Who actually brings value

[Yawkey Way]

the Women's program has more demand than probably 25 Power 5 Football programs easy.[/QUOTE]

Doubt it. Nothing against Uconn's fine basketball program, but the comment that Women's Basketball, even Uconn's Women basketball, has " more demand " nationally than " 25 P5 football programs " is rather silly. Women's College Basketball has a comparatively small, niche audience, and of mostly regional interest. I'm in Florida, and the Women's College Basketball game TV ratings in the large state of Florida, even when Uconn is on, are rather dismal... they are abysmal numbers as a matter of fact. But I can only speak for the level of sports fans interest in Women's College Basketball games watching on TV in the state of Florida. Perhaps its much better in most other national regions, who knows, but I sort of doubt it.

 

[kingdobbs]

If the data shows that ESPN is getting " 2-3 times the amount of money in returns that they pay in advertising costs for games featuring Uconn football " then Uconn is probably being screwed over, as the OP is claiming. Uconn officials need to renegotiate such a future relationship with ESPN then... as Uconn football can not long sustain such intentional network revenue stream " screwing overs ", once the exit fees are gone to the school. I don't pretend to know what the answer is here, but picking a fight with one of the biggest Corporations in Connecticut.. one that will have the TVmicrophones to give their side of the story to the public in any battle between Uconn and ESPN... may still be the best course of action for Uconn. Uconn has lots of value and influence ( we're told ) so Uconn should be able to marshal legal and public taxpayor outcries among its residents if it feels its football program is being harmed by ESPN intentionally, and Uconn football is not getting the revenues it believes its entitled too from the telecast of its football games.

It's not just football that's getting screwed. It's basketball, men's and women's.

The math is pretty simple: UConns yearly share of the AAC contact is 1.5M or so. If a UConn game (FB, MBB, WBB) is being broadcast twenty times per year, ESPN is giving us 75k per game (and top of that, ESPN is getting a payout every time CBS Sports picks up a game through their suc license agreement).

SNY, just a scant few years ago, was willing to pay us a similar amount JUST for the women's basketball games ESPN wouldn't broadcast. JUST the women's basketball games.

 

[Yawkey Way]

It's not

SNY, just a scant few years ago, was willing to pay us a similar amount JUST for the women's basketball games ESPN wouldn't broadcast. JUST the women's basketball games.

Why didn't Uconn sign on for that deal with SNY to have SNY broadcast all the Uconn Women's Basketball Games ? Just curious, as I don't see why Uconn could not negotiate such a plush deal for themselves. If Women's basketball is so attractive in the marketplace, then Uconn could simply adopt their own ND model and negotiate their own separate Uconn Women's Basketball contract with ( say ) SNY. ESPN be damned. ND did this. Texas did. So... whats stopping them ? Lots of football schools have a few of their football games picked up by the national networks, and then the locals ( SNY, NESN ) decide if its worth it to them and their advertisers to pick up the remaining games locally or not. If Uconn Women's Basketball was such a lucrative hot commodity, SNY would have all of their non national telecasted games on SNY, and each year too. So why isn't every non ESPN nationally televised Uconn Women's Basketball game on TV every year now with ( for example ) SNY ?

 

[HoopsFan21]

Why didn't Uconn sign on for that deal with SNY to have SNY broadcast all the Uconn Women's Basketball Games ? Just curious, as I don't see why Uconn could not negotiate such a plush deal for themselves. If Women's basketball is so attractive in the marketplace, then Uconn could simply adopt their own ND model and negotiate their own separate Uconn Women's Basketball contract with ( say ) SNY. ESPN be damned. ND did this. Texas did. So... whats stopping them ? Lots of football schools have a few of their football games picked up by the national networks, and then the locals ( SNY, NESN ) decide if its worth it to them and their advertisers to pick up the remaining games locally or not. If Uconn Women's Basketball was such a lucrative hot commodity, SNY would have all of their non national telecasted games on SNY, and each year too. So why isn't every Uconn Women's Basketball game on TV with ( say ) SNY ?

UConn did do that, but any such benefit was lost as soon as the AAC contract with ESPN was signed and UConn lost all of its rights and any money earned on side deals like the one struck with SNY. You should go back and read the first post of this thread for a little background and how we got to where we are.

 

[Glastonhusky]

Fishy 's analysis looks like a good exhibit in an antitrust lawsuit.

As this CR nightmare drags on, I'm becoming more and more convinced that the only solution just might be a lawsuit. I know it didn't work out too well for us last time, but there's no way that the P5 cartel's stranglehold on college sports is legal. In no other aspect of society would this type of monopoly be tolerated. If I started my own insurance company and The Hartford and Travelers got together and said sorry, but you can't sell your products in states where we do business, how long would it take for a judge to decide in my favor? I see no difference with the P5 cartel.

 

[Glastonhusky]

Fishy 's analysis looks like a good exhibit in an antitrust lawsuit.

As this CR nightmare drags on, I'm becoming more and more convinced that the only solution just might be a lawsuit. I know it didn't work out too well for us last time, but there's no way that the P5 cartel's stranglehold on college sports is legal. In no other aspect of society would this type of monopoly be tolerated. If I started my own insurance company and The Hartford and Travelers got together and said sorry, but you can't sell your products in states where we do business, how long would it take for a judge to decide in my favor? I see no difference with the P5 cartel.

 

[upstater]

But who argues that? No one on this thread surely.

At any rate, you all got it right that UConn is subsidizing other programs, you just are focusing on the wrong ones. Just as it would be weird to hear a Carolina fan lament they are subsidizing Vanderbilt given the disparity in network exposure when Wake is the one tied contractually to them. Wake is benefitting from Carolina. Vandy is benefitting from Alabama, that's their problem. You all have Tulsa you are propping up. If you want to get mad, get mad at them or the AAC or someone UConn is actually contracted with. UConn and Wake's relationship is basically non-existent.

Your math is a total failure. The money made by ESPN far exceeds the conference payout. This is the entire point of this thread. It's right in the OPs post.

 

[upstater]

Except that is exactly what the conference as a whole is worth since no network was willing to bid more than that to show their games. It's seems to me that UConn needed the AAC for football, and was willing to accept total membership in the conference as the price.

In any case I understand your angst.

That's not even the point. The point is that ESPN is ripping us off, and they are using the money to subsidize others.

 

[Yawkey Way]

UConn did do that, but any such benefit was lost as soon as the AAC contract with ESPN was signed and UConn lost all of its rights and any money earned on side deals like the one struck with SNY. .

Everything is negotiable. I'm sure you've heard this. If Uconn gave up a potentially lucrative Women's Basketball contract with SNY, as part of their initial agreement contract negotiation with AAC/ ESPN, then thats that, and it would appear then that there can be no more complaining about the " value of the Uconn's Women's Basketball program bring screwed over as well ". Uconn made that choice, and so its really only the football team thats being" screwed over", as Uconn did apparently freely acquiese to giving up their negotiating rights with SNY ( or NESN ) on behalf of their Women's Basketball program, it would appear in their AAC/ ESPN negotiations.

 

[upstater]

You have any ratings to back that up? I find your assertion hard to believe without numbers and if your assertion is correct then Uconn should become an independent just for WBB.

The women did a .7 and .8 rating multiple times last year. Against teams like South Carolina and Baylor, they pulled decent numbers. These are not world-beating numbers, though the finals are great (5 ratings in NYC). I don't think Pudge's assumption is off at all. You'll find a lot of P5 football games below that. As a matter of fact, this week's Primetime Saturday night at 8 pm game pulled a .5. UConn women beat that number multiple times last year.

 

[upstater]

Again, for our visitors, (and I don't know why this is so difficult), ESPN pays the conference $19.8m a year (1.8m x 11). UConn alone brings in close to that.

This is what we are talking about. UConn's profits are then redistributed elsewhere by ESPN in order to keep a hold on its in-house branded conference (ACC).

 

[lne001]

You assume a "cliche" Women's game.

That simply is not what UConn WBB had been. It's not ESPN3 ... It's prime time. Prime network. Holidays as the premier match. I'm sorry that you are ignorant & some kind of WBB hating gnome ... but the Women's program has more demand than probably 25 Power 5 Football programs easy.

Prime time is one or two games a year on the national networks. Weeknights is not prime time. As far as ignorant, I'll bet you right now that I have watched more basketball in total, including UConn women's games, than you. And finally, you are so far off your rocker with your last sentence I'll let you slide into the abyss.

 

[Yawkey Way]

The women did a .7 and .8 rating multiple times last year. Against teams like South Carolina and Baylor, they pulled decent numbers. These are not world-beating numbers, though the finals are great (5 ratings in NYC). I don't think Pudge's assumption is off at all. You'll find a lot of P5 football games below that. As a matter of fact, this week's Primetime Saturday night at 8 pm game pulled a .5. UConn women beat that number multiple times last year.

You have to compare apples to apples however. If we take some of the P5 football games matchups with uasppealing or mediocre opponents, that would be relative then to matching that up with Uconn's Women's Basketball games ratings with an inferior or unattractive opponent TV game ratings as well. As such, a BC- Uconn football game ( both suck in football ) would still outdraw in TV ratings a Uconn- BC Women's Basketball game TV rating, where only BC sucks in that sport, but Uconn is in a class by itself in the college sport. Uconn Women's basketball does no better on the West Coast for example with its TV ratings there for a game with a non west school, than a Uconn football game thats televised there does on the West Coast for a non west school's team.

 

[auror]

Again, for our visitors, (and I don't know why this is so difficult), ESPN pays the conference $19.8m a year (1.8m x 11). UConn alone brings in close to that.

This is what we are talking about. UConn's profits are then redistributed elsewhere by ESPN in order to keep a hold on its in-house branded conference (ACC).

How do you know the ACC deal isn't profitable to ESPN by itself? As one of the only bidders in the marketplace, they have most of the leverage in these deals.

 

[upstater]

Prime time is one or two games a year on the national networks. Weeknights is not prime time. As far as ignorant, I'll bet you right now that I have watched more basketball in total, including UConn women's games, than you. And finally, you are so far off your rocker with your last sentence I'll let you slide into the abyss.

You don't know what you are talking about. Pudge is right.

 

[upstater]

How do you know the ACC deal isn't profitable to ESPN by itself? As one of the only bidders in the marketplace, they have most of the leverage in these deals.

Because they just bid against themselves. They just raised up the ACC when they were in the middle of a long-term contract. What they are now doing to the B12 is exactly what they did to the Big East. They will grab up valuable properties, for which they will pay over--and they'll make out in the end because they will then pay a bunch of others less than what they are worth. They screamed at the pro-rata clauses in the B12 contract for precisely this reason.

 

[Fishy]

Some people are too dumb or too impressed with their own thoughts so they can't follow a simple directive.

This thread is now presented without interruption from the Beantown pinhead.

 

[lne001]

Your math is a total failure. The money made by ESPN far exceeds the conference payout. This is the entire point of this thread. It's right in the OPs post.

Really? How much money did ESPN 'make' off UConn, then, in dollars? I'm afraid I don't see it in the OP. Don't worry about answering that question, however, because you can't.

 

[auror]

How do you know the ACC deal isn't profitable to ESPN by itself? As one of the only bidders in the marketplace, they have most of the leverage in these deals.

Because they just bid against themselves. They just raised up the ACC when they were in the middle of a long-term contract. What they are now doing to the B12 is exactly what they did to the Big East. They will grab up valuable properties, for which they will pay over--and they'll make out in the end because they will then pay a bunch of others less than what they are worth. They screamed at the pro-rata clauses in the B12 contract for precisely this reason.

The ACCs contract is apparently flat for the extended term, they did not escalate the value. Also, being willing to extend the contract seems to suggest it was profitable for them.

 

[upstater]

You have to compare apples to apples however. If we take some of the P5 football games matchups with uasppealing or mediocre opponents, that would be relative then to matching that up with Uconn's Women's Basketball games ratings with an inferior or unattractive opponent TV game ratings as well. As such, a BC- Uconn football game ( both suck in football ) would still outdraw in TV ratings a Uconn- BC Women's Basketball game TV rating, where only BC sucks in that sport, but Uconn is in a class by itself in the college sport. Uconn Women's basketball does no better on the West Coast for example with its TV ratings there for a game with a non west school, than a Uconn football game thats televised there does on the West Coast for a non west school's team.

I have no idea you are trying to say, but if you are arguing that watching the #5 college football team in the country play a game over broadcast TV on a Saturday night is less appealing than watching the UConn women, I'll say many more people agree with you than disagree. Look at the ratings of top 25 teams this year. Pudge was not wrong. Several games this past weekend were well over the women's threshold, but most of them weren't. Not USC-Arizona, not FSU-WF, not West Va.-Texas Tech, not Miami-Ga. Tech or Illinois-Nebraska. This is Pudge's point. No one is beating Ohio State-Wisconsin.

 

[upstater]

Really? How much money did ESPN 'make' off UConn, then, in dollars? I'm afraid I don't see it in the OP. Don't worry about answering that question, however, because you can't.

Asked already and answered. My multiple posts already answered this.

 

[upstater]

The ACCs contract is apparently flat for the extended term, they did not escalate the value. Also, being willing to extend the contract seems to suggest it was profitable for them.

Can't be right. The thing that set off the B12 was the extra money coming to the ACC from an ESPN run network for them.

 

[uconndogs]

Some people are too dumb or too impressed with their own thoughts so they can't follow a simple directive.

This thread is now presented without interruption from the Beantown pinhead.

And for this we give thanks.

 

[lne001]

Asked already and answered. My multiple posts already answered this.

OK, you are officially an idiot. After having to suffer rereading all your inane posts in this thread I found 2 that even mentioned a dollar amount, and they did not address the question at all. I asked how much ESPN made in profits off broadcasting UConn games and your answer was some amount the women received 6 years ago and a wild ass guess as to what the men might generate. No mention of football at all.

 

[upstater]

OK, you are officially an idiot. After having to suffer rereading all your inane posts in this thread I found 2 that even mentioned a dollar amount, and they did not address the question at all. I asked how much ESPN made in profits off broadcasting UConn games and your answer was some amount the women received 6 years ago and a wild ass guess as to what the men might generate. No mention of football at all.

Wow, you blew a gasket. Thanks for informing us that weeknight TV isn't primetime. Don't embarrass your alma mater by telling us which dreg school you graduated from. We figured that out already.