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upstater said:
Oregon was just in a close one with OSU, a team that lost to Washington 69-27 the previous week. Wisky has beaten the bad teams they played, and lost to the good, and was dominated by a mediocre at best PSU team. I haven't really checked the others, but I bet they played some close ones against bad comp too. Temple is bad no doubt, but at least USF has beaten Cincy. Michigan State, in fact, was up by only 1 score over USF until late in their game.
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CF is filled with the inexplicable, well not really, see my post response to one of Billy Bud's posts. Motivation, travel, match ups, venues, rivalries, youth, focus and execution are heavy factors at this level. PSU clearly won the "motivation, focus & execution" battles with Wisky. I mean Wisky did beat IU 51-7, and the Hoosiers spanked PSU. I wouldn't say PSU dominated Wisky as much as the Badgers beat themselves. They played awful and O'Brien is to good of a coach not to exploit such mistakes. I was at the PSU-Minny game, btw Minny lost to Wisconsin, and the Gophers were in control for much of their matchup with PSU and won. The score may suggest differently, but Minnesota controlled the lines and just knew they would win, no one at TCF seemed worried after seeing a few quarters. Minny has had a lot of success against PSU over the years, esp during the Mason era - thus a rivalry for them, not so much PSU & it shows for them in the loss column.
 
gioff23 said:
FSU is overrated. They beat NO ONE. The ACCis incredibly weak and they and OSU benefitted from down years in thier respective conferences.

Miami and Duke would not make it out of the SEC with winning records. Heck, Duke would not finish in the top 2 in the AAC.

Having a NC game w/FSU and OSU sparring is a perfect way for the BCS to end -- let the better teams watch the games from their couches. Then again, I think OSU gets knocked off this weekend.
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I disagree, both the ACC and BIG have crowded mid-level teams with a lot of bowl eligibility, both lack more than 2 or 3 "really strong" teams. The ACC had a lot of change this year due to expansion, these young men need a couple of years to adapt to the schedule - such is a tricky proposition. Last year, I suspected Mizzou would struggle more with an SEC schedule due to recruiting styles and greater travel than aTm, but look at this year.
 
Gfunk said:
CF is filled with the inexplicable, well not really, see my post response to one of Billy Bud's posts. Motivation, travel, match ups, venues, rivalries, youth, focus and execution are heavy factors at this level. PSU clearly won the "motivation, focus & execution" battles with Wisky. I mean Wisky did beat IU 51-7, and the Hoosiers spanked PSU. I wouldn't say PSU dominated Wisky as much as the Badgers beat themselves. They played awful and O'Brien is to good of a coach not to exploit such mistakes. I was at the PSU-Minny game, btw Minny lost to Wisconsin, and the Gophers were in control for much of their matchup with PSU and won. The score may suggest differently, but Minnesota controlled the lines and just knew they would win, no one at TCF seemed worried after seeing a few quarters. Minny has had a lot of success against PSU over the years, esp during the Mason era - thus a rivalry for them, not so much PSU & it shows for them in the loss column.
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No offense, but I'm convinced you didn't watch the game. It was domination.
 
I agree, you do matchup historically well, but that doesn't translate into playing a regular season against a BIG schedule.

I remember that FSU-PSU game, it had a lot at stake due to Bowden vs Paterno, all-time wins & it wasn't really a pretty game. As I clearly said in my response to you, things such as "motivation, match ups, injuries, momentum" etc., matter greatly. Similar to Oregon's sudden slide this season (loss to Stanford de-rerailed them, therefore an AZ loss) PSU missing out on a NCG with their loss to Michigan (2005), they lost plenty of motivation after realizing they would not play for it all. The pressure was on PSU, not so much FSU. Lower ranked teams, esp in a bowl game, generally have the motivation edge (upset alert) to pull it off. Give Bowden a month to prepare for any team, game on, but the same goes for Paterno. If I'm not mistaken, PSU had some key injuries in that game as well. That Polouszny guy was playing with a broken something.

That PSU team had QB controversy all year, it eventually got exposed against Michigan, you guys as well.

billybud said:
I am not A Big Ten guy....But FSU has historically matched up well against Big Ten teams...

Beat 11 win Michigan, the Big Ten Champ in their Big House, by scoring 51 points to set a scoring record (split 1-1 record with Michigan)...beat Michigan State both times that they have played (in Lansing by a combined score of 62-10), beat Ohio State by at least two scores every time that they have played (twice in Columbus and once in the Sugar), beat Wisconsin in Champs Bowl by 29 points...and my favorite..

FSU lost to Penn State in the Orange Bowl in FSU's down years (2005)...Penn State was 11-1 (lost on the last play of game to Michigan to keep them from being undefeated). There was much whining and carping about being disrespected and having to play 8-4 FSU in the Orange Bowl. David Robinson spent his evening being chased and tackled by the Nole front line as the game went to triple overtime. A great defensive battle.

The Myth of FSU's Dynasty Run Being with a Weak Schedule:

During the Dynasty run...FSU played a tough Schedule (teams play schedules not conferences).

Both Miami and Florida were in the Top Five Winningest Teams of the 90's...and they blew the schedule up playing both every year.

This run started in 1987 and ending in the year 2000. Let's compare schedule of the I-A teams over that period.

Florida State played 172 games from 1987 to 2000. Their .887 winning percentage is about 3 percentage points better than the second place team.

Florida State played 35 teams that finished in the top 10. That's 20.3% of their games and a higher percentage than all but 2 teams.

Florida State played 67 teams that finished ranked. That's 39.0% of their games and a higher percentage than all but 3 teams.

Florida State played 104 teams that finished with a winning record. That's 60.5% of their games and a higher percentage than all but 1 team.

Florida State played 90 teams that went to bowls. That's 52.3% of their games and a higher percentage than all but 3 teams.

Florida State's opponents combined for a winning percentage of .595, which is a higher percentage than any other team.
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upstater said:
No offense, but I'm convinced you didn't watch the game. It was domination.
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Disagree. It looked more like Wisky was flat, dumb (TOs and that blown coverage on one of PSU's TDs), out coached and overconfident. Wisky outscored PSU in 2 quarters of the game. Wisky abandoned their run game, big time, partly because one of the RBs was injured. The Wisky HC is not Bill O'Brien, he's made some seriously bad mistakes this year - he lacks in game adjustment skills. Btw, I rooted for PSU, almost always root against Wisky.

The stat lines were nearly equivalent, except the often overlooked yet supremely important TO column, which was the difference in the end - coaching as well. It was pretty clear Wisky switched gears, albeit too late, in the 4th qtr and a comeback seemed possible for much this quarter. PSU won the TO and coaching battles - hardly dominance. NO OFFENSE, but Stay away from unfiltered water. A better example of dominance is say PSU beating OSU in 1994.
 
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Gfunk said:
Disagree. It looked more like Wisky was flat, dumb (TOs and that blown coverage on one of PSU's TDs), out coached and overconfident. Wisky outscored PSU in 2 quarters of the game. Wisky abandoned their run game, big time, partly because one of the RBs was injured. The Wisky HC is not Bill O'Brien, he's made some seriously bad mistakes this year - he lacks in game adjustment skills. Btw, I rooted for PSU, almost always root against Wisky.

The stat lines were nearly equivalent, except the often overlooked yet supremely important TO column, which was the difference in the end - coaching as well. In other words, PSU won the TO and coaching battles - hardly dominance. Stay away from unfiltered water.
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Man, you're making classic excuses here. Stat line when the team out in front builds a three score lead? Really?

PSU got way out in front, played prevent and ran out the clock. It was classic fourth quarter football.

And turnovers are part of the game. So are blown coverage. UConn is a bowl team if not for turnovers and blown coverages.
 
upstater said:
Man, you're making classic excuses here. Stat line when the team out in front builds a three score lead? Really?

PSU got way out in front, played prevent and ran out the clock. It was classic fourth quarter football.

And turnovers are part of the game. So are blown coverage. UConn is a bowl team if not for turnovers and blown coverages.
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What excuses am I making? My posts clearly say coaching and TOs are part of the game & I was rooting for PSU. You don't seem to understand the word "dominance". I gave you an example, how about a few more: USC vs OU, Florida vs OSU, Neb vs Fl - all easy to remember NCG - the games were out of reach by halftime. Please don't redefine "dominance". I was worried as hell that Wisky would come back on PSU and kill the upset bid. I don't feel that way if I know the team I want to win is "dominating". Case closed!
 
Gfunk said:
What excuses am I making? My posts clearly say coaching and TOs are part of the game & I was rooting for PSU. You don't seem to understand the word "dominance". I gave you an example, how about a few more: USC vs OU, Florida vs OSU, Neb vs Fl - all easy to remember NCG - the games were out of reach by halftime. Please don't redefine "dominance". I was worried as hell that Wisky would come back on PSU and kill the upset bid. I don't feel that way if I know the team I want to win is "dominating". Case closed!
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Dominance is when you control both sides of the line of scrimmage and go up by 3 scores to a team who is favored by 24 points AT their home.

I was never ever worried about Wisconsin that whole game.

What excuses? How about when you said PSU didn't dominate so much as Wisconsin blew coverages and turnovers? Those are excuses. That's just part of football.
 
upstater said:
Dominance is when you control both sides of the line of scrimmage and go up by 3 scores to a team who is favored by 24 points AT their home.

I was never ever worried about Wisconsin that whole game.

What excuses? How about when you said PSU didn't dominate so much as Wisconsin blew coverages and turnovers? Those are excuses. That's just part of football.
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You know, I really don't care at this point. You seem hellbent on your glory. We both can take refuge in the fact that Wisky lost. I can take refuge in the fact that Minny beat PSU : ). You need to read more carefully. I do not make excuses for TOs, they are clearly part of the game. I can honestly say that Wisky is a better team than PSU, most days, just as PSU is a better team than IU, most days. And it pains me to say Wisky is a better team than Minnesota.
 
Gfunk said:
You know, I really don't care at this point. You seem hellbent on your glory. We both can take refuge in the fact that Wisky lost. I can take refuge in the fact that Minny beat PSU : ). You need to read more carefully. I do not make excuses for TOs, they are clearly part of the game. I can honestly say that Wisky is a better team than PSU, most days, just as PSU is a better team than IU, most days. And it pains me to say Wisky is a better team than Minnesota.
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Holy cow. You have some of the thinnest skin repeatedly on these boards. Why on earth are you going after my point about Wisconsin's weak schedule. It's the whole context behind what I wrote. Lordy.
 
Personally, I think FSU is worthy of being in the Championship Game. It's the other undefeated team that I'm not sold on. I'm not so convinced that they will get past Sparty so we will likely see FSU vs. 1-loss SEC team in the Championship Game anyway.
 
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Michigan State has a lousy offense....OSU should beat them...I don't hink you beat OSU with defense only.

Sparty has four games of scoring 21 points or less..three of 17 points or less. Lowly Purdue held them to 14 and USF to 21.
 
OSU's D is not good either…

Cal - 34 pts
Northwestern - 30 pts
Iowa - 24 pts
Illinois - 35 pts
Michigan - 41 pts

I see the matchup as each team's strengths and each team's weaknesses going up against each other. It can go either way but MSU has a good shot of winning. FSU will blow out Duke. Honestly, part of me is hoping for OSU to blow out MSU so that we can land Narduzzi.
 
billybud said:
Michigan State has a lousy offense....OSU should beat them...I don't hink you beat OSU with defense only.

Sparty has four games of scoring 21 points or less..three of 17 points or less. Lowly Purdue held them to 14 and USF to 21.
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Look at it the other way: MSU has not given up a touchdown in 5 of their last 6 games and OSU isn't stopping anyone lately.
 
Dooley said:
Personally, I think FSU is worthy of being in the Championship Game. It's the other undefeated team that I'm not sold on. I'm not so convinced that they will get past Sparty so we will likely see FSU vs. 1-loss SEC team in the Championship Game anyway.
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I agree with you on Fla St but I'm not so sure the SEC deserve's what their hype machine would have us believe this year?Not only that, I'm pretty SEC weary after having them pumped down our throats every yr like no one else knows how to play FB! Check out the SEC's schedules OOC and see how often they'll play anyone of signifigance ?Their good at the top but not Mt Olympus great like the talking heads on the E-spin keep telling us.(I also think its gonna be a tough game for OSU against Sparty)
 
The SEC is very good at the top...

Hard to match a row like Alabama, Auburn, LSU, South Carolina, Missouri....
 
Dooley said:
OSU's D is not good either…

Cal - 34 pts
Northwestern - 30 pts
Iowa - 24 pts
Illinois - 35 pts
Michigan - 41 pts

I see the matchup as each team's strengths and each team's weaknesses going up against each other. It can go either way but MSU has a good shot of winning. FSU will blow out Duke. Honestly, part of me is hoping for OSU to blow out MSU so that we can land Narduzzi.
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Michigan St. versus Ohio St. should be a good one. I am rooting for Sparty because I simply cannot stand Urban ‘Discipline is nothing, winning is everything’ Myer. If Michigan St.’s defense can hold Ohio St., to 21 or less points, I think they have a good chance of winning.
Of course, that will open to gates to the SEC talking heads demanding that they have at least 1 team in the championship. SEC will push for two teams (Missouri/Auburn winner versus Alabama) in the BCS title match if Florida St. loses to Duke or if Jameis Winston is charged and suspended by FSU between the ACC championship game and the BCS game.
Does anyone think that Oklahoma St deserves BCS talk with 1 loss, assuming they beat Oklahoma? I would say no due to the fact that their one loss is to West Virginia (versus a loss to Alabama or SC) and the XII does not have the top-heavy strength that the SEC has. Plus, their OCC schedule (UTSA and Lamar) is a joke.
 
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Please...please...Ohio State win.

The college world depends upon you to end the despotic SEC dynasty.

No pressure! no pressure! But you MUST WIN!
 
Everyone is blasting Ohio State but Florida St should be held to the same standard. OSU will have beaten Michigan St and Wisconsin. Florida St will have beaten Miami and Clemson.

I have to say, I'm not going to make a huge differentiation between Miami, Clemson, Michigan St, and Wisconsin.
 
I don't know why folks would blast Ohio State...except for the fact that they have a 1-9 record against the SEC ...and that perception hurts them.

If you are in an AQ conference and win 13 games...you are good and probably a little lucky as well.

Ohio State giving up 600 yards to Michigan and squeaking out that win on the failed two point conversion must be the impetus for the carping...
 
I'd bet the house billybud, gfunk and Fishy are all the same person. There is just no way 2 out of those 3 are real people.
 
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I am happy that you are comfortable.

I am almost drunk and fabulous....about as happy as any homeless guy is on a prettywarm sunny day in Florida with his team ranked #1.

Cadging a newspaper, as we speak, from a passing suit to read.

Now that we have traded statuses (stati?)....we can go on about our business.
 
billybud said:
The SEC is very good at the top...

Hard to match a row like Alabama, Auburn, LSU, South Carolina, Missouri....
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Even in that group....since when was a USCe or Mizzou considered powers? Was'nt it just last yr a mediocre SU squad went there(Mizzou) and whooped them on their own field? So in one down yr in the SEC Mizzou can be compared to Bama or LSU? Outside of Cam Newton's yr I'm hesitant to call Auburn great ! But no denying the couple or 3 at the top of the SEC are real tough team's.Too bad we got stuck pairing Bama with over rated ND last yr allowing the unbeatable "myth" to go on ! I'm starting to think a shortage of HS kids playing FB is getting critical? Most of even us fan's are adverse to having our kid's play.
 
NickyNewark said:
Even in that group....since when was a USCe or Mizzou considered powers? Was'nt it just last yr a mediocre SU squad went there(Mizzou) and whooped them on their own field? So in one down yr in the SEC Mizzou can be compared to Bama or LSU? Outside of Cam Newton's yr I'm hesitant to call Auburn great ! But no denying the couple or 3 at the top of the SEC are real tough team's.Too bad we got stuck pairing Bama with over rated ND last yr allowing the unbeatable "myth" to go on ! I'm starting to think a shortage of HS kids playing FB is getting critical? Most of even us fan's are adverse to having our kid's play.
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I think his comment was regarding this year only. One could make the argument that these 5 could be split up and be the champions of all the power 5 conferences in the country. Something that no other conference can match, for a lot of power 5 conference teams that is 5 automatic losses right off the bat.
 
There is this year...with Mizzou, Bama, Auburm , South Carolina...(with Georgia and Florida hurt with injuries)

In another year it has been Florida, Georgia, LSU, Bama, Arkansas...the same teams may not be at the top of the conference...but the SEC has been pretty consistent at putting up a strong slate of five teams...

Teams like Auburn, Florida, South Carolina, LSU and Georgia rotate in and out....

Since the BCS started....Tennessee has won an NC...Bama has won three, Florida two, LSU and Auburn one each.

Teams like Mississippi and Mississippi St. have had some good years in the last five and ended up in the final AP Rankings...even Vandy made the Final Top 25 last year.
 
upstater said:
Everyone is blasting Ohio State but Florida St should be held to the same standard. OSU will have beaten Michigan St and Wisconsin. Florida St will have beaten Miami and Clemson.

I have to say, I'm not going to make a huge differentiation between Miami, Clemson, Michigan St, and Wisconsin.
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The difference is in the eye test. FSU has just steamrolled everyone. OSU hasn't looked as good and was fortunate to avoid Nebraska and MSU in the regular season and get the other tough games at Columbus. I think FSU would be favored over OSU by 14 at least.
 
HuskyHawk said:
The difference is in the eye test. FSU has just steamrolled everyone. OSU hasn't looked as good and was fortunate to avoid Nebraska and MSU in the regular season and get the other tough games at Columbus. I think FSU would be favored over OSU by 14 at least.
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I think you are right. Some interesting stuff from ESPN's David Hale....

David Hale ‏@DavidHaleESPN2 Dec
#FSU has scored 68 more TDs than it’s allowed. The next closest in the nation is Baylor at 49. Only 6 teams have even scored 68 TDs total.

David Hale ‏@DavidHaleESPN7h
Vs FBS teams w/winning record, #FSU has No. 1 scoring O (50.8/g), No. 3 total O (546/g), No. 3 scoring D (15.5) & No. 7 total D (308).

David Hale ‏@DavidHaleESPN2 Dec
#FSU avg 3.8 more yards/play than its opponents, best in FBS. Only 7 other teams in nation have a differential half that much.
David Hale ‏@DavidHaleESPN2 Dec
#FSU has No. 1 avg margin of victory (42.7), No. 1 yard/play differential (3.82) & No. 2 3rd-down conv differential (26.1%) in the nation.
https://twitter.com/DavidHaleESPN/status/407540975997689857

David Hale ‏@DavidHaleESPN1 Dec
Jimbo asked about Winston on 3rd&long: JW is 16-of-18 for 317 yards, 15 first downs & 4 TDs on 3rd-and-10+ this year.

(Note from Billy...that is an absolutely unbeliveable 3rd down and 10 passing stat)

Overall opponent records:
FSU 71-74
Oh St 65-79
Mizzou 77-67
Auburn 78-66
 
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