"UConn Trying to Snatch $10 Million for a Phone Call with Ray Allen"

[Fishy]

he has plenty of time to get it together but I don't see him getting anything any time soon. and that's before you factor in the fact that he cheated, got caught, lied to his employer about it, got fired, and then sued them.

This latest kerfuffle won’t help, but his biggest issue is that he got one of the best jobs in the sport and reduced the place to absolute rubble.

His next gig would have to be a step-down gig paying him a whole lot less money...if the guy couldn’t be motivated to work for $3.5M, good luck trying to get him out there recruiting for the University of California at Nowhere for $750,000 a year.

Plus, he’s objectively an awful program manager and a lousy bench coach.

Other than that, I think he has a lot going for him.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

Can you imagine the reaction on here if Cuse or BC was doing the same thing?

We don't have to imagine it; we pretty much saw it when Pitt's (weaker) case against Kevin Stallings was first reported. And those two parties settled.

But Ollie is one of us. He didn't turn out to be the right guy to lead the programlong term, but he's a UConn guy. He's been an ambassador for our brand for decades. He was fired because he was not winning basketball games. Not for a few minor violations. This is undeniable. And when a coach is fired for not being successful, generally they get the money contractually due to them.

This sounds like a good platform for settling, and overwhelmingly, parties settle.

This hasn't gone well, and I don't know who has or hasn't negotiated skillfully or in best faith. I doubt too many who are posting here do know, but that hasn't muted a lot of strong opinions.

 

[GetTheFacts]

I've been traveling for work the past couple of days so I haven't been able to keep up with the recent developments in a timely manner but just caught up on the headlines.

I was one of the more vocal fans calling for Ollie's job prior to the beginning of last season (couldn't even watch the games because the on-court product was so terrible). But the way the University is handling his dismissal is an absolute DISGRACE. It's embarrassing to everyone that's associated with UConn.

He has been a tremendous ambassador for this university for nearly two decades and the school doesn't want to pay him because they signed onto a contract they can no longer afford so they are dragging him through the mud over the most minute accusations. I feel bad for KO.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

You’ve peddled your conspiracy theory around here as fact for the last 24 hours - what’s the difference? Where’s your evidence?

Stop trying to undermine his posts. He doesn't like it.

 

[CL82]

That all may be true.

But he absolutely will land somewhere when all said in done.

cLOL82 has him blackballed from basketball for life. For fighting for the same money you or I would fight for if put in the same circumstances.

All the things you said above are true in my opinion in you evaluating his performance. But what does that have to do with fighting for a buyout?

I’ll answer it.


Absolutely nothing.

Sigh. Do I actually bother with your nonsense posts? You fired off two of them so I'll take a shot.

First, spare me the Cesspool name calling stupidity and red herrings. Even there, it has long ago gotten tired and served as a substitute to intelligent discussion. Please don't spread the mess you created down there to the main boards.

So I don't know if you do any hiring or interviewing for high managerial or professional positions. One of the things that gets looked at is the relationship with the former employer and the level of professionalism with which you left your prior position. That will be a problem for Ollie especially if he makes good on his scorched earth tactics promise. That may not be an issue in most union disputes, but it is for someone who will be a public face for the university. If you don't believe that, that's fine, but that's the way things work.

Absolutely Ollie should fight for as much as he can get, but there are ways to that in which everyone makes nice and shakes hands at the end. That's usually the best choice. In this case every day Ollie spends threaten to smear Calhoun, Geno and others is decreases the value of an agreed settlement. That's a business decision, and one that I think KO is misplaying. I suspect that that thought has occurred to his non-union representation (who has a very good employment law reputation by the way) and that's why we saw they included a make nice statement from Ollie with their posturing response.

I think we will see a settlement prior to arbitration because Ollie will lose in arbitration, so he has maximum leverage now. Just a hunch.

Did that help explain my thought process?

 

[Ewekon]

He didn't win enough games means he quit on UConn? That just means he didn't win enough games. The main purpose of the head coach's contract is to determine what he is owed if he is fired for not winning enough games.

No. It is the reverse. He quit on UConn so he didn't win enough games. He lost the players during the season. He lost many players and a star recruit after a season ('16 - 17) and he lost too many games. That is the narrative.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

For fighting for the same money you or I would fight for if put in the same circumstances.

Under same circumstances (your phrase, respectfully offered by someone who agrees with you way way more than not), I'd settle . . . and I think you would too.

I also wouldn't expect, under the circumstances, for the other party to just say, "Oh, OK, here" . . . and I don't think you would either.

If, "Nah, you get nothing," was the University's opening gambit, then I'm completely on board with you. It would be pretty irregular and strategically foolish if they in fact did that

If an offered settlement was insultingly low, then I'm still along for the ride, but I'd want to know more about counteroffers and posturing.

All of that said, I don't know what was or wasn't offered, or what was or wasn't countered. Do you?

I haven't seen anything reliable here that suggest anyone posting knows.

That would be the basis for my casting a skeptical eye toward some of the hardline positions taken here.

 

[August_West]

So I don't know if you do any hiring or interviewing for high managerial or professional positions. One of the things that gets looked at is the relationship with the former employer and the level of professionalism with which you left your prior position.

We are talking college basketball here not GE. If you don’t know the difference , I don’t know what to say, other than look at the history of 2nd 3rd and 9th chances.

In this case every day Ollie spends threaten to smear Calhoun, Geno and others is decreases the value of an agreed settlement. That's a business decision, and one that I think KO is misplaying.

You have absolutely no information to make that contention. You don't know the starting point. You don't know if there was even a an offer. So at this time it is just as likely he could be strengthening the settlement. Especially if NO offer ever existed obviously. You can't weaken " zero" .

Point being that is a bold supposition based on no information.

 

[CL82]

We are talking college basketball here not GE. If you don’t know the difference , I don’t know what to say, other than look at the history of 2nd 3rd and 9th chances.

Don't kid yourself, college basketball is big business. Regardless, people may overlook flaws of successful people. It's a cost benefit analysis, right? But Ollie already hurt his value, with back to back losing seasons, kids transferring en masse and NCAA violations. He's already a question mark. Being a question mark who made a mess on the way out isn't an attractive option to most employers.

You have absolutely no information to make that contention. You don't know the starting point. You don't know if there was even a reduced by offer. So at this time it is just as likely he could be strengthening the settlement. Especially if NO offer ever existed obviously. You can't weaken " zero" .

Point being that is a bold supposition based on no information.

It's fair point that neither you nor I know what, if anything was offered by each side but you are missing the larger point. If Ollie's implicit negotiation strategy is if you don't pay me what I want than I'll drag the school and it's beloved Hall of Fame icons through the mud, and that is what it appears to be, that loses value every day he drags them through the mud. You can only play your Trump card once.

 

[Chief00]

He didn't win enough games means he quit on UConn? That just means he didn't win enough games. The main purpose of the head coach's contract is to determine what he is owed if he is fired for not winning enough games.

I like KO, but the man has been living a reckless life the last few years - it’s not even a borderline call. I have no idea what the man’s been thinking? Is it really bad decisions? Is it he doesn’t care? Did his ego inflate and then deflate at times? Is he in total denial?
I don’t know?
On the other hand we do know who Glen Miller is - he’s more than confirmed all my worse suspicions.

 

[dennismenace]

I sincerely don't understand why people feel bad for him. He quit on UConn and on his players, pocketed huge paychecks while paying lip service to doing his job, and reportedly failing to exercise much self discretion or control. That's without any NCAA violations. On that alone, I certainly don't think he deserves any buyout money.

We are not talking about the guy who spent 30 years in a coal mine or on an assembly line and was screwed out of his pension on some technicality. When did a pampered, overpaid ex-jock making millions become the symbol of oppression?

There is a large emotional investment in sports for fans. It is a great escape from the daily grind. It's about youth, college and good times that hope springs eternal. College sports is also very big business. KO made a considerable amount of money as an NBA player and also as a coach. Contracts are to protect the parties for performance for the investment being made. He failed to live up to the terms of his contract and, arbitration not withstanding, his violations constitute failure to perform. If he had personal problems it is on him (and anyone else in that position) to get help. The sorrow I feel for KO is that he apparently did not seek the help he needed. I don't know this for a fact and perhaps this is only speculation but that is the way I see it. It is a lesson perhaps to all that it is OK to say "I need help".

 

[Huskybass]

That all may be true.

But he absolutely will land somewhere when all is said and done.

cLOL82 has him blackballed from basketball for life. For fighting for the same money you or I would fight for if put in the same circumstances.

All the things you said above are true in my opinion in you evaluating his performance. But what does that have to do with fighting for a buyout?

I’ll answer it.


Absolutely nothing.

This trumps all that:

Ollie’s contract also states that he can be fired for “just cause.” Just cause, in this case, can include any violation by Ollie of any “law, rule, regulation, policy, bylaw, or official interpretation of the University, the Conference or the NCAA.”

You cant really believe something doesnt stick given that incredibly broad definition of "cause".

 

[whaler11]

Stop trying to undermine his posts. He doesn't like it.

Remember when you were so thoughtful and wise?

All I had to do was undress you once and you’ve been reduced to third rate attempts at trolling.

Stick to soup.

 

[MadDogRevival]

Everybody has gotta work reeeeaaaally hard to focus on the only issue that matters:

What the contract says. It uses very broad language that allows for Ollie's termination for even the smallest of rules violations. Ollie's lawyer advised him to sign it. If the contract says, "yeah, even a phone call to Ray Ray constitutes "just cause", " then Ollie should get what is coming to him, which is zero.

Is that "right"? Who cares? That's the wrong question presented by somebody who has lost focus or never had it.

No matter what emotional, irrational headline some scrub at a click bait internet cyberag cobbles together, all that matters is this:

Ollie had counsel. Ollie signed the contract. The contract governs.
If Ollie doesn't like that, he can google, "legal malpractice attorney connecticut."

 

[whaler11]

Everybody has gotta work reeeeaaaally hard to focus on the only issue that matters:

What the contract says. It uses very broad language that allows for Ollie's termination for even the smallest of rules violations. Ollie's lawyer advised him to sign it. If the contract says, "yeah, even a phone call to Ray Ray constitutes "just cause", " then Ollie should get what is coming to him, which is zero.

Is that "right"? Who cares? That's the wrong question presented by somebody who has lost focus or never had it.

No matter what emotional, irrational headline some scrub at a click bait internet cyberag cobbles together, all that matters is this:

Ollie had counsel. Ollie signed the contract. The contract governs.
If Ollie doesn't like that, he can google, "legal malpractice attorney connecticut."

I love when lawyers try to apply their standards to the real world.

OJ Simpson was cool in 1998. All that matters was the jury decision. Is that ‘right’? Who cares!

Yeah we get that lawyers and courts decide who gets how much money. Lawyers and courts don’t decide how much respect you lose for people when they enlist a rat against the institution they represent to further their own interests.

 

[mauconnfan]

You do realize the odds of him being a successful head coach somewhere else are pretty much slim to none, dont you?

Why??? Because you say so... hilarious again!

 

[Stinger92860]

The question is,
Does the $10 million that you may still have to pay Ollie worth the stain and possible downward spiral of the program?

A downward spiral. How much lower can we go?

 

[Stinger92860]

@CL82, I beg the differ. This is going to get uglier and uglier for UConn. This negative publicity will kill UConn basketball. We were at a very fragile stage before this. Who knows what is going to come out next about Coach Calhoun and Geno. What infractions and violations did they commit and what were the consequences? I hate to see what is happening but the truth is Ollie has nothing to loose and his statement today indicates that. I pray before I die I get to see UConn dominate again. Settle with Ollie, fire Herbst and Benedict, settle with Miller and let's get the season going.

Settle with Miller for what? I hope the women’s field hockey team will is safe.

 

[buddy]

I

I don't see this killing Uconn basketball. Most people, except the boneyard and some people in CT, will loose interest. Recruits don't care about any of this.

Certainly wouldn't want to loose interest.

 

[jimva]

@CL82, I beg the differ. This is going to get uglier and uglier for UConn. This negative publicity will kill UConn basketball. We were at a very fragile stage before this. Who knows what is going to come out next about Coach Calhoun and Geno. What infractions and violations did they commit and what were the consequences? I hate to see what is happening but the truth is Ollie has nothing to loose and his statement today indicates that. I pray before I die I get to see UConn dominate again. Settle with Ollie, fire Herbst and Benedict, settle with Miller and let's get the season going.

Your insane. Go away. KO deserves nothing. No one will care about any of this a year from now. Especially after Hurley makes NCCAs.

Sorry had to edit to add.......with essentially the same players.

 

[MadDogRevival]

I love when lawyers try to apply their standards to the real world.

My standards? Lol.
You invoke OJ to compare to KO?
P U.

 

[UCDaveD]

I like KO, but the man has been living a reckless life the last few years - it’s not even a borderline call. I have no idea what the man’s been thinking? Is it really bad decisions? Is it he doesn’t care? Did his ego inflate and then deflate at times? Is he in total denial?
I don’t know?
On the other hand we do know who Glen Miller is - he’s more than confirmed all my worse suspicions.

I’m no doctor, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Kevin is clinically depressed.

 

[crewbear742]

So what you have here is a bunch of pissant violations that no one really cares about - except to use as a lever to fire KO for cause because he can't be fired for losing. Any old port in a storm, I guess. Especially when $10 million is at stake. Sure it may not be ethical or right or a bunch of other similar words that lawyers haven't been able to grasp since leaving law school. But it sure is effective.

Just be consistent. The next time you want to complain about FSU or BC or Louisville or Rutgers or the ACC or ESPN or any other conspirator you want to blame for UCONNs predicament, you just stop yourself and remember that it's all just business.

 

[Paesano]

The question is,
Does the $10 million that you may still have to pay Ollie worth the stain and possible downward spiral of the program?

Yes. And you and Kathy can go away any time. Really. Leave. And never come back. And take the rest of the Ollie clan with you.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

Remember when you were so thoughtful and wise?

All I had to do was undress you once and you’ve been reduced to third rate attempts at trolling.

Stick to soup.

I love when you quote me.

You complained about a heckler "undermining" you, moved into explaining your joke, defended a misspelled attempt at Francesa's New Yawk accent, snagged kudos from someone who I once disputed as "Best Poster" to greater acclaim, declared yourself winner ("No, Hans, I am), and now refer to undressing me while fetching nearly every bone I've tossed ever since.

Good boy.

Is this where you'd like me to say, "Ouch," so I don't upset you?.

 

[whaler11]

I love when you quote me.

You complained about a heckler "undermining" you, moved into explaining your joke, defended a misspelled attempt at Francesa's New Yawk accent, snagged kudos from someone who I once disputed as "GBest Poster" to greater acclaim, declared yourself winner ("No, Hans, I am), and now refer to undressing me while fetching nearly every bone I've tossed ever since.

Good boy.

Ouch.

Is this where you tell us how you have to go tend to your garden, try to take your ball and go home but then post 10 more times after that?

As bad as you are at dime store pyschiatry, you are way worse at trolling. Oh and only passive aggressive bitches don’t quote people. I know that’s beyond your grasp - consider it free advice.

 

[Waquoit]

So what you have here is a bunch of pissant violations that no one really cares about - except to use as a lever to fire KO for cause because he can't be fired for losing.

I have a buddy that got fired for one (1) pissant violation. His real crime was his wife getting cancer. Ollie has a bunch? Gone.

 

[August_West]

This trumps all that:

Ollie’s contract also states that he can be fired for “just cause.” Just cause, in this case, can include any violation by Ollie of any “law, rule, regulation, policy, bylaw, or official interpretation of the University, the Conference or the NCAA.”

You cant really believe something doesnt stick given that incredibly broad definition of "cause".

Where did I say just cause wasn't met?

 

[Huskybass]

Where did I say just cause wasn't met?

All the other tangential arguments are moot if cause is established.

 

[August_West]

All the other tangential arguments are moot if cause is established.

Then you are not for a settlement. Right?