2022 Giants Thread

[CardiacAndre7]

So your one of those that was starving to see the Giants lose so you could go Jones bashing.

Yep, that’s exactly my mindset

 

[mauconnfan]

Miss throw on a similar ball to Breida, both overthrows.

I never said he was the only reason. He just doesn’t really have the ability to win a game himself like good QBs must have

Breida wasn’t open that’s a huge stretch. No QB could win with this group of WRs please he is the furthest thing from the issue.

6-2 and he’s a big reason we are. Barkley is too and he wasn’t very good today either. But much like Jones you can’t blame him, they didn’t control the line. So much more to today’s disappointment than these 2.

 

[CardiacAndre7]

Breida wasn’t open that’s a huge stretch. No QB could win with this group of WRs please he is the furthest thing from the issue.

6-2 and he’s a big reason we are. Barkley is too and he wasn’t very good today either. But much like Jones you can’t blame him, they didn’t control the line. So much more to today’s disappointment than these 2.

Breida certainly was open.

Maybe I am a bit too hard on Jones, i’m just nearly certain he isn’t the QB of the future. But you also give him too much of a pass.

 

[mauconnfan]

Breida certainly was open.

Maybe I am a bit too hard on Jones, i’m just nearly certain he isn’t the QB of the future. But you also give him too much of a pass.

Agree to disagree.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

Personally I've always been of the belief that you shouldn't believe that a QB is a franchise QB or 'the guy' who could be the difference between a decent team and a legitimate playoff threat until he proves it. On that end, the jury is still out on Jones as there is no way he, or anyone else could have demonstrated much of anything with what he's had around him for the past three plus years.

One thing I don't want to see is the Giants reaching for a QB in the draft, hoping he turns into something. Too many teams have spent years, in some cases decades doing this, getting nowhere in that time (look at 75% of the league over the past couple of decades).

Another thing I don't want to see, if we do sign Jones for 2023 (and beyond) is a contract that lasts more than a couple of years and a cap hit that would leave any real dead money if and when we decide to move on. I've read estimates of what his current play should earn him (some claim $20 million per, others $25 million per) and my first reaction is we should then let him walk. I don't want to see a cap hit higher than maybe (and this is still maybe) $15 million and I want to be able to get out of it in two years with almost no dead money.

I would really like the chance to see what he could do with a competent (across the board) offensive line and actual weapons at receiver. I don't think that could happen here as too much time was wasted by horrible management prior to this season. All we can do is enjoy what the remainder of this season gives us as it's already been far better than what we should have reasonably expected.

 

[Edward Sargent]

Breida certainly was open.

Maybe I am a bit too hard on Jones, i’m just nearly certain he isn’t the QB of the future. But you also give him too much of a pass.

Jones wasn't good, Barkley wasn't good, the O line wasn't good the WRs were terrible and the defense was on the field too long and tired by the second half maybe accounting for missed tackles and blown coverage. Finally the scouting and play calling was way off the mark. Run defense was supposed to be Seattle's Achilles heel and it certainly wasn't. So with all that said to single out Jones is a bit too hard.

 

[Hankster]

Again not on Jones with that play calling. And they have zero receivers getting open he’s throwing bullets just to complete passes with defenders draped on our guys. No one ever open.

Make the move for a play maker please.

I agree. Not sure if I heard Slayton's name at all second half. I know the score, however I think the defense played very good until the turnovers. They looked tired. Never really had a chance to catch a breath. Also, running Barkley up the middle?. Not sure about that. Well blue has a bye. Figure something out.

 

[Edward Sargent]

I agree. Not sure if I heard Slayton's name at all second half. I know the score, however I think the defense played very good until the turnovers. They looked tired. Never really had a chance to catch a breath. Also, running Barkley up the middle?. Not sure about that. Well blue has a bye. Figure something out.

It started in the first half early those three 3 and outs were followed by a 15 play touchdown drive. D never go a break

 

[Hankster]

Personally I've always been of the belief that you shouldn't believe that a QB is a franchise QB or 'the guy' who could be the difference between a decent team and a legitimate playoff threat until he proves it. On that end, the jury is still out on Jones as there is no way he, or anyone else could have demonstrated much of anything with what he's had around him for the past three plus years.

One thing I don't want to see is the Giants reaching for a QB in the draft, hoping he turns into something. Too many teams have spent years, in some cases decades doing this, getting nowhere in that time (look at 75% of the league over the past couple of decades).

Another thing I don't want to see, if we do sign Jones for 2023 (and beyond) is a contract that lasts more than a couple of years and a cap hit that would leave any real dead money if and when we decide to move on. I've read estimates of what his current play should earn him (some claim $20 million per, others $25 million per) and my first reaction is we should then let him walk. I don't want to see a cap hit higher than maybe (and this is still maybe) $15 million and I want to be able to get out of it in two years with almost no dead money.

I would really like the chance to see what he could do with a competent (across the board) offensive line and actual weapons at receiver. I don't think that could happen here as too much time was wasted by horrible management prior to this season. All we can do is enjoy what the remainder of this season gives us as it's already been far better than what we should have reasonably expected.

Manning super bowl years had everything. Backfield receiver's and a murderous defense. He was blessed. Look what happened a couple years after up until he retired. Maybe Danny is starting where Manning left off. Only way is up. It was a bad game. Let's move on.

 

[navery12]

Personally I've always been of the belief that you shouldn't believe that a QB is a franchise QB or 'the guy' who could be the difference between a decent team and a legitimate playoff threat until he proves it. On that end, the jury is still out on Jones as there is no way he, or anyone else could have demonstrated much of anything with what he's had around him for the past three plus years.

One thing I don't want to see is the Giants reaching for a QB in the draft, hoping he turns into something. Too many teams have spent years, in some cases decades doing this, getting nowhere in that time (look at 75% of the league over the past couple of decades).

Another thing I don't want to see, if we do sign Jones for 2023 (and beyond) is a contract that lasts more than a couple of years and a cap hit that would leave any real dead money if and when we decide to move on. I've read estimates of what his current play should earn him (some claim $20 million per, others $25 million per) and my first reaction is we should then let him walk. I don't want to see a cap hit higher than maybe (and this is still maybe) $15 million and I want to be able to get out of it in two years with almost no dead money.

I would really like the chance to see what he could do with a competent (across the board) offensive line and actual weapons at receiver. I don't think that could happen here as too much time was wasted by horrible management prior to this season. All we can do is enjoy what the remainder of this season gives us as it's already been far better than what we should have reasonably expected.

You're living in a fantasy world with these hopes. If every team was able to sign good QBs for cheap $15M short term contracts with no dead cap and easy outs they'd be doing it. That's just not how the real world works

 

[FfldCntyFan]

You're living in a fantasy world with these hopes. If every team was able to sign good QBs for cheap $15M short term contracts with no dead cap and easy outs they'd be doing it. That's just not how the real world works

Maybe I am. I personally believe that I am more in favor of Jones than most. I also believe that at this point the Giants shouldn't sign him if he costs much more than what I proposed. If he has another handful of game winning drives this season my stance will change dramatically. For now I see too many holes to fill throughout the roster to commit anything more than what I proposed for a "maybe he can turn into the guy" at QB.

 

[navery12]

Maybe I am. I personally believe that I am more in favor of Jones than most. I also believe that at this point the Giants shouldn't sign him if he costs much more than what I proposed. If he has another handful of game winning drives this season my stance will change dramatically. For now I see too many holes to fill throughout the roster to commit anything more than what I proposed for a "maybe he can turn into the guy" at QB.

Yeah I agree in that I wouldn't go above $20-25M for him a year over 3 years. All I'm saying is if you do let Daniel Jones walk I don't think you're getting a better QB than him AND paying him less on a short term deal with no dead cap and no high draft capital committed. Might be able to check off 1 or 2 boxes but all is a lot to ask

 

[FfldCntyFan]

Yeah I agree in that I wouldn't go above $20-25M for him a year over 3 years. All I'm saying is if you do let Daniel Jones walk I don't think you're getting a better QB than him AND paying him less on a short term deal with no dead cap and no high draft capital committed. Might be able to check off 1 or 2 boxes but all is a lot to ask

Fair enough. While I do like Jones I don't think it makes a lot of sense (with what limited success we've seen) to commit all that much to him right now. Going over $20 million a year could prevent us from resigning a player at the end of his rookie deal or bringing in a piece that would be very valuable.

It is very possible that Jones (with a better cast around him) could be a bargain at $20-$25 million a year. At the moment it is still a huge gamble to think that way and we aren't in a position where a gamble like that couldn't set us back a few years.

 

[mauconnfan]

Fair enough. While I do like Jones I don't think it makes a lot of sense (with what limited success we've seen) to commit all that much to him right now. Going over $20 million a year could prevent us from resigning a player at the end of his rookie deal or bringing in a piece that would be very valuable.

It is very possible that Jones (with a better cast around him) could be a bargain at $20-$25 million a year. At the moment it is still a huge gamble to think that way and we aren't in a position where a gamble like that couldn't set us back a few years.

I'm a Jones guy but only to a point as well. They can get him for a small contract with a solid but no too high number which won't prohibit other moves required, then do it. But he still has a lot to prove, just give him some weapons to prove it. Barkley sucked yesterday too according to the way that game played out and we know he doesn't. Thing is if they can only throw passes for 5-8 yards all day then let's be sure Saquon doesn't kill us. We made it way too easy for Carroll to defend.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Fair enough. While I do like Jones I don't think it makes a lot of sense (with what limited success we've seen) to commit all that much to him right now. Going over $20 million a year could prevent us from resigning a player at the end of his rookie deal or bringing in a piece that would be very valuable.

It is very possible that Jones (with a better cast around him) could be a bargain at $20-$25 million a year. At the moment it is still a huge gamble to think that way and we aren't in a position where a gamble like that couldn't set us back a few years.

QB Pay decisions are tricky. Some of them really are worth it. But the difference between the guys at Jones' level and the guys below him, is less than the difference between Jones and Josh Allen or Pat Mahomes. I'd say Prescott, Tannehill, Carr, Wentz, Ryan, Wilson, Goff... are all overpaid and handicap those teams. In 2023 his whole draft class are FAs, Lamar, Darnold, Baker Mayfield, plus, Bridgewater, Garoppolo, Flacco. Geno Smith makes $3.5M. I don't think Jones is $15M better than some of these guys that will make $10M or less. It will be interesting to see what the Giants do. At $18-20 a year, I'd sign him.

Quarterback Contracts and Salaries | Over The Cap

Ranking the top NFL Quarterback contracts and salaries in the NFL

overthecap.com

 

[HeGotGame]

Maybe I am. I personally believe that I am more in favor of Jones than most. I also believe that at this point the Giants shouldn't sign him if he costs much more than what I proposed. If he has another handful of game winning drives this season my stance will change dramatically. For now I see too many holes to fill throughout the roster to commit anything more than what I proposed for a "maybe he can turn into the guy" at QB.

Ok, then paint the picture for a new and better QB..........

The Jones slander is ridiculous this year, He is 6-2 with the worst WR core in the league and a bad oline. Guy wasn't great yesterday, but his WRs, TE's and oline did him no favors. Ezudu giving 6 pressures up the middle is colossally bad. First time he hasn't lead a game winning drive in 4 weeks and guys like @CardiacAndre7 can't wait to come in and dump on him while neglecting the situation around him and the performance of the rest of the team.

 

[CardiacAndre7]

Ok, then paint the picture for a new and better QB..........

The Jones slander is ridiculous this year, He is 6-2 with the worst WR core in the league and a bad oline. Guy wasn't great yesterday, but his WRs, TE's and oline did him no favors. Ezudu giving 6 pressures up the middle is colossally bad. First time he hasn't lead a game winning drive in 4 weeks and guys like @CardiacAndre7 can't wait to come in and dump on him while neglecting the situation around him and the performance of the rest of the team.

Because I know he isn’t the QB of the future. He’s managed the game well and cut down on turnovers, but he doesn’t impress really other than his legs.

Yes, WRs suck. But 16 games with less than 250 pass yards in a row, probably more than half with less than 200. At some point you would expect to hit that mark. It’s crazy that he hasn’t.

 

[HeGotGame]

Because I know he isn’t the QB of the future. He’s managed the game well and cut down on turnovers, but he doesn’t impress really other than his legs.

Yes, WRs suck. But 16 games with less than 250 pass yards in a row, probably more than half with less than 200. At some point you would expect to hit that mark. It’s crazy that he hasn’t.

Your stat is wrong, if you are gonna repeat a meaningless stat to dump on the guy who has the team at 6-2 at least get it right.

You were awfully quite on that winning streak, let just hope he can keep winning and you can stay under the bridge looking for other meaningless and wrong stats to pop out with the next time they lose.

 

[CardiacAndre7]

Your stat is wrong, if you are gonna repeat a meaningless stat to dump on the guy who has the team at 6-2 at least get it right.

You were awfully quite on that winning streak, let just hope he can keep winning and you can stay under the bridge looking for other meaningless and wrong stats to pop out with the next time they lose.

Oh okay, 15* games, my bad. And I posted a few times how he was playing well during the streak, so don’t try that.

You can think what you want my man. This is year 4 and it’s a passing league. Time is running out

 

[Hankster]

Again not on Jones with that play calling. And they have zero receivers getting open he’s throwing bullets just to complete passes with defenders draped on our guys. No one ever open.

Make the move for a play maker please.

Not only did the receiver's not get open, he actually doesn't have any. Slayton started off great. Then adjustments at half time by Seattle fixed that. I miss our tight end.

 

[Hankster]

I'm a Jones guy but only to a point as well. They can get him for a small contract with a solid but no too high number which won't prohibit other moves required, then do it. But he still has a lot to prove, just give him some weapons to prove it. Barkley sucked yesterday too according to the way that game played out and we know he doesn't. Thing is if they can only throw passes for 5-8 yards all day then let's be sure Saquon doesn't kill us. We made it way too easy for Carroll to defend.

Correct if i am wrong, Barkley did not get a touch the first and second series? It is a very easy scouting report on the plays for Barkley. Seattle game not counted, but Barkley always gets the ball on very first play. Gets racked up. Teams know when he is getting the ball. You don't get stuffed at the line of scrimmage 12 times a game with the defense not knowing when he gets the ball. Help me here. What is the offensive formation called when Barkley is in the QB position? Seems he has better view and I believe it was more successful than not.

 

[Edward Sargent]

Correct if i am wrong, Barkley did not get a touch the first and second series? It is a very easy scouting report on the plays for Barkley. Seattle game not counted, but Barkley always gets the ball on very first play. Gets racked up. Teams know when he is getting the ball. You don't get stuffed at the line of scrimmage 12 times a game with the defense not knowing when he gets the ball. Help me here. What is the offensive formation called when Barkley is in the QB position? Seems he has better view and I believe it was more successful than not.

Its called a wildcat formation I think and the Giants tried it with a direct snap to Barkley and were called for a false start. It seemed to me that Seattle D planned for Barkley's cut backs and also had someone shadowing Jones

 

[HeGotGame]

Oh okay, 15* games, my bad. And I posted a few times how he was playing well during the streak, so don’t try that.

You can think what you want my man. This is year 4 and it’s a passing league. Time is running out

Here is an actual stat that matters. He is 10-6 over the last 16 games with half of those coming with horrendous coaching and all of it with no WRs or Oline.

And no, you posted once "DJ was solid today", that is it, everything else is constant dumping on him while you wish wash on the oline and complain about the WRs. Hmmmm, interesting.

It is fine, you do this on bball board. UConn loses it is always Hurley's fault. Clearly there is a major lack of critical thinking. Stick with your narratives that are easy and simple for you.

 

[Edward Sargent]

No Giants so I am forced to watch GB and Lions. My takeaway from the announcers is GBs lack of experienced WRs is wasting Rodgers HoF talent! So I ask are our lack of experienced WRs wasting Jones' potential HoF talent? I cannot stomach Rodgers as it is always someone else's fault when things go wrong.

 

[Scoe]

No Giants so I am forced to watch GB and Lions. My takeaway from the announcers is GBs lack of experienced WRs is wasting Rodgers HoF talent! So I ask are our lack of experienced WRs wasting Jones' potential HoF talent? I cannot stomach Rodgers as it is always someone else's fault when things go wrong.

But but but, Rodgers did have 291 passing yards, that’s all that matters right passing yards are everything according Ffld. Jones would love to have Rodgers receivers.