U CONN and Big 10....

[SouthronCross]

UConn's only hope is basketball. While the entire TV landscape has written off basketball, the BTN's head recently said that 60% of the networks revenues come from football. Nationally, we've heard that 85% come from football. Well, that still means bball is value at between 15-40% of revenues. That's not chopped liver.

There are two big factors as far as UConn and the B1G go.

1. Basketball. The B1G is about to get its clock cleaned in the next few years by the ACC. UNC, Duke, Louisville, Syracuse, Ga. Tech, NC State, Pitt are a formidable lineup against the B1Gs Indiana, Michigan St, Michigan, Ohio St, Wisky, Purdue, etc. Now, imagine adding UConn and Kansas to that lineup. The field instantly tilts back.

2. The Conn. TV market and NYC. It is significant. Hav a look at UConn's royalties/licensing which are the highest of the old BE. UConn sports through SNY got very high ratings in the market, and even the women's bball team knocks Syracuse bball off the air in NYC.

There are a great many negatives, but these two are the biggest factors.

I believe that UConn is still in the ACC's future plans. Once the football schools are convinced that the potential revenues being missed by overlooking basketball are substantial, and, that UConn can drive them upwards, they will come around.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Missouri would leave because it would rather be affiliated with some of the best universities in the country, especially when those universities make more money on and off the field.

There are two leagues that are untouchable, the Big 10 and Pac 12, The ACC and Big 12 have their GOR, so they are pretty safe. The SEC doesn't think anyone would ever want to leave, and for the most part, they are right. That said, Missouri pined for the Big 10 for years before they joined the SEC, and I don't imagine their preference has changed now.

For the most part I agree; but, 1) how much as Mizzo’s success on the football field in 2013 changed their minds, if at all, and 2) are there any ill feelings from Mizzo towards the B1G due to their prior snub?

 

[DarthGrumpy]

As I indicated in my previous post, I think UConn will ultimately be in the B1G. (In fact, you may remember that the administration at Rutgers knew way before the official announcement that they would get a B1G invite when a suitable partner was found. UConn may already be in the same situation.)

The bad news, as I see it, is UConn is going to be waiting awhile. A long while. The major conferences are much, much more stable than expansionist junkies seem to think. With the GOR's in place, all the more so.

IMHO, Missouri is not happening. B1G didn't want them. B1G didn't want them again. Don't know why exactly, but I'll bet the B1G still doesn't them and now I'm sure the feeling is mostly mutual especially since MO thought they were falling onto concrete and hit a feather bed instead. The most likely SEC candidate in my opinion is Vandy and, frankly, that's the longest of long shots and probably not happening. My guess is that nothing's happening until the GORs near expiration, or maybe if Texas goes slightly more insane and starts shopping again, or maybe if the Holy Mother appears on the 50 yard line during a Notre Dame game and gives the Irish a directive from heaven. I think the B1G really does want to see how the Rutgers/Maryland integration plays out. I don't think the B1G is ready to try a "grow a program" at this point.

Unless some Black Swan swims into the picture, like a Canadian school or John Hopkins running a full slate of D-1 sports or Amherst suddenly getting sports mania, I think UConn has to make the best of the wait and do all the right things in the interim.

Down the road, I could see B1G putting the full court press on Virginia or Kansas, but that's a long way off at this point.

I think I agree with the poster above who said the only way U Conn gets into the Big 10 is with Missouri....but I also think the only way the Big 10 expands in the next two years is with U Conn and Missouri....

No doubt Delaney was looking at Virginia as his first choice. There was also a lot of talk about GT and even UNC. So what has dramatically changed in the last 2 years is the execution of the GOR agreements by the ACC and Big 12. The Big 10's southeast strategy has gone out the window, for at least the nest 10 years, unless one or more ACC teams is up to challenging not only the exit fee but also the GORs.

Looking back to when Neb. was added, Mo was probably the 2md choice at the time....they lost out when NEB became available....then they joined the SEC and the BIG Ten lured MD.......

So if the Big 10 REALLY wants to expand within the next 2 years, MO may be a requirement. KU or OK would involve breaking a GOR....Conn and KU wouldn't have enough football moxey anyway. OK would bring academic and culture issues. TX doesdn't want to move, nor does UNC.

So the Big Ten could afford to pee all over MO two years ago, but might have to kiss up to them at this point.....as others have suggested, that would be a tough sale for Mo's sports fans and t-shirt backers.........

Obviously the situation changes dramatically if the Big Ten decides to wait 10 years for the GORs to run out......but tjhere have been a lot of indicatikons they would much prefer to move before the current TV contracts expire.....

Mizzo makes sense in the ‘near term’ if the B1G needs to get to 16 schools for the next TV contract in 2015 and if the B1G had abandoned tit’s southeast expansion plan, i.e. UVA, UNC & G Tech out of the ACC, due to the GOR and now believes that the XII is conference most likely to collapse and wants a land bridge to Texas (or at least Oklahoma).

One question I have not seen raised is how would the SEC respond to the B1G luring Mizzo over? Would they seek revenge and go after a B1G team or simply shrug it off and add a school to get back to 14 (West Virginia, Louisville, etc.)?

 

[hthusky74]

Let's be honest people. After this football season, we have a lot of work to do before any real conference will consider taking us in. A visit to the final four by both our basketball teams would help to minimize the damage (co-national championships would be even better!), but we really dug ourselves a deep hole this season and it will take time before we climb out of it.

 

[CTGoonie]

Let's be honest people. After this football season, we have a lot of work to do before any real conference will consider taking us in. A visit to the final four by both our basketball teams would help to minimize the damage (co-national championships would be even better!), but we really dug ourselves a deep hole this season and it will take time before we climb out of it.

Nah. Look who the B1G took last time. Rutgers has never won anything and Maryland was in the midst of a 2 win season. It's all about potential future growth.

 

[The Funster]

I can't see Texas to the B1G for a couple of reasons. The first is that the B1G has made it pretty clear that all its members will be equal. For Texas to be equal, the LHN would have to be folded into the BTN. Also, since when has Texas wanted to be anyone's equal. Secondly, I remember seeing a direct quote from Delany where he stated that he never wanted, as part of his legacy, to be instrumental in the downfall of another conference. I cannot find it but he did state that shortly after the ACC poached the BE for the 2nd time. If Texas were to leave the Big 12, it would be the end of that conference.

I'm not sure what Delany is going to do. Remember, his decision to expand came about only because the scheduling alliance with the PAC fell through. Had the PAC not had conflicts that doomed that alliance I don't think Rutgers and MD would be in the B1G right now.

 

[HuskyHawk]

The Big Ten's problem, at least in terms of expansion, is a lack of warm bodies.

Missouri was snubbed pretty hard by the Big Ten the last time around and they really do not need the Big Ten this time around. And have the conditions that caused the Big Ten to reject Mizzou in the past changed so much that they're now a candidate?

The ACC has a grant of rights, but beyond that, it's pretty clear that Virginia and probably North Carolina have rejected the Big Ten and opted to stay in a generally southern conference.

Then there is UConn - we have no obvious partner to enter with and, oh by the way, we have the worst football team in DI. We're in a conference with a bunch of schools with more parking spaces than books and they're drubbing us weekly.

If someone puts a gun to your head and asks you to make a prediction, if you don't say conference realignment has gone into deep hibernation, you do not have enough regard for the well-being of your head.

I do think the snub by the B1G will weigh on Missouri. They clearly preferred the Big Ten to the SEC. If you know antything about Mizzou, you would realize that it is pretty deeply connected to Chicago. They get a lot of kids from Chicago, always have. Plus St. Louis views itself as a little Chicago. The state of Missouri, has some southern connections, but those stem from Springfield and the Ozarks.

UVA and UNC aren't going anywhere. They correctly realized that they are in the demographic sweet spot and were best served shoring up the ACC rather than being after thoughts in the B1G. The ACC is likely to trend up, even in football, from here on out.

The only mover at this point is the Big 12, and they seem to be sitting tight, since UConn is pretty lousy fit for them. The ACC called that correctly, and effectively froze us and Cinci out by taking Louisville from the Big 12. If UConn got the ACC call, I think Cinci and UL are in the Big 12 at this point.

 

[btstimpy]

They bring the same thing they do to the B1G, a state flagship university, just like most of the other schools in the SEC (UGA, Alabama, Mississippi, LSU, UF, UT, UK, Arkansas, USC). They are also in the geographic range of the SEC much more so than the B1G.

UVA also brings Men's Soccer, Men's and Women's Lacrosse, Wrestling, Field Hockey, and Rowing that would be homeless in the Southeastern Conference. What conference would take these programs? All of UVA's athletic programs have a home and good competition in the ACC. UVA is not interested in the SEC. It is a step backwards as an athletic department to play with football factories. And it is a really big step backwards academically. I don't see it.

 

[btstimpy]

UNC might go to the SEC, if the ACC ever imploded. Which it won't for the life of the GOR, at least. The UNC Board of Governors might allow it, but, the NC General Assembly is not going to let UNC go anywhere without finding NC State a soft landing spot first.

Of course, the UNC administration might opt for the B1G, but, they'd face a backlash from the fanbase like they'd never seen in the history of the University.

While UVA fans might like the idea of the SEC, the UVA administration does not. They'd go to the B1G without a second thought.

UNC would have the same issue with the SEC that UVA would have, in fact worse because UNC sponsors more sports than UVA does with Fencing, Gymnastics, etc. I think the SEC sponsors Gymnastics. The SEC does not sponsor Men's Soccer, Men's and Women's Lacrosse, Field Hockey, Wrestling, or Rowing. The ACC sponsors all of these sports and will probably add Fencing now that Notre Dame is in.

I hope one of the negotiations for Division 4 will be to require the SEC to add sports. It makes sense for Alabama to lower Nick Sabon's salary from $7 million per year to $2 million per year and add Men's Soccer. Makes sense to me anyway. That conference is too rigged for football. I actually like the other sports too, and they will be what carry a television network.

 

[huskymedic]

I hope one of the negotiations for Division 4 will be to require the SEC to add sports. It makes sense for Alabama to lower Nick Sabon's salary from $7 million per year to $2 million per year and add Men's Soccer. Makes sense to me anyway. That conference is too rigged for football. I actually like the other sports too, and they will be what carry a television network.

http://www.athleticscholarships.net...tions-propose-more-teams-and-scholarships.htm

"A group of 12 Division I coaches’ associations in such sports as soccer, volleyball, and swimming is urging the NCAA to increase the number of sports and the amount of financial aid a university would have to offer if it sought to join any new “super division” comprising the most-powerful institutions."

http://www.athleticscholarships.net...imum-would-impact-the-power-5-conferences.htm

 

[hthusky74]

UVA also brings Men's Soccer, Men's and Women's Lacrosse, Wrestling, Field Hockey, and Rowing that would be homeless in the Southeastern Conference. What conference would take these programs? All of UVA's athletic programs have a home and good competition in the ACC. UVA is not interested in the SEC. It is a step backwards as an athletic department to play with football factories. And it is a really big step backwards academically. I don't see it.

You miss the basic point. There is nothing to be gained by the SEC if they add UVA, nothing. They are lucky to be where they are in the ACC.

 

[Sea Goat]

UVA also brings Men's Soccer, Men's and Women's Lacrosse, Wrestling, Field Hockey, and Rowing that would be homeless in the Southeastern Conference. What conference would take these programs? All of UVA's athletic programs have a home and good competition in the ACC. UVA is not interested in the SEC. It is a step backwards as an athletic department to play with football factories. And it is a really big step backwards academically. I don't see it.

Didn't UVA already agree to a big step backwards academically by voting to add Louisville to the ACC?

 

[hthusky74]

Didn't UVA already agree to a big step backwards academically by voting to add Louisville to the ACC?

Athletically, Louisville is on the up-side and UVA is ancient history.

 

[Sea Goat]

Athletically, Louisville is on the up-side and UVA is ancient history.

You miss the point. UVA has been an elite national university for decades - along with many schools in the ACC. Our Cavalier friend says the SEC would be a step back academically for UVA, but they voted to accept Louisville, a school ranked below Ole Miss. Louisville is doing great now in athletics, but it wasn't always that way. Academically, it has been an underachiever for decades.

 

[NickyNewark]

Rutgers, if they continue along the line of their 49-14 pasting by Houston, may not be much of a draw for Big Ten fans...How many Ohio State or Michigan fans will spend money to travel to watch their team pound Rutgers versus travel to a Ohio State-Michigan Match..or Penn State-Ohio State, etc?

THOUSANDS.... Now your showing even me the truth!!I guess folksy doesn't have to equate with classy or having anything special on CFB!This was an interesting thread until your classless comment!And what do you care anyway?RU's in like it or not.Live with it!

 

[btstimpy]

Didn't UVA already agree to a big step backwards academically by voting to add Louisville to the ACC?

The ACC did yes. But 12 top 75 schools including 8 top 50 schools with 3 outliers in the ACC is better than 4 top 75 schools with 1 top 50 school and 10 outliers in the SEC.

 

[btstimpy]

http://www.athleticscholarships.net...tions-propose-more-teams-and-scholarships.htm

"A group of 12 Division I coaches’ associations in such sports as soccer, volleyball, and swimming is urging the NCAA to increase the number of sports and the amount of financial aid a university would have to offer if it sought to join any new “super division” comprising the most-powerful institutions."

http://www.athleticscholarships.net...imum-would-impact-the-power-5-conferences.htm

Good. I was going to suggest 20 sport minimum. Those not participating could probably afford to upgrade to that much. 24 sport minimum would have some schools dropping out of all the conferences. For example, to me it doesn't make sense for the richest athletics departments in Texas as well as Alabama to be out there fielding only 18 sports like they do today. The other extreme is somebody like Ohio State who fields 35. That's a bit rich.

 

[btstimpy]

You miss the basic point. There is nothing to be gained by the SEC if they add UVA, nothing. They are lucky to be where they are in the ACC.

Not even in the cards for consideration. Not interested in the SEC.

 

[Sea Goat]

The ACC did yes. But 12 top 75 schools including 8 top 50 schools with 3 outliers in the ACC is better than 4 top 75 schools with 1 top 50 school and 10 outliers in the SEC.

So why dilute the academic integrity of the conference for some perceived quick fix with Louisville? Did the Board of Visitors hold its collective nose on that one? Smacks of desperation. Here's what I'll never get - the ACC adds 3 former BE schools (I don't count ND and you shouldn't either.) that all are ranked below UConn academically. Further, none of them had a more distinguished athletic record either. If its all about the hatred then keep us out - we'll land some place where petty bu!! is not paramount.

 

[John Greene]

So why dilute the academic integrity of the conference for some perceived quick fix with Louisville? Did the Board of Visitors hold its collective nose on that one? Smacks of desperation. Here's what I'll never get - the ACC adds 3 former BE schools (I don't count ND and you shouldn't either.) that all are ranked below UConn academically. Further, none of them had a more distinguished athletic record either. If its all about the hatred then keep us out - we'll land some place where petty bu!! is not paramount.

I'm sorry but here I go again.

Hatred, no. Payback probably. We (justly or not) are associated in the minds of many sports administrators with the Blumenthal strategy of bringing actions against college presidents and AD as well a conference officials as individuals.
That made what should have been business, personal. Cuse & Pitt were part of the action but are not seen as closely associated with the particular strategy. This opinion is not mine but comes from two SEC admins.

 

[businesslawyer]

So why dilute the academic integrity of the conference for some perceived quick fix with Louisville? Did the Board of Visitors hold its collective nose on that one? Smacks of desperation. Here's what I'll never get - the ACC adds 3 former BE schools (I don't count ND and you shouldn't either.) that all are ranked below UConn academically. Further, none of them had a more distinguished athletic record either. If its all about the hatred then keep us out - we'll land some place where petty bu!! is not paramount.

I don't know why you are wasting time with him on this. There is no reason I know of to think UVA wouldn't have been happier had UConn joined instead of LV. What do you want UVA to do -- quit in protest?

 

[btstimpy]

So why dilute the academic integrity of the conference for some perceived quick fix with Louisville? Did the Board of Visitors hold its collective nose on that one? Smacks of desperation. Here's what I'll never get - the ACC adds 3 former BE schools (I don't count ND and you shouldn't either.) that all are ranked below UConn academically. Further, none of them had a more distinguished athletic record either. If its all about the hatred then keep us out - we'll land some place where petty bu!! is not paramount.

I would like to see UConn invited. I've said it on this board many times. I think UConn brings a lot. The ACC has an expansion committee that is made up of Presidents, ADs, and faculty reps. They have gone over all the available and interested schools very carefully and put together an options list, and they like what they see in Louisville. They weren't interested in West Virginia who is about the same academically as Louisville and has existing rivalries with Pitt and Virginia Tech. Why? I don't have a clue. I'm not privy to that information, and they keep it well locked down. I do know that the schools in the southern part of the ACC sponsored Louisville. They were an option that pleased both the football interests and the basketball interests in the conference. The academic interests sat that one out.

 

[B1GALUM]

Mizzo makes sense in the ‘near term’ if the B1G needs to get to 16 schools for the next TV contract in 2015 and if the B1G had abandoned tit’s southeast expansion plan, i.e. UVA, UNC & G Tech out of the ACC, due to the GOR and now believes that the XII is conference most likely to collapse and wants a land bridge to Texas (or at least Oklahoma).

I have seen speculation about Mizzou to the B1G in the kind of scenario that you mentioned and speculated about it myself: the B1G is going to 20 and Mizzou comes along with Kansas, Oklahoma and Texas to join Nebraska for a 5 team pod.

However, I do not think the B1G "needs" Mizzou for the next TV contract.
I anticipate the B1G could go forward with the 14 schools and have allowances for re-negotiation of the TV contract should additional members join the B1G.
I would have to rely on those of you in the business and legal realm regarding whether this is a feasible option.

Regarding Mizzou ...
Yes Mizzou meets much of the B1G criteria for a prospective member but ...
The B1G could have invited Mizzou before the Big 8 and SWC merged but did not.
The B1G could have invited Mizzou back in 2009-2010 when conference realignment blew up after the B1G announced it was thinking of expanding but did not.
The B1G could have invited Mizzou back in 2011 when it became apparent Mizzou was going to leave for the SEC but did not.
My personal opinion: I would be fine with Mizzou in the B1G and have been surprised that it did not happen.
However, my personal opinion aside, it is difficult for me to see why the B1G would invite Mizzou now.
The B1G does not "need" Mizzou and Mizzou does not "need" the B1G.
The B1G would certainly take Texas without a "land bridge".

 

[hthusky74]

You miss the point. UVA has been an elite national university for decades - along with many schools in the ACC. Our Cavalier friend says the SEC would be a step back academically for UVA, but they voted to accept Louisville, a school ranked below Ole Miss. Louisville is doing great now in athletics, but it wasn't always that way. Academically, it has been an underachiever for decades.

No you miss the point It isn't a matter of would UVA go to the SEC or not, it is a matter of would the SEC ever add UVA. The answer is NO. They already have Vanderbilt, why would they add a school not isn't even as good academically as Vanderbilt and has been going downhill athletically for years? UVA is not a major player in these discussions.

 

[Adios]

I have seen speculation about Mizzou to the B1G in the kind of scenario that you mentioned and speculated about it myself: the B1G is going to 20 and Mizzou comes along with Kansas, Oklahoma and Texas to join Nebraska for a 5 team pod.

However, I do not think the B1G "needs" Mizzou for the next TV contract.
I anticipate the B1G could go forward with the 14 schools and have allowances for re-negotiation of the TV contract should additional members join the B1G.
I would have to rely on those of you in the business and legal realm regarding whether this is a feasible option.

Regarding Mizzou ...
Yes Mizzou meets much of the B1G criteria for a prospective member but ...
The B1G could have invited Mizzou before the Big 8 and SWC merged but did not.
The B1G could have invited Mizzou back in 2009-2010 when conference realignment blew up after the B1G announced it was thinking of expanding but did not.
The B1G could have invited Mizzou back in 2011 when it became apparent Mizzou was going to leave for the SEC but did not.
My personal opinion: I would be fine with Mizzou in the B1G and have been surprised that it did not happen.
However, my personal opinion aside, it is difficult for me to see why the B1G would invite Mizzou now.
The B1G does not "need" Mizzou and Mizzou does not "need" the B1G.
The B1G would certainly take Texas without a "land bridge".

Taking all factors into consideration, I find it surprising that the B1G chose Nebraska over Missouri. Missouri has much more significance in trade routes and obviously has a larger population. Nebraska just has 5 titles in football and a lot of crops. And I guess Warren Buffet.

If the B1G does go to 20 and UConn is added, who would the 20th school be?