BIG 12 25-26 | Page 8 | The Boneyard

BIG 12 25-26

Battle for sole possession of 7th place between ISU and ASU tonight in Ames.

Not where ISU was projected to be near seasons end. Will be interesting to see how much Addy Brown actually plays tonight after missing 10+ games. Or how effective she might be in integrated back into a lineup that has been playing without her.
 
Iowa State is a tournament team with Addy Brown back. That being said, I'm really not a fan of Jayda Williams. She can score, but she's really not a point guard. Lots of possessions you can just tell she's looking to score vs seeing what the defense is giving them. Turnover prone as well. Will be interesting to see how far they get.
 
Iowa State is a tournament team with Addy Brown back. That being said, I'm really not a fan of Jayda Williams. She can score, but she's really not a point guard. Lots of possessions you can just tell she's looking to score vs seeing what the defense is giving them. Turnover prone as well. Will be interesting to see how far they get.
After 2 years of watching Jayda in Tucson, the biggest issue was her streakiness. Not sure always if it was a result of being more of a 2 guard or just part of her game.

The converse to your point is that, at least during her time at Arizona, she at least knew what her teammates were supposed to do. Frustrated her when they didn't, leading to take over syndrome. I would assume this is not an issue at Iowa State.

I don't know which is more frustrating, Adia's teams not quite playing up to their apparent potential, or this year's team under Becky Burke which plays very, very hard but lacks (some) talent and any athletic height. In the game against Colorado, we had them confused and worked up a 7 point lead. Their coach settled them by reminding them we had absolutely no answer for shots in the paint due to being unable to contest. They went on an 18-3 run to win.
 
Current update with focus on Colorado:


Most importantly however

"Arizona State’s Molly Miller is now the winningest first-year coach in Sun Devils history. A 23-point loss to Iowa State dims some of the enthusiasm since it impacts the race for an at-large bid in a very negative way, but it shouldn’t take away from how thoroughly Miller has turned this program around. The last few seasons have been a nightmare in Tempe, but things are looking up."

This morning Charlie Creme had ASU the last team in.

That said the road to the dance is going to be very narrow and challenging.

The Devils end with Houston, BYU and Texas Tech. With victories over the first two in a loss to the Red Raiders in the season ender I think the Devils need to win at least two games in the tournament to dance.

This morning Creme had Utah the first team out and ASU swept the Utes . Nebraska is the second team out and they effectively removed themselves from the dance with their collapse last night.

But lurking in the second four out are both Cal and Stanford.... These are the teams I fear will catch the Sun Devils either down the stretch or in the tournament. Also I think there's a scenario in which the Spiders weave their web in
 
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But lurking in the second four out are both Cal and Stanford.... These are the teams I fear will catch the Sun Devils either down the stretch or in the tournament. Also I think there's a scenario in which the Spiders weave their web in
Stanford is likely out barring a miracle ACC tournament run (that's not going to happen). Even though they hold a road win over UNC (which seems like ages ago), they have a blowout road loss to Georgia Tech, a home loss to UVA (who just moved to the right side of the bubble and is going to have a tough stretch to end their season), and this blowout loss to Miami (a team that's not going dancing unless it wins the ACC tourney). Even if they were to win out, they're looking at 8-10 in the ACC.

Cal could win out and reach 11 ACC wins. If Notre Dame remains a Q1, then they could possibly sneak in with one ACCT win (over anyone--doesn't matter). If ND falls off (they have a game against Syracuse and a game at Louisville waiting for them), then they might need a Q1 win in the ACCT (e.g. ND, UNC, NC State).
 
After 2 years of watching Jayda in Tucson, the biggest issue was her streakiness. Not sure always if it was a result of being more of a 2 guard or just part of her game.

The converse to your point is that, at least during her time at Arizona, she at least knew what her teammates were supposed to do. Frustrated her when they didn't, leading to take over syndrome. I would assume this is not an issue at Iowa State.

I don't know which is more frustrating, Adia's teams not quite playing up to their apparent potential, or this year's team under Becky Burke which plays very, very hard but lacks (some) talent and any athletic height. In the game against Colorado, we had them confused and worked up a 7 point lead. Their coach settled them by reminding them we had absolutely no answer for shots in the paint due to being unable to contest. They went on an 18-3 run to win.
Adia’s coaching was not improving. And Adia was having more trouble recruiting and maintaining players, was she not? Whereas I think it reasonable to hope Coach Burke can improve her roster in the off season. I think I would be a hopeful fan. But then again, I usually am (a hopeful fan.)
 
Adia’s coaching was not improving. And Adia was having more trouble recruiting and maintaining players, was she not? Whereas I think it reasonable to hope Coach Burke can improve her roster in the off season. I think I would be a hopeful fan. But then again, I usually am (a hopeful fan.)
Adia - rather than "not-improving" I would go for "not changing with the times". One result of an old school mentality about playing time, and roles, and all the rest of that is perhaps a difficulty in retaining players who don't want to be a sporadic sub, or be needed to play a position that doesn't showcase their skills so well, etc. As far as it goes, I think most of her players liked her well enough and I'm not sure her recruiting was a real problem.

Becky - I fully believe she is improving her roster based on early commits. She was in a no-win situation coming aboard so late. The team - as I have said before - is a high level non-power conference team this year. The players have talent, but I don't see anyone that would be starting on a good Power 4 team. This is not Becky's fault, nor is the putrid OOC schedule a negative - regardless of how much she actually had to do with it and how much was left over from the prior staff.

I am hopeful of success going forward (certainly next year will be an improvement) but I am cautious. Becky needs to prove that she can coach at this level.

There are also a few things that I am slightly displeased with, although I'm sure no one else cares. In 30 years of following WBB she is the first coach I remember taking "center stage" as players are introduced - with many coaches ignoring it and others standing along the side and getting a fist bump. I don't begrudge "sleeves up" but I resent being expected to chant it - Adia never made fans chant "Made for It". Bear Down as a tradition stands on its own. And I liked banging the drum - I gather football took the drum once the women didn't want it. It was cool. And not her fault, but I don't like the head coach being announced when they walk out, although I know the men do it too. For all my years at Rutgers games, before we moved, C. Vivian Stringer was never announced - but often got a standing ovation as she walked out. Earned. Naismith Hall of Fame. But all of this is just me.
 
Becky - I


There are also a few things that I am slightly displeased with, although I'm sure no one else cares. In 30 years of following WBB she is the first coach I remember taking "center stage" as players are introduced - with many coaches ignoring it and others standing along the side and getting a fist bump. I don't begrudge "sleeves up" but I resent being expected to chant it - Adia never made fans chant "Made for It". Bear Down as a tradition stands on its own. And I liked banging the drum - I gather football took the drum once the women didn't want it. It was cool. And not her fault, but I don't like the head coach being announced when they walk out, although I know the men do it too. For all my years at Rutgers games, before we moved, C. Vivian Stringer was never announced - but often got a standing ovation as she walked out. Earned. Naismith Hall of Fame. But all of this is just me.
Interesting you should mention the center stage decision by BB. I was also struck and surprised by that last Saturday. Like you I don't believe I've ever seen that before and I'd love to sit down with her and hear her rationale as I'm sure she has a reason for this.

On another note I saw the mock up for the planned renovation of McKale..... If accurate it's spectacular.

As I said to a fan sitting next to me last Saturday I think Cornfield is a really fine point guard and Welchis an undersized passion player. Both had excellent games against the Sun Devils.
 
Stanford is likely out barring a miracle ACC tournament run (that's not going to happen). Even though they hold a road win over UNC (which seems like ages ago), they have a blowout road loss to Georgia Tech, a home loss to UVA (who just moved to the right side of the bubble and is going to have a tough stretch to end their season), and this blowout loss to Miami (a team that's not going dancing unless it wins the ACC tourney). Even if they were to win out, they're looking at 8-10 in the ACC.

Cal could win out and reach 11 ACC wins. If Notre Dame remains a Q1, then they could possibly sneak in with one ACCT win (over anyone--doesn't matter). If ND falls off (they have a game against Syracuse and a game at Louisville waiting for them), then they might need a Q1 win in the ACCT (e.g. ND, UNC, NC State).
Thx for the analysis. If ACC materializes in the way you anticipate that would be very helpful for ASU particularly we beat BYU and don't get destroyed by Texas Tech.

I'm wondering how the committee would look at a 25 win ASU team with no quad one wins versus Richmond.

This is a great time of year. While I love the Huskies there's zero uncertainty until late March. For many or most of us this is the time of year of peak anxiety and anticipation

I'm really looking forward to tournament week. I've already decided that next year I'll be going to Kansas City Kansas City here I come. This will be the last year the Mountain West exists in its current configuration and I'm not anticipating a huge leap by Grand Canyon.

A fellow fan said that there's an excellent hotel very near the arena where the big 12 is played in KC so I'm going to save my nipples and dimes over the next year in the hope that ASU keeps rolling
 
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Adia - rather than "not-improving" I would go for "not changing with the times". One result of an old school mentality about playing time, and roles, and all the rest of that is perhaps a difficulty in retaining players who don't want to be a sporadic sub, or be needed to play a position that doesn't showcase their skills so well, etc. As far as it goes, I think most of her players liked her well enough and I'm not sure her recruiting was a real problem.

Becky - I fully believe she is improving her roster based on early commits. She was in a no-win situation coming aboard so late. The team - as I have said before - is a high level non-power conference team this year. The players have talent, but I don't see anyone that would be starting on a good Power 4 team. This is not Becky's fault, nor is the putrid OOC schedule a negative - regardless of how much she actually had to do with it and how much was left over from the prior staff.

I am hopeful of success going forward (certainly next year will be an improvement) but I am cautious. Becky needs to prove that she can coach at this level.

There are also a few things that I am slightly displeased with, although I'm sure no one else cares. In 30 years of following WBB she is the first coach I remember taking "center stage" as players are introduced - with many coaches ignoring it and others standing along the side and getting a fist bump. I don't begrudge "sleeves up" but I resent being expected to chant it - Adia never made fans chant "Made for It". Bear Down as a tradition stands on its own. And I liked banging the drum - I gather football took the drum once the women didn't want it. It was cool. And not her fault, but I don't like the head coach being announced when they walk out, although I know the men do it too. For all my years at Rutgers games, before we moved, C. Vivian Stringer was never announced - but often got a standing ovation as she walked out. Earned. Naismith Hall of Fame. But all of this is just me.
Interesting. Texas has always announced the head coach at the end of the player intros. The coach is generally standing near the team bench going about their business.
It’s tough for me being an old fan sometimes. Each new coach and each new AD changes things. I sigh and hope the younger fans like the way things are. I once went years without missing a home game. I still support the team. But it takes less and less for me to decide to stay home and watch on television. I love that Texas can now get 10,000 plus fans for a big weekend game with no gimmicks.
 
Thx for the analysis. If ACC materializes in the way you anticipate that would be very helpful for ASU particularly we beat BYU and don't get destroyed by Texas Tech.

I'm wondering how the committee would look at a 25 win ASU team with no quad one wins versus Richmond.

This is a great time of year. While I love the Huskies there's zero uncertainty until late March. For many or most of us this is the time of year of peak anxiety and anticipation

I'm really looking forward to tournament week. I've already decided that next year I'll be going to Kansas City Kansas City here I come. This will be the last year the Mountain West exists in its current configuration and I'm not anticipating a huge leap by Grand Canyon.

A fellow fan said that there's an excellent hotel very near the arena where the big 12 is played in KC so I'm going to save my nipples and dimes over the next year in the hope that ASU keeps rolling
We will go one of these years, when Arizona improves, most likely. We used to go to the Big East Tournament for years when we were following Rutgers, usually in Connecticut.

We saw a Holiday Inn of some sort near the arena (we typically stay in Holiday Inns, usually Expresses), but I'm sure there are others. During one of our visits to KC (we have been twice) we stayed in the Marriott Downtown (we had some free nights) and it was very, very nice. But not right by the arena.
 
Thx for the analysis. If ACC materializes in the way you anticipate that would be very helpful for ASU particularly we beat BYU and don't get destroyed by Texas Tech.

I'm wondering how the committee would look at a 25 win ASU team with no quad one wins versus Richmond.

This is a great time of year. While I love the Huskies there's zero uncertainty until late March. For many or most of us this is the time of year of peak anxiety and anticipation

I'm really looking forward to tournament week. I've already decided that next year I'll be going to Kansas City Kansas City here I come. This will be the last year the Mountain West exists in its current configuration and I'm not anticipating a huge leap by Grand Canyon.

A fellow fan said that there's an excellent hotel very near the arena where the big 12 is played in KC so I'm going to save my nipples and dimes over the next year in the hope that ASU keeps rolling
No problem!

Right now, I think that seven ACC teams are either in or are in decent enough shape to feel good about themselves for now. That leaves Clemson and UVA either duking it out for one spot or trying to hold off a surging Cal (or a B12 team). Both can be in right now despite their warts, but it really looks like they've both got work to do to make it. Clemson's not going to beat Duke, so they have to sweep the Cali schools (only four teams have done that in the two years that the ACC has expanded to California). I can't see that happening because Cal is making a late charge for an at-large bid and has to win out to have a shot (they don't have any Q1 opportunities, so that may be tricky). And UVA probably has to beat UNC (for a Q1) AND Virginia Tech (a Q2, but it would keep VT from collecting a Q1 and completing the sweep) to get in. They're not going to beat Louisville, so we don't even have to entertain that.

I say all that to say that Arizona State should be in good shape coming down the stretch here because Clemson, UVA, and Cal are not all going to make it. Winning out would clench it for your Sun Devils, but 10-8 with a Big 12 tourney win might be enough.

Have fun at the tourney!

EDIT: Whoops--UVA beat Louisville!!!!!!!
 
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BYU got the sweep of Utah. Utes continuing their late season swoon and have probably played themselves out of Tourney consideration.

Arizona St. crushed Houston.
 
Kansas St. with a puzzling home loss to Kansas today. KU has climbed up into the utter mediocrity in the middle of the conference.
 
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Kansas St. with a puzzling home loss to Kansas today. KU has climbed up into the utter mediocrity in the middle of the conference.
Why was the loss so puzzling? Kansas has the better overall record and had already beaten Kansas St. by 22 points last month.
 
Why was the loss so puzzling? Kansas has the better overall record and had already beaten Kansas St. by 22 points last month.
A lot of oddities in the Big12.

Kansas and Cincinatti winning some surprising games.

BYU and Utah frightenly inconsistent. Even add Oklahoma St to that list.

Texas Tech turning into pretender down the stretch...but still a nice season.

ASU also a nice season under new coach Miller.
 
Why was the loss so puzzling? Kansas has the better overall record and had already beaten Kansas St. by 22 points last month.
K State had a better conference record. I didn't remember the previous lop sided score between them.
 
Watching Colorado and Utah. Pregame, at the quarter break, and now at halftime they're talking about the postseason prospects for these two teams.

I'm sitting here having watched ASU beat both of these teams and in fact swept Utah. To me it's inconceivable that ASU is not in the conversation. The announcers are talking about quad 1 wins.... Colorado has one and Utah has two. I can't help but thinking ASU has beaten these two teams that have quad one wins.

And while this incessant statistical focus on quad one continues I'm still bedeviled by the fact that a 10 conference loss Mississippi State team gets to dance while a 10 win ASU team doesn't.

This time of year is exquisitely, agonizingly tremendous.

Oh, and down in the dirty t looks like the kitties are going to be able to defend their home court against bottom feeder Houston.
 
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Utah beat Colorado on the road. That figures in this crazy Big 12 season. Always expect the thing you don't expect to happen.
 
Watching Colorado and Utah. Pregame, at the quarter break, and now at halftime they're talking about the postseason prospects for these two teams.

I'm sitting here having watched ASU beat both of these teams and in fact swept Utah. To me it's inconceivable that ASU is not in the conversation. The announcers are talking about quad 1 wins.... Colorado has one and Utah has two. I can't help but thinking ASU has beaten these two teams that have quad one wins.

And while this incessant statistical focus on quad one continues I'm still bedeviled by the fact that a 10 conference loss Mississippi State team gets to dance while a 10 win ASU team doesn't.

This time of year is exquisitely, agonizingly tremendous.

Oh, and down in the dirty t looks like the kitties are going to be able to defend their home court against bottom feeder Houston.
The first half of the Arizona / Houston game was the worst 2 quarters of basketball I have watched in a very long time. Years ago a very elderly ex-coach was hosting (i.e. serving as a local contact for one of the teams participating in an in-season tourney) and commented about the team that "they are nice girls that don't play basketball very good". That described both teams in the first half of the game.

As I have said, Arizona always plays hard and has some individual scoring talent. Teams took and largely hit a lot of free throws, that was a good thing. I think there were somewhere around 8 video reviews which didn't help make the game pleasant.

Incidentally, FWIW, Houston's new coach this season is former Kentucky head guy Mathew Mitchell. I had forgotten, but he retired in 2020 due to on-going issues from a concussion suffered in an accident. He is only in his 50's.
 
The first half of the Arizona / Houston game was the worst 2 quarters of basketball I have watched in a very long time. Years ago a very elderly ex-coach was hosting (i.e. serving as a local contact for one of the teams participating in an in-season tourney) and commented about the team that "they are nice girls that don't play basketball very good". That described both teams in the first half of the game.

As I have said, Arizona always plays hard and has some individual scoring talent. Teams took and largely hit a lot of free throws, that was a good thing. I think there were somewhere around 8 video reviews which didn't help make the game pleasant.

Incidentally, FWIW, Houston's new coach this season is former Kentucky head guy Mathew Mitchell. I had forgotten, but he retired in 2020 due to on-going issues from a concussion suffered in an accident. He is only in his 50's.

Bad hoops would be what to expect with Arizona, UFC and Houston. At least Cincy, the other member of the bottom four, has some players that can make games spirited although they can't seem to avoid a million bad turnovers each game.
 
Colorado gave Utah, which looked to be dead in the water after a disastrous late-season swoon, another Q1 win.
 
Oy ... With the q1 wins. ASU swept Utah and beat Colorado. It's increasingly apparent that the Sun Devils barring big wins over Tech and a deep run in the tournament will be left out of the big dance.

The Nebraska win over Washington I think sealed the deal. (Talk about mixed emotions)

Tonight is senior night in Tempe. The graduating transfers Gabby Elliott, Last Tear POA, and Marley W have been impressive. I'm really on pins and needles both for the emotion of the game and more importantly the absolute requirement to beat BYU.

With a victory over BYU ASU will move to 23 victories and 10 wins in conference. Looking back I think the loss on the road to Cincinnati is the killer. The Devils played the best first quarter of the entire season and then Cincinnati came roaring back to win that game.

I know I know the dreaded q1. One would think you would get a little credit for beating these q1 winners but had things turned out differently in Baylor or if somehow we can go on the road and beat Texas Tech to end the season.....
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Watching Colorado and Utah. Pregame, at the quarter break, and now at halftime they're talking about the postseason prospects for these two teams.

I'm sitting here having watched ASU beat both of these teams and in fact swept Utah. To me it's inconceivable that ASU is not in the conversation. The announcers are talking about quad 1 wins.... Colorado has one and Utah has two. I can't help but thinking ASU has beaten these two teams that have quad one wins.
This is the frustration that ACC and Big 12 teams face. Can anyone say, with certainty, that Arizona State, Oklahoma State, Colorado, and Utah or Clemson, Virginia Tech, Syracuse, and UVA are noticeably worse than Illinois, Oregon, Washington, and Nebraska? No, they can't say that. If they say that they can, they're lying. We have metrics that people refuse to use because either they don't fully understand them, don't know how the committee will interpret them, or want to push a narrative.

Also, the sensationalism generated around a single "big win" has to stop. I still remember when Mississippi State beat LSU (the defending champs) and everyone and their mamas thought that they'd sealed their tournament fate (that they were in no matter what). They made the WBIT, largely because they slumped hard after that one data point. Colorado's win over Texas Tech on Saturday was nice, but now we see a Q2 loss to a reeling Utah team. So they're still on the bubble because they negated a nice Q2 win over TT with that mess against Utah. The Clemson (Duke) and Virginia (@ Louisville) wins are the talk of the town right now, but they won't mean much if those teams don't win out (and I would be surprised if Clemson wins out because they're making their California trip, and only four teams in two seasons have swept the California teams in California: UNC last year and Duke, Louisville, and Virginia Tech this year).
 
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