Did you people watch Calhoun UConn teams?

[Matrim55]

With Ricky's injury and Doron's groin pull, we got really slow and lost to an inferior Mississippi State.

That Mississippi State team was legit, though – one of only two teams to beat UK that year (Camby's UMass was the other).

 

[Fishy]

I seriously doubt any of you did.

The problem with your asking the question is that you then spend about a thousand words demonstrating that you are completely unfit to ask it.

Calhoun had some terrific offensive teams. He also had some terrific defensive teams.

There is no correlation or lessons to be learned about this debacle by looking back at Calhoun’s career.

You get a complete fail here.

 

[8893]

The problem with your asking the question is that you then spend about a thousand words demonstrating that you are completely unfit to ask it.

Calhoun had some terrific offensive teams. He also had some terrific defensive teams.

There is no correlation or lessons to be learned about this debacle by looking back at Calhoun’s career.

You get a complete fail here.

There is at least one lesson: when all else fails play tough defense.

 

[8893]

Calhoun was an alchemist on offense, using what he had. It wasn’t always pretty and it usually involved exploiting mismatches wherever he could find them. He generally had better ingredients but he was also better at using them.

But again, when all else failed, he made his teams play defense.

Ollie has not been able to make his teams commit to 40 minutes of defense, and his two best offensive players on this team are his two laziest defenders.

 

[superjohn]

The problem with your asking the question is that you then spend about a thousand words demonstrating that you are completely unfit to ask it.

Calhoun had some terrific offensive teams. He also had some terrific defensive teams.

There is no correlation or lessons to be learned about this debacle by looking back at Calhoun’s career.

You get a complete fail here.

Thanks for this. Happy New Year.

 

[Fishy]

Thanks for this. Happy New Year.

Sudafed, DayQuil and gin.

I’m seeing the world extra clear tonight and I couldn’t let that pile of tripe pass.

Happy New Year!

 

[8893]

Sudafed, DayQuil and gin.

I’m seeing the world extra clear tonight and I couldn’t let that pile of tripe pass.

Happy New Year!

Knock on wood, I don’t get sick much. When I do, I am still a sudafed and DayQuil devotee. Sudafed for at least 30 years and DayQuil for at least 20. I was stunned to learn that they are basically controlled substances now. Then again, I powered through a lot of seemingly miraculous situations with them, so maybe not so surprising after all.

 

[Fishy]

Knock on wood, I don’t get sick much. When I do, I am still a sudafed and DayQuil devotee. Sudafed for at least 30 years and DayQuil for at least 20. I was stunned to learn that they are basically controlled substances now. Then again, I powered through a lot of seemingly miraculous situations with them, so maybe not so surprising after all.

I try not to take anything, prescription or otherwise, if I can avoid it.

My theory is that if I don’t, when I really need it, the stuff will work like gangbusters.

That has proven true here - I feel like holy hell, but the Sudafed is making things bearable.

The jury is out on the DayQuil. I have no idea why something would taste that horrific and still be offered for public sale. I don’t care how bad I feel, I am not taking another drop of that stuff.

Shoutout to the genius who invented the Puffs Plus. They are so soft. The ones infused with Vicks are a gift from God.

 

[8893]

I try not to take anything, prescription or otherwise, if I can avoid it.

My theory is that if I don’t, when I really need it, the stuff will work like gangbusters.

That has proven true here - I feel like holy hell, but the Sudafed is making things bearable.

The jury is out on the DayQuil. I have no idea why something would taste that horrific and still be offered for public sale. I don’t care how bad I feel, I am not taking another drop of that stuff.

Shoutout to the genius who invented the Puffs Plus. They are so soft. The ones infused with Vicks are a gift from God.

Agree on all. Sudafed definitely more effective for me. My wife turned me on to DayQuil a few times when I needed to power through a few more symptoms but it was the gel caps so no taste issues. Sudafed is basically speed.

 

[Paesano]

I try not to take anything, prescription or otherwise, if I can avoid it.

My theory is that if I don’t, when I really need it, the stuff will work like gangbusters.

That has proven true here - I feel like holy hell, but the Sudafed is making things bearable.

The jury is out on the DayQuil. I have no idea why something would taste that horrific and still be offered for public sale. I don’t care how bad I feel, I am not taking another drop of that stuff.

Shoutout to the genius who invented the Puffs Plus. They are so soft. The ones infused with Vicks are a gift from God.

Before bed, take a dose of tylenol chased with a shot of black sambuca. Look for a brand called Opal Nera. It is legit with real elderberry.

 

[8893]

Before bed, take a dose of tylenol chased with a shot of black sambuca. Look for a brand called Opal Nera. It is legit with real elderberry.

Gran Marnier in a heated snifter is my magic elixir for a cold. Vitamin G. I have made many converts.

 

[Jaker]

Good gawd, lets keep living in the past. Calhoun has retired and is not comimg back people and he had his share of issues.

 

[Matrim55]

Before bed, take a dose of tylenol chased with a shot of black sambuca.

no. You should never take Tylenol at all, but taking it in conjunction with alcohol is a recipe for liver damage.

Do not, EVER, mix alcohol with acetaminophen. Honestly if that stuff was discovered now it would never get past the FDA – it's poison.

Just take two alka seltzer before bedtime and you'll be fine.

 

[boog204]

I agree, JC's offense was rudimentary and actually held us back when we were more finesse in the 90s. The m.o. was make us play half court and beat up the star and you will beat us. You saw this come to fruition with Donyell vs. Florida and especially with Ray vs. Boubacar Aw and then later vs. Miss St. The difference was that JC got his guys to play hard and to run through walls. KO has not been able to do that. So it magnifies the x and o issues all the more. While I agree with your basic premise that KO is just doing what he learned; it's not working. KO does not have the ability (it seems) to make guys plays 120% or with the fear of the hook to execute appropriately. So as a result you see the same craptastic offense but guys going through it at 75%. The awful/predictable baseline or pin down screens are done with such nonchalance that they just serve to clog up spacing. JC, even in his down years, would ensure that that big was getting a body on someone. The last 3 years have illustrated that this style does not work but there is nothing being done to change anything. So not only are we not seeing results, but we are also losing the fan base, the recruits, and the roster is going through rapid turnover. I can't just sit back and say, "well KO is just doing what has worked in the past." Because it is not working at all right now. This isn't a one year abberation when JC was building the team up (or tearing down as in 2010). This is 3 of 4 years where we are mediocre and in the other year we badly under-performed.

To build on the bad offense idea, even with JCs struggles in the half court (especially early) we were still able to get some good shots. There was still some ball movement/player movement. The plan wasn't for Ray to get the ball and everyone get out of the way. Ray seemed to always get great looks. I feel like we get a few open looks every game and everything else is off the dribble or guys just going one-on-one. That's a huge issue.

 

[Kenny11]

I agree. Calhoun teams never ran great flowing offensive sets.

But the game has changed so much even just in the last 5 Years. Unless you have elite 5 star level talent (which we don’t) you better be able to have multiple guys that can spread the floor and make 3s. Toughness alone isn’t getting it done anymore in modern basketball.

 

[Paesano]

no. You should never take Tylenol at all, but taking it in conjunction with alcohol is a recipe for liver damage.

Do not, EVER, mix alcohol with acetaminophen. Honestly if that stuff was discovered now it would never get past the FDA – it's poison.

Just take two alka seltzer before bedtime and you'll be fine.

So you are not a fan of nyquil then. Pretty much most medications, including many holistic ones, are poison in terms of doing some damage. That is why you should avoid them unless you feel like total crap and can't afford to sleep it off.

 

[CTBasketball]

Calhoun offenses throughout the 90s were a thing of beauty.

Same with the 2000’s except for a few down years. 2010 and 2012 stick out in people’s mind too much.

 

[djct1999]

Most times, Calhoun's offense centered around an elite, nba lottery bound wing. There are guys on this team that wouldn't start with the Balls in Lithuania on their B team.

If you don't see the difference between hitting Rip on a curl vs Jalen holding the ball on the top of the key, waiting for the shot clock to go down to 10, then driving into traffic.......should you really be posting about this?

 

[willie99]

Our biggest complaint in the Calhoun year's used to be how bad the offense sucked, that is until the team figured it out and started clicking sometime in January (February in 2002 and March in 2004 and 2011)

Calhoun never made the NCAA with all newcomers either, see 93, 97, 01, 07 (2010 was a flame out with seniors, the one and only time that happened). It always took time to jell

Furthermore, I'd wager many of the haters who are way over the top in their bashing of Ollie probably complained about Calhoun too for pulling the kids too quickly and destroying their confidence. I personally loved that stuff, I loved the timeouts 10 seconds into the game.

Many of that same crowd were probably even calling for Calhoun's head in the 1990's. Anyone remember that "Calhoun can't win the big one" nonsense?

Debbie Downer, Negative Nancy and Pessimistic Patty are people it's literally unhealthy to be around. Miserable people tend to bring misery into the lives of everyone they touch. It's better to avoid them


Love the points the OP is making, the dumpster fire crowd even rewrites history to fit their narrative

 

[willie99]

Calhoun's teams were not beat up so consistently on the boards. But offensively Calhoun's teams were not lights out. Unless he had future pros shooting....which he frequently did.

I would also note that Calhoun never had a third of the team transfer out. I would argue that nobody has. Except KO. Unless the coach was let go.

If we have anymore than one person transfer this off season everyone should be off the KO band wagon. Even one transfer will raise some eyebrows if it's someone expected to play next year.

I concur about the transfers. I give him a one time pass for last season after he decided things had to change. If that happens again this year, if multiple kids who are playing transfer out, then he has a deeper problem.

 

[willie99]

The 2004 team ran some pretty solid sets off of Gordon and Okafor. We didn't need to "muck" up the game. We would just wear you down from the tip.

Calhoun was named the "uncoach of the year" in February of 2004 because UConn wasn't playing up to expectations.

 

[raf46]

I seriously doubt any of you did.

Either that or you have severe selective memory.

In no way is what I write a ringing endorsement of Kevin Ollie. He owns most of this mess. For many reasons I'll get into. But it isn't for on the floor style of play or "ugly offense" that I see written here ad nauseam .

If I see one more post about " lack of offensive sets" or how " teams run so much more prettier offenses than UConn " I want to puke.

Because that was Calhouns case too. We never ran pretty offense. Ever. Never.

How did Calhoun become the greatest coach of all time with such a predictable offense?

He had the uncanny knack of making his teams tougher than everyone else. Our good teams were always tougher. When our offense wasn't pretty we had horses crashing glass and cleaning up messes. You saw witchita do that yesterday in 2nd half. Cleaning glass off misses erases a lot of bad looking offense.

On defense we were brutal to teams. alternately having teams that could really get into you on the perimeter or having devastating rim protectors where no team would ever get anything easy . How many times over the years would you see teams actually get near the rim realize there was an oak , thabeet, even Brimah and not even take a shot and bring the ball back out because of fear?

We made games ugly. They were rockfights . There was never anything easy.
Through defensive will, keying offense off of defense, some offensive rebounding toughness and players who consistently improved it was a formula for great success. Unparalleled.

But does anyone ever wonder why the one thing lacking on JCs awesome coaching resume is a consistent string of NCAA tourney appearances? There were quite a few years JC teams stayed home while teams at our elite level would go every year.

Because JC's coaching style demanded all in defensive buy in plus a dynamic player or two who found consistency. When we weren't the mentally and physically toughest teams in the country we suffered even on very talented teams ( see 2012, 2010, 2007, 2001, 1997, 1993)
It is much harder to build a team with a collective constant will to win. Playing in such a demanding system. JC couldn't always do it, but when he did we were very hard to beat.

What I'm getting at is that KO is a Calhoun disciple . He is trying to keep JC's style of UConn basketball.

I see it.

Isn't it funny that in the closer losses against teams way more talented than us this year ( mich state, zona, WSU) that I see people on here saying "oh we suck, those teams were just having " off nights" . No it wasn't off nights. It's not coincidence . We made the games ugly. We competed hard and paid attention to detail on the defensive end in ways that we don't against lesser teams.
It looked like traditional UConn winning basketball for big stretches of all those games. The problems were we couldn't sustain it. We don't have enough horses. It takes great effort to sustain that style of play and notice that under 10 minutes left in each of those games we are simply gassed. KO has had to take timeouts under 10 to just rest players.

Now problem number 1 with that, that I will hang on KO (but not entirely) is why can the players only get up and play with the effort required to make our system successful against top 10 teams? I mean I get that is human nature to get juiced for the big moments. But for the system to work we have to buy in as a team culture every minute of every game . We don't.

Also, and the buck stops with KO as head coach, but again not entirely:
We are stupid. I mean this is a situationally unaware just mind boggling stupid collection of players as far as making unforced mistakes . Whether it is Vital chucking ridiculous threes , multiple players travelling, and larrier and Adams being so loose with the ball, we don't ever go more than 2 consecutive trips without absolutely shooting ourselves in the foot. KO can't be on the floor. And it's not like he can bench guys for stupid, because on the bench he has people who just ratchet up the stupid if out on the floor.

And then here is where it gets so fun.
If we manage to avoid stupid on the offensive end and get a good shot, we can't hit it. The shooting is just abysmal. We were never going to be that great a shooting team, but we shouldn't be this bad.

I think people think our low assist numbers are due to poor offense. Not really we have never run a high assist number type of offense. Our assists numbers are so terrible because we can't make a frickin shot. Please someone tell me, who do you want Jalen or Terry throwing the ball to for a score?
Polley?
Carlton?
DO?
ANDERSON?
Cobb?
Whaley?
Vital who is a black hole inconsistent 3 chucker?

None of them have any offensive game. I don't care if you bring in Pete Carril to run the Princeton offense none of those guys at this point have any inkling on how to play within themselves and put a ball in the hoop.

It's the Jalen and Terry show sink or swim. Unfortunately Jalen hasn't taken the next step that he should've for a kid with his tools junior year. He desperately needs to start draining that elbow jumper he can get any time he wants. It would open up the lane for drives, and dishing. And Terry looks like he's getting it and can be unstoppable except for the fact that he can't seem to ever get going in 1st half, and he has bad judgement putting the ball on the floor.

But to me bad offense is anyone but those 2 guys taking shots. Even with their flaws, and their flaws are hurting us right now.

We just don't have answers, our margin of error is so thin. We get something offensively we miss a shot. Good teams like the 3 I mentioned above if we have a single defensive breakdown after 5 excellent defensive trips by us , sink a three. Or get a board.

Now if you want to blame Ollie for having the players he has or players not getting better, or mind scratching lineups and substitution patterns, I get all that and fully agree.

But I don't blame him for trying to continue Jim Calhouns legacy and style and brand of UConn basketball. It brought us four titles.
And for good stretches against the best 3 teams we played this year, it proves to me that it can still work. We just don't have enough to make it work for 40 minutes. And we don't have the buy in to play that way consistently it is such a mentally fragile team.

Now that can entirely be KOs fault for not keeping his players engaged day in and day out, or some can hang on some players too. Don't care doesn't matter , end result the same and buck stops with coach.

But remember one thing. UConn basketball "style" as a brand is gone forever if KO can't find a way to make it work and we need to replace him.

And that makes me sad.

I don't know if he can do it or not off the floor. Because that's where our problems lie.

it is not that complicated. Jim, recruited better players! Better players win, not the coach. Which is why, in most cases Coaches donot replicate past glory when they switch schools. You don't by accident win 800 games.

 

[willie99]

Talk about rewriting history, does anyone remember what this board was like in September of 2010? Anyone remember how much "those who only want what's best for our program" HATED our incoming class and complained about the demise of our program?

Calhoun can't recruit, Calhoun can't relate to modern day recruits, Calhoun pulls kids too quickly and one of my personal favorites of all-time, "we got the wrong Lamb"

Yep, the more things change, the more things stay the same, especially with the dumpster fire crowd. They just seem to forget a lot

 

[Marty Jackson]

I'm not comparing them. I'm saying Kevin Ollie is using Calhous system .

Calhoun's system worked for Calhoun. He came to UConn with experience and success already.
To me, more important than Calhoun's style is the desire to win. I don't care if Ollie instills his style, Calhoun's style, or if he goes and follows some unknown coach in hs. Whatever it is, get the players and develop them. WIN!
Ollie is floundering in that aspect. It's been 6 seasons. Every year we are looking at recruits, wondering what they bring, why they are at UConn, and whether they can play at this level. For the 2nd straight season we are looking at a team ill prepared for the rigors of a full season and woefully unbalanced in terms of needed skills.

That is on Ollie. That is the difference between a coach with years of experience building a team and one that is learning on the fly.

If Ollie can fix this, great. If not, get someone who can. All I've said is that this current trend isn't working. Maybe the new coaches will help. But without an NCAA appearance this year, I think Ollie is gone. At the least, the expectations go up next year. Top 3 in AAC, NCAA appearance with at least 1 win.

 

[Paesano]

Talk about rewriting history, does anyone remember what this board was like in September of 2010? Anyone remember how much "those who only want what's best for our program" HATED our incoming class and complained about the demise of our program?

Calhoun can't recruit, Calhoun can't relate to modern day recruits, Calhoun pulls kids too quickly and one of my personal favorites of all-time, "we got the wrong Lamb"

Yep, the more things change, the more things stay the same, especially with the dumpster fire crowd. They just seem to forget a lot

Yeah, and 2009-2010 was probably Calhoun's worst year, post 1990. They finished 18-16 and 7-11 in the Big East for 11th place. People were really doubting him after that.

But how bad was it really? Well, this team is currently 105th in the Sagarins. This time last year, they were 101st. Calhoun's awful 2009-2010 team finished 53rd. And he followed it up with a national championship. That was a shaky season but it wasn't another NIT run. This is flat out ugly. People need to wake up and stop trying to put lipstick on this pig.

 

[mauconnfan]

Calhoun's teams were not beat up so consistently on the boards. But offensively Calhoun's teams were not lights out. Unless he had future pros shooting....which he frequently did.

I would also note that Calhoun never had a third of the team transfer out. I would argue that nobody has. Except KO. Unless the coach was let go.

If we have anymore than one person transfer this off season everyone should be off the KO band wagon. Even one transfer will raise some eyebrows if it's someone expected to play next year.

Argue away:
Verbal Commits | D1 Players Transferring in 2017

 

[mauconnfan]

What I learned from reading this thread:

Do not take Tylenol with alcohol it can kill you.

You need to take Tylenol with alcohol watching KO's offense, or Nyquil / Opal Nero an hour before the game so you can't watch it.

JC had guys that could shoot, rebound, play tough and win games with defense alone.

KO needs to get better players for his system to work.

 

[Waquoit]

I concur about the transfers. I give him a one time pass for last season after he decided things had to change. If that happens again this year, if multiple kids who are playing transfer out, then he has a deeper problem.

How many one-time passes are you going to give the guy?

 

[Huskybass]

At this point, anyone who can't see this for what it is simply does not want to see it. Period. Whether it's recruiting, roster construction, player development, talent evaluation, in game coaching, use of timeouts, development of offensive sets... its all lacking.

You don't become last in the nation in assists with an average margin of defeat of 19 points if the team is well coached. Those who believe things will turn around under this head coach are simply refusing to see what is right in front of them.

 

[MuchoDogYears]

You dope. Those 94-96 teams were a fastbreak thing of beauty. Because of scheffer mostly. But our 1/2 court sets were exactly the same as they've always been and not very effective at all and quite frankly ugly. Which is why we never won crap then .

Go watch the Miss St sweet 16 game and tell me how pretty we looked.

Making it to the Sweet 16 is slightly,... barely,... by the slimmest of margins,... better than "we never won crap then". Just my uninformed personal opinion.

Look, I get that the players on JC's teams were more talented. You'd have to be an idiotic to compare talent levels then and now. Yeah JC's teams weren't the best in half-court sets with sometimes falling into the windshield wiper offense, passing the ball around the perimeter. But even with that, there was an inside-outside balance, fast-breaks, and some semblance of an offense other than ISO. Hero ball happened back then too, but only when the time and score called for it, JC went to his "star". KO has no semblance of a set offense, no fast break, only hero ball all the time. Like opposing coaches say, easy to defend. Blame it on lack of talent, but I watch other teams with less talent running offensive sets and getting open looks.