Watching the girls team, ok?

[uconnfan68]

Why? If all the men's teams used a smaller ball is there some advantage you think we would have?

Our center could palm it.

 

[Hankster]

My understanding is that it was somehow formula-based, even if it did add up to undeniably questionable optics. And it did require UConn to do everything it had it in order to steadily elevate itself while re-integrating all of the pieces to not just a 2 Seed, but the best of the 2 Seeds.

NOT NECESSARILY DIRECTED TO YOU:

This thread strongly suggests that most posting here did not watch the team throughout the entire season. There were pre-season transfers & injuries, an early season transfer, a second semester transfer, a COVID stoppage, at least one player illness, a concussion, and in-season injuries (most notably Bueckers who had serious surgery in mid-December) requiring healing and recovery.

The team had as few as 7 available scholarship players in some games, and used 11 different starting line-ups. At times, they looked decimated, pathetic, and/or completely overmatched, as though the season might completely unravel.

Something would improve, and then there'd be another gut-punch. It was tragic and comedic.

And then, players started returning one-by-one, somewhat akin to the Taking Heads tour that started with David Byrne & sn acoustic guitar, and built to a 9-piece funk band.

Carolyn Ducharme has not regained the form, shooting success, and confidence she displayed when 'forced' into heavier action than Geno would have otherwise chosen. She was the guts and glue during the most precarious time. I'm hopeful for a good prep week that results in her making a leap not unlike what Paige did last night in OT without still being 100% of last year.

The loss of Ducharme looms large, because she was the necessary additional big to address what has stalled this team with 3 consecutive losses in the Semi-final game. Mir McLean transfered to lowly Virginia for the second semester, and was the ACC's second-leading rebounder.

So much of this this has been like 'just-in-time' manufacturing that it wasn't really known if UConn would be an almost #1 by the time of the Elite 8.

And now, the anticipated pre-season drama regarding the Final Four challenge will put the team up against last year's champion and overall 1Seed, and one of two other 1 Seeds who have already defeated UConn this season.

It will require 3 consecutive wins in dark uniforms over #1 Seeds to win a National Championship.

Last year and this year are the only two seasons I've ever watched start-to-finish, just shy of every game. Very gripping and well worth my time.

Excellent write up.

 

[dtrumpet]

True, but doesn’t always work out. Have you ever been to a women’s game?

Kindly save the snark. It's unwarranted.
Of course it doesn't always work out, sports doesn't work that way. But the competitive imbalance created by so many home games in the women's tournament is undeniable, Uconn's run this year being just the latest example.

 

[ecasadoSBU]

When they’re younger than you grandkids calling them the men’s and women’s team seems out of context. We haven’t accepted the fact our 50 year old children are adults. Heck we barely accept the fact we are. I and some older posters male and female constantly refer to the men or women as kids and the main reason we get defensive when they are unjustly attacked.Is our paternal or maternal instincts kick in.
It’s more a sign of *love than disrespect.
* The simplest definition of love is wanting what’s best for them or caring.

Do you do the same with younger-than-50 NBA/WNBA players? That would be pretty weird.

College team are always referred to as Men's and Women's

High School and pre-HS teams are mostly referred to as girls and boys

 

[Hey Adrien!]

I don’t like to compare the sports.

But she, Paige and Nika are so fun to watch.

Those two are a great pair: two point guards but one is a smooth scorer with unreal court vision while the other is the emotional leader of the team with an endless motor and an ability to shut down the other team's best guard.

Considering that Isaiah Whaley was my favorite player on the mens' team, it makes sense why Muhl is my favorite player on the mens' team. Different positions, but similar traits.

 

[cohenzone]

Kindly save the snark. It's unwarranted.
Of course it doesn't always work out, sports doesn't work that way. But the competitive imbalance created by so many home games in the women's tournament is undeniable, Uconn's run this year being just the latest example.

Ease up there. If the women could get the same attendance the men do at neutral courts they would do it the same way. Even for the men the top 4 teams are placed as close to home as possible. So one is allowed to wonder if those who seem to be troubled by the better women‘s teams getting home court ever go to a women’s game. The attendance still is pretty poor at a lot of D1 women‘s games except for the more elite programs and that means the tournament format isn’t likely to change any time soon.

 

[Hey Adrien!]

This will make your early evening:

 

[imno1]

Best game of the post season men's or women's.

 

[Deadrody]

Big difference between the men's and women's tournament is a 4 game home winning streak gets you in the Final 4.

Nice

 

[Deadrody]

Ease up there. If the women could get the same attendance the men do at neutral courts they would do it the same way. Even for the men the top 4 teams are placed as close to home as possible. So one is allowed to wonder if those who seem to be troubled by the better women‘s teams getting home court ever go to a women’s game. The attendance still is pretty poor at a lot of D1 women‘s games except for the more elite programs and that means the tournament format isn’t likely to change any time soon.

Indeed. Bridgeport had over 10k for the two games this weekend. The other regions were between 4 and 8k. They picked Bridgeport because even IF UConn didn't play there, the state is the biggest fanbase of women's hoops in the country. And they always try and send the top seeds to the closest region if they can.

Anyone remember the men playing Florida in FL in 1994, then UCLA in Oakland in 1995, and UNC in Greensboro in 1998 ?? Happens in the men's game too. Without any of the revenue generating reasons why.

 

[Deadrody]

Yeah, the advantage would be not having the asinine "this girl X, should go teach this guy y how to shoot" , nonsense that has been going on here for 20 plus years.


Smaller ball, same size hoop, ball more likely to go in, no? I mean that is simple physics.


Very enjoyable game last night. Can't it ever be on its own merits?

Yeah, I'd bet someone has actually done a study about just how much more likely that is. And lo and behold, google result #1:

The Effect of Introducing a Smaller and Lighter Basketball on Female Basketball Players’ Shot Accuracy - PMC

Our study examined whether the introduction of a smaller and lighter basketball (no. 6) affected the accuracy of female basketball players’ shots at the basket. The International Basketball Federation (FIBA) introduced a size 6 ball in the 2004/2005 ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Did not make a difference, except in FT% (it went DOWN) and 3 point shots taken.

The difference in size is one inch. The idea that the great shooters are a product of such a small difference is insulting.

 

[HitDog]

Indeed. Bridgeport had over 10k for the two games this weekend. The other regions were between 4 and 8k. They picked Bridgeport because even IF UConn didn't play there, the state is the biggest fanbase of women's hoops in the country. And they always try and send the top seeds to the closest region if they can.

Anyone remember the men playing Florida in FL in 1994, then UCLA in Oakland in 1995, and UNC in Greensboro in 1998 ?? Happens in the men's game too. Without any of the revenue generating reasons why.

Texas in San Antonio in 2003

 

[mauconnfan]

I think we also need to look at how often a #2 seed beats a #1…and consider that it is likely that the #1 that traveled to the #2 seeds were the weakest #2 seeds.

And for the comments above, Paige Bueckers and Azzi Fudd are better shooters than any player on the UConn men’s team, and probably in college basketball - regardless of ball size. men have physical advantages over women, not skill advantages.

I do wish that they’d switch though (as Geno wanted to), just so we’d stop hearing the excuse.

Fudd is a great shooter as is Paige no doubt. You put them head to head versus the men with no defense just shooting probably not close. But it’s only relative due to the game of basketball otherwise much harder, during the game, for men to get wide open than it is for the women. It’s still impressive no matter they can shoot it!

 

[Kaizen]

The women’s tournament loses money. This is the only way to generate revenue. If UConn had been sent to Wichita no one would have shown up

And Monday ESPN's UConn - NC State game has over 2 million viewers.

 

[mercfan]

Fudd is a great shooter as is Paige no doubt. You put them head to head versus the men with no defense just shooting probably not close. But it’s only relative due to the game of basketball otherwise much harder, during the game, for men to get wide open than it is for the women. It’s still impressive no matter they can shoot it!

I meant simply in pure shooting.

The second point is more about athleticism again. I don't think it's harder for women to get open against women than it is for men to get open against men (particularly because women don't respect each other's space, and refs aren't exactly great), but obviously Paige and Azzi would struggle to get open against men. (again, athleticism and size. The two of them are probably 140 pounds a each..heck, Paige is scrawny next to women)

And btw, that's not a shot at the men at all. Azzi Fudd might already be the best pure shooter Uconn has ever had, and Paige doesn't miss midrange jumpers. (As NC State just found out. ) The two of them are just exceptional.

 

[HCCForever]

The UConn - NC State game was the second item mentioned on PTI tonight. The top story was Tiger Woods potentially playing the Masters.

Tony Kornheiser had good things to say about the team but wondered why NC State didn't double team Paige in OT. He also questioned Geno not fouling at the end of the first OT.

Michael Wilbon said that he watched the entire game and that he watched more women's college games than men's this year. Obviously they both have respect for the women's game.

 

[CL82]

ISTR Geno explaining why the smaller ball made it tougher some years back. Of course he was full of sewerage, but it almost sounded like he believed what he was shoveling into the microphone.

Really? I remember Geno advocating for using the same size ball. Basically he said it doesn’t make a material difference, the kids don’t care, and people use the smaller ball as a way to unfairly dismiss women’s basketball.

As long as we’re on the subject, one of my favorite stories regarding this involves Diana Taurasi. She was playing one on one with a reporter who apparently was decent in high school, or at least thought he was. She beat him easily. His response was the claim that he wasn’t used to playing with the smaller ball. Tarasi told him to go get a bigger ball and she would still beat him. Then she added with typical DT swagger “hell go get a golf ball in a bowling ball and I’ll beat you with those too!”

 

[Deadrody]

The UConn - NC State game was the second item mentioned on PTI tonight. The top story was Tiger Woods potentially playing the Masters.

Tony Kornheiser had good things to say about the team but wondered why NC State didn't double team Paige in OT. He also questioned Geno not fouling at the end of the first OT.

Michael Wilbon said that he watched the entire game and that he watched more women's college games than men's this year. Obviously they both have respect for the women's game.

You have to play the women straight up or they'll pick you apart. NC St actually did a great job defensively after UConn took the early 10 pt lead.

 

[mauconnfan]

I meant simply in pure shooting.

The second point is more about athleticism again. I don't think it's harder for women to get open against women than it is for men to get open against men (particularly because women don't respect each other's space, and refs aren't exactly great), but obviously Paige and Azzi would struggle to get open against men. (again, athleticism and size. The two of them are probably 140 pounds a each..heck, Paige is scrawny next to women)

And btw, that's not a shot at the men at all. Azzi Fudd might already be the best pure shooter Uconn has ever had, and Paige doesn't miss midrange jumpers. (As NC State just found out. ) The two of them are just exceptional.

I didn’t mean they’d have trouble getting open versus men at all. Was talking purely women just don’t guard as well on the defensive end so during games they get much better looks. Helps that Geno draws some good ones up as well.

But I agree with you looking at pure shooting throwing them the ball in the gym I take Fudd all day with Paige being a close 2nd over any of the mens players on campus.

 

[Devland]

The difference in the ball size is roughly 1/4" diameter. I have a hard time believing that would make a significant difference.

 

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

In my experience, it is more challenging to control a smaller lighter object when you are throwing.

 

[imno1]

You have to play the women straight up or they'll pick you apart. NC St actually did a great job defensively after UConn took the early 10 pt lead.

And when PB gets into that zone she’s unstoppable.

 

[storrsroars]

And when PB gets into that zone she’s unstoppable.

That's what was so damned frustrating in the last few minutes of regulation. Paige had that 10-12 footer whenever she wanted, but they kept forcing outside for threes or inside for a difficult layup against NC St's behemoth.

I could say same for the men at times. Whaley had that shot. Can't remember which game it was - either last of BET or the R64 - but Whaley drained a couple of those late in first half - he was wide open - and they never went to him again. I get that analytics are correct over a large sample, but when you have someone who can make that shot and the opponent is giving it to you... get the ball to that shooter and have them shoot.

 

[Eweconn]

It was a really enjoyable game last night but in what world do you force a higher rated team to play in the lower rated teams backyard? That has to be worth at least 6 points.
If I'm NC State I would not be happy.
Good job UConn women (can I say women?!!)

I think it's all about attendance (money). They've tried it differently in the past and attendance wasn't good. I read somewhere that next year, they're going to only two regional sites. Regardless, if you're the best team, you've got to be able to beat any team on any court. However, I do agree home court advantage exists.

 

[Eweconn]

I think they try to keep teams as close to home as possible, and South Carolina was seeded ahead of NC State, so they got Greensboro. That left NC State with Bridgeport. (But to your point about attendance, I can't imagine there was ever any chance UConn wasn't going to be put in the Bridgeport region regardless.)

There actually was a chance UConn was going to Greensboro had they not won the Big East Tournament and secured a #2 seed.