping every day that the Cavaliers couldn't get a deal done, and then this happens.
Ainge got taken behind the woodshed by a GM with less than a month on the job.
Ainge got taken behind the woodshed by a GM with less than a month on the job.
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Another post with zero analysis and facts and the regurgitation of the opinion of an ESPN writer. Thank you for your contribution.
The fact you agree with @nelsonmuntz tells you all you should need to know.
Waquoit
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At least he didn't have to give up his watch.
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Because they are both only good at scoring and his height hasn't stopped him from doing so in high volume. His height is only and issue on Defense, and if you think that give Kyrie and advantage.....you have never seen him play defense. He is turrrible.
By the way, Kyrie is 6'3". And he is still a bad defender.
You can't have IT in the PnR at all can he even be on the court v. the Warriors? You can hide Kyrie on defense but how do you hide IT?
HuskyHawk
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So far I have not seen a single "expert" at any site that doesn't think the Celtics are the loser in this trade. Given that Cleveland had to unload Irving, it was a huge haul for him.
It was probably a smart move for both teams, because they were both boxed in. IT plus Crowder more than makes up for Irving in terms of Cleveland's ability to win next year. They just got better. The pick helps them post Lebron in two years.
Boston was going to have to let IT walk after this season or put too much money into a limited 30 year old. They got a little better this year, because they were overloaded at Crowder's position anyway once they signed Hayward. The biggest loss really is Avery Bradley, because he'd be a great compliment to Irving. So Smart will need to play a lot more, and is definitely a plus defender. The Celtics become incredibly tough to defend with a lot of scoring wings and much bigger backcourt. They need to hope they can turn the Laker's pick into a quality big man next year.
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His height has affected him greatly in the playoffs. There is a reason why his shooting percentages drop significantly and his turnovers increase.
HuskyHawk
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And Thomas isn't 5'9". 5'8" is generous. Celtics now have a big backcourt with Smart likely to play a lot more minutes.
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If I have to hide a player, does it matter?
Why would Steph Curry want to run PnR against IT? In an iso he gets IT on an island. In PnR he winds up with a larger defender. Sure, his role partner gets IT, but why bother.
Did you watch any of the games in Finals last year? Kyrie doesn't guard Curry well either. He doesn't guard anyone well. So his height advantage over IT ain't worth a bag of .
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