UConn stats....Nika vs Hailey Van Lith...

[HuskyNan]

UConn would gain 20 points from the switch. Probably fewer turnovers.

Hailey. Is. Not. A. Point. Guard. She had 119 assists last season while Nika had 257 in roughly the same minutes. Hailey’s A/TO ratio is .88 meaning she had more turnover than assists. Nika’s was 2.24 so she had more than twice as many assists as turnovers

 

[Bone Dog]

What Geno wants from Nika is leadership and FIRE. And this is exactly what she gives him. When the team falters, it's often because they've lost that fire, they've slumped as a unit. Nika is who fixes that. She is one of the few players who breathes fire every minute she's on the floor. That she also gives assists, steals, rebounds, some buckets, and general defensive disruption to opposing teams -- all of that is a bonus on top of the main thing: FIRE.

I don't know of anyone else in D1 who gives that to her team. I hope KK and Ashlynn learn it from her.

 

[tomcat]

I really like Nika's game, and believe she is incredibly valuable to UConn. But this post, to me is an exercise is proving the old adage that you can get statistics to do whatever you want them to. Let's face it: If you can stand a volume shooter, Van Lith is an monster on offense. Nika is not, and unless she really ups her offensive game this year, she won't ever be. And on this UConn team, where there are so many options on offense, that's not likely to happen, anyway.
But maybe that's the point. On this UConn team., Nika is so valuable because she fits in so well and can providde the assists and defense that keep the team moving.

 

[HuskyNan]

That’s like saying that Paige, who is ready to play this year, is not better running the point than Nika???? Come on.

What are you talking about? The discussion was talking about swapping Nika for Hailey.

 

[Waquoit]

Hailey. Is. Not. A. Point. Guard. Her A/TO ratio is .88 meaning she had more turnover than assists. Nika’s was 2.24 so she had more than twice as many assists as turnovers

That one word sentence thing isn't any less dumb looking when you do it, Nan. So condescending. If there was a straight swap of the two (which was the question posed) Geno would find a PG. And again with stats compiled against the JV. Try to bury it in the wash if you want but one player here scores 20 points in the Sweet 16 while the other makes 7 TO's. And let's not get wrapped around the axle here. The OP tried to make the case using fun with numbers that Nika is a superior offensive player. Totally ridiculous yet those pushing back are getting the stick. Nika has played 6 NCAA games past the first weekend. In each game, she has scored just 1 basket and yet the OP is saying she's a better offensive player. And it's not that I'm killing Nika, she is who she is. I'm critical of those who pump these players up into something they are not. Who had more fire and heart than Molly Bent? Nobody, from what I read here on the Boneyard for years. So if fire is that important, why didn't she get more run? Because she wasn't good enough.

 

[sun]

I would choose Halley over Nika in a heartbeat.
UConn has other point guards, but no one can come close to the moves that Halley can make except maybe KK.
Coached by Jen Rizzotti, Halley helped end an 8 year drought to bring home the 3X3 Gold Medal. this year.
Halley's talent easily passes the eye test showing why she was selected to play for Team USA.

HAILEY VAN LITH PUTS DEFENDER IN A BLENDER AS SHE AND CAMERON BRINK LEAD TEAM USA TO BREAK GOLD MEDAL DROUGHT​

Hailey Van Lith Puts Defender In Blender En Route To USA Gold Medal

Hailey Van Lith and Cameron Brink led Team USA to its first gold medal in the 3X3 World Cup since 2014. They were both on fire!

www.outkick.com

 

[sun]

 

[#12in21]

Halley 's 19.7 average was greater than Azzi's averaqe of 15.0.
Do folks actually think that Nika is a better player than Azzi too?
That's what it seems like when folks say the Nika is better than Halley.
That would also mean that Nika iis better than Azzi which simply isn't true.
It's about being a better all around player.
There's more to the game than defense because a team needs to score points to win.
How many of Nika's assists could have been made by anyone else on the team able to make a routine pass?

So you are saying swap anyone else from last year's roster to PG for Nika and they get 284 assists, 200 assists, 150 assists....? Seriously, give her her due. With her court vision she consistently got herself in great position to make passes to teammates right where they needed it. Paige is the only proven player on the current roster that can make a lot of those passes and no-one on last year's was even close. Do you think Nika would have set the Uconn record for minutes/game if Geno felt anyone else on the roster can do what she did? She has never claimed to be a star player and yet critiques of her often contrast her against a player that is. She is not a big time scorer which has never been her intent, her emphasis and value is in making her team much better with her than without her. As Geno has said, 'he's only had a handful of players like her', 'you want her on the floor because she makes her team better', 'she is unique', .....

As you say 'there's more to the game than defense because a team needs to score points to win', and yet you follow that with discounting Nika's (record setting) assist ability, why not throw in her leadership skills, her constant chatter positioning her teammates, her ability to push pace, her tenacity, drive and stamina and the fact she actually had the highest percentage of point production shares (combining assists and point totals) of anyone on the roster last season? Just a thought, maybe if we add in those we get a better picture of who she is as an all around player. Forget about comparisons to Hailey or anyone else, the real question should be the value she has to her team. IMO, last season, she was as valuable to her team as any player was to there's in wcbb. This season her minutes will certainly drop but I expect her to remain a significant piece of a (hopefully) championship roster.

 

[Golden Husky]

NISE going, David.

 

[sun]

So you are saying swap anyone else from last year's roster to PG for Nika and they get 284 assists, 200 assists, 150 assists....? Seriously, give her her due. With her court vision she consistently got herself in great position to make passes to teammates right where they needed it. Paige is the only proven player on the current roster that can make a lot of those passes and no-one on last year's was even close. Do you think Nika would have set the Uconn record for minutes/game if Geno felt anyone else on the roster can do what she did? She has never claimed to be a star player and yet critiques of her often contrast her against a player that is. She is not a big time scorer which has never been her intent, her emphasis and value is in making her team much better with her than without her. As Geno has said, 'he's only had a handful of players like her', 'you want her on the floor because she makes her team better', 'she is unique', .....

As you say 'there's more to the game than defense because a team needs to score points to win', and yet you follow that with discounting Nika's (record setting) assist ability, why not throw in her leadership skills, her constant chatter positioning her teammates, her ability to push pace, her tenacity, drive and stamina and the fact she actually had the highest percentage of point production shares (combining assists and point totals) of anyone on the roster last season? Just a thought, maybe if we add in those we get a better picture of who she is as an all around player. Forget about comparisons to Hailey or anyone else, the real question should be the value she has to her team. IMO, last season, she was as valuable to her team as any player was to there's in wcbb. This season her minutes will certainly drop but I expect her to remain a significant piece of a (hopefully) championship roster.

Every player has their good points & bad points.
When I compare all of Hailey's good points to all of Nika's good points, I find that Hailey's good points far outweigh Nika's good points.
And when I compare all of Nika's bad points to Hailey's, I find that Nika's bad points far outweigh all of Hailey's bad points.
It's simply my opinion & no one else needs to agree with it.
You're entitled to your opinion just as I am to mine.
You won't change my opinion & I won't change yours.
I think that both players are very talented but that Hailey has more overall BB talent than Nika.
If Jen Rizzotti, Geno & Paige were asked which player they would rather have on their team then each may give a different answer.

 

[Bald Husky]

I would choose Halley over Nika in a heartbeat.
UConn has other point guards, but no one can come close to the moves that Halley can make except maybe KK.
Coached by Jen Rizzotti, Halley helped end an 8 year drought to bring home the 3X3 Gold Medal. this year.
Halley's talent easily passes the eye test showing why she was selected to play for Team USA.

HAILEY VAN LITH PUTS DEFENDER IN A BLENDER AS SHE AND CAMERON BRINK LEAD TEAM USA TO BREAK GOLD MEDAL DROUGHT​

Hailey Van Lith Puts Defender In Blender En Route To USA Gold Medal

Hailey Van Lith and Cameron Brink led Team USA to its first gold medal in the 3X3 World Cup since 2014. They were both on fire!

www.outkick.com

We don't need a player like Halley since we have about three of them already, but we do need a player with a game that Nika provides. Why do you want 4 or 5 players that do the same thing? Nika provides aspects of the game that are not big assets of most of our other players, and she provides that in a most awesome way. Let the other players shoot, Nika will provide the defense, the spark, and a player who enjoys setting up her teammates. I know you don't appreciate Nikas game, but how about looking at the team as a whole, and not individual parts.

 

[diggerfoot]

UConn would gain 20 points from the switch. Probably fewer turnovers.

Lol. So UConn would average 20 points a game more with Hailey Van Lith, which would have made them by far the most potent offense in the country, leaving Iowa in the dust? Perhaps you need to rethink that bold claim.

As for fewer turnovers, it depends whether you mean by Hailey Van Lith or the team as a whole. Hailey Van Lith not being a pure PG would handle the ball less than Muhl did last year so, yes, would likely have fewer turnovers. But Hailey Van Lith and Duscharme average more turnovers per minute, while Fudd is not far behind, so the team as a whole would have more turnovers per game if the switch was made.

 

[Bone Dog]

I would choose Halley over Nika in a heartbeat.
UConn has other point guards, but no one can come close to the moves that Halley can make except maybe KK.

I'm pretty sure Uconn has two other guards whose 'moves' are even better than what Hailey can do, even three if you count KK. Didn't we just spend a summer hearing arguments about how Paige was the best pg on the team? And how many BYers have claimed that Azzi was the second best pg on the team. Apart from how unpersuasive those arguments were, there is just no calculus where Hailey is a reasonable choice for a UConn team that has Paige Azzi and KK on it.

Don't get me wrong, I like Hailey's game. She's feisty and clever and can contribute to most teams... if she's used in the right way. And that way is not as pg. There's just no way I'm sitting Paige or Azzi down for her, and if those two are available to play, then Nika is a better choice for pg since Hailey's skill set would be redundant and Nika's wouldn't be. You can find the videos of their HS FIBA games and see the same result play out -- Hailey was second string on those teams behind Paige and Azzi. The basic facts haven't changed in the interim. Or you can consider the Louisville game from 2 years ago. We lost without Paige or Azzi or Nika, but Caroline outplayed Hailey with 24 pts on 10-20 shooting vs 16 points on 5-14 shooting. A freshman did that. These are the facts plain to see.

 

[Cuango]

Halley 's 19.7 average was greater than Azzi's averaqe of 15.0.
Do folks actually think that Nika is a better player than Azzi too?
That's what it seems like when folks say the Nika is better than Halley.
That would also mean that Nika iis better than Azzi which simply isn't true.
It's about being a better all around player.
There's more to the game than defense because a team needs to score points to win.
How many of Nika's assists could have been made by anyone else on the team able to make a routine pass?

Very few people are saying that Nika is better than Hailey Van Lith And those that are are simply wrong! What most people are saying is that exchanging those two players is not as simple as simply designating one player as “better” than the other. Nika is a point guard, Hailey Van Lith is not! Nika produced lots of assists, Hailey Van Lith, not so much.
UConn needed a point guard, not a small volume shooter with inferior defensive skills. UConn is not a destination for short volume shooters with low shooting percentages and poor defensive skills. I actually admire Hailey Van Lith! She has maximized her ability and made herself a star. I just don’t think she’s a good fit at UConn and certainly not as a replacement for what was then, our only experienced PG.
While I have serious doubts as to whether she can even be an effective point guard, I wish her all the best and hope she finishes fourth in the POY vote behind Paige, Aaliyah, and Azzi. (Not necessarily in that order)
Finally, as you rightly say, simply using scoring average to determine who is the best player just doesn’t get the job done. Sure, Hailey Van Lith is a better player in some ways but the material point is that she is not better for UConn than Nika, especially considering the circumstances we faced last season.

 

[CONN78SEJ]

Hailey. Is. Not. A. Point. Guard. She had 119 assists last season while Nika had 257 in roughly the same minutes. Hailey’s A/TO ratio is .88 meaning she had more turnover than assists. Nika’s was 2.24 so she had more than twice as many assists as turnovers

With all due respect Nan, I’ll take points over assists any day, and on that score. A point guard has to be a threat to score every time down the floor, if she isn’t then doubling the ball is so much easier for the defense. That’s exactly what happened in the embarrassing loss to Ohio State.

 

[nwhoopfan]

I would choose Halley over Nika in a heartbeat.
UConn has other point guards, but no one can come close to the moves that Halley can make except maybe KK.
Coached by Jen Rizzotti, Halley helped end an 8 year drought to bring home the 3X3 Gold Medal. this year.
Halley's talent easily passes the eye test showing why she was selected to play for Team USA.

HAILEY VAN LITH PUTS DEFENDER IN A BLENDER AS SHE AND CAMERON BRINK LEAD TEAM USA TO BREAK GOLD MEDAL DROUGHT​

Hailey Van Lith Puts Defender In Blender En Route To USA Gold Medal

Hailey Van Lith and Cameron Brink led Team USA to its first gold medal in the 3X3 World Cup since 2014. They were both on fire!

www.outkick.com

The comparison someone else made to Plum seems fairly apt watching this 3x3 footage. Both lefties, similar size, and I definitely see some similarity in playing style.

 

[sun]

In Hailey's recent interview posted on rthe 2023 LSU Offseason thread, she said that Kim is preparing her to play multiple positions.
She knows that she's not a PG & that she's only starting to learn the position.
Being able to play different positions is another indication of her BB skills compared to Nika's which are more limited.
It's just like how Paige doesn't need to play PG but she can excel wherever Geno plays her.

I look at it as if UConn were a pro team & if I were the GM would I trade Nika for Hailey.
Geno's contract pays him $50K for winning certain NCAAT rounds, so a coach would want the best availalble player so that he can earn the most money & to help his team win.
Just like why Hailey was chosen to be on the Team USA 3X3, because being smaller makes her quick enough to evade defenders.
It's only a hypothetical scenario anyway & not to be taken seriously.

 

[Notyetready]

Thank you David. Excellent post.

I guess the Nika debate on the Boneyard will continue for one more year. Nika is the Rodney Dangerfield of UConn Women's Basketball.

Two time Defensive Player of the Year in the Big East. Season UConn record for assists. The floor general of the team. The heart and soul of the team.

Her game has improved every year. To me, she passes the eye test as the point guard of the team. I would take Nika over Van Lith every time.

Apperently Geno would take Nika over Van Lith as well since it seems no offer was made to her when she was in the transfer portal.

 

[Cuango]

The comparison someone else made to Plum seems fairly apt watching this 3x3 footage. Both lefties, similar size, and I definitely see some similarity in playing style.

Kelsey shot 44 (overall) & 38%, Hailey Van Lith shoots 41 & 29% (last season) Kelsey is the most prolific scorer in college history, Hailey Van Lith, not so much. Plum never shot below 33% on threes and shot 37%, 40%, & 43% in her three other seasons for a 38.2 career avg. Hailey Van Lith shot 38%, 36%, & 29% for a 33.8% career avg. I would think she’ll be hard pressed to maintain or improve those percentages with her added responsibilities as a PG. She is smaller, a substantially poorer shooter, and is simply not in the same league as Plum!
We’ll see this season if Kim can reinvent Hailey Van Lith and turn her into a point guard. I wish her well but I have to say I have my doubts. I do hope I’m wrong though, as I admire her feisty attitude. She is a fearless and competitive player who never backs away from a challenge so I wish her all the best.

 

[nwhoopfan]

Kelsey shot 44 (overall) & 38%, Hailey Van Lith shoots 41 & 29% (last season) Kelsey is the most prolific scorer in college history, Hailey Van Lith, not so much. Plum never shot below 33% on threes and shot 37%, 40%, & 43% in her three other seasons for a 38.2 career avg. Hailey Van Lith shot 38%, 36%, & 29% for a 33.8% career avg. I would think she’ll be hard pressed to maintain or improve those percentages with her added responsibilities as a PG. She is smaller, a substantially poorer shooter, and is simply not in the same league as Plum!
We’ll see this season if Kim can reinvent Hailey Van Lith and turn her into a point guard. I wish her well but I have to say I have my doubts. I do hope I’m wrong though, as I admire her feisty attitude. She is a fearless and competitive player who never backs away from a challenge so I wish her all the best.

I'm a huge Plum fan, so you don't need to try to convert me. I obviously agree KP had a much better college career, but as I said I can see some similarities, particularly in the 3x3 format. It's a different flavor of hoops that both seem to shine at.

 

[hoophuskee]

you can use stats to prove the Earth is flat meaning numbers can be manipulated.. The only thing Nka is better at than Haley is Defense and assist.. would you want Haley or Nika taking a game-winning 3 or 2-point shot as for that NISE reference it's the same formula used to explain the world is flat as for turnovers Haley is a shooting guard who traditionally always have more turnovers than your point guard which Nika is simply out Noka is not better than Haley and I'm a Nika fan

I have said I believe Hailey Van Lith is the better player -- but there is something to be said regarding fit. Some posters will look at scoring as the only factor because they believe mistakenly that anybody can pass or learn to play great defense. Which imo is a gross error.


Anyhow- you speak of a game winning shot - but what about the other end if UCONN needs a stop for the last possession of the game? Who would you rather have? Secondly, Paige and Azzi are superior efficient scorers than Hailey Van Lith. Why wouldn’t we want the guard more dedicated to getting Paige and Azzi the ball? That’s a point digger expressed so well among others. I've gotten into many disagreements as well. IMO a classic example of what "Nika is" is shown per the video below. With 3:57 left in 3rd qtr UCONN down by 3, Azzi had missed all her 3's with maybe exception of 1 in 1st half, at 3:55 she probably sees Azzi once she receives the pass. She isn't going hyper speed and she slows down enough so that at 3:54/3:53 you can see she set up the defense while she had her back to Azzi.

It's no accident she immediately spins around at 3:53 as if she had eyes in the back of her head to face and pitch the ball back to Azzi. She knew Azzi was there. And at 3:52 upon pitching the ball back she is deliberately making her body wide so in a way she is simultaneously setting a pick/screening for Azzi so she can get off the shot without much contest from the defense. After Azzi drills this 3 to tie the game, she goes on to hit a few more. before that she wasn't hitting 3's but she got hot from 2.

For me, I find this play to be terrific and a testament to a pg's relentless approach of getting teammate superstars the ball in favorable positions and a clasic example of wha Nika is and wants to do as much as possible. On the flipside imo posters that want the pg's to score or make flashy passes or don't think much of passing can never appreciate this. And it's something possibly Hailey Van Lith will rarely have a mindset to do. Instead Hailey Van Lith may very well rush up the floor to her left side, away from Azzi, and look to make a move on her own. This means less efficinet scorer is going to take away shots from Azzi (and/or Paige). That may not be better.

 

[CL82]

think if Hailey Van Lith was on the team the past three years they'd have two Natty's at least

Probably like 5 or something.

 

[CL82]

I would choose Halley over Nika in a heartbeat.
UConn has other point guards, but no one can come close to the moves that Halley can make except maybe KK.
Coached by Jen Rizzotti, Halley helped end an 8 year drought to bring home the 3X3 Gold Medal. this year.
Halley's talent easily passes the eye test showing why she was selected to play for Team USA.

HAILEY VAN LITH PUTS DEFENDER IN A BLENDER AS SHE AND CAMERON BRINK LEAD TEAM USA TO BREAK GOLD MEDAL DROUGHT​

Hailey Van Lith Puts Defender In Blender En Route To USA Gold Medal

Hailey Van Lith and Cameron Brink led Team USA to its first gold medal in the 3X3 World Cup since 2014. They were both on fire!

www.outkick.com

Not a single pass to a teammate. Selfish?