The Official 2023 New England Patriots Thread

[Husky25]

He played more or less like always. Made a few bad throws, mostly good ones. Guys caught the ball, line gave him time. The biggest change I saw was a massive increase in pre-snap motion, misdirection and a real effort to disguise what they were doing. That was a welcome change, I’m no expert and I felt like I could reliably predict what they were running before. So the D definitely could.

Didn't watch the game yet. I record all the Patriots and Commanders (when they are on terrestrial TV). The Patriots are the primary franchise in my market, so because they preempted the FOX game, I listened to/watched that game from an "alternate source" as I was doing house and yard work. I had planned to watch the Patriots at during the 4:00 window, but I was so disgusted by the Commanders performance, I hardly watched any more football yesterday.

Glad they won and I'll watch at some point today or tomorrow.

 

[HuskyHawk]

This weekend is really interesting. If they pull off a win, I think they have to be buyers at the trade deadline. If they lose, we can expect them to trade some pieces. My overall guess is we will see some trades of impending free agents like Uche and maybe Dugger. Bill will also value shop for guys he thinks are under-valued.

 

[HuskyHawk]

It's bad. So many dumb penalties. Guys running horrible routes. Guys dropping easy passes. Mac making some really good throws and some really bad one (the floated sideline ball to Mondre off the back foot). He almost threw a pick when throwing a ball away, and yet there was no need to even throw it away, there was no significant pressure. Defense played well except it kept giving up big plays on 3rd down, over and over. Bill benching his two best CBs to start didn't help, but maybe it was needed to send a message.

I think it's time to blow it up. Too many of these guys have checked out.

 

[Husky25]

It's bad. So many dumb penalties. Guys running horrible routes. Guys dropping easy passes. Mac making some really good throws and some really bad one (the floated sideline ball to Mondre off the back foot). He almost threw a pick when throwing a ball away, and yet there was no need to even throw it away, there was no significant pressure. Defense played well except it kept giving up big plays on 3rd down, over and over. Bill benching his two best CBs to start didn't help, but maybe it was needed to send a message.

I think it's time to blow it up. Too many of these guys have checked out.

Belichick's decision to put a ST coach and Defensive Coordinator in control of the offense may have damaged Mac Jones beyond repair.

The way BB answered questions during the week, there was speculation on WEEI that he is flirting with Washington to become their head coach. I really hope that does not turn out to be the case. Washington needs new blood too.

 

[Waquoit]

Mac has been a stiff from day one. Nobody damaged him except himself.

 

[Husky25]

Mac has been a stiff from day one. Nobody damaged him except himself.

Disagree. 3,800 yards and a pro bowl alternate as a rookie. He had promise.

 

[Waquoit]

Disagree. 3,800 yards and a pro bowl alternate as a rookie. He had promise.

Biggest game of the year and they didn't let him throw the ball. Plus, he sounds like a clubhouse lawyer.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Disagree. 3,800 yards and a pro bowl alternate as a rookie. He had promise.

Biggest game of the year and they didn't let him throw the ball. Plus, he sounds like a clubhouse lawyer.

It's easy to talk yourself into anything. He's accurate and fairly smart. He's more mobile than people said he was. He does not have a big arm, but it's an NFL arm. So he's a lot better than he has looked and won't be out of the league anytime soon. At worst, he's a 10+ year backup who starts some. Nic Foles, Mariota level backup at a minimum. Which is why trading him this year would be dumb.

My main complaint is that he's too often throwing touch passes, especially to the sideline. The grotesque floater to Mondre was one of dozens of examples. His screens have the same issue. It lets defenders close on our guys and either break it up or tackle them immediately. Too much air under deep balls too. He lacks appreciation for NFL defenses. Brady did this a bit too, early on (not a bad as Mac), and learned how to really rip tight window throws later on.

I'm ready to move on, even if we keep Mac as insurance. Zappe is awful and needs to be cut. I'd be thrilled to see what Cunningham can do. Honestly, given what Dobbs just did and what Purdy has done, you have to find out if other teams just missed on Cunningham. Nobody wanted Romo or Kurt Warner either. I don't want to waste the 3rd pick in the draft on a mobile QB if we already have one.

 

[Deepster]

It's easy to talk yourself into anything. He's accurate and fairly smart. He's more mobile than people said he was. He does not have a big arm, but it's an NFL arm. So he's a lot better than he has looked and won't be out of the league anytime soon. At worst, he's a 10+ year backup who starts some. Nic Foles, Mariota level backup at a minimum. Which is why trading him this year would be dumb.

My main complaint is that he's too often throwing touch passes, especially to the sideline. The grotesque floater to Mondre was one of dozens of examples. His screens have the same issue. It lets defenders close on our guys and either break it up or tackle them immediately. Too much air under deep balls too. He lacks appreciation for NFL defenses. Brady did this a bit too, early on (not a bad as Mac), and learned how to really rip tight window throws later on.

I'm ready to move on, even if we keep Mac as insurance. Zappe is awful and needs to be cut. I'd be thrilled to see what Cunningham can do. Honestly, given what Dobbs just did and what Purdy has done, you have to find out if other teams just missed on Cunningham. Nobody wanted Romo or Kurt Warner either. I don't want to waste the 3rd pick in the draft on a mobile QB if we already have one.

Take it for what it's worth. A lot of the time you say things like "he's more mobile than people said he was" like it's true. And you really have nothing quantifiable to back that up. And the numbers completely disagree with you. He has 1 rushing TD in 40 career games and horrific rushing splits. He's possibly the LEAST mobile QB in the league right now. But you talk yourself into believing that's not the case and you need to stop that.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Take it for what it's worth. A lot of the time you say things like "he's more mobile than people said he was" like it's true. And you really have nothing quantifiable to back that up. And the numbers completely disagree with you. He has 1 rushing TD in 40 career games and horrific rushing splits. He's possibly the LEAST mobile QB in the league right now. But you talk yourself into believing that's not the case and you need to stop that.

Get real. He’s way more mobile than Kirk Cousins, or Jimmy G. It’s time to move on. That doesn’t mean he’s terrible. He’s just not the answer.

Qb Rushing Leaders 2023 | StatMuse

Lamar Jackson had the most rushing yards by a quarterback in 2023, with 821 yards.

www.statmuse.com

 

[Husky25]

Biggest game of the year and they didn't let him throw the ball. Plus, he sounds like a clubhouse lawyer.

Yeah, the weather was not even considered when developing the gameplan that evening. The Patriots had a solid running game and good defense in '21, and I commented in this space at the time that I thought it took remarkable leadership and maturity for a kid that young and with his history of success to stick to the gameplan and not complain.

Of course it helps to win.

 

[HuskyHawk]

It's a fair question at this point.

Has Bill Belichick lost the room? That’s the only question worth asking at this point

What’s troubling isn’t just the sloppiness the Patriots have displayed on the field. Just as concerning is what is happening off the field.

theathletic.com

 

[Deepster]

Get real. He’s way more mobile than Kirk Cousins, or Jimmy G. It’s time to move on. That doesn’t mean he’s terrible. He’s just not the answer.

Qb Rushing Leaders 2023 | StatMuse

Lamar Jackson had the most rushing yards by a quarterback in 2023, with 821 yards.

www.statmuse.com

Based on what? You watching the 3 of them and deciding you’re right? Back it up or stop posting your nonsense.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Based on what? You watching the 3 of them and deciding you’re right? Back it up or stop posting your nonsense.

I posted their rushing numbers. He's not worst (or even close). He's bottom 1/3. You want to talk pocket presence/movement? He sucks at that this year.

 

[Waquoit]

He sucks at that this year.

This year? Like all of a sudden he sucks at it? Why are you wasting your time defending a stiff? But I'll give you he's more mobile than Cousins today.

 

[Waquoit]

I commented in this space at the time that I thought it took remarkable leadership and maturity for a kid that young and with his history of success to stick to the gameplan and not complain.

Could there be a possibly lower bar for success?

 

[HeGotGame]

I posted their rushing numbers. He's not worst (or even close). He's bottom 1/3. You want to talk pocket presence/movement? He sucks at that this year.

Of QBs that have played every week he is near the bottom, there is four or five below him, that have less running attempts. Cleary using his mobility is not part of the game plan. Also, every QB above him averages more yards a carry except Burrow who is playing on 1 leg.

If this is the hill you want to die on defending him, go for it, but it is an odd one.

 

[HuskyHawk]

This year? Like all of a sudden he sucks at it? Why are you wasting your time defending a stiff? But I'll give you he's more mobile than Cousins today.

He was better at it as a rookie. I said it's time to move on. Acting like he's the worst QB in the NFL is ridiculous, he's not. Most of what's wrong with the team isn't him, but some of it is and he doesn't do enough to cover up the other stuff. There's no point in screaming about him like a toddler. There is no QB in NFL history that would elevate this team beyond mediocre as it is right now.

Hate to say it but Troy Brown has to go. He took over the WR group in 2020 and they seem very poorly coached. No fundamentals in route running, the don't catch the ball. Awful.

 

[Husky25]

Could there be a possibly lower bar for success?

If you are talking about prior to the referenced game in Buffalo during the 2021 season, then yes. There could 100% be a lower bar for success.

Prior to that game, Mac Jones was 8-4 as a pro. He was selected 15th overall, beat out the incumbent starter, and out performed every other rookie QB, including Trevor Lawrence.

Prior to being selected #15 overall, he went 15-1 as a starter at the best program money could buy, set the single season NCAA completion % record, threw for 4,500 yards and 41 TDs, and won a National Championship.

With the benefit of hindsight, Tom Brady would have been selected earlier than #199 and Brock Purdy would not be a Mr. Irrelevant. Lance, Wilson, and Fields would not have even been invited to the Green Room, either.

A special teams and defensive coordinator trying to coach offense drove down said bar.

 

[HeGotGame]

Pats should keep drafting kickers in the 4th round. As dumb as that pick was at the time it somehow looks even dumber now.

 

[87Xfer]

These guys are just hard to watch right now. Stevenson is the only bright spot on the team.

 

[HuskyHawk]

These guys are just hard to watch right now. Stevenson is the only bright spot on the team.

At this point they need to lose. Tanking for the pick

 

[BRS24]

Mac was not a 1st round pick. Mac is not getting a contract extension.
Bill needs to go. Take Brian and Steve B with him.
Josh is not the answer at HC. Maybe Mayo, not sure.
Clean house.
Jonathan needs to take over for Robert.

Since I no longer live in CT, I'm thankful that I don't get the NEP games every week, and don't feel obligated to watch them.

 

[87Xfer]

Mac was not a 1st round pick. Mac is not getting a contract extension.
Bill needs to go. Take Brian and Steve B with him.
Josh is not the answer at HC. Maybe Mayo, not sure.
Clean house.
Jonathan needs to take over for Robert.

Since I no longer live in CT, I'm thankful that I don't get the NEP games every week, and don't feel obligated to watch them.

I bought NFL Sunday Ticket exclusively for the pleasure of watching this ish show

 

[Waquoit]

Jonathan needs to take over for Robert.

If Jonathan is the answer, what's the question? If you look up mediocre, they give the New England Revolution as an example. That's Jon's baby.