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OT: UConn chicks

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I typically don't post on the men's board - although I do watch all their games. I'm a die hard Husky fan both men and women, but confess I watch the women more (I'm a girl BTW). But last night was painful. I was ashamed to call myself a UCONN fan. TWICE they could've closed it out in OT and BLEW it. And, Doty handling the ball? No. I just can't. What a nightmare....anyway, back to your regularly scheduled programs..
 
Well, pointing out that women aren't as big, strong, fast or athletic as men is a pretty lightweight observation, intellectually. There are hundreds of years worth of statistical data that pretty much make that a "duh".

Also a "duh": athletics is conducted pretty much universally in such a way that athletes compete against their own peer groups. There are college sports (broken down by division) high school sports (broken down by school size), little league and Pony League, senior tennis and golf, the amateur champion in the US and British Open, paralympics, weight classes in boxing and wrestling, U-18 soccer, age groups in road races, etc. And, yes, women competing solely against women. If athletes of lesser athletic ability weren't allowed to compete against each other, we'd just have one pro league and be done with it.

Many of you are probably old enough to follow - and get into - Trumbull and Chris Drury beating Taiwan. I know I did. That was flippin' awesome. They couldn't have hacked it against a decent high school team either, but it didn't make that less fun to watch them win.

Yesterday certainly wasn't a sterling example of our women's team at its best. But the biggest matchups don't always produce masterpieces in any sport. I love soccer and the last World Cup final was perfectly dreadful between Spain and the Netherlands. I wouldn't let anyone near that tape if I was trying to convince them that soccer was fun to watch (I know I'm setting up for some anti-soccer jokes here, but there have been many Super Bowls that sucked too). I happened to love the Butler final, especially in the second half, but I know casual fans didn't.

I still say, though, that two of the best basketball performances - in terms of artistic merit - I've ever seen on a big stage in 50-50 games were by our women, the Stanford semi in 1995 and the final against Tennessee in 2000. The Stanford semifinal was a clinic in how to run a high-low offense, and the Tennessee final was a clinic in motion offense (backdoor layup, open 3, backdoor layup, open 3, repeat). I put those games ahead of other blowouts where we were just simply better - since both of those games were tossups. We split two close games with Tennessee in 2000 and Stanford was expected by most (or many) to beat us. But it isn't always that easy - sometimes the other team devises a game plan to stop you and it works.

The "better fundamentals" is kind of a weak argument, though. The point of basketball is to get high percentage shots - and if you can use your athleticism to get them by jumping over people, then you should. There's nothing not fundamental about throwing the ball up near the rim and letting Blake Griffin or Andre Drummond go get it. You don't have to do a three-man weave and throw a two-handed bounce pass for a layup.

(Geez - I was all over the place with this post, wasn't I?)
 
I typically don't post on the men's board - although I do watch all their games. I'm a die hard Husky fan both men and women, but confess I watch the women more (I'm a girl BTW). But last night was painful. I was ashamed to call myself a UCONN fan. TWICE they could've closed it out in OT and BLEW it. And, Doty handling the ball? No. I just can't. What a nightmare....anyway, back to your regularly scheduled programs..

No matter how poorly they play, you should not be ashamed to call yourself a UConn fan.
 
Im just pissed Uconn lost to ND I hate it when we lose to them in any sport it just makes ESPN unwatchable. I do believe Uconn matches up best against Baylor but can they get past ND. Last night im sorry to say they choked and I would say the same thing about the men if/when/they have choked. Uconn will either get better from this loss or worse.
 
The next time someone tries to claim that women's basketball is more fundamentally sound, I'm breaking out clips of the 2012/13 UConn chicks.

In regulation, instead of icing the game after an ND miss while they were up one, Dolson throws a moving screen 90' from the basket and fouls out in the process. Somehow, she managed to wrack up 11 turnovers - they should shoot a center who turns the ball over 11 times.

Instead of a last second shot after ND ties it, Doty gets herself trapped at midcourt.

They miss four of five free throws in OT - three front ends. Up three, Geno opts not to foul - Doty doesn't even bother defending, so ND banks in a three. Doty throws up a three-quarter court shot Roscoe-style with five seconds left giving ND another shot.

They're gutty, they're talented, but s***, they're stupid.
Spot on my boy!
 
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Most of you would be dead today if this thread was on the gals board.
 
The smaller ball actually hurts shooting percentage. It was originally put in place because women have smaller hands, but in general, WCBB players don't anymore. (One of Rondo's issues when it comes to shooting.) But the fact that the ball is smaller actually causes more pop outs.

That's actually been one of Geno's biggest talking points for a while. He wants WCBB to switch to the larger ball and he'd like to either place in a back court shot clock or shorten the shot clock from 30 seconds to 24. (I think the second one is a mistake though...)
What? The smaller ball hurts shooting percentages, women used to have smaller hands but don't anymore, again what???
 
This is an example where if we want to be gender-equitable and treat everyone as athletes, then some criticism is highly warranted for losing that one. They competed hard, it was an entertaining game, etc. But they blew that game seven ways to Sunday, as Fishy documented in the original post, and they pretty much wilted once they fell behind in OT3.

I had a very similar feeling to the 6OT game. Yeah, yeah - it was a classic and all, but we had no business not winning the damn thing, so the loss trumps the "kudos for trying really hard" feeling (and the women gave it away worse yesterday than the men did in the '09 BET).

The recent Georgetown loss for the men had the caveats that we pulled a rabbit out of the hat to get to overtime in the first place, and our best player was badly hobbled. Plus, we never missed four straight FTs or did anything stupid to turn the ball over early in the shot clock. We just had bad late-shot clock possessions when we were running on fumes.
 
No one was guarding McBride last night because Hartley fouled out, Banks is injured, and Faris was guarding Diggins. (who, despite always making the big shot, did miss 20 shots last night..so perhaps the defense wasn't that bad.) KML is not a good defender, but she was the best they could throw on her.

And how about, McBride is just a fantastic player. I watched numerous not even elite players absolutely destroy the UConn men. Every season.

It's a shot to the ego, I understand...to be just a Uconn men's fan and have to deal with the women having bigger success and playing, within their competition, an arguably better brand of basketball. Certainly not more athletic...but I thought Uconn men's fans learned the lesson that athletic was not necessarily better after the Sticks/Dyson season. Handle the ball better? Sure Bazz and Boat can handle it better than any of the girls on this team. Better than the quality of guards Geno usually has (Montgomery, Bird ) I don't think so.

This Uconn team struggles to handle the ball, and this Uconn team struggles in close games, and this Uconn team, quite frankly..is pretty dumb. All unusual for a Uconn women's team. And here's the thing, if you've watched the women throughout the years..you would have known that even against the weaker teams, this team wasn't running great offense. It's silly though. Someone says "look at all the turnovers and missed shots..the women's game is so ugly." Only to be answered with, "they scored more than the men usually do in close games." So obviously the reply is "no defense." Lol. So when the women's offense looks good/better against the elite team its because lack of defense, but when they struggle it's because they suck. And when the men struggle it's because of defense and when they don't it's because of their athletic and talent superiority. Sure, I buy it. It couldn't be because Boat and Bazz dribble the ball for 25 seconds and take a poor shot on half of our possessions. Sounds like fantastic offense to me.

And I hate getting into these arguments because I love both teams. But it's ridiculous. I've always thought the men's team's offense looks uglier. And here's the thing, it should. Women have to run a more complex and tighter offense because they don't have the athleticism and playground game men tend to have. (One of the reasons why, if Hartley is playing well..Uconn can get by without running a great offense. Because she's one of the few women that does play like that.) Not to mention, the Uconn women had 6 players on the Olympic team this season. Four of them were starters on the same team, including the starting Olympic backcourt. No it usually looks better. Sue Bird was probably the best female point guard in the world when she was playing at Uconn. Of course she's going to run an elite offense. I'm not even saying that WCBB runs a better offense. That I disagree with. I'm saying the UConn WCBB team usually does.

It's a different brand of basketball, completely, almost to the point of comparing it being silly. If people don't like it, people don't like it. But it's just inaccurate to make like women's basketball is inferior in every way. It's not. It's different. Some of it might be better, depending on what you like.
But it's just a shame that so many men's fans can't support the women because of an inferiority complex.

Whatever!!:rolleyes:.......clueless. Smaller ball hurts shooting. Are you trying to see how many stupid things you can come up with in one post?
 
Here are some hard truths about women's basketball:

It's called good fundamentals because it confuses old people into thinking it's a 1958 NBA game. Its not good fundamentals it's a lack of athleticism.

The women's board hates the good ND player and one of the reasons why is she said she wanted to rain on TN's parade for Summit. You have to be kidding me. It's just silly on so many levels. Oh she talked about going on the road and ruining their night? The horror.

It's completely uncompetitive on a night in and night out basis. There is no other televised sport that is consistently dominated by such a small percentage of teams. A lack of competition is just boring.

You want the highest rated television show in Connecticut history. Set up a charity game between UConn WBB and Eastern's mens team. You'd pull a Superbowl like share in the state. Who wouldn't watch that game.
 
Here are some hard truths about women's basketball:

It's called good fundamentals because it confuses old people into thinking it's a 1958 NBA game. Its not good fundamentals it's a lack of athleticism.

The women's board hates the good ND player and one of the reasons why is she said she wanted to rain on TN's parade for Summit. You have to be kidding me. It's just silly on so many levels. Oh she talked about going on the road and ruining their night? The horror.

It's completely uncompetitive on a night in and night out basis. There is no other televised sport that is consistently dominated by such a small percentage of teams. A lack of competition is just boring.

You want the highest rated television show in Connecticut history. Set up a charity game between UConn WBB and Eastern's mens team. You'd pull a Superbowl like share in the state. Who wouldn't watch that game.

Hopefully for blackbirds sake you're talking Bristol Eastern and not ECSU as they may hang with the Bristol HS...........although I forgot they are better defenders and definitely will run better offense so how could they guard them??
 
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Hopefully for blackbirds sake you're talking Bristol Eastern and not ECSU as they may hang with the Bristol HS...........although I forgot they are better defenders and definitely will run better offense so how could they guard them??

I was talking about ECSU. They could sell out XL for that game.
 
I was talking about ECSU. They could sell out XL for that game.

Yeah but ECSU would hammer them despite their ability to D up and run offense........although I need to take in to consideration that ECSU would have trouble adapting to the small basketball!!:oops:
 
Yeah but ECSU would hammer them despite their ability to D up and run offense........although I need to take in to consideration that ECSU would have trouble adapting to the small basketball!!:oops:

Yes I do think Eastern would beat them. I'm shooting for the highest TV rating.
 
The smaller ball actually hurts shooting percentage. It was originally put in place because women have smaller hands, but in general, WCBB players don't anymore. (One of Rondo's issues when it comes to shooting.) But the fact that the ball is smaller actually causes more pop outs.

That's actually been one of Geno's biggest talking points for a while. He wants WCBB to switch to the larger ball and he'd like to either place in a back court shot clock or shorten the shot clock from 30 seconds to 24. (I think the second one is a mistake though...)
So if I start playing golf with a baseball my putting will improve?
 
The smaller ball actually hurts shooting percentage. It was originally put in place because women have smaller hands, but in general, WCBB players don't anymore. (One of Rondo's issues when it comes to shooting.) But the fact that the ball is smaller actually causes more pop outs.

That is why when you go to county fairs the Carnies running the basketball shooting game have hula hoop sized rims and you shoot with a tennis ball. No one would ever get it in.
 
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Here are some hard truths about women's basketball:

It's completely uncompetitive on a night in and night out basis. There is no other televised sport that is consistently dominated by such a small percentage of teams. A lack of competition is just boring.

How many NBA teams have won titles in the last 30 years?
 
How many NBA teams have won titles in the last 30 years?

How many titles have UConn and Tennessee women's teams won in the last 30? How about 14 and UConn women were not even a factor in the first few years.
 
How many titles have UConn and Tennessee women's teams won in the last 30? How about 14 and UConn women were not even a factor in the first few years.

The Lakers and Celtics have half of the NBA titles in the whole history of the league (33 of 66)
 
Pretty poor comparison when one uses a 7 game series, and the other uses single game elimination. One tends to let better teams advance at a a higher rate than the other.
 
I don't think it makes any sense to compare the women's game to the men's. But it does make sense to evaluate the Uconn women against other teams. I don't think Geno got out-coached in any of the losses this year. He got out-talented. If you consider who from the Uconn team would start for Baylor or Notre Dame, IMHO only Mosqueda-Lewis and perhaps Kelly Farris would be good enough. I think the girls had a deer-in-the-headlights look all night. If you look at the stats, Uconn had more rebounds, more assists, more blocks and shot for a higher percentage. Turnovers and free throw shooting did them in. Unfortunately, I don't think this loss will help them in the post-season but who knows?
Like comparing apples to oranges.
 
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If any of the officiating that I saw happened in a men's game, I would have gone through 3 tvs this season. Its deplorable.
Thats the way it has ALWAYS been. Don't know why the officiating is the way it is. Some of the womens officials are not bad, but most of them are terrible. Hell, I have not officiated games since college 1974, and I think I could do a better job than some of these pukes.
 
UConn women will be heavily favored to win at least the next two championships. Griner and Diggins are both seniors. While this year has had some disappointments, it's not over yet. They get another shot at Notre Dame in the Big East Tournament in Hartford next week. I'd imagine they will be favored in that game.

Yes, they lost to Baylor, but hung with them for 30 minutes and lost by 5. Anything is possible in the tourney. All UConn needs is for Bria Hartley to rediscover her sophomore form.
 
You forgot jumping. Has anyone ever measured a women's players vertical leap? I expect it would take the total of 3 women to get near the vertical of Ryan Boatright.
Actually yes they have. Saw some SPARQ test results a few years ago. Lorin Dixon, who played a couple years back, recorded a 33" vertical.
 
Pretty poor comparison when one uses a 7 game series, and the other uses single game elimination. One tends to let better teams advance at a a higher rate than the other.

Well, hell. How many sports are there to compare, now? The original point was that it gets boring when the same teams always win. You want another? Men's Lacrosse. Only something like six schools have ever won titles. Or softball - the Pac 10 has won almost every title. Or women's soccer, which is pretty much North Carolina's invitational. But do these rise to the level of "televised sports"? Probably not. So if we screen for only televised sports that are single elimination (or sports that don't suck), we are basically down to men's and women's basketball, and the NFL, which has all sorts of rules to ensure parity. Yeah - wbb ranks a distant third behind those sports entertainment-wise. I won't argue that.

In truth, UConn has twice put together teams that were too good for the whole country (2002 when we beat Oklahoma, and 2009 when we ran a dogsled over Louisville for 40 minutes) and it was certainly a bit boring. Other than that, they had to battle for them. In other years, we trailed Virginia late in 1995, had a tight regional final with LSU, needed Taurasi to bail us out against Texas, trailed at the half by double digits against Stanford, etc.

The biggest reason why you have juggernauts from time to time in WBB is that elite players don't leave early. In 2002, Bird-Cash-Jones-Williams were seniors and Taurasi was a soph (then Taurasi carried us to two more with an ordinary supporting cast). In 2009 Montgomery-Charles-Moore were all still there as a senior-junior-sophomore. If you have early entries, who knows how many of those people stay that long, and maybe we never win any of them. If the men stopped having early entries, the Squid would have four or five titles by now (so we can be grateful).
 
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