Gamecocks 2022, Part II

[ConwayGmck]

When SC plays Boston, Cooke, Henderson and Amihere (4 best currently) that leaves Staley a choice to either play Beal, Rivers or Cordosa in the last spot during crunch time, depending on if she wants speed/offense (Rivers), size/post D (Cordova) or smarts (Beal).
If she gets it right, watch out. Rivers needs a month or more to make that move, but she is that good. Raven will spot duty Henny and Cooke all year. Amihere can play 3 or 4.

And playing Saxton, Hall, even Littleton more for defensive purposes - although Littleton looks like she wants to score points too - when heavy defense is needed.

It gives Staley the opportunity to rotate all the above without there being much of a drop-off in game production, to keep those top players fresher so that when there IS a "crunch time" in tight games, Staley can put those top players back in the game, and they won't be saddled with fouls, or be gassed when they are needed most to execute and produce.

As you point out here, Staley has plenty of options.....

 

[GamecockFam]

Minor pet peeve of mine right now but it's spelled Cardoso on the back of her jersey...not Cardosa, Cardozo, Cordova or whatever other spelling I'm seeing being tossed around this board at the moment. Everyone please take note! Thank you!

You're all forgiven of your sins, now go forth and spread the gospel of the Gamecock!

 

[GCKSFN4L]

Minor pet peeve of mine right now but it's spelled Cardoso on the back of her jersey...not Cardosa, Cardozo, Cordova or whatever other spelling I'm seeing being tossed around this board at the moment. Everyone please take note! Thank you!

You're all forgiven of your sins, now go forth and spread the gospel of the Gamecock!

I'll take all those variations of Cardoso over Silva like they did during the Americup. It was really confusing to me.

 

[JonathanXIV]

Amihere is going to be the breakout player this year, the super recruits will need to bide their time and wait for opportunities to play. Saxton is a great team player, but Amihere is dynamic and super elite athlete, expect Saxton to lose playing time. Would love to see Rivers develop as the number 2 at the 3 spot and take minutes from Beal as season progresses, Beal is glue but nothing special on offense. Raven will spot duty Henny and Cooke some. Feagin will wait and develop behind the experienced bigs this year. Hall is a likely defensive type sub for the 2 and 3 spots at certain times. Will take a month or more for Staley to juggle and decide how the team looks down the stretch lineup wise, but Amihere is likely going to be playing in the crunch minutes and not Sexton.

I find your post, and others on this topic, interesting in light of the preseason projections. For instance, virtually every preseason artoc;e about South Carolina mentioned their #1 recruiting class as a key reason for their high rating. Particularly since many of the recruiting class rankings place considerable value on the number of recruits in the class.

Let's face it. South Carolina was a Final Four team last year and returns everyone. They were going to be a top ranked team with no recruits, let alone five highly ranked players. But, as noted above, improvement for this year's team will likely rely more on the improvement of returning players, such as Amihere, and a transfer than on the contributions of the freshman.

I also think that the number of freshman recruits is over valued. Generally significant contributions from freshman are more likely from one outstanding freshman (see Bueckers, Clark) than contributions from a number of freshman. In the case of South Carolina, I think it more likely that your freshman contributions will come disproportionately from Rivers, as opposed to a number of your freshman making significant contributions.

Of course, all of this applies to UConn as well. And it's not to say that many of these freshman will not eventually make enormous contributions to their programs. But relying on numerous freshman for a team's improvement is usually an unlikely proposition. This should serve to temper expectations when projecting huge improvements based on a recruiting class. A remind us that often the sought after improvements are already in the locker room.

 

[ConwayGmck]

I find your post, and others on this topic, interesting in light of the preseason projections. For instance, virtually every preseason artoc;e about South Carolina mentioned their #1 recruiting class as a key reason for their high rating. Particularly since many of the recruiting class rankings place considerable value on the number of recruits in the class.

Let's face it. South Carolina was a Final Four team last year and returns everyone. They were going to be a top ranked team with no recruits, let alone five highly ranked players. But, as noted above, improvement for this year's team will likely rely more on the improvement of returning players, such as Amihere, and a transfer than on the contributions of the freshman.

I also think that the number of freshman recruits is over valued. Generally significant contributions from freshman are more likely from one outstanding freshman (see Bueckers, Clark) than contributions from a number of freshman. In the case of South Carolina, I think it more likely that your freshman contributions will come disproportionately from Rivers, as opposed to a number of your freshman making significant contributions.

Of course, all of this applies to UConn as well. And it's not to say that many of these freshman will not eventually make enormous contributions to their programs. But relying on numerous freshman for a team's improvement is usually an unlikely proposition. This should serve to temper expectations when projecting huge improvements based on a recruiting class. A remind us that often the sought after improvements are already in the locker room.

From all the articles I've read, the addition of the #1 class was just one of several aspects why the team was ranked so highly. I can't say I've read one where the class was a "key" reason, as in, a or THE primary reason.

As you've already pointed out, the team returns all of its starters - in fact, all of its entire roster - from a team that itself was pre-season ranked #1 for 2020-21, that reached the 2021 Final Four and was a tip-in away from playing for the 2021 national title. That was mentioned in all the articles. In addition to that returning cast, South Carolina added a transfer big in Cardoso that was highly regarded - most were already recognizing that Boston, as talented a post as she is, was often over-burdened against many opponents last season, and thus to add a quality all-Power Five Conference post to the depth to spell Boston some minutes was perceived as nothing less than a coup of sorts for Staley and her staff. That was mentioned in those articles too.

And then finally, the addition of the #1 class to add quality depth to that team overall that was lacking in such depth, was also mentioned. Cardoso went a LONG ways in adding depth to the frontcourt, but the backccourt behind Henderson and Cooke was also sorely needing, as well as more consistent contributions from the 3 spot. The class at the minimum seemed to provide that depth.

So I think there was very little thought process in the articles that ANY of the class of freshmen were expected to come in and earn starting roles, or even starter's minutes. But that the sheer TALENT of the class may very well provide it just the same. At the least, it makes an already stout team worthy of national title contention even more worthy. And I think THAT was what those articles I read, were all saying.....

But coming into this season, the team needed an unquestioned #2 at PG behind Henderson, and an unquestioned #2 at the SG position behind Cooke. Staley wants to run a fast-paced up-tempo offense to capitalize on the team's speed, and with Henny and Zia being top scoring options for the team they can't be expected to be running all game long and average 40 mpg. We didn't really have that consistently last season for them.

At the 3, Beal developed and established herself as a top defensive stopper, but was a bit challenged offensively. She took strides forward from her freshman season, but still playing defense can be tiring.

Raven is the heir-apparent for the time being to Henderson's job, and is the #2 PG. She's where Henderson was behind Ty Harris 2 years ago. Rivers is expected to start rotating in for Cooke but right now senior Littleton has been stepping up, albeit for just one game. Rivers is an outstanding offensive talent but needs some refining of her defensive game. She'll get planty of playing time as the season progresses. Bree Hall was always sort of slotted in to possibly rotating with Beal - as it is, she's seemingly gotten an inch or two taller than she was perceived to be as just a signee of the class, and she's pleasantly surprised Staley with her defensive skillsets, so if anything she's sort of a Brea Beal v.2. So she's gotten early PT thus far for that, and that helps keep Beal fresher, but we're still waiting on the offensive aspect for the position.

Those three (3) freshmen were all expected to factor in for substantial minutes this season off the bench, with only Feagin buried a bit further down the depth chart, and this was the case even before Cardoso became an element to the equation. But overall it gives the staff more options, gives the veteran starters more rest and relief of pressure, and keeps the pressure on opponents for a full 40 minutes a game as the team is better able to keeping coming in waves, as opposed to taking portions of the game off where the production subsides with a talent drop-off from reserves coming into the game in critical junctures, where normally they should come in only for mop-up duty.....

 

[Tank]

I find your post, and others on this topic, interesting in light of the preseason projections. For instance, virtually every preseason artoc;e about South Carolina mentioned their #1 recruiting class as a key reason for their high rating. Particularly since many of the recruiting class rankings place considerable value on the number of recruits in the class.

Let's face it. South Carolina was a Final Four team last year and returns everyone. They were going to be a top ranked team with no recruits, let alone five highly ranked players. But, as noted above, improvement for this year's team will likely rely more on the improvement of returning players, such as Amihere, and a transfer than on the contributions of the freshman.

I also think that the number of freshman recruits is over valued. Generally significant contributions from freshman are more likely from one outstanding freshman (see Bueckers, Clark) than contributions from a number of freshman. In the case of South Carolina, I think it more likely that your freshman contributions will come disproportionately from Rivers, as opposed to a number of your freshman making significant contributions.

Of course, all of this applies to UConn as well. And it's not to say that many of these freshman will not eventually make enormous contributions to their programs. But relying on numerous freshman for a team's improvement is usually an unlikely proposition. This should serve to temper expectations when projecting huge improvements based on a recruiting class. A remind us that often the sought after improvements are already in the locker room.

Never said the freshmen would be integral, said a few might find a role. And yeah, Amihere and Cordosa have alot to do with that.

You spoke out of both sides tbh in your post. You contradicted yourself, look and see.

I said it straight. Yourself? You “prosed” and “fluffed” for what, 4 paragraphs? Only to circle back and contradict your own self?

I’m just trying to understand WTH you were trying to communicate.

 

[GamecockFam]

I think one of Dawn's recent interviews gives her perspective on the role she expects the freshmen to fill this year -- or at least at this point. She said that she wants them to "hold serve", which to me meant that she isn't expecting them to win the game for us but she also won't play anyone who is a liability. It seems their role is be inserted to give the starters a breather and just maintain what the starters have produced.

I think she has more expectations for Raven as she is the heiress to the throne next season or if Henny gets injured this season. She will probably get the most playing time just because of that. Obviously, things can change and it seems that Rivers is the most likely candidate to go from "holding serve" to bonafide playmaker as a freshman. But all of that is conjecture right now. I, for one, cannot wait to watch them grow before our eyes!

 

[visitingcock]

Never said the freshmen would be integral, said a few might find a role. And yeah, Amihere and Cordosa have alot to do with that.

You spoke out of both sides tbh in your post. You contradicted yourself, look and see.

I said it straight. Yourself? You “prosed” and “fluffed” for what, 4 paragraphs? Only to circle back and contradict your own self?

I’m just trying to understand WTH you were trying to communicate.

This ain't Taternet. We are welcomed here.

 

[TC22]

Never said the freshmen would be integral, said a few might find a role. And yeah, Amihere and Cordosa have alot to do with that.

You spoke out of both sides tbh in your post. You contradicted yourself, look and see.

I said it straight. Yourself? You “prosed” and “fluffed” for what, 4 paragraphs? Only to circle back and contradict your own self?

I’m just trying to understand WTH you were trying to communicate.

You might want to temper it down a bit. We are guests here. Don't ruin it for the rest of us. And it's Cardoso.

 

[JDuro]

Already announcing a year in advance.

 

[triaddukefan]

Already announcing a year in advance.

Is she any good? That's a big and varied list.

 

[JDuro]

Is she any good? That's a big and varied list.

Ranked #8 for ‘23 by ESPN HoopGurlz.

 

[GCKSFN4L]

Is she any good? That's a big and varied list.

It's from my understanding she is one of the top 2 PG that anybody program should want. Between her and Fulwiley

 

[JonathanXIV]

Never said the freshmen would be integral, said a few might find a role. And yeah, Amihere and Cordosa have alot to do with that.

You spoke out of both sides tbh in your post. You contradicted yourself, look and see.

I said it straight. Yourself? You “prosed” and “fluffed” for what, 4 paragraphs? Only to circle back and contradict your own self?

I’m just trying to understand WTH you were trying to communicate.

Was not going to respond, but I thought it necessary to clarify my post.

First, my post was less in response to your original post than an exercise in thinking out loud. So, to better clarify my thoughts let me set them out.

1. Team projections by pundits often refer to the quality and depth of incoming classes.

2. Most, if not all, of these preseason articles referenced South Carolina's very talented incoming class. (To be fair, the same could be said about articles about UConn).

3. South Carolina is going to be very, very good this year, even if they hadn't recruited anyone.

4. As you suggested in your post (and I agree), South Carolina's improvement over last year (again, starting from a very high level) might be driven more from the improvement of returning players than the freshman.

5. Slightly off topic, but large freshman classes may be overvalued for first year impact, as often the biggest impact from freshman are from a few very good freshman, as opposed to impact from many of them (citing Clark, Bueckers and - potentially Rivers - as examples).

6. And finally, if these factors/thoughts/musings apply to South Carolina, they almost certainly apply to UConn as well. Another Final Four team returning (almost) everyone, a skilled transfer big, and a highly ranked recruiting class.

To further clarify, never said that you wrote that the freshman would be "integral." (actually never used that word). Also, don't see where I "contradicted" myself.

Sorry that you thought that my post was an attack or an attempt to diminish or refute your post. I really don't disagree with anything you wrote (and I certainly defer to you and other SC fans about any analysis of your team). Certainly wasn't my intention.

As for what I think about South Carolina (since you asked ). As a UConn fan, South Carolina scares me more than any other team. You are always tough defensively, play hard, rebound really well, are deep, and are physically a difficult match up. If you have an Achilles heel, it's that sometimes you can have difficulty scoring. Again, as a UConn alum, I worry that you will fix that.

Finally, I'm looking forward to the UConn-South Carolina match-up(s) this year. They should be great basketball and provide opportunities for moves and counter-moves as both teams try to play "their" game. As I posted previously, I would love to see a best of seven between the two teams.

If you are ever in Storrs, the first sundae at the Dairy Bar is on me.

 

[cockhrnleghrn]

Amihere is going to be the breakout player this year, the super recruits will need to bide their time and wait for opportunities to play. Saxton is a great team player, but Amihere is dynamic and super elite athlete, expect Saxton to lose playing time. Would love to see Rivers develop as the number 2 at the 3 spot and take minutes from Beal as season progresses, Beal is glue but nothing special on offense. Raven will spot duty Henny and Cooke some. Feagin will wait and develop behind the experienced bigs this year. Hall is a likely defensive type sub for the 2 and 3 spots at certain times. Will take a month or more for Staley to juggle and decide how the team looks down the stretch lineup wise, but Amihere is likely going to be playing in the crunch minutes and not Sexton.

Beal is an outstanding defender so I wouldn't expect her playing time to decrease much.

 

[cockhrnleghrn]

It's from my understanding she is one of the top 2 PG that anybody program should want. Between her and Fulwiley

We need Fulwiley - she's a top prospect and from Columbia - plus I like her name. "She'll go all Fulwiley on you."

 

[jchusky]

I just browsed the tv schedule for the gamecocks and geez, every game aside the 1st 2 at Atlantis are on an espn network.
Sec network/espn/espn2/ and tonight's game on Espnews. Keep in mind this is vs SOUTH DAKOTA, it's not vs a huge brand. If anyone wants to know if tv contracts matter this is the perfect example. Amazing how a team like SC can have a tv contract like this, but Uconn is on SNY and fox sports1.

 

[SCGamecock]

I just browsed the tv schedule for the gamecocks and geez, every game aside the 1st 2 at Atlantis are on an espn network.
Sec network/espn/espn2/ and tonight's game on Espnews. Keep in mind this is vs SOUTH DAKOTA, it's not vs a huge brand. If anyone wants to know if tv contracts matter this is the perfect example. Amazing how a team like SC can have a tv contract like this, but Uconn is on
SNY and fox sports1.

Yeah, but Uconn basically owns SNY, that’s pretty much your longhorn network when they’re not showing pro sports. Lol I know this for a fact because I used to live in CT.

 

[jchusky]

Yeah, but Uconn basically owns SNY, that’s pretty much your longhorn network when they’re not showing pro sports. Lol I know this for a fact because I used to live in CT.

I thought it was the mets who owned that network? Either way I'm 0 for 2 with both those networks. Just glad I get sec/acc network

 

[visitingcock]

Yeah, but Uconn basically owns SNY, that’s pretty much your longhorn network when they’re not showing pro sports. Lol I know this for a fact because I used to live in CT.

A little dirty laundry here.

We have a small lunatic fringe of fans who complained about Dawn’s recent raise because our wbb team “loses money.” What they don’t realize is that our wbb team is important too the SEC’s mega contract with ESPN. People only think in terms of football producing the TV money. However, eSPN is paying the SEC fir sports programming. The SEC network would be broke without all the other programming like WBB.

Our 30 ESPN WBB games indirectly generate a lot of money for the SEC. that profit helps provide the basis for our annual shares. The NC State game drew good eyeballs and Dawn helps ESPN sell lots of advertising.

Just another example of how women’s basketball is undervalued. It is not given a “line item” in SEC/ESPN accounting.

 

[UConnCat]

I just browsed the tv schedule for the gamecocks and geez, every game aside the 1st 2 at Atlantis are on an espn network.
Sec network/espn/espn2/ and tonight's game on Espnews. Keep in mind this is vs SOUTH DAKOTA, it's not vs a huge brand. If anyone wants to know if tv contracts matter this is the perfect example. Amazing how a team like SC can have a tv contract like this, but Uconn is on SNY and fox sports1.

You obviously know nothing about conference media rights deals. The SNY deal is with the UConn women’s team, not the BE, which is pretty incredible.

SMH.

 

[Creature]

A little dirty laundry here.

We have a small lunatic fringe of fans who complained about Dawn’s recent raise because our wbb team “loses money.” What they don’t realize is that our wbb team is important too the SEC’s mega contract with ESPN. People only think in terms of football producing the TV money. However, eSPN is paying the SEC fir sports programming. The SEC network would be broke without all the other programming like WBB.

Our 30 ESPN WBB games indirectly generate a lot of money for the SEC. that profit helps provide the basis for our annual shares. The NC State game drew good eyeballs and Dawn helps ESPN sell lots of advertising.

Just another example of how women’s basketball is undervalued. It is not given a “line item” in SEC/ESPN accounting.

That dirty laundry is not only unique to SCar my friend. Also please not that most WBB progrmas lose money on the books;but you have to determine if its an accounting decision or due to poor fan support. I thin the SCar program is served up as a "loss lead" for the fan base to have cheap tickets to a winning product.

 

[jchusky]

You obviously know nothing about conference media rights deals. The SNY deal is with the UConn women’s team, not the BE, which is pretty incredible.

SMH.

that's wonderful, I don't get that channel. And I'm sure many ppl don't. SEC network is a channel that is part of the Espn family along the Acc network so it's easier to access.

 

[UConnCat]

that's wonderful, I don't get that channel. And I'm sure many ppl don't. SEC network is a channel that is part of the Espn family along the Acc network so it's easier to access.

I understand, but you talked about the SC women’s team having a TV contract which is not accurate. The SEC has a media rights deal with ESPN and of course the SEC network is owned and operated by ESPN. The Big East has a media rights deal with Fox and CBS. Conferences control the media deals except that the UConn women have their own deal with SNY, a sports network with 8 million subscribers in the NYC area and 12 million subscribers elsewhere. The SNY games can be streamed on the FoxSports app which works great for a lot of fans. Of course, ESPN puts the Huskies on its family of networks, including the first regular season WCBB game ever on ABC, whenever it can because of the ratings.

 

[SCGamecock]

I thought it was the mets who owned that network? Either way I'm 0 for 2 with both those networks. Just glad I get sec/acc network

It’s the Mets’ network. I’m just being sarcastic about the fact that they show and promote UConn a lot… way more than the SEC Network promotes any individual school.

 

[visitingcock]

That dirty laundry is not only unique to SCar my friend. Also please not that most WBB progrmas lose money on the books;but you have to determine if its an accounting decision or due to poor fan support. I thin the SCar program is served up as a "loss lead" for the fan base to have cheap tickets to a winning product.

I agree.

 

[Gamecockfan77]

Rough looking injury for Raven. Hope it isn't as bad as it looked. Seems like a just awful year as far as injuries go nationally.

Good win. The starters are making good decisions right now. Aliyah is rarely wrong and is flat dominant defensively right now.

One of Henderson's best I would think.

 

[jumpstart]

A little dirty laundry here.

We have a small lunatic fringe of fans who complained about Dawn’s recent raise because our wbb team “loses money.” What they don’t realize is that our wbb team is important too the SEC’s mega contract with ESPN. People only think in terms of football producing the TV money. However, eSPN is paying the SEC fir sports programming. The SEC network would be broke without all the other programming like WBB.

Our 30 ESPN WBB games indirectly generate a lot of money for the SEC. that profit helps provide the basis for our annual shares. The NC State game drew good eyeballs and Dawn helps ESPN sell lots of advertising.

Just another example of how women’s basketball is undervalued. It is not given a “line item” in SEC/ESPN accounting.

Most WBB teams (if not ALL) lose money. The most the universities can do is mitigate the losses. Dawn has done a great job of mitigating the losses with the crowds that attend. Concessions are a big part of the revenue also.

 

[jumpstart]

I understand, but you talked about the SC women’s team having a TV contract which is not accurate. The SEC has a media rights deal with ESPN and of course the SEC network is owned and operated by ESPN. The Big East has a media rights deal with Fox and CBS. Conferences control the media deals except that the UConn women have their own deal with SNY, a sports network with 8 million subscribers in the NYC area and 12 million subscribers elsewhere. The SNY games can be streamed on the FoxSports app which works great for a lot of fans. Of course, ESPN puts the Huskies on its family of networks, including the first regular season WCBB game ever on ABC, whenever it can because of the ratings.

The ESPN deal is all tiers of the universities sports programs in the SEC. The eyes are on South Carolina WBB more than most WBB teams...and eyes sell ads.....Therefore the contract is also with the women's team.

 

[ConwayGmck]

Some observations from the South Dakota game:

Still too many turnovers for the team. Dawn says she's a bit more OK with turnovers that are made while attacking the basket in fast transition. It's the foolish turnovers from bad-decision passing, traveling, double-dribbling or charging while in half-court situations, that bug her the most. Don't know what category these TOs fall in, but they are too much.

To start the 3rd Qtr., the regular starting 5 for the Gamecocks came out on the floor. Don't know what was told to the team in the lockerroom during the halftime, but if anyone saw Brea Beal's hair on fire to start the 2nd half, they weren't hallucinating. In the first 4:35 of the 3rd Period, Beal had 6 rebounds - 5 of them offensive boards - shot 2-3 for 4 pts, and had a block. She's a great defensive player, but that was some of the most aggressive offensive effort I've seen from her as a Gamecock. She then was rotated out of the game with Saxton.

Hey! Both Boston and Cardoso wound up on the floor together in the 3rd Qtr. at the 5:25 mark - Cardoso came in for Saxton, while Littleton came in for Beal - and stayed out there through the end of the 3rd period. The Coyotes acknowledged this by trying to collapse into the paint, and this allowed Henderson to hit two of her 4 3-pt shots for the game. Both threes came off of assists from Kamilla.

One great play was on a missed Coyote shot that was rebounded by Henderson - the ball works it's way to Cardoso rushing down into the paint to the other end. Boston was trailing behind but was also running towards the lane. Her Coyote defender moves away from Boston and focuses on doubling up Cardoso. Boston just continues towards the basket, and even speeds up her pace. Kamilla gives Boston a sweet little pass out of the double-team, and Boston lays it up for the score:



It reminded me of the old plays from the Boston Celtics days of Bird, Parrish, and McHale: when your defender leaves you to pick up your teammate with the ball, just move immediately to the basket, and your teammate will feed you the ball for the easy lay-up. For the final 17 seconds of the 3rd Qtr., Amihere joined both Boston and Cardoso on the floor at the same time.

Overall, the Gamecock defense was pretty stifling in the 2nd half: 5-18 (27.8%) for the 3rd Qtr., and 6-31 (19.4%) for the 2nd half. A big part of that was containing Liv Korngable to just 6 pts in the 2nd half, after she scored 18 in the 1st. Chloe Lamb scored 10 pts for the game, but after those two, the rest of the team only scored a total of 7 points. In 2019-20 we beat them 73-60 in Colonial Life Arena, and we beat the Coyotes 81-71 last season in the Pentagon. They converted 41.9% and 43.3% respectively, in those games. Shot equal to us in 19-20, and better than us last season. We held them to just 25.0% Friday, while we converted 46.7% of our shots. Looks like defensive improvement, at least.....