California state university system cancels fall classes on campus

[StllH8L8ner]

If you're referencing me as it relates to grandstanding - I guess if adding a perspective based on my professional role that has actual facts pertaining to this thread is grandstanding, then I'm guilty.

I wasn't. Sorry.

 

[upstater]

I'm in the president's council and the BOT meetings and have a voice in that decision - what you're saying may be correct for you institution, but it's not universal which is how I read it.

Marketing/enrollment has a say in the decision for any school, if you think it doesn't you aren't living in reality.

(edit) why do they have a say - because they have to manage all of the communications around it and the potential fall out from the decision.

I'm not here to puff myself up. When I hear Provosts say it is not fully my decision, I don't doubt them.

 

[mussels]

You need testing and a decent system to monitor contacts. Body temperature machine scanners at points of entry would be important. We also should have adequate numbers of ventilators and PPE. This is not rocket science because we have a successful model in South Korea. They were one of the first countries if not the first country outside of China to get cases. They had no advance warning other than China. There was no Italy or NYC when they went into lockdown. But they were and are prepared for this pandemic. Just emulate what they did and are doing.

You can't test everyone in a country every day. I never stated that. What you do is is test a percentage of people and if they test positive you trace who they came in contact with and isolate them if they don't have antibodies. Same with any individual who becomes symptomatic or has a fever. Infected people will still move through society but not at a rate that causes an overwhelming of the medical system. The average person will feel relatively safe and the economy can resume with some modifications to the work environment.

South Korea uses cellphone data to trace where an infected person has been, and then broadcasts it (without names) so others will know if they may have come in contact. They also use an app that tracks a persons phone to insure that he isn’t breaking quarantine. Although the published data doesn't include names there are cases where people have connected dots, and also businesses where people have been lose business despite cleaning and disinfecting done by the state.

How do you think Americans would respond to such "virtuous surveillance"?

 

[NJHusky]

Its been an expensive bet so far. I've been following the situation in Scandinavia and to this point Sweden, absent many restrictions, has 7x as many deaths as Norway and Finland combined (which is close to an equal comparison as far as population is concerned). There isn't a sign of herd immunity yet after three months as they are still racking up way more new cases per day (602 v 44 yesterday) but thousands of additional people are dead. We'll see what happens over the next month or so.

If you are going to use a number at least do the math correctly. According to worldometer Denmark had 533 deaths and Finland had 284. That’s 817. 7x that is 5719. Worldometer shows Sweden with 3460 deaths. You’re off by 1.75x but never let facts get in the way. They conceded they did not properly safeguard their senior living places that account for over 50% of deaths. If u look at the general populace mortality it’s about 1700 or 2x Finland and Denmark. Let’s see what happens in July as they expect herd immunity in June.

 

[Peacefrog]

Did you mean Sweden had 602 cases yesterday compared to a combined 44 total for Finland and Norway? Is so, my bad.

Yes, that’s what I meant if I didn’t type it clearly. I’m really hoping for signs of some immunity in Sweden but they’re not really showing a decrease in new cases or deaths.

 

[NJHusky]

Herd immunity is just not going to happen, unfortunately.

And your source?

 

[NJHusky]

The USA. A first world country without colleges.

Or better yet colleges that are forced to come back to reality and charge tuition that isn’t 3x higher than inflation for the past 40 years.

 

[Peacefrog]

If you are going to use a number at least do the math correctly. According to worldometer Denmark had 533 deaths and Finland had 284. That’s 817. 7x that is 5719. Worldometer shows Sweden with 3460 deaths. You’re off by 1.75x but never let facts get in the way. They conceded they did not properly safeguard their senior living places that account for over 50% of deaths. If u look at the general populace mortality it’s about 1700 or 2x Finland and Denmark. Let’s see what happens in July as they expect herd immunity in June.

I think my math is fine thanks. Read my post again. I never mentioned Denmark so that's your reading issue, not my math issue. May 12th Sweden had 57 deaths compared to a combined 8 for Finland and Norway. Last time I checked 8x7=56, no? Total deaths through Tuesday are 3,313 to 503 (factor of 6.6 higher). I think the Finland + Norway comparison is better since Sweden is sandwiched right in between versus separated by a body of water. Also, Finland + Norway have 11M people combined compared to 10M in Sweden. Pretty close. If you are going to use Denmark + Finland instead you at least need to normalize for the fairly large population difference, no? Math fact mic drop.

I've read about the issue with the elderly in Sweden. My concern is that all countries are seeing large percentages of deaths in senior living. Are Finland and Norway outliers? If they also had 50% deaths in this community it wouldn't change the ratios, right?

I'm sensing aggression and I'm not sure where its coming from. We're all on the same team here. I want the best possible outcome and simply posted data with no bias or ulterior motive and you seemed to come at me for some reason. Believe me, I hope Sweden's approach works but the numbers are worrying at this point. As you said, we'll know more in a month or so.

 

[August_West]

I understand why California wud cancel fall sports but why make the decision this early? Why not wait another month till mid June? Why the burning rush to call it so fast? Does fall semester start in late July out there? Or they just trying to be the first ones? Extra strange when u take into account that just a couple weeks ago Cali was talking about reopening public schools in July. So weird

What do you think exactly is going to happen between now and then? A vaccine? Jesus doing resurrection 2 and touching us all on the shoulder and healing us?

either of the above by the fall would be great.

Neither is happening.

 

[superjohn]

What do you think exactly is going to happen between now and then? A vaccine? Jesus doing resurrection 2 and touching us all on the shoulder and healing us?

either of the above by the fall would be great.

Neither is happening.

What does a vaccine have to do with it? We may never have a vaccine.

 

[August_West]

What does a vaccine have to do with it? We may never have a vaccine.

Nope we may not. But you can’t rush herd immunity without unneedingly sacrificing lives either.

I get your trips to the gym and hoisting beer at a football game are vital to you.

playing music is vital to me.

but .....

priorities my friend

 

[superjohn]

Nope we may not. But you can’t rush herd immunity without unneedingly sacrificing lives either.

I get your trips to the gym and hoisting beer at a football game are vital to you.

playing music is vital to me.

but .....

priorities my friend

Geezus, be better than that.

 

[August_West]

Geezus, be better than that.

Than what?

stores should be open. People should be going back to work. All with social distancing practices and masks. That’s where we are.

you leaving your sweat on a bench press or me spraying the front row with saliva while I sing in a crowded indoor bar is the height of stupidity. I know you’re not that stupid.

you think you’re going to see 100k in ann arbor for Michigan Ohio state this fall? Guess again, chumley.

 

[Palatine]

What do you think exactly is going to happen between now and then? A vaccine? Jesus doing resurrection 2 and touching us all on the shoulder and healing us?

Just some facts.

1-SARS simply disappeared as the seasons changed. Why do you think there is a "flu" season. Weather affects viruses.

2-There is money to be made. Remdesivir looks to be lame. However, almost every major pharma player has folks working on treatments which would be a windfall. At least 75 are in the pipeline. Only one has to work.

3-Testing is increasing exponentially. As surveillance testing becomes more widely available political decision makers will be able adjust their state re-openings based on better data.

4-Coutries all over the world (and states here at home) are re-opening at different rates and with different precautions. These experiences will inform decision makers on does and don't and could cause some to change course.

5-I hope you have a lightning rod on your home. Touching one on the shoulder isn't Jesus's only option.

 

[August_West]

Just some facts.

1-SARS simply disappeared as the seasons changed. Why do you think there is a "flu" season. Weather affects viruses.

2-There is money to be made. Remdesivir looks to be lame. However, almost every major pharma player has folks working on treatments which would be a windfall. At least 75 are in the pipeline. Only one has to work.

3-Testing is increasing exponentially. As surveillance testing becomes more widely available political decision makers will be able adjust their state re-openings based on better data.

4-Coutries all over the world (and states here at home) are re-opening at different rates and with different precautions. These experiences will inform decision makers on does and don't and could cause some to change course.

5-I hope you have a lightning rod on your home. Touching one on the shoulder isn't Jesus's only option.

I don’t know which of those 5 points made me laugh harder. Thank you.

 

[superjohn]

Than what?

stores should be open. People should be going back to work. All with social distancing practices and masks. That’s where we are.

you leaving your sweat on a bench press or me spraying the front row with saliva while I sing in a crowded indoor bar is the height of stupidity. I know you’re not that stupid.

you think you going to see 100k in an arbor for Michigan Ohio state this fall? Guess again, chumley.

What are you talking about? That's not where we are. Businesses aren't open, they're going out of business all over the place.

Nobody has said anything abour concerts or gyms in any of these threads. It's all about risk/reward analysis, the shutdown has had dire consequences and it's only getting worse with things being shutdown until the end of summer. People are dying at home from other things than Covid, a lot of kids are getting f-ed up.

Your post is extremely cavalier about what's happening to people. I could care less about the gym, you playing guitar, oe football games. It's not about you or me.

I still have no clue what your vaccine comment means.

 

[August_West]

What are you talking about? That's not where we are. Businesses aren't open, they're going out of business all over the place.

Point being, mom and pop shops and non essential businesses should be open. I believe that. And I believe they will be over the next 6 weeks.
That’s not cavalier.

 

[August_West]

I still have no clue what your vaccine comment means.

Break it down.
There will be no “ normal “ until a vaccine. It’s that simple. Mass gatherings and businesses where it’s impossible to practice social distancing are screwed.. it’s sad, but it’s true.

 

[superjohn]

Break it down.
There will be no “ normal “ until a vaccine. It’s that simple. Mass gatherings and businesses where it’s impossible to practice social distancing are screwed.. it’s sad, but it’s true.

So no school or sports for years?

 

[superjohn]

Supreme Court of Wisconsin just struck down the stay at home order from the Governor, all restaurants and bars can open immediately.

It's pretty obvious this was always going to happen around the country.

 

[August_West]

So no school or sports for years?

Maybe.

or until something changes and people actually get tested at the numbers they should be and by some miracle the contagiousness of this travesty is mitigated.

school will combine sparse rotated classrooms with online learning. Sucks for kids but way easier on college and high school students than the young ones for who socialization is just as important.

sports?

I’m sure they’ll find a way on pro level. But sold out arenas and stadiums are kaput for a bit. College sports? I can’t see it if kids aren’t on campus.

 

[August_West]

Supreme Court of Wisconsin just struck down the stay at home order from the Governor, all restaurants and bars can open immediately.

It's pretty obvious this was always going to happen around the country.

it’s a bold move, cotton. Let’s see if it pays off.
Hope it does. Many won’t open. ( see Georgia) and the fear right now is too fresh.

 

[JB75]

I

The NBA and MLB have both stated they need a month of warm up activities to prevent injuries and get back in shape, and that isn't football. Besides for at least a month now, people have been speculating about having fall sports start after the new year.

I agree that fall sports cud start Jan 1 coinciding with College hoops. They re saying nfl starting Columbus Day weekend , nba beginning July 4 weekend with a couple exhibition games then right into playoffs which will conclude around Labor Day weekend. So yes I understand , just think jumping gun on May 10th is a month too early. That’s all. Obviously no one knows what’s going on. Just a huge mess

 

[auggie22]

The chain of payments is kept in tact in Denmark. Everyone can buy food, everyone can pay the rent, landlords can collect rent, banks can collect on loans, no one loses their job, companies meet payrolls despite shortfalls in sales.

Are people buying computers? Buying cars? Taking vacations? Investing money? Economies are pretty complicated things. Your response does not explain how paying people’s salaries for a few months would protect our economy. What about the people who have jobs now but won’t in three or four months when the lack of spending forces businesses to close or retrench. Or 12 months from now when the vicious spiral continues?

The truth is layoffs are going to get much, much worse before they get better. The length of our mandated quarantine will determine how bad and for how long. By this time next year most of us could very well be out of jobs. Paying the unemployed their salary for a few months (or years) is not going to stop it.

 

[JB75]

Early June is the deadline for all schools to decide.

I heard late June just last week but since people r announcing things already this will definitely push up that date as everyone goes into a panicky rush to make sure they were “proactive”.