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UConn basketball....

HuskylnSC

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What I see is a young guy who inherited a successful program from an incredibly strong willed coach and had great success with the players who knew that system.

Although he grew up in that system, he learned other systems and through cross pollination has developed his own system.

As he tried to marry the old and new failure is the result.

Now with boldness that rankles those that love the old system (NOTE: I coached Glen Miller as a 12 year old rec league so I love the old system) he cleans out the old system to create his own vision. Win or lose he is going to do it his way. New offense stifling man to man. Versatile players not confined by traditional roles. Think NBA ball

I suggest we give him some time to see if his way works
 
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What I see is a young guy who inherited a successful program from an incredibly strong willed coach and had great success with the players who knew that system.

Although he grew up in that system, he learned other systems and through cross pollination has developed his own system.

As he tried to marry the old and new failure is the result.

Now with boldness that rankles those that love the old system (NOTE: I coached Glen Miller as a 12 year old rec league so I love the old system) he cleans out the old system to create his own vision. Win or lose he is going to do it his way. New offense stifling man to man. Versatile players not confined by traditional roles. Think NBA ball

I suggest we give him some time to see if his way works
How much time are you suggesting?
 
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Gee, and then we won the AAC Tournament, a fact you conveniently ignore. Sorry, but finishing up the season as one of the 32 best teams in the country is decidedly NOT mediocre and irrelevant. You can put whatever spin you want on the regular season, but you also fail to acknowledge that Brimah spent a fair amount of the season injured and unavailable. It's always and forever all negative no matter what the circumstances were.
That was absolutely a mediocre season considering the talent we had, our preseason ranking, and where our expectations were. We finished 6th in the conference regular season and were squarely on the bubble before Jalen hit a 75 foot prayer.
 

HuskyHawk

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What I see is a young guy who inherited a successful program from an incredibly strong willed coach and had great success with the players who knew that system.

Although he grew up in that system, he learned other systems and through cross pollination has developed his own system.

As he tried to marry the old and new failure is the result.

Now with boldness that rankles those that love the old system (NOTE: I coached Glen Miller as a 12 year old rec league so I love the old system) he cleans out the old system to create his own vision. Win or lose he is going to do it his way. New offense stifling man to man. Versatile players not confined by traditional roles. Think NBA ball

I suggest we give him some time to see if his way works

I'm not sure I follow this. Calhoun's later year offense was pretty much old school NBA offense, relying on mismatches and players beating their man one on one. It works if you have great 1 on 1 players and you aren't facing a capable zone. It's a lousy offense for the modern college game. Ollie needed to change it. He hasn't changed it, that's the problem. If you are saying he's going to try to run a Golden State style offense, fine. But I have seen no evidence of that yet. It will rely on shooters all over the floor and flexible players as you describe. You'd think Vance would love such a system, and yet he's gone. Wilson would have been a good fit as well.

If I see Adams or Gilbert standing around dribbling in place early next season I'm going to scream.
 
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Since when does advancing to the Round of 32 in the NCAAs and getting beaten by a No. 1 seed constitute a season of "mediocrity and irrelevance"? We were one of the 32 best teams in the country out of what, 345 or so? I fail to understand how that is mediocre and irrelevant.

You guys are consistent, I'll grant you that. Always paint the picture in broad brush strokes. Everything is either good or bad, black or white, no shades of gray. It's all doom and gloom if you're on the Ollie Ollie out free express train, and I'm so sick and tired of reading messages about how Brimah's play against St. Joe's is the only reason Ollie still has his job.

You may all be proven right by the end of next season, but can we at least play it out first before we shovel the final scoops of dirt on Ollie's coffin?

We had wayyyy too much talent on that team to finish 6th in the American. Behind Cinci, Tulsa, Houston, Smu, and Temple (reverse order- temple finished 1st).

We had more talent than any of those teams. And a good mix of senior experience and younger guys. guards and bigs. No excuses at all for that result.

Losing to a 1 seed in the second round isn't a bad result. The bad result was finishing 6th in the American and putting ourselves in position to lose to the 1 seed in the second round because we were an 8/9 seed.

That season is so overrated by people on this board simply because we beat Colorado in the first round of the NCAA tournament. With the talent we had and considering our schedule, we should have been a 4 seed at the absolute worst.

Was it a bad season? No? But was it a good season? Also no. We under-performed quite a bit.
 
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That was absolutely a mediocre season considering the talent we had, our preseason ranking, and where our expectations were. We finished 6th in the conference regular season and were squarely on the bubble before Jalen hit a 75 foot prayer.

We thought they were on the bubble, but even with a loss there they make it. Tulsa with 20 wins and an RPI at 65 made it. UConn's Pomeroy's were also much higher than Tulsa's before the tournament. In the 30s. BPI was even higher. In fact, after the tournament, they were 18th. If Jalen's 75 footer doesn't go in, they still make it. I'm not disputing they were a bubble team. They were. But the Jalen part of your post is irrelevant.
 
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I am glad that I don't overreact like some of my fellow boneyard family members and like some media heads out there. Coach KO will lead our beloved Huskies to a bounce back season where we make the NCAA tournament and get back to solid skill development and continued academic success. We will be okay, fellow boneyard family. R-E-L-A-X.
 
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We thought they were on the bubble, but even with a loss there they make it. Tulsa with 20 wins and an RPI at 65 made it. UConn's Pomeroy's were also much higher than Tulsa's before the tournament. In the 30s. BPI was even higher. In fact, after the tournament, they were 18th. If Jalen's 75 footer doesn't go in, they still make it. I'm not disputing they were a bubble team. They were. But the Jalen part of your post is irrelevant.
I think they still make it but conventional wisdom at the time was we needed that win, never want to leave it up to the committee. Wasn't just that it was a miraculous shot but the circumstances surrounding it added to it being a big story everywhere and going down in all-time Husky lore.
 
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Since when does advancing to the Round of 32 in the NCAAs and getting beaten by a No. 1 seed constitute a season of "mediocrity and irrelevance"? We were one of the 32 best teams in the country out of what, 345 or so? I fail to understand how that is mediocre and irrelevant.

You guys are consistent, I'll grant you that. Always paint the picture in broad brush strokes. Everything is either good or bad, black or white, no shades of gray. It's all doom and gloom if you're on the Ollie Ollie out free express train, and I'm so sick and tired of reading messages about how Brimah's play against St. Joe's is the only reason Ollie still has his job.

You may all be proven right by the end of next season, but can we at least play it out first before we shovel the final scoops of dirt on Ollie's coffin?

If you consider never being ranked and one NCAA tournament win and zero NIT wins in a three year span acceptable, I dont know what to tell you. That team that won one game in the tourney underperformed all season long and was loaded with talent. They should have never had such a low seed that they had to face Kansas in the second round. They had the potential to be more like a 4 seed, but underperformed badly.
 
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If you consider never being ranked and one NCAA tournament win and zero NIT wins in a three year span acceptable, I dont know what to tell you. That team that won one game in the tourney underperformed all season long and was loaded with talent. They should have never had such a low seed that they had to face Kansas in the second round. They had the potential to be more like a 4 seed, but underperformed badly.

I agree with that. I said in another post that we looked like a final four team up until the early 2nd half of the Michigan game. We were up 20ish and were flying and then something changed. The rest of the year we were inconsistent. That team was very talented but was just poorly constructed. Our point guard (Gibbs) was not a point guard and Jalen wasn't ready to lead. So DHam took on the facilitator role but he wasn't fully equipped to do that either. If that team had a real PG, they would have won 30 games.
 
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I agree with that. I said in another post that we looked like a final four team up until the early 2nd half of the Michigan game. We were up 20ish and were flying and then something changed. The rest of the year we were inconsistent. That team was very talented but was just poorly constructed. Our point guard (Gibbs) was not a point guard and Jalen wasn't ready to lead. So DHam took on the facilitator role but he wasn't fully equipped to do that either. If that team had a real PG, they would have won 30 games.

I've always said that one of the big problems the last few years is that a top point guard wasn't recruited after Boatright/Napier. If you look at the UConn teams of the prior decade, since Taliek, a veteran PG took the lead while a freshman learned the ropes. Taliek to Marcus W. to AJ Price to Kemba to Napier. So Jalen Adams comes in, and he has no one to learn from. Instead, because of the recruiting issue, Sterling Gibbs is brought in.

Terrence Samuel was supposed to be the link between the vet and the freshman, but Terence was not tanked anywhere near as high as Taliek and Marcus and AJ and Kemba.
 

intlzncster

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Mau, please tell me why you are confident in KO despite things like losing to Northeastern, Wagner and ECU last season combined with the loss of Enoch, Jackson, Durham and MAL? What have you seen in terms of actual performance over the past three seasons to suggest that this will be a good season for the Huskies? I see an outstanding player in Jalen Adams and a very solid player in Christian Vital. Beyond that, I see many question marks and a roster that is still 3 players short at a very late date in the recruiting cycle.

The first two games, before they lost guys, isn't who they would have been at the end of the season if those guys were healthy and they had Diarra. It's silly and disingenuous to extrapolate like that.

We lost from last year: Facey, Brimah, Purvis, Enoch, Jackson and Durham.

This year, we have additions of Gilbert, Larrier, Diarra, plus Polley, Cobb, Carlton, Whaley, and Anderson.

Leaving the depth issue aside, Gilbert, Larrier, Diarra are worth more than the entire crew we lose, imho.

The depth issue and the potential health issue are huge concerns. But our team this year is more talented on paper, especially considering development of guys like Vital and Adams.

And inexperience up front could be a huge albatross. But that still remains to be seen. We may get more from a hopefully in shape Cobb than we thought. And Diarra might be that tough rebounding presence we need.
 
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It's amazing how your conclusion is that this is somehow Calhoun's fault. We were pretty good when he was here. We should have just let him play through this APR nonsense like UNC did with Roy or Louisville did with Pitino when the NCAA came knocking. That was the mistake in my opinion.

Chief - I realize you are the biggest Calhoun apologist on here. But it was a known fact around the program in his last few years that he paid less and less attention to details like the consequences of pushing guys like Doug Wiggins and Darius Smith out without making sure they were in good academic standing upon leaving. And the combination of the Nate Miles scandal which led to Patrick Sellers and Beau Archibald being fired, the APR tournament ban in 2013, and the negative recruiting against us because of Calhoun's career almost being at an end (all of this has been noted as fact in newspaper articles dating back to those years - do some research and look it up) absolutely hurt our recruiting up through the 2013 and 2014 seasons... not to mention the transfers that all but gutted the 2012 class.

And yet you want to say that none of that was Calhoun's fault or responsibility? That is a purely nonsensical take Chief.

By the way, saying that Calhoun was the greatest basketball program builder that we have ever seen and one of the 3 to 5 best men's college basketball coaches ever BUT that he also dropped some significant balls over his last few years that hurt our talent level and depth while also hurting our reputation as a program at the end and the first several years after his departure are not mutually exclusive. I was raised by a Navy man who had a "Captain of the ship" mentality. Knowing Calhoun and his upbringing and coaching style, he has a similar mentality. Well sorry, but he was the captain of the ship at that time.

That having been said, I will always be thankful for the amazing coach that he was, and how he helped to enrich my life and sports fandom while at UConn and for the 2 1/2 decades since. Dickie V is definitely one of the all time blowhards, but he was spot on when he called Calhoun the "Michelangelo" of men's college basketball.
 
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The first two games, before they lost guys, isn't who they would have been at the end of the season if those guys were healthy and they had Diarra. It's silly and disingenuous to extrapolate like that.

We lost from last year: Facey, Brimah, Purvis, Enoch, Jackson and Durham.

This year, we have additions of Gilbert, Larrier, Diarra, plus Polley, Cobb, Carlton, Whaley, and Anderson.

Leaving the depth issue aside, Gilbert, Larrier, Diarra are worth more than the entire crew we lose, imho.

The depth issue and the potential health issue are huge concerns. But our team this year is more talented on paper, especially considering development of guys like Vital and Adams.

And inexperience up front could be a huge albatross. But that still remains to be seen. We may get more from a hopefully in shape Cobb than we thought. And Diarra might be that tough rebounding presence we need.

And the experience in the frontcourt is who?
 

intlzncster

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And the experience in the frontcourt is who?

Did you miss the last paragraph? It's an important question mark.

Can you tell me how all those guys are going to play? Because I can't. Not Nostradamus.

Also, we have a different staff this year. Ostensibly, that should lead to different results, good or bad remains to be seen.
 

intlzncster

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Very fair reply. I just think it's more of an uphill battle given that Larrier and Gilbert are coming off missed seasons and significant injuries, and there really is no frontcourt depth and very little experience at the 4 and 5.

You mean backcourt depth no? There's tons of front court depth, but, as you say, little experience.
 
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I've always said that one of the big problems the last few years is that a top point guard wasn't recruited after Boatright/Napier. If you look at the UConn teams of the prior decade, since Taliek, a veteran PG took the lead while a freshman learned the ropes. Taliek to Marcus W. to AJ Price to Kemba to Napier. So Jalen Adams comes in, and he has no one to learn from. Instead, because of the recruiting issue, Sterling Gibbs is brought in.

Terrence Samuel was supposed to be the link between the vet and the freshman, but Terence was not tanked anywhere near as high as Taliek and Marcus and AJ and Kemba.


Yeah, that whole lack of recruiting and getting a PG to replace Bazz was a major screw up. Imagine what we would have been like if Boat declared for the draft and didn't return for his senior year to play point. :(
 
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Still using the "APR ban" as an excuse for Ollie means you lose the argument. He's brought in guys and lost them. That's on him.

Uh, no... that is not my argument Waquoit. Again, you negative guys cherry-picking statements to support your false claims.

My argument is and has been, correctly, that the 2014-2015 team's lack of talent and depth was directly a result of the APR ban in addition to the transfers from Calhoun's last team. Those are facts, but only part of the level-headed point I made. I did not state in that post, nor have I ever stated that the APR ban had a significant effect on this last year's team. Jeez, can you negative guys just stop with the cherry-picking of points?

You guys certainly all have that in common. You all say that every one of sees nothing wrong - and yet not one of us reasonable guys hoping for a positive turnaround has ever once said "nothing is wrong". What part of OLLIE DID A BAD JOB THIS YEAR do you guys not understand?

Honestly, you negative guys make yourselves look stupid and immature when you do that. A mature debate involves discussing the entirety of a person's point. Not your taking one sentence out of context and then stating it was my entire argument when it obviously wasn't... you would of course have realized this if you would get out of "hot take" mode and actually read my posts in their entirety.
 

intlzncster

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I mean frontcourt depth. Who is playing center? Who is the backup?

Between Diarra, Cobb, Whaley, Carlton, Polley, Larrier. We've got plenty of options at the 4/5. Who knows how it shakes out?

Backcourt, not so much. It's worrisome.
 
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The team and season were decent, but once again, not as good as they should have been given the players on the roster. I'm hopeful for Ollie, but I don't think he did a good job that year just because his highly talented team won its way into the tournament. It shouldn't have been in doubt. I think he knows this.

The Red Sox made the playoffs last year, but I'll tell you this: John Farrell was terrible.


HuskyHawk, as one of the more reasonable posters on here, I am interested in fleshing out why you felt that the 2015-2016 had such good players on the roster.

For example: Our "Best Player" was considered to be Daniel Hamilton. I realize that many on here felt that Hamilton was this fantastic player - but I submit that his game, although great at times, was often uneven. And more than once, he slacked on the defensive end. He hurt us with his uneven play in quite a few games. For example, I remember distinctly yelling at the TV at the end of the first half of the game at home against Houston (that we subsequently went on to lose) at the end of the regular season where within a minute to a minute and a half he did about 3 monumentally stupid things, including a bad pass and then sulking on defense. The lead went from 9 to 1, and then we lost in the 2nd half.

He was also an inconsistent shooter, as his 39% / 33% from 3 numbers plainly show. In addition, he never showed the desire to be a leader.

He got drafted in the late 2nd round for a reason. I hope for his sake that he improves on his game enough to make it in the NBA, but that of course is far from a sure thing at this time.

Shonn Miller: loved his hard-nosed game and grit. But he got into to foul trouble too easily and too often. He also struggled against highly skilled forwards, particularly the ones he faced in the Kansas game.

Amida Brimah: limited game. Been hashed out on here a thousand times over. A barely above average player who had a strong tendency to disappear against decent or better competition. Loved his enthusiasm, not often his actual play.

Sterling Gibbs: a decent but limited player. He could get hot, and did, at times. He also shot us in the foot with cold shooting and poor decision-making in several critical losses. He also had slow foot-speed and was a definite liability on defense against better, more agile guards.

Rodney Purvis: Inconsistent with a few good games surrounded by a lot of head scratchers.

Jalen Adams: should have pushed into action more earlier on (absolutely could be held against Ollie)... prone to freshman mistakes, but also had some shining moments, including the obvious heroics against Cincinnati in the AAC tourney quarters.

Omar Calhoun: unfortunately a shell of the player we thought we saw emerging in his freshman year. Loved his toughness and loyalty, but still have no idea how the hip surgeries at the end of his freshman year that were supposed to be "routine" and actually improve his range of motion seemed to permanently ruin his game. Mystifying.

Phil Nolan: had a few decent minutes, and certainly gave good effort on a consistent basis. But had a very limited set of skills and often you barely noticed that he was on the court.


Ok, there are our 8 best players - the rest were below these guys. Where do you see "highly talented" in this group or their backups?

This is not to say that Ollie did a great job of coaching in 2015-2016. He definitely could have done a better job coaching this group, specifically utilizing Shonn Miller more and better (how many times were we all pulling our hair out at the lack of touches he would get at critical times in games?) and recognizing Jalen Adams was his best true point guard and giving him significantly more playing time earlier in the year....
And the two losses to Temple, at home to Stanford, Cincinnati and Houston all included less than stellar coaching at critical times.

But I just don't see (and did not see at the time) the "high talent" of this group as a collective. Your thoughts?
 
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HuskyHawk, as one of the more reasonable posters on here, I am interested in fleshing out why you felt that the 2015-2016 had such good players on the roster.

For example: Our "Best Player" was considered to be Daniel Hamilton. I realize that many on here felt that Hamilton was this fantastic player - but I submit that his game, although great at times, was often uneven. And more than once, he slacked on the defensive end. He hurt us with his uneven play in quite a few games. For example, I remember distinctly yelling at the TV at the end of the first half of the game at home against Houston (that we subsequently went on to lose) at the end of the regular season where within a minute to a minute and a half he did about 3 monumentally stupid things, including a bad pass and then sulking on defense. The lead went from 9 to 1, and then we lost in the 2nd half.

He was also an inconsistent shooter, as his 39% / 33% from 3 numbers plainly show. In addition, he never showed the desire to be a leader.

He got drafted in the late 2nd round for a reason. I hope for his sake that he improves on his game enough to make it in the NBA, but that of course is far from a sure thing at this time.

Shonn Miller: loved his hard-nosed game and grit. But he got into to foul trouble too easily and too often. He also struggled against highly skilled forwards, particularly the ones he faced in the Kansas game.

Amida Brimah: limited game. Been hashed out on here a thousand times over. A barely above average player who had a strong tendency to disappear against decent or better competition. Loved his enthusiasm, not often his actual play.

Sterling Gibbs: a decent but limited player. He could get hot, and did, at times. He also shot us in the foot with cold shooting and poor decision-making in several critical losses. He also had slow foot-speed and was a definite liability on defense against better, more agile guards.

Rodney Purvis: Inconsistent with a few good games surrounded by a lot of head scratchers.

Jalen Adams: should have pushed into action more earlier on (absolutely could be held against Ollie)... prone to freshman mistakes, but also had some shining moments, including the obvious heroics against Cincinnati in the AAC tourney quarters.

Omar Calhoun: unfortunately a shell of the player we thought we saw emerging in his freshman year. Loved his toughness and loyalty, but still have no idea how the hip surgeries at the end of his freshman year that were supposed to be "routine" and actually improve his range of motion seemed to permanently ruin his game. Mystifying.

Phil Nolan: had a few decent minutes, and certainly gave good effort on a consistent basis. But had a very limited set of skills and often you barely noticed that he was on the court.


Ok, there are our 8 best players - the rest were below these guys. Where do you see "highly talented" in this group or their backups?

This is not to say that Ollie did a great job of coaching in 2015-2016. He definitely could have done a better job coaching this group, specifically utilizing Shonn Miller more and better (how many times were we all pulling our hair out at the lack of touches he would get at critical times in games?) and recognizing Jalen Adams was his best true point guard and giving him significantly more playing time earlier in the year....
And the two losses to Temple, at home to Stanford, Cincinnati and Houston all included less than stellar coaching at critical times.

But I just don't see (and did not see at the time) the "high talent" of this group as a collective. Your thoughts?
The most talented roster in the AAC and we finished 6th in the regular season.
 

Waquoit

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Uh, no... that is not my argument Waquoit. Again, you negative guys cherry-picking statements to support your false claims. My argument is and has been, correctly, that the 2014-2015 team's lack of talent and depth was directly a result of the APR ban in addition to the transfers from Calhoun's last team. Those are facts, but only part of the level-headed point I made. I did not state in that post, nor have I ever stated that the APR ban had a significant effect on this last year's team. Jeez, can you negative guys just stop with the cherry-picking of points?
You said, "It's posters like you who have built this false narrative of the last 3 years being totally Kevin Ollie's fault, as if Calhoun had nothing to do with the APR ban and its effects on two years of recruiting, that the more reasonable posters find detestable." That sure sounds like you are saying the APR ban affected this year. Since last year is part of the last 3 years and all. But the cherry picking comment is hilarious. It's as if you think your screeds are so tightly written and just a couple lines are cited, you were somehow taken out of context.
 

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