May 2024 WNBA Thread, part II | Page 13 | The Boneyard

May 2024 WNBA Thread, part II

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Reese vs. Brink show down isn't really materializing at the half, neither doing much. Mabrey/Evans/Carter trio have led Chicago to an 18 point lead, 30 points combined for them.
 
103-88 final, wasn't really that close. Indiana w/ a late push when Seattle emptied the bench.

KLS found the touch from 3, that might be the only positive for the Fever.

Muhl still looking for her first WNBA bucket, but she did pick up 3 fouls in 4 minutes...:rolleyes:
 
I was thinking it but forgot to say, Diggins-Smith is definitely finding her groove with the Storm.
 
Chicago gonna get the win over LA. Indiana and Washington are clearly in the cellar, not sure how much separation the Sparks have from the bottom 2. Sky got themselves back into the big logjam in the middle.
 
nwhoopfan said:
Reese vs. Brink show down isn't really materializing at the half, neither doing much. Mabrey/Evans/Carter trio have led Chicago to an 18 point lead, 30 points combined for them.
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LA closed the gap in the third, but Chicago kept the margin around 10, finishing at 83-73. Elisabeth Williams finished with a 17 pt./11 rebound double-double, but Chicago's three guard attack kept the pressure on, as noted, finishing with 49 points. Mabrey had 20 points (6-11 from three), as well as 7 rebounds and assists and played 33 minutes, most on Sky. Williams was second with 30+.

Dearica Hamby led the Sparks with 24 points and 13 rebounds, while Kia Nurse, had 17, hitting 5-6 from the FT line.
 
nwhoopfan said:
I was thinking it but forgot to say, Diggins-Smith is definitely finding her groove with the Storm.
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Looked pretty smooth for Sky, as well as Jewell Loyd. Maybe the trip to the heartland (close to ND) has relaxed them, because they both had strikingly similar stats in this game: both shot 8-14 from the floor (2-4 from three), while Diggins-Smith had 9 assists and Loyd 6.
 
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Rowdy831 said:
I have watched more WNBA games this year than any other year and I find it almost impossible to enjoy. The interior defense is hold, push and hack and if you are a rookie you get zero calls. If the WNBA is ever to be a viable league they need to move it to more like the college game than the NBA game.

The only way they can slow down CC is to grab her and bump her on every play. I hate to say it be the league needs to meet with the Refs and get it cleaned up and cleaned up fast.
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I think the Fever need a Charles Oakley-type to handle some of the chippiness being sent in CC’s direction.
 
Dillon77 said:
Richard Cohen of HerHoopsStats Examines Coaching Hot Seats So Far

He places the categories ranging from "Part of the Furniture and Going Nowhere" and "Too Soon, Safe for Now" and "Steady Growth, Seats Secure" to "High Expectations, Better Keep Winning" and, of course, "Will They See Through the Rebuild?"

Given the input and discussion on this thread, I'll be the regulars won't have too tough a time guessing what coach goes where.
That said, Cohen offers snippets on one and all categories, teams and coaches.

herhoopstats.substack.com

WNBAnything Rankings 2024: Coaching Hot Seats

This week it's time to rank the comfort of the WNBA's head coaches, from relaxed and safe to those starting to feel the heat
herhoopstats.substack.com herhoopstats.substack.com
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Sides cannot be fired soon enough, provided they know how to hire a competent replacement - which is no given.
 
cancontent said:
Glad to see that Thibault was listed where he is. The situation in Washington is a complicated one. Also, after seeing a clip where Cloud talked about why she is in Phoenix, I was a little surprised. Didn't assume the transition would be seamless, but it still was odd seeing how things played out during the off-season.
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I’ll-served when diva EDD bailed in her team.
 
Marina Mabrey is proving her worth this year putting up Clark/Ionescu-esque numbers. 17 points, 6 rebounds and 5 assists per game while leading underdog Chicago to a 3-3 record.

Side note: the 2019 WNBA draft had an incredible group of second round draft picks:
Marina Mabrey
Sophie Cunnington
Jessica Shepard
Natisha Hiedeman
Megan Gustafson
Han Xu
Bridget Carleton
Kennedy Burke
 
nwhoopfan said:
103-88 final, wasn't really that close. Indiana w/ a late push when Seattle emptied the bench.

KLS found the touch from 3, that might be the only positive for the Fever.

Muhl still looking for her first WNBA bucket, but she did pick up 3 fouls in 4 minutes...:rolleyes:
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Nalyssa Smith played well. Team defense was terrible though, they gave up 103 points and 29 assists. Game was blown open in the 3rd and this was a total blowout (27 point lead with 5 min left) despite Indiana making a surge to narrow the final score. Clark looks like she's having a miserable time out there. I wonder if she regrets going pro this summer. The announcers mentioned something along the lines of she's focused on maintaining her mental health which likely indicates she's having a tough time right now dealing with everything. I can't imagine the pressure she's under and how rough it must be to lose so much with expectations sky high. Not her best game tonight but she was fine (18 points, 9 assists, 7 TOs). The league is really physical on her and she isn't getting a lot of calls and is getting frustrated. Furthermore, the team is lacking veteran leadership and when things don't go well, the wheels seem to fall off and they don't know how to get back on course. The team chemistry is just not good either, but everyone else also had a short training camp so I'm not sure why Indiana looks so much worse than other squads right now. I also have no idea why Sides opted to play Clark 40 minutes tonight, she should've sat her the entire 4th IMO and given subs a chance to prove their worth (Taylor, Hull, Saxton). At the rate they're going, they're going to have the most lottery balls for the Paige sweepstakes next year.
 
bballnut90 said:
Nalyssa Smith played well. Team defense was terrible though, they gave up 103 points and 29 assists. Game was blown open in the 3rd and this was a total blowout (27 point lead with 5 min left) despite Indiana making a surge to narrow the final score. Clark looks like she's having a miserable time out there. I wonder if she regrets going pro this summer. The announcers mentioned something along the lines of she's focused on maintaining her mental health which likely indicates she's having a tough time right now dealing with everything. I can't imagine the pressure she's under and how rough it must be to lose so much with expectations sky high. Not her best game tonight but she was fine (18 points, 9 assists, 7 TOs). The league is really physical on her and she isn't getting a lot of calls and is getting frustrated. Furthermore, the team is lacking veteran leadership and when things don't go well, the wheels seem to fall off and they don't know how to get back on course. The team chemistry is just not good either, but everyone else also had a short training camp so I'm not sure why Indiana looks so much worse than other squads right now. I also have no idea why Sides opted to play Clark 40 minutes tonight, she should've sat her the entire 4th IMO and given subs a chance to prove their worth (Taylor, Hull, Saxton). At the rate they're going, they're going to have the most lottery balls for the Paige sweepstakes next year.
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The league is really physical on EVERYONE. She’s used to an especially soft whistle in college and is adjusting to the physicality allowed in the WNBA. The constant complaining from Clark and her super fans about how unfair everything is for her is tiring.
 
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bballnut90 said:
The league is really physical on her and she isn't getting a lot of calls and is getting frustrated.
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She got NO calls tonight. I'm not a conspiracy theorist but my goodness, are the refs trying to prove something? Just because she's a rookie doesn't mean they have to swallow the whistle all game long.


edit--she did have 5 FTA's, but almost all of those were late; she was getting beat up the whole first half and I'm pretty sure she didn't draw a single whistle
 
Are y’all talking about the same Caitlin Clark that shot 15 free throws last game? The same Caitlin Clark that 64% of her shot attempts are 3s? That’s the girl you think the refs are working against?

Clark super fans need to take a breather. She’s a generational talent and excellent for a rookie. Y’all don’t need to be doing all of this extra stuff.
 
Well I saw Clark get knocked down 4 times in the first half without a single whistle. She might've been selling it on one of them. Definitely not on the rest. I also saw her drive numerous times, draw contact, and again get no whistle. That's poor officiating, not because I'm a Clark stan, it's because it's poor officiating. And inconsistent. We all know some players are gonna get that call in their favor every single time. I was even rooting for Seattle, so you don't need to call my bias into question.
 
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nwhoopfan said:
Well I saw Clark get knocked down 4 times in the first half without a single whistle. She might've been selling it on one of them. Definitely not on the rest. I also saw her drive numerous times, draw contact, and again get no whistle. That's poor officiating, not because I'm a Clark stan, it's because it's poor officiating. And inconsistent. We all know some players are gonna get that call in their favor every single time. I was even rooting for Seattle, so you don't need to call my bias into question.
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Clark needs to get stronger. I watched the game as well and while fouls could have been called on some of those plays they certainly aren’t guaranteed foul calls in the WNBA. The physicality in the Mercury/Liberty game was far worse yesterday imo and those are some of the biggest stars in the league. If Sabrina, Stewie, and Taurasi’s aren’t getting fouls called when they are bleeding, Clark shouldn’t expect to get a special whistle because she can’t absorb contact yet.

And it goes both ways. You want a tighter whistle for Clark on offense be she got away with a ton of uncalled fouls against Skylar on the other end.

WNBA officiating isn’t GOOD but these allusions to refs conspiring against Clark are just weird.
 
hoopsnloops32 said:
Are y’all talking about the same Caitlin Clark that shot 15 free throws last game? The same Caitlin Clark that 64% of her shot attempts are 3s? That’s the girl you think the refs are working against?

Clark super fans need to take a breather. She’s a generational talent and excellent for a rookie. Y’all don’t need to be doing all of this extra stuff.
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I suggest watching the games. She's been getting mauled several times a game when she drives to the basket with no call and then has been getting whistled for committing invisible tick tack fouls. Here are a couple from tonight:

A couple from previous games:

Yes the league is physical, but if you've been watching games, she's received the brunt of a lot of the extremely physical plays in the early season.
 
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nwhoopfan said:
Would it have been any different if she waited a year?
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In theory if Indiana bombed again, they might have a different coach in place. But probably not though. I just imagine she's extremely drained right now and running on empty.
 
bballnut90 said:
In theory if Indiana bombed again, they might have a different coach in place. But probably not though. I just imagine she's extremely drained right now and running on empty.
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Honestly that's brutal for all WNBA rookies, the time frame is awful. Especially for teams that make deep runs in the Tourney. College season ends, draft, minuscule preseason, and you're right into the regular season, with no real break at any point. I can't think of any other pro sport that goes from the draft to the season starting so rapidly.

edit--I agree she looks worn out. I think the chase for the scoring record was draining and she's carrying the weight of more expectations than most WNBA rookies. And of course Indiana has played more games than anybody else. Seattle has only 1 game less, but everybody else is 2 or more behind. A few have played 5 while Indiana has played 9. Who the heck came up with this schedule?
 
hoopsnloops32 said:
Clark needs to get stronger. I watched the game as well and while fouls could have been called on some of those plays they certainly aren’t guaranteed foul calls in the WNBA. The physicality in the Mercury/Liberty game was far worse yesterday imo and those are some of the biggest stars in the league. If Sabrina, Stewie, and Taurasi’s aren’t getting fouls called when they are bleeding, Clark shouldn’t expect to get a special whistle because she can’t absorb contact yet.

And it goes both ways. You want a tighter whistle for Clark on offense be she got away with a ton of uncalled fouls against Skylar on the other end.

WNBA officiating isn’t GOOD but these allusions to refs conspiring against Clark are just weird.
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The calls in the past game were pretty egregious. I almost turned off the game in the 3rd because I was so frustrated with the refs. For context, I am not a personality that easily gets frustrated and/or blames the refs. There was no consistency and it seemed like each ref had a different idea on the allowable amount of physicality, so that compounded the issue and made it confusing to the players and viewers.

IMO the allowed amount of physicality in the W does not make it fun to watch at times, and if they want to keep viewers, I think they need to tighten up the whistles and set new (and consistent) expectations.
 
WBBTakeover said:
I think you're seeing what you want to see.

Many here, including myself, have extended grace to Caitlin and have placed the bulk of the blame for Indiana's early-season failures elsewhere (e.g. coaching, GM, other players). She isn't blameless by any stretch, but she isn't the main reason why the Fever look the way they do.

And she's received grace from Internetland in general because most sensible people know that the Fever are a rebuilding team. That said, I don't recall seeing her called a (insert racial slur towards people who look like Aliyah), (misogynistic term used against people who look like Aliyah) who needs to perish/be offed because she's been missing lay-ups. But we all know who HAS received that kind of treatment from Internetland.

So yes, Caitlin has received grace from me. But Aliyah is receiving more from me due to the level of vitriolic abuse she's received.
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x___________________.
 
hoopsnloops32 said:
WNBA officiating isn’t GOOD but these allusions to refs conspiring against Clark are just weird.
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Keep in mind this is the same player who was ESPN's golden goose in college and got away with just about anything. You can't tell me that if any other player bounced a ball off their head out of anger that they wouldn't get a technical. These refs just don't take BS from anybody because everybody's a star in this league. Plain and simple.
 
nwhoopfan said:
Honestly that's brutal for all WNBA rookies, the time frame is awful. Especially for teams that make deep runs in the Tourney. College season ends, draft, minuscule preseason, and you're right into the regular season, with no real break at any point. I can't think of any other pro sport that goes from the draft to the season starting so rapidly.

edit--I agree she looks worn out. I think the chase for the scoring record was draining and she's carrying the weight of more expectations than most WNBA rookies. And of course Indiana has played more games than anybody else. Seattle has only 1 game less, but everybody else is 2 or more behind. A few have played 5 while Indiana has played 9. Who the heck came up with this schedule?
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There is one other virtually sadistic turnaround like the W: Men's lacrosse.

The men's Final Four ran through Memorial Day, the Tewaaraton Ceremony (Lacrosse's equivalent of the Heisman Trophy) was Thursday night and all five of the finalists will report to training camp today to play in games on ... catch your breath...Saturday.
(And for those not in the Final Four, most of them played in the NCAA tournament, graduated and got to Albany, NY, for training camp.)

Most of the professional circuit is played on weekends, but it's still intense...
 
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bballnut90 said:
I suggest watching the games. She's been getting mauled several times a game when she drives to the basket with no call and then has been getting whistled for committing invisible tick tack fouls. Here are a couple from tonight:

x.com

x.com x.com

x.com

x.com x.com

A couple from previous games:

x.com

x.com x.com

x.com

x.com x.com

Yes the league is physical, but if you've been watching games, she's received the brunt of a lot of the extremely physical plays in the early season.
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@bballnut90
Nan put out a note on the forum, if you want to get your twitter posts to open up, replace the "x" in the twitter URL with the word "twitter".
 
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yhun89 said:
Keep in mind this is the same player who was ESPN's golden goose in college and got away with just about anything. You can't tell me that if any other player bounced a ball off their head out of anger that they wouldn't get a technical. These refs just don't take BS from anybody because everybody's a star in this league. Plain and simple.
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Hold on. The networks don't have the sway with referees as you are implying here.

Second, the BIG10 isn't affiliated with ESPN and majority of her games were not on their network.

Third, NCAAW referees and how they call things varies greatly per conference and they all let players get away with things I don't see them get in the WNBA. The lack of consistency and the standard at the college game is more the problem than the networks.
 
cancontent said:
Hold on. The networks don't have the sway with referees as you are implying here.

Second, the BIG10 isn't affiliated with ESPN and majority of her games were not on their network.

Third, NCAAW referees and how they call things varies greatly per conference and they all let players get away with things I don't see them get in the WNBA. The lack of consistency and the standard at the college game is more the problem than the networks.
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ESPN was just a general term, I didn't imply they were in charge of reffing. That's just what some people referred to her as.
 
yhun89 said:
ESPN was just a general term, I didn't imply they were in charge of reffing. That's just what some people referred to her as.
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Your first sentence gives the impression your implying this. If you know the issue is the at the feet of the conference and the NCAA, why was ESPN even referenced?
 
nwhoopfan said:
Uh oh to the rest of the league. Tiff Hayes un-retired and is joining the Aces. Maybe not the PG some think they need, but will definitely add another scorer to the mix.
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Sorry to quote myself. So how do we think this will effect the rotation? Eat way into Martin's minutes? Does Clark stay a starter and Hayes off the bench, or vice versa? Or maybe Martin/Hayes both get minutes and Young/Plum get more rest.

I looked, Young and Plum both clocking 36 minutes, Clark 32, Martin 21. And Colson is only 7, maybe she gets squeezed out. And Bell has only played in 1 game, is she injured or just on the outside looking in?
 
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