The Official 2016 NY Yankees Thread

[DarthGrumpy]

Any word if there are open try-out for a 1st baseman? Unlike A-Rod, I have no problem learning a new skillset to help my team.

 

[Dooley]

This year might be what is best for Yankees baseball going forward. Trade at least 2 of their 3 headed bullpen monster and seriously stock up the farm. Deal off Gardner, Ellsbury, Tex, Castro, McCann, Tanaka, CC, whoever. Shed money. Here is what I would do:

Chapman to the Texas Rangers for Jurickson Profar and Dillon Tate. Chapman immediately becomes the CP in Texas, something they sorely need, and frees up the MI logjam they have. Tate is a live arm but years away. Profar becomes immediate 3B when...

Castro and Miller (and some cash) to Washington for Trea Turner, Victor Robles and Erick Feede. Miller setups up Papelbon who won't relinquish his CP role and gives the Nats an elite LHP in their pen for a playoff push. Castro is an IMMEDIATE upgrade over Danny Espinosa and Dusty Baker is familiar with him. Turner is called up tomorrow and is the Yankees new 2B. Robles is 1-2 years out and needs room cleared for him. Feede is a nice #2 SP projection, probably 2 years out.

Ellsbury or Gardner (plus cash), Betances, and Tanaka to Cubs for Gleybar Torres, Ian Happ, Eddy Martinez, and Carl Edwards. Ellsbury/Gardner immediately hits 1 or 2 in that lineup and helps fill the void left by Schwarber's injury. Taking back part of one of those contracts is the price paid for acquiring an elite pen arm who could shift to CP if Rondon struggles. Tanaka gives them a solid 3 or 4 SP behind Arrieta, Lester, and Hammel/Hendricks. Torres could supplant Didi at SS in 2017. Happ and Martinez are years away but both, especially Martinez, offer very good upside. Edwards is probably middle of the rotation arm but I could see him shifted to the pen (ala Betances) to max out his stuff.

DFA - Chase Headley.

2016 free agency - sign Chapman back (will not lose the 1st rd pick since he was traded). 4 years/$60M.

C - McCann
1B - Bird
2B - Turner
SS - Torres/Didi
3B - Profar
RF - Judge
CF - Robles?
LF - Ellsbury/Gardner
DH - ARod

The rotation will be horrendous in 2017 but it doesn't matter. 2017-18 free agency class can quickly fix that after a year for Feede, Tate and Edwards (and Kapriellan) to develop. The name of the game here is clearing out money for the free agency class. OF will have an opening for Harper. Rotation will have an opening for J Fernandez. Maybe even 2 openings for Fernandez and Harvey. The lineup will have young speed, excellent INF defense, and plenty of upside to build around Harper. The pen will have 2 years of Chapman as CP to make a run at the 2018 and 2019 WS.

But make no mistake, 2016 is toast. They need to tear this thing down now before any injury bugs bite.

 

[mauconnfan]

Any word if there are open try-out for a 1st baseman? Unlike A-Rod, I have no problem learning a new skillset to help my team.

ARods trying to reinvent himself as a hitter, leave him alone

 

[mauconnfan]

This year might be what is best for Yankees baseball going forward. Trade at least 2 of their 3 headed bullpen monster and seriously stock up the farm. Deal off Gardner, Ellsbury, Tex, Castro, McCann, Tanaka, CC, whoever. Shed money. Here is what I would do:

Chapman to the Texas Rangers for Jurickson Profar and Dillon Tate. Chapman immediately becomes the CP in Texas, something they sorely need, and frees up the MI logjam they have. Tate is a live arm but years away. Profar becomes immediate 3B when...

Castro and Miller (and some cash) to Washington for Trea Turner, Victor Robles and Erick Feede. Miller setups up Papelbon who won't relinquish his CP role and gives the Nats an elite LHP in their pen for a playoff push. Castro is an IMMEDIATE upgrade over Danny Espinosa and Dusty Baker is familiar with him. Turner is called up tomorrow and is the Yankees new 2B. Robles is 1-2 years out and needs room cleared for him. Feede is a nice #2 SP projection, probably 2 years out.

Ellsbury or Gardner (plus cash), Betances, and Tanaka to Cubs for Gleybar Torres, Ian Happ, Eddy Martinez, and Carl Edwards. Ellsbury/Gardner immediately hits 1 or 2 in that lineup and helps fill the void left by Schwarber's injury. Taking back part of one of those contracts is the price paid for acquiring an elite pen arm who could shift to CP if Rondon struggles. Tanaka gives them a solid 3 or 4 SP behind Arrieta, Lester, and Hammel/Hendricks. Torres could supplant Didi at SS in 2017. Happ and Martinez are years away but both, especially Martinez, offer very good upside. Edwards is probably middle of the rotation arm but I could see him shifted to the pen (ala Betances) to max out his stuff.

DFA - Chase Headley.

2016 free agency - sign Chapman back (will not lose the 1st rd pick since he was traded). 4 years/$60M.

C - McCann
1B - Bird
2B - Turner
SS - Torres/Didi
3B - Profar
RF - Judge
CF - Robles?
LF - Ellsbury/Gardner
DH - ARod

The rotation will be horrendous in 2017 but it doesn't matter. 2017-18 free agency class can quickly fix that after a year for Feede, Tate and Edwards (and Kapriellan) to develop. The name of the game here is clearing out money for the free agency class. OF will have an opening for Harper. Rotation will have an opening for J Fernandez. Maybe even 2 openings for Fernandez and Harvey. The lineup will have young speed, excellent INF defense, and plenty of upside to build around Harper. The pen will have 2 years of Chapman as CP to make a run at the 2018 and 2019 WS.

But make no mistake, 2016 is toast. They need to tear this thing down now before any injury bugs bite.

I like your thoughts just can't do all or much of that. I mean Betances, Chapman, Miller and Tanaka all gone? That would be ridiculous. No way you get rid of more than one of the 7-8-9 pen guys. Have to keep tanaka their only solid guy, should be a 2-3 guy and a solid one. Can't bake on too many minor leaguers like that doesn't always work.

But they do need to blow it up in some ways for sure and by no means, unless he makes a major comeback, does ARod continue to be the DH - take a huge loss and dump him and Tex, they blow.

 

[Dooley]

I like your thoughts just can't do all or much of that. I mean Betances, Chapman, Miller and Tanaka all gone? That would be ridiculous. No way you get rid of more than one of the 7-8-9 pen guys. Have to keep tanaka their only solid guy, should be a 2-3 guy and a solid one. Can't bake on too many minor leaguers like that doesn't always work.

But they do need to blow it up in some ways for sure and by no means, unless he makes a major comeback, does ARod continue to be the DH - take a huge loss and dump him and Tex, they blow.

I say yes. They are not going to be competitive this year and, spoiler alert!, they won't be competitive next year either. This approach would be the NBA approach. Clear money, add as many high upside prospects with 1-2 year windows as possible, then spend, spend, spend after the 2017 season (when the contracts of ARod, Tex, CC, etc are all finally gone) and mesh the two together. The Yankees best trade chips are their 7-8-9 inning guys and with the premium placed on bullpen arms, especially for contenders, the haul that all 3 could net is too much to ignore. You don't need a good bullpen when you're only winning 70-80 games per year.

 

[mauconnfan]

I say yes. They are not going to be competitive this year and, spoiler alert!, they won't be competitive next year either. This approach would be the NBA approach. Clear money, add as many high upside prospects with 1-2 year windows as possible, then spend, spend, spend after the 2017 season (when the contracts of ARod, Tex, CC, etc are all finally gone) and mesh the two together. The Yankees best trade chips are their 7-8-9 inning guys and with the premium placed on bullpen arms, especially for contenders, the haul that all 3 could net is too much to ignore. You don't need a good bullpen when you're only winning 70-80 games per year.

But you need a good bullpen eventually and there's no guarantee anyone you trade for can be any of those guys. No way on earth you unload all of them.

 

[Dooley]

But you need a good bullpen eventually and there's no guarantee anyone you trade for can be any of those guys. No way on earth you unload all of them.

Agree to disagree. My point: we aren't competitive in 2016. We will not be competitive in 2017 either. That gives 2 years to find other (cheaper) live arms. Whether that arm is a failed SP who couldn't develop a 3rd pitch or a free agent or acquired via trade in 2018 (when we are ready to contend again), there is plenty of time. I would rather use that time building up the youth so that in 2018, when we have over $100M worth of freed up free agency money to spend, we can use it to compliment a solid core lineup.

 

[Dove]

@Dooley I see your interesting "If I were GM" post. Interesting stuff. Off the top of my head I can't remember the last time the Yanks traded for a top prospect. Not #firecashman 's forte.

I will spend time tonight to think like a rebuilduing GM. Astros have a stud SP in the minors named Joe Musgrove. Would love to see him come back for a closer. Or maybe take a shot at Joey Gallo.

Remember...the Bird is still the Word! Just next year.

 

[mauconnfan]

Agree to disagree. My point: we aren't competitive in 2016. We will not be competitive in 2017 either. That gives 2 years to find other (cheaper) live arms. Whether that arm is a failed SP who couldn't develop a 3rd pitch or a free agent or acquired via trade in 2018 (when we are ready to contend again), there is plenty of time. I would rather use that time building up the youth so that in 2018, when we have over $100M worth of freed up free agency money to spend, we can use it to compliment a solid core lineup.

All good here, both frustrated with what we have and something needs to be done for sure no matter what.

 

[mauconnfan]

@Dooley I see your interesting "If I were GM" post. Interesting stuff. Off the top of my head I can't remember the last time the Yanks traded for a top prospect. Not #firecashman 's forte.

I will spend time tonight to think like a rebuilduing GM. Astros have a stud SP in the minors named Joe Musgrove. Would love to see him come back for a closer. Or maybe take a shot at Joey Gallo.

Remember...the Bird is still the Word! Just next year.

Quit worrying about being a Yanks GM and get your butt up in the bushes of Storrs to see how the visits are going!

 

[Deadrody]

First of all, you can't just deal off players. There has to be someone who WANTS them, first. Tex, A-Rod, Ellsbury, CC, Gardner, etc. aren't netting you anything of value unless the Yankees eat a whole lot of those horrific contracts (Gardner's is the least bad, but still, he can't stay healthy so you'd be trading him just at the point of the season when he typically tanks). Tex isn't hitting a lick and he's hurt. You couldn't trade him for a bag of balls.

Tanaka, while currently the ace of the staff, has a ticking time bomb in his elbow and an opt out. after next season, so his value is limited.

The only real trade chips they have are Chapman, Miller, and Betances. Fortunately, you don't build a team around late inning relieves, so while Mau is loathe trade them, if you can get a solid return, you do it.

Castro is also not an immediate upgrade for the Nats. And that's comparing him to Castro playing 2B, rather than SS where he is a liability, especially compared to Espinosa.

The thing to remember is if your team is somewhat stinky, it's not because they have good players. Beltran is probably the single most valuable hitter on the team right now, yet you don't have him listed in the overly optimistic trade list.

The bottom line is that the plan all along - allegedly - has been to get the payroll down below the luxury threshold for a reset, and then spend. Of course, that was the plan before and then they got nervous and blew it on the ridiculous 2014 off season lighting money on fire for McCann, Beltran, and Ellsbury. Suffice to say, I'm not overly confident that they don't get nervous again and blow up that plan with bad contracts for aging veteran free agents.

 

[Deadrody]

But you need a good bullpen eventually and there's no guarantee anyone you trade for can be any of those guys. No way on earth you unload all of them.

Thing is, they're letting Chapman go at the end of the year, regardless. And by the time the team is ready to be competitive, Miller will bein a contract walk year. The only one worth keeping is Betances because he is under team control for a while yet. but by that same logic, he's by far the most valuable of the three. With the volatility of high leverage relief pitchers, who knows if he's the same guy in 2018 he is now.

Also for anyone's team projection or trade proposal, TINSTAAPP. Kaprelian is already on the high A DL. I wouldn't count on him or any other pitcher in the Yankees system for anything. All you need to do is look at where Severino is right now.

 

[Dooley]

Thing is, they're letting Chapman go at the end of the year, regardless. And by the time the team is ready to be competitive, Miller will bein a contract walk year. The only one worth keeping is Betances because he is under team control for a while yet. but by that same logic, he's by far the most valuable of the three. With the volatility of high leverage relief pitchers, who knows if he's the same guy in 2018 he is now.

Also for anyone's team projection or trade proposal, TINSTAAPP. Kaprelian is already on the high A DL. I wouldn't count on him or any other pitcher in the Yankees system for anything. All you need to do is look at where Severino is right now.

Exactly my point on relievers. When you have a mediocre club like the Yankees do, you don't need top shelf CPs or middle relief. You trade these guys while their value is extremely high - like it is at this very moment. All 3. Even Betances. That gives the Yankees 2 years to evaluate every arm under contract, available in international free agency/amateur draft, and on other rosters. To me, Kap screams closer to me. Live arm, might never develop the required 3rd pitch to be an effective SP.

As for Beltran, every day they don't deal him off increases the likelihood of him landing on the DL and weighing down the roster. They will need to trade him to an AL club so they can DH him to save his legs. Of the teams in contention, not many have a free DH spot on their roster. Needless to say, the return will be minimal at best.

I, too, worry about a needless spending spree this offseason in a poor free agency class. The best names on this offseason's free agency list are two closers (assuming both Chapman and Jansen hit the market like they appear to want) - something a last place team does not need, especially at the cost of their 1st round pick. Unfortunately for the Yankees, they will likely finish a notch below .500. Mediocre, but not bottom 10 awful. That means any tendered free agent will cost them their 1st round pick. I am absolutely not on board with tossing that away for anyone in this free agency class. I suppose they could sign Chapman since if the Yankees trade him, he will not cost a first round pick. But again, a bad team does not need a top shelf CP. I would prefer that they continue to trim the financial fit and have over $100M come 2018 when names like Harper, Fernandez, Harvey, Arrieta, etc hit the market. Those names excite me. Paired with young, developed talent from the next few years, this team could become exciting to watch again...assuming YES and Comcast can settle their differences by then!

 

[Dooley]

One interesting name that I see dropping in MLB Mock Drafts is Alec Hansen, SP at Oklahoma. Aside from the obvious top arms in the draft (Puk, Groome, Pint), Hansen has the best arm. The knock on him is control and consistency - a knock that most young pitchers have entering the draft. I don't care about that. I care about the 80 grade heater. He's got himself a huge frame (6'7") and a wipeout slider to accompany 98+ heat. Sound familiar? If he doesn't develop the control/consistency, I can see him following in Betances' footsteps as a dominating bullpen arm. Mocks have him going anywhere from the middle of the 1st round through to the 2nd round. The Yankees pick at 18. They were able to draft a live arm in Kap at 17 last year. I would love to follow that up and grab Hansen this year at 18.

Just my two cents.

 

[zyron]

Wow, 12 runs so far, most since second game of season. It's a miracle.

 

[Dove]

What's up with CC Sabathia? Girardi says its the knee brace keeping his landing pain free.

Watched him throw 40+ pitches in first two innings last night. When he got Miggy to bounce into a DP (4th inning?) you knew Sabathia was pitching on guile.

 

[mauconnfan]

What's up with CC Sabathia? Girardi says its the knee brace keeping his landing pain free.

Watched him throw 40+ pitches in first two innings last night. When he got Miggy to bounce into a DP (4th inning?) you knew Sabathia was pitching on guile.

Rumor is that cutter now at 85-87 is from Mo and Andy working with him and it's huge. He's changing speeds nicely learned how to pitch and added a couple at 92-93 rather than 89-91 all the time. I'm impressed so far, will grab a Crow App at dinner tonight. Of course there's still a lot of pain on this team on offense but a couple bats have awaken. Amazing this team could even win 5 in a row.

 

[Dove]

When watching the CC game I thought of Andy when I saw some of those "slurves". Didn't know they were working with him.

 

[Dove]

The Yankees are 21-15 since #norunsdmc have been together. Imagine how things would have been if Chappy didn't browbeat his woman.

I don't understand the intrigue in the shirts when the trade rumors are flying.

 

[Deadrody]

The Yankees are 21-15 since #norunsdmc have been together. Imagine how things would have been if Chappy didn't browbeat his woman.

I don't understand the intrigue in the shirts when the trade rumors are flying.

If that never happened, the trade with the Dodgers goes through and this is all moot.

If you go back and look at the games they lost, there are only 3 where Chapman might have made a difference. Johnny Barbato took the loss in 2 of them, and Nova the other one, altho Betances gave up the HR that was ultimately the difference in that game against the Sox.

 

[Dove]

So the Yankees are in suck mode again out west and...

the Chapman trade talks are revving up. The Cubbies will be suitors and here is an article saying Andrew Miller could be a future Cub WITH(!!) Chapman.

Better get Shwarber.

 

[mauconnfan]

Headley was batting clean up today I heard LOL, now that's scraping the bottom of the barrel. Sox have better hitters on the bench than him and certainly their 8-9 hitters are a ton better.

 

[Dooley]

So the Yankees are in suck mode again out west and...

the Chapman trade talks are revving up. The Cubbies will be suitors and here is an article saying Andrew Miller could be a future Cub WITH(!!) Chapman.

Better get Shwarber.

No question that if the Cubs are asking for both lefties that Schwarber/Baez/Contreras is part of the deal coming back to New York. Hell, I'll give them all 3 bullpen arms for all 3 of those bats. Baez profiles more as a 3B anyways - natural fit there. Swap out Contreras (not sure where he will play unless they deal off McCann or 1B) and get Torres/Happ/Martinez (preference is Torres despite being over 2 years away but I'll take any). 3 impact bats for bullpen arms in a lost season? Sign me up 24/7/365. Build a nice lineup around Harper for 2018.

 

[Dove]

#firecashman built a sad- starting staff.

Ok...I get the Tanaka signing. And we al saw CC tailing off at some point (cringing at an upcoming PED fail).

But Pineda, Eovaldi and Nova are mediocre.

On the farm...James Kaprelian out since Mid May with elbow inflammation), Ian Clarkin (yeesh. Still in high A ball.), ...........................

 

[Dooley]

As a Yankees fan, the reality has been that the Yankees have been in desperate need to properly rebuild for years. The pressure to win now in New York is too great and hurts their ability to properly develop their young talent. This is the absolute PERFECT season for the Yankees to stockpile their system with good, young talent. Bad teams like the Yankees have no need for elite closers - let alone 3 of them. The Yankees are not going to be good next year either so I would trade ALL THREE. Chop 'em up and send one to each highest bidding contender (unless a team overwhelms with an offer for 2 of the big 3). In addition, Beltran would make for a must-trade candidate to a contender. As would any player over the age of 30 that a contender inquires about. My plan for the coming years:

1. Trade Chapman to the Nationals for Reynaldo Lopez and Erick Fedde. Two explosive arms (Lopez moreso than Fedde) that are probably 1-2 years away, respectively. Chapman reunites with Dusty Baker and gives the Nats that power LHP to match up against Rizzo, Heyward, Fowler, Belt, A Gonzalez, etc.

2. Trade Miller to the Cubs for Gleyber Torres, Ian Happ, and Eloy Jimenez. Because Miller is cost-controlled at a very affordable $9M/yr, he costs more. 3 young impact position players is a fair price for a guy who will instantly become the Cubs shutdown closer in the upcoming title years. Maddon gets a LHP that can get Harper out. If the Cubs want both Chapman and Miller, then the asking price has to include Schwarber. If the Cubs balk at trading Schwarber, then this 3-for-1 deal is fair for both sides.

3. Trade Betances to the Rangers for Jurickson Profar. OR, trade Betances to the Rangers for Lewis Brinson, Luis Ortiz and Yohander Mendez. Like Miller, Betances is cost-controlled for several seasons. Unlike Miller, he does not cost the acquiring club $9M/yr. Because of this, Betances comes with the highest price tag. Texas is in desperate need for elite arms in the back-end of their pen. Enter Betances. Profar would give the Yankees their 2B or 3B of the long-term future while the Rangers deal away from their ridiculous surplus of talented middle infielders. If Profar is untouchable, the 3 for 1 deal works for both clubs. Brinson comes with a billing that exceed Nomar Mazara (who is tearing up MLB pitching in his rookie season), Ortiz is a power arm that is probably 2 years out and Mendez is a big LHP with good control.

4. Once Lourdes Gurriel, Jr is granted his free agency from Commissioner Manfred, you do whatever you can to sign him. Read: do not be overbid by a few million dollars like they were by Boston with Yoan Moncada. Gurriel is an instant upgrade over Castro or whoever they throw out at 3B today. If the Yankees can get Profar for Betances (see above), then the INF of Gurriel, Profar and Didi will be amongst the best in baseball.

If the Yankees can turn their 3 closers into 6-9 top young position players and pitchers, then that can pair nicely as they begin to turn the page from awful contracts to old players to talented youth (Teixeira into Bird, for example) and prepare for the All-Star free agency class of 2018=19.