Expansion Rumors site profiles UConn

[woomba]

North Carolina, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Duke, Miami, and Georgia Tech are all full of students from the northeast, and each has many alumni in the northeast. I would agree that this is not really the case with Clemson, NC State, and Florida State. One of the reasons Boston College joined the ACC in 2003 was to recruit students from the southeastern Atlantic states. I know that Syracuse, Pitt, and Notre Dame all want to do this as well because demographically it makes the most sense.

As far as the ACC having the old Big East bolted on, Miami and Virginia Tech are assimilated very well. Boston College has had more of a challenge, but with Notre Dame, Pitt, and Syracuse, it will help them. Connecticut would help even more. I can't speak for Connecticut, but I would think the UConn fans would enjoy all the good basketball competition that would involve rejoining Syracuse and picking up the Carolina Schools to play.

You can make the same argument for the Midwest schools. In fact, I would argue the Northern schools in the ACC are much more out of place than the Eastern Big Ten schools in terms of cultural compatibility.

I really don't see how you can fashion yourself as a "old school" ACC guy when the original ACC teams don't even make up the majority of the conference anymore.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

You can make the same argument for the Midwest schools. In fact, I would argue the Northern schools in the ACC are much more out of place than the Eastern Big Ten schools in terms of cultural compatibility.

I really don't see how you can fashion yourself as a "old school" ACC guy when the original ACC teams don't even make up the majority of the conference anymore.

Connecticut has more in common with the Eastern Midwest than than the do with Northern New England.
Both heavily industrialized areas in transition.
Those areas were amongst the first targets of Conn settlers.
Plus both areas were targets of the great European migration.
Southern Ohio and Southern Indiana are the exception.
That resulted in a diverse populations of simalar ethnic groups.

The South until recently was homogeneous.

BC in the land were there are 9 choices of Babtists is kind of funny.

 

[upstater]

Connecticut has more in common with the Eastern Midwest than than the do with Northern New England.
Both heavily industrialized areas in transition.
Those areas were amongst the first targets of Conn settlers.
Plus both areas were targets of the great European migration.
Southern Ohio and Southern Indiana are the exception.
That resulted in a diverse populations of simalar ethnic groups.

The South until recently was homogeneous.

BC in the land were there are 9 choices of Babtists is kind of funny.

Are you referring to Vermont, NH and Maine?

I have to say many towns and cities in those states feel like much of Conn. to me. Nothing the midwest ever felt like that. People are totally different too. Many Anglos and Italians in Conn., Catholics too. Midwest is heavy, heavy, heavy on Germans, some Dutch.

 

[SouthronCross]

I get the Penn State and Comcast issue in Philadelphia for the Big Ten. What I'm concerned with is the ACC in Philadelphia, and I'd prefer for the ACC to have presence in Philadelphia than in Cincinnati. That's all. I remember how awful Georgia Tech basketball was when they were invited. At that time the ACC cared more about basketball, but Georgia Tech was invited because the league wanted to be in Atlanta. I see the Temple/Philly idea as the same.

Connecticut should be choice 16 for sure. UConn runs a very successful athletic department overall, is a power in basketball, and is competitive in football. Connecticut both solidifies New England and enhances presence in New York for the ACC. The school is similar in size, demographic, and academic mission with many members of the ACC, especially the public schools. There is also much familiarity and rivalry with all the former Big East members. I still, however toy with the idea of going to 20 and what options are out there to enhance the league.

I totally understand the Atlanta-Philadelphia comparisons. And, why you'd want an ACC presense there. But, where Ga Tech had a tremendous history in football, Temple's is equally as barren. And, that is one reason they'd never get a second glance from the ACC.

 

[billybud]

Connecticut has more in common with the Eastern Midwest than than the do with Northern New England.
Both heavily industrialized areas in transition.
Those areas were amongst the first targets of Conn settlers.
Plus both areas were targets of the great European migration.
Southern Ohio and Southern Indiana are the exception.
That resulted in a diverse populations of simalar ethnic groups.

The South until recently was homogeneous.

BC in the land were there are 9 choices of Babtists is kind of funny.

The south wasn't that homogenous....we had, of course, the Scots-Irish migrations, the English migrations, some areas (my home town) had spanish, black and indian forming creole cultures, lower Alabama (Mobile) through Shreveport have a french acadian influence. We just weren't middle european (lithuanian, hungarian, polish) nor italian like the midwest was.

Louisianna had their Cote de Allemand where alsation farmers immigrated and germans settled throughout the south from Virginia to Texas....

 

[btstimpy]

You can make the same argument for the Midwest schools. In fact, I would argue the Northern schools in the ACC are much more out of place than the Eastern Big Ten schools in terms of cultural compatibility.

I really don't see how you can fashion yourself as a "old school" ACC guy when the original ACC teams don't even make up the majority of the conference anymore.

You can argue it sure. All I have to go on is half the Penn State fan base who think they are out of place along with Maryland and Rutgers who have not had the experience yet. The jury is out on that one, but there will be reference points in about 5 years. If it were 1965, I'd agree with the out of place. In 2013 with all the migration in the US, I don't agree.

For the eastern schools it is a choice of Minnesota, Iowa, Wisconsin, Nebraska, and Illinois VS Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, and North Carolina. Pennsylvania, Indiana, and Ohio if Cincinnati joins the ACC would be overlapping. With the demographic trends in the United States population and growth areas, I don't think it's a tough choice, rust vs growth. But Maryland did leave growth for rust, so some may see it as a benefit to head to the midwest.

 

[woomba]

Some? You guys needed a GOR to keep the entire conference from falling apart and had to let in a partial member in on all your bowls. Nothing the ACC has done the past few years in alignment screams strength.

 

[upstater]

You can argue it sure. All I have to go on is half the Penn State fan base who think they are out of place along with Maryland and Rutgers who have not had the experience yet. The jury is out on that one, but there will be reference points in about 5 years. If it were 1965, I'd agree with the out of place. In 2013 with all the migration in the US, I don't agree.

For the eastern schools it is a choice of Minnesota, Iowa, Wisconsin, Nebraska, and Illinois VS Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, and North Carolina. Pennsylvania, Indiana, and Ohio if Cincinnati joins the ACC would be overlapping. With the demographic trends in the United States population and growth areas, I don't think it's a tough choice, rust vs growth. But Maryland did leave growth for rust, so some may see it as a benefit to head to the midwest.

Given UConn's experience, we're likely to think the Civil War played a part in UConn being left behind.

 

[NickyNewark]

Since when does Villanova have an ambitious FB program? They were D-1 (FBS) in the 1970's until they dropped FB all together. They brought FB back, but at the D-1AA (FCS) level. They have thought about moving up to FBS, but so far have not done so. They are a good FCS program, but I wouldn't call them ambitious.

I'm also not so sure that they are the bigger hoops brand in Philly. Philly tends to get behind whichever Big-5 school is doing best at the time, often that is Nova, but Temple and St Joes have also had their moments in the sun.

Not ambitious?Why do you think the BE fell apart besides poaching?Villanova made a big push(though in vain)to get D1 status among the BE but were voted down 3 times that Im aware of!The catholic schools thought it was due to animosity but the truth is their too far behind to do anything but water down a conference that was already under fire!I can still hear the ESPin talking heads joking about it on there thrones a couple years ago just before the split!If someone would accept Villanova they'd make the jump quicker than Mizzou woulda joined the B1G if accepted a few years ago!Seems to me every time the BE wanted/needed to add schools Villanova tried to push their way in but the votes weren't there!

 

[BlueHen]

Not ambitious?Why do you think the BE fell apart besides poaching?Villanova made a big push(though in vain)to get D1 status among the BE but were voted down 3 times that Im aware of!The catholic schools thought it was due to animosity but the truth is their too far behind to do anything but water down a conference that was already under fire!I can still hear the ESPin talking heads joking about it on there thrones a couple years ago just before the split!If someone would accept Villanova they'd make the jump quicker than Mizzou woulda joined the B1G if accepted a few years ago!

If Villanova was ambitious about moving up, they would have done so. The Villanova board of trustees has never voted one way or the other on moving up. There have been feasibility studies, and talk, but that is all, that does not make them ambitious.

 

[NickyNewark]

If Villanova was ambitious about moving up, they would have done so. The Villanova board of trustees has never voted one way or the other on moving up. There have been feasibility studies, and talk, but that is all, that does not make them ambitious.

So all that talk was about possibilities?Or rumors?I don't claim any inside knowledge only whats reported in the media.

 

[HuskyDogArt]

There's deep-seated hatred that goes back generations between people who swear by the UConn Dairy Bar and those who swear by the Penn State Creamery.

Middle East conflicts come and go, but ice cream wars are forever.

I had both and I think PSU's ice Cream has more butterfat, but on a scale of 1 to 10... PSU is 9.9999 and UConn's 9.998. Both are great!!

 

[HuskyDogArt]

As well as an important source of basketball talent regionally, Connecticut is also the best football recruiting ground in New England. Connecticut consistently produces more BCS players than the rest of New England combined, and more than New York State. Of course New Jersey, Pennsylvania, and Maryland are stronger still.

Moreover, UConn does better on TV than BC due to its larger alumni base and non-alumni state fans. Also, BC is hemmed in and has no room for expansion, so it is stuck with rather mediocre facilities, while UConn can grow significantly.

BC, in other words, has peaked in value, while UConn lots of room to grow.

I think Massachusetts is stronger in HS Football. I think we are second in New England (Which is the weakest region for HS Sports. CT High schools do not travel...)

 

[NickyNewark]

I think Massachusetts is stronger in HS Football. I think we are second in New England (Which is the weakest region for HS Sports. CT High schools do not travel...)

Trouble is too many Conn kids if their special in FB go to private or parochial powers out of state like Steele Devito SS/LB of BC who I believe went to NJ's DonBosco or Bergen Catholic to get better exposure and play against "supposedly" better competition (in North Jersey parochial league its a fact)!I believe he was a Star Ledger NJ 2nd team all-state I believe?

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I had both and I think PSU's ice Cream has more butterfat, but on a scale of 1 to 10... PSU is 9.9999 and UConn's 9.998. Both are great!!

I would like to volunteer to referee that match. I foresee extensive use to re-tasting to get to the bottom of making the right call.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Trouble is too many Conn kids if their special in FB go to private or parochial powers out of state like Steele Devito SS/LB of BC who I believe went to NJ's DonBosco or Bergen Catholic to get better exposure and play against "supposedly" better competition (in North Jersey parochial league its a fact)!I believe he was a Star Ledger NJ 2nd team all-state I believe?

The Big 4 in Catholic HS football in NNJ went 3 & 1 against out-of state competition this week with Paramus Catholic (NJ #1, National #4) blanking out Gilman (Maryland #3) 28 to 0, Don Bosco (#2 NJ) blowing out St. Joseph Prep (PA #2) 42 to 0, and St, Joseph’s of Montvale beat DeMartha (Maryland #4, National #14) easily 42 to 14 while Bergen Catholic (NJ #4) lost 24 to 13 at John Curtis (Louisiana #1, National #2).
That is why CT (and Mass) HS football stars transfer to Preps while NJ and NYC metro football stars go to NNJ.

 

[NickyNewark]

The Big 4 in Catholic HS football in NNJ went 3 & 1 against out-of state competition this week with Paramus Catholic (NJ #1, National #4) blanking out Gilman (Maryland #3) 28 to 0, Don Bosco (#2 NJ) blowing out St. Joseph Prep (PA #2) 42 to 0, and St, Joseph’s of Montvale beat DeMartha (Maryland #4, National #14) easily 42 to 14 while Bergen Catholic (NJ #4) lost 24 to 13 at John Curtis (Louisiana #1, National #2).
That is why CT (and Mass) HS football stars transfer to Preps while NJ and NYC metro football stars go to NNJ.

We in Connecticut should make a concerted effort to attract qualified academically NYC underprivelged but talented as live-in guests in W.Conn and maybe Boston area same to E.Conn as sort of "exchange student/goodwill" gesture?Is it ethical/legal?I know the public schools in NJ frown on that "recruiting" in HS and puts privates/parochials at a distinct advantage. @Mr.Conehead,I see most of my answer was already in your last line?I should have read it closer!

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Don Bosco pulls in kids from the inner cities in NY (Paterson especially and a few from Newark), plus a few from NYC, and a lot from the Hudson Valley of NY. Bosco runs a school bus in the morning and afternoon from the local train station that I use to get to work, so I see them every day. Can’t speak for the other 3 (Bergen Catholic, St Joe’s, Paramus Catholic); but, they are farther away from the train stations.

 

[UConnNick]

This is true. UConn, BC, and Syracuse for that matter would generate a great rivalry. I could even have an Ice Hockey element to it. BC would have to pick it up a notch in basketball, but that is not outside the realm of possibility. Right now BC is sitting as Virginia Tech's designated rival in football. No Hokie that I know, and I know more than I care to, thinks of BC as their rival school in football. In fact if you go on their conference realignment board many of them want West Virginia. They view West Virginia as their second rival after UVA. Pittsburgh might even like that too. West Virginia isn't available though.

But back to Boston College, the reasoning they give for not wanting Connecticut is short sighted and a foreign concept for those of us that are of a competitive nature. It would boost interest in college sports in New England, and it would be good for student athletes. It would also help out the ACC.

Now the Southern members of the ACC would want something in return for inviting UConn. They don't like travelling north as much as they do now. Plus the fans of the northern schools don't travel to games at their place much either. So the ACC would have to rework the divisions. With 16 we would have to anyway.

You're correct that it's short sighted and something folks from other parts of the country wouldn't understand. That's because it's classic small-time, parochial New England thinking. BS College doesn't see much beyond it's own little backyard, and it has quite a lot of competition locally in its best sport, hockey. It's also seeing local competition from schools such as Harvard lately in BB, as the Beagles have declined precipitously and Harvard has ascended. They think the only way to remain relevant, even in their own home market, is to torpedo anybody they perceive as a threat to their local market share. UCONN represents their biggest threat in that regard.

As for football, the Beagles have been a DI school forever, but still haven't made it to a BCS bowl. UCONN has been DI only since 2002, and has already been to a BCS bowl. That's what scares the pants off Father Lie-hy and the rest of the Beagle administration. If they get permanently overshadowed by UCONN in football, they feel they're done in New England, even in their own local market. They'll do anything they can to keep that from happening. Getting beat in football by Clemson, FSU, UNC and Maryland doesn't phase them. Getting beat by UCONN in football would be an unmitigated disaster as far as they're concerned, and they know it would just be a question of time before they become second fiddle to another New England DI football program.

 

[btstimpy]

You're correct that it's short sighted and something folks from other parts of the country wouldn't understand. That's because it's classic small-time, parochial New England thinking. BS College doesn't see much beyond it's own little backyard, and it has quite a lot of competition locally in its best sport, hockey. It's also seeing local competition from schools such as Harvard lately in BB, as the Beagles have declined precipitously and Harvard has ascended. They think the only way to remain relevant, even in their own home market, is to torpedo anybody they perceive as a threat to their local market share. UCONN represents their biggest threat in that regard.

As for football, the Beagles have been a DI school forever, but still haven't made it to a BCS bowl. UCONN has been DI only since 2002, and has already been to a BCS bowl. That's what scares the pants off Father Lie-hy and the rest of the Beagle administration. If they get permanently overshadowed by UCONN in football, they feel they're done in New England, even in their own local market. They'll do anything they can to keep that from happening. Getting beat in football by Clemson, FSU, UNC and Maryland doesn't phase them. Getting beat by UCONN in football would be an unmitigated disaster as far as they're concerned, and they know it would just be a question of time before they become second fiddle to another New England DI football program.

We've gone over this. BC is confortable playing BU in everything, so what's wrong with UConn. To me, Nothing. Hopefully that last effort to exclude UConn is over. I think UConn is the best choice. I think UConn offers a good rival to BC not only in football and basketball, but in other sports. It's also a good rivalry in a league geographically dispersed. BC and Clemson are not going to be rivals, I'm sorry, as much as they want to. It will not happen.

I think Virginia can develop a rivalry with UConn. But we are much closer geographically.

 

[Adios]

We never beat BC in football in 10+ tries and they are scared of us.

 

[billybud]

Personally and selfishly, I would like to see another southern program added to the ACC before going further into the north east. And then North-South divisions.

Since FSU joined the ACC, the conference has added Boston College, Syracuse, Pitt, and Louisville (all to the north of Kentucky proper).....and FSU travels to three of the four in the division.

While there are sparse pickings, maybe something like UCF (sagarin currently has higher than Mizzou, UNC, and Michigan State).

 

[upstater]

We never beat BC in football in 10+ tries and they are scared of us.

UConn played them twice and lost after moving up. Wouldn't this be like touting all-time winning %s over Notre Dame and South Carolina as being somehow significant? Some of the losses to BC happened the week after UConn played (and lost) to New Britain High School. How much stock can we really put in that?

And, we're not the ones that came up with this "scared of UConn" story. Bob Ryan quoted people in the BC AD's office to that effect.

 

[TouchdownHusky]

Bob Ryan? Didn't think anybody in Boston even cared about college football, not with hockey only weeks away.

 

[upstater]

Bob Ryan? Didn't think anybody in Boston even cared about college football, not with hockey only weeks away.

They used to care about BC. This was the distant past. Before rodeo mania took over the city.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Don Bosco pulls in kids from the inner cities in NY (Paterson especially and a few from Newark), plus a few from NYC, and a lot from the Hudson Valley of NY. Bosco runs a school bus in the morning and afternoon from the local train station that I use to get to work, so I see them every day. Can’t speak for the other 3 (Bergen Catholic, St Joe’s, Paramus Catholic); but, they are farther away from the train stations.

For those who are interested, this write-up in the local paper here in NNJ really sums-up the progression of (catholic) high school football around here. I also like that even at the HS level, the 4 big schools root for each other overall as they recognize that the combined success of each program will only lead to bigger and better things for everyone. BC should take note.

http://www.northjersey.com/columnis...rominence_growing_in_our_Garden.html?page=all

 

[billybud]

FSU pulled DE Bjorn Werner out of the Salisbury School in Connecticut...the kid had a good career and went in the 1st round.

 

[Adios]

UConn played them twice and lost after moving up. Wouldn't this be like touting all-time winning %s over Notre Dame and South Carolina as being somehow significant? Some of the losses to BC happened the week after UConn played (and lost) to New Britain High School. How much stock can we really put in that?

And, we're not the ones that came up with this "scared of UConn" story. Bob Ryan quoted people in the BC AD's office to that effect.

Our first game against them was in 1908. We stated playing colleges only in 1915; had an Ivy League school in our schedule that year. That's 10+ games between 1908 and 2004, with the easy majority being after 1914.

 

[NickyNewark]

Personally and selfishly, I would like to see another southern program added to the ACC before going further into the north east. And then North-South divisions.

Since FSU joined the ACC, the conference has added Boston College, Syracuse, Pitt, and Louisville (all to the north of Kentucky proper).....and FSU travels to three of the four in the division.

While there are sparse pickings, maybe something like UCF (sagarin currently has higher than Mizzou, UNC, and Michigan State).

A school in the south I respect and sympathize with in a "tight" market is ECU as I think we both mentioned?I love a loyal,dedicated fanbase! Of course until UConn gets in a B1G5 conference invite I won't be happy! Also I like USF ahead of UCF(altho they fit in the discussion) as they've grown alot since joining the BE!

 

[NickyNewark]

UConn played them twice and lost after moving up. Wouldn't this be like touting all-time winning %s over Notre Dame and South Carolina as being somehow significant? Some of the losses to BC happened the week after UConn played (and lost) to New Britain High School. How much stock can we really put in that?

And, we're not the ones that came up with this "scared of UConn" story. Bob Ryan quoted people in the BC AD's office to that effect.

Bob Ryan may or may not have been right but I think of him as a dinosaur!And I think hes not much older than me?If at all?I'm 62 in November!But looking at him he's got to be 70?I don't care about his age though just his 1960s/70s thinking!