UCONN-Texas Post Game Thread

[Gordo]

People keep clamoring for Geno to play Amari because, supposedly, greater height means more rebounds. Similarly, some fans feel Geno should recruit 6-6, 6-7 girls, even unknown quantities and Geno can coach them up. I guess some feel these giants will make UConn unbeatable.

My point is that incremental size doesn’t mean a better player. Brittney Griner is a great player but when the Huskies played Baylor, Tina ate Brittney’s lunch with 21 points, 13 rebounds against the bigger woman even though she’s 4” shorter.

Okay I get it now and we are together on this. Thank you for clearing this up for me Nan.

 

[Gordo]

I agree with you, but Paige is quite possibly the smartest basketball player UConn has ever had. She'll figure what to do and what not to do to save yourself wear & tear.

I meant herself of course.

 

[LarryLegend]

Maybe they need a players meeting!?

Or a sports psychologist. Like in The Natural

 

[Gordo]

Didn't he coach up Wolters and Dolson? They took about 2 years to develop.

He did, but there was a much higher level of talent there. Dolson has continued to grow and thrive as a pro.

 

[mauconnfan]

Yep. The Texas game looked an awful lot the first half of the men’s Kansas game, complete with the home cookin’

Absolutely Nan. Don’t want to make it a big deal but those Longhorn girls consistently went through and over without a worry of foul trouble. What I will say is when it’s happening like that you need to occasionally extend your box out into a physical “altercation” to get your point across !

 

[HuskyNan]

Absolutely Nan. Don’t want to make it a big deal but those Longhorn girls consistently went through and over without a worry of foul trouble. What I will say is when it’s happening like that you need to occasionally extend your box out into a physical “altercation” to get your point across !

Unfortunately, the team doesn’t have the personnel. We need Bam-Bam Hansmeyer to come give lessons

 

[mauconnfan]

Unfortunately, the team doesn’t have the personnel. We need Bam-Bam Hansmeyer to come give lessons

Good call she wouldn’t have taken that crap tough kid loved her.

It’s weird Edward’s is tough but in a different manner. Plus she can’t afford foul trouble.

 

[Cuango]

With as much parity as exists in WCBB, how well a team shoots makes a big difference in wins and loses. I always look to see how a team won or lost before making a judgement as to how good or bad a team is. With parity teams face more opponants that are able to beat them when they have lesser than normal shooting days. This is when in the past not having to play teams that could threaten you played a major part in a teams record.. That meant that you could play more games at substandard and still win.

Common sense tells you that injuries often play a major role in how well a team does. They are part of basketball. It isn't just about how many injuries hit a team but how those injuries affect the over all strength of the team. Most teams are not really aware of other teams injuries or how they have effected their ability to win. They also do not really know if the individual players are having sub par or if they are exceeding their usual nom percentage wise. This sort of negates the " if certain players had played better" we would have won easily. Why because that applies to both teams. Players are not machines and lack consistency and thats part of basketball. While some are more consistant than others, every player has days when they can not miss or conversely even hit the ocean. Thats why the best free throw shooters have days when they miss were no own guards them. You are never as good as your best day or as bad as your worst. The same applies to teams.

UConn has recently been affected by a couple of bad injury years. That is a given. However, there have been other teams who have had their potential season effected with multiple key major injuries that have gone unnoticed by other fan base's. Why? Because fans tend to be miopic in respect to their own teams. I could name quite a few teams that due to injuries have had seasons derailed, just off the top of my head. But things are what they are and circumstances just need to be dealt with.

I would be curious as to what teams have suffered as many injuries to key players as UConn?

 

[oldude]

People keep clamoring for Geno to play Amari because, supposedly, greater height means more rebounds. Similarly, some fans feel Geno should recruit 6-6, 6-7 girls, even unknown quantities and Geno can coach them up. I guess some feel these giants will make UConn unbeatable.

My point is that incremental size doesn’t mean a better player. Brittney Griner is a great player but when the Huskies played Baylor, Tina ate Brittney’s lunch with 21 points, 13 rebounds against the bigger woman even though she’s 4” shorter.

There needs to be a qualification here. When Tina faced Griner, Tina was a senior, 1st team AA on the #1 ranked, defending national champions. Griner was just a freshman on a 29-10 Baylor team. The lesson that Tina gave the youngster was well-used as Griner lead the Lady Bears to a national championship in 2012.

 

[browns]

There needs to be a qualification here. When Tina faced Griner, Tina was a senior, 1st team AA on the #1 ranked, defending national champions. Griner was just a freshman on a 29-10 Baylor team. The lesson that Tina gave the youngster was well-used as Griner lead the Lady Bears to a national championship in 2012.

Her only one though and she had Odyssey Sims as a teammate for three years

 

[Cuango]

If you watch UConn right now they are playing very soft half court defense and that allows teams with good penetrators to have their way with them. By contrast watch Texas play defense, they are playing tight man all over the court and suffocating the offense. Both these teams play a similar offense but notice where Texas was playing their rotations and compare that to where UConn is starting theirs. UConn right now is not doing the basics very good and until that changes they are going to struggle to score and keep the opponent from scoring.

If Geno can't figure out a way to get Amari into the game and contribute this team will have a long year. AE is playing tough but the have zero low post defense other than her and half of Texas's rebounds yesterday were offensive. That coupled with 20 turnovers makes it an impossible game to win.

It is fixable but will take some courage and patience.

I’m afraid the Amari ship has sailed. She, for whatever reason, simply does not “get” it. It’s a shame and l agree that Geno should have (it seems) put more effort into her in her freshman year but who knows, maybe he did! She just doesn’t seem to be interested in doing the things he needs her to do. It would be one thing if she were actively trying but I’m just not seeing it. Every time she goes in she seems to be very passive and uncertain! Obviously she’s not built for being a banger in the low post but neither was Liv and I rarely had any complaints about her effort Level. Unfortunately, there are only two possible explanations for her play, disinterest, or a profound lack of understanding of the game. I realize she had some physical issues for awhile but supposedly, those are no longer a factor. She’s apparently well liked by everyone and is an exemplary teammate off the court, but I’m afraid that may be the extent of her contribution to this team.

 

[willtalk]

Actually, except for KK being faster than her upper class counterpart Muhl and even PB, its the other way around, i.e. Griffin is faster than either Shade and even Q , and Edwards is a faster than Brady. If your point is that quickness and athleticism are on the rise among the top tier teams and Uconn has to recruit accordingly, OK we get that. But otherwise, don't seek to make a point with faulty facts

Edwards was killing Jones off the dribble. That was her weekness at Oregn St as well. She has long legs and has trouble with side to side quickness.

 

[willtalk]

And there are stories out now that Brink was quite ill for the Gonzaga game. As for UCONN " probably" getting Ducharme back and Patterson back, that may apply more to next season than this one. If Ducharme remains out for Ball state,, it is going to be a long term thing. And, likely, recurring. She probably needs a red shirt year. Do we know what procedure Patterson had, and exactly when it took place?

Yes there is a big difference between a player out for one game and players out for the season of struggling with injuries.

If some UConn fans think they will get a bad ratings break because of their problems, all they have to do is look that they only dropped behind Texas because of that loss. It was explained that the were given slack because their other losses were to top ten teams. Well ND and another team in the mid teens only have one loss and they were to a top ten team as well. Yet they are in the mid teens way behind UConn with 3 losses. UConn fans have no reason to complain about them ever getting the shaft in respect to ratings. At least not yet. Now UConn might very well still be better than ND or the other team, but not because of the criteria that was presented to justify them only dropping one spot.

 

[HuskyNan]

There needs to be a qualification here. When Tina faced Griner, Tina was a senior, 1st team AA on the #1 ranked, defending national champions. Griner was just a freshman on a 29-10 Baylor team. The lesson that Tina gave the youngster was well-used as Griner lead the Lady Bears to a national championship in 2012.

Point taken but there are Boneyarders that seem to feel if Geno brings in an unknown 6-6 kid from, say, Middletown High School that UConn will be okey-dokey in rebounding against the Texas and South Carolina type teams.

 

[Cuango]

Wonder if Ice is hobbled, literally, by her serious knee injury. There is no reason whatsoever for her to be such a meager contributor to team performance- except if she's physically unable to perform. And it could be that Aubrey is once again suffering from her injured spine. Agree that Paige might be playing on borrowed time.

I think she’s simply overwhelmed by the speed and size of the other players. Remember she’s been away from the game basically since she graduated so I’m sure this foray into college ball is even tougher for her than if she were an incoming freshman. Bigs generally take longer than other players to adjust to the college game anyway and she is carrying the added baggage of both her long absence from the game, her freshman jitters and the pressure of knowing that her team is desperate for her contributions in the post! That’s a lot to deal with!
I have little doubt she will have a solid career here. We just have to have patience until the game begins to slow down for her. Not easy, I know but it has to come in it’s own time. She will make us all proud before it’s said and done.

 

[Cuango]

Your pov regarding above is much more reserved for pro ball. It has little place for premiere College basketball programs in early December. The point in bold isn't reality for a premiere college coach, a premiere college coaching staff, a premiere program, and proud college players used to excellence.

Unfortunately, mauconnfan is likely right. We are most likely playing mostly for next year at this point. Of course, it’s possible that we will develop into a real threat by March but realistically, it is more likely that this season is about getting our young players acclimated to the college game so we can hit the ground running next season! If that happens; our four freshmen are playing at a high level by the end of the season and our injured players are fully healthy next November, then 2024 could be a season to remember! Not giving up on this season, just being realistic. This is a year to watch our players grow. Anything beyond the sweet sixteen will be a pleasant surprise.

 

[hoophuskee]

It is possible, by the way, that Paige will never be the same.

Yes -- it's possible. Though I highly doubt it the way Geno was talking about her early in the season. We'll see.
But imo she has to be "Caitlin" to some high degree. Maybe it wil start next game or maybe it takes two months . . .

In terms of meeting her potential, UCONN and her can't be scared to play. Adn imo superstars get beat up. It would be a shame if her body can't take it.

 

[ctkaiser]

And there are stories out now that Brink was quite ill for the Gonzaga game. As for UCONN " probably" getting Ducharme back and Patterson back, that may apply more to next season than this one. If Ducharme remains out for Ball state,, it is going to be a long term thing. And, likely, recurring. She probably needs a red shirt year. Do we know what procedure Patterson had, and exactly when it took place?

I had read something Geno said about Patterson that I took to mean they thought she would be back by now. What procedure was done was never mentioned as is fairly common now.

 

[Cornell Lt]

Turnovers.

and 16 offense rebounds by Texas

 

[hoophuskee]

Ok that’s a fair point. But they won’t do anything this year you can dream all you want. December or February they won’t rebound or defend teams with larger girls and better athletes, it’s simple. And I understand the pride and commitment others have put or tried to put in. But the future is KK, Shade and Samuel now so let them grow. Not saying all the minutes by any means but more for Shade and Samuel than they are getting. And rebounding isn’t all size it’s will as well and width which they have very little of. Boxing out is very important but you need to move them back not just put your butt on them. Admittedly I thought Texas was over the back a lot more than called yesterday.

I agree with you to a very specific degree but overall no way with your tone. The part I agree about is that this year they aren't winning any title. I don't expect them to get to E8 never mind Final Four. But hey- if Creighton -- Creighton - Creighton from 2 years ago can get to an E8- Creighton - then there is no way no way that Geno, the coaching staff, or the players would share a pov that you are posing.

I was on the old Hartford Courant Board and then the old ESPN Board. One issue that always upset me about Geno was his early comments and actions of the young Tina Charles. One point I hated was how the spoke of her game. I can recall her soph year he would say "Tina should average a double-double at halftime." Then when she didn't get it, he'd rip her. Realistically that demand of averaging a double double at halftime was off-the-charts- especially with the team he had that was so amazingly efficient and had several star players.

The point is-- that he was demanding something that was unrealistic. But he was doing it because he's an elite coach and he is held accountable. it's his job to demand "unlrealistic." It's his job to push for a Final Four. We as fans can make cavalier statements because we aren't accountable. I'm wiht you - this year I don't see much. But your point about the bold in your advocating playing worse players than can win now because you are looking toward a someday in the future moment - is more unrealistic than Geno’s past demand from Tina Charles. And you are advocating this in early December of all things.

I know you aren’t saying bench the seniors etc- but a 1 or 2 minute move can cost UCONN a game. And there is no way any member of staff or player worth their salt as a player would be willing to accept that. The pros they would be okay with doing this. College ain't the pros.

 

[Blond D.]

I had read something Geno said about Patterson that I took to mean they thought she would be back by now. What procedure was done was never mentioned as is fairly common now.

What Patterson has is an "angry knee". It swells up for no real reason. Tyus Bowser of the Ravens has the same thing and hes been waiting since the beginning of the NFL season for it to be OK. Its just something that takes its own time to heal.

 

[mauconnfan]

I agree with you to a very specific degree but overall no way with your tone. The part I agree about is that this year they aren't winning any title. I don't expect them to get to E8 never mind Final Four. But hey- if Creighton -- Creighton - Creighton from 2 years ago can get to an E8- Creighton - then there is no way no way that Geno, the coaching staff, or the players would share a pov that you are posing.

I was on the old Hartford Courant Board and then the old ESPN Board. One issue that always upset me about Geno was his early comments and actions of the young Tina Charles. One point I hated was how the spoke of her game. I can recall her soph year he would say "Tina should average a double-double at halftime." Then when she didn't get it, he'd rip her. Realistically that demand of averaging a double double at halftime was off-the-charts- especially with the team he had that was so amazingly efficient and had several star players.

The point is-- that he was demanding something that was unrealistic. But he was doing it because he's an elite coach and he is held accountable. it's his job to demand "unlrealistic." It's his job to push for a Final Four. We as fans can make cavalier statements because we aren't accountable. I'm wiht you - this year I don't see much. But your point about the bold in your advocating playing worse players than can win now because you are looking toward a someday in the future moment - is more unrealistic than Geno’s past demand from Tina Charles. And you are advocating this in early December of all things.

I know you aren’t saying bench the seniors etc- but a 1 or 2 minute move can cost UCONN a game. And there is no way any member of staff or player worth their salt as a player would be willing to accept that. The pros they would be okay with doing this. College ain't the pros.

I get some of what you’re saying to a point. Not sure of what you mean by my “tone” but that’s fine. The honest truth is Muhl is what she is, Edward’s is what she is, Griffin is what she is. Ducharme healthy is what she is. The freshman we aren’t sure and yet they are the only hope of this being anything more than hopefully a sweet 16 team at best. Let them get better and start that phase now. It’s not just better for the future it could change this year just a bit.

 

[hoophuskee]

Unfortunately, mauconnfan is likely right. We are most likely playing mostly for next year at this point. Of course, it’s possible that we will develop into a real threat by March but realistically, it is more likely that this season is about getting our young players acclimated to the college game so we can hit the ground running next season! If that happens; our four freshmen are playing at a high level by the end of the season and our injured players are fully healthy next November, then 2024 could be a season to remember! Not giving up on this season, just being realistic. This is a year to watch our players grow. Anything beyond the sweet sixteen will be a pleasant surprise.

My point to mau and my point to you is that there is no way a premiere College Program like UCONN with two potential All-Americans in which one could be at the flip-of-a switch the best player in WCBB going to have the attitu7de "to play for next year," As stated that is more unrealistic than Geno demanding the soph Tina double-double at halftime.

Many years ago my dad and I went to a UCONN game - we were playing Northeastern. We had a Program and had this written up article of Northeastern coach a guy named Calhoun. Before the game, I was surprised by all the awards he got that was stated in the article. I didn’t know of him before the game. Then when the game started I saw this non-Big East team play a style like a wild pack of dogs and the coach was even more wild than any player. I told my dad "That's the coach I want." I loved that we got him. I saw his team play a certain way - and I loved it. They (Northeastern) weren't going to win a title. But it was the style Calhoun the great coach he was demanded. I share the poster below that made comments about Jim Calhoun per the link I’ve provided on here from many years ago. .

Well Auriemma is of the same blood. If you or anyone else thinks it's in his blood or best for the team to to not want to demand the best with what he has rather than mostly looking into the future at this early of a time periods - then imo you are way off-base. Auriemma is going to want his team to play like a wild pack of dogs and try to bleed every win he can get out of them. And that is not the way that you and other are advocating. IMO it's contrary to what a premier college program would do.

The pros is different.

Jim Calhoun was 100% correct ...

JC basically insisted that KO would take his place. He knew 2 years before any of us that KO was THE right man for the job. Kudos to JC for his conviction and stubbornness. Yet another thing to be thankful for in the JC body of work.

www.the-boneyard.com

 

[hoophuskee]

I get some of what you’re saying to a point. Not sure of what you mean by my “tone” but that’s fine. The honest truth is Muhl is what she is, Edward’s is what she is, Griffin is what she is. Ducharme healthy is what she is. The freshman we aren’t sure and yet they are the only hope of this being anything more than hopefully a sweet 16 team at best. Let them get better and start that phase now. It’s not just better for the future it could change this year just a bit.

What I mean by "tone" is that more or less your tone is "play the freshmen" at near any cost because basically you've given up on the some of the upperclassmen. Am I right? If not I apologize. But for example if it wasn't for Griffin, you think the freshmen such as Q or Ice or maybe togother could have won the game with quite a few less minutes from Griffin?

The point is-- that you have to win the game. UCONN doesn't win without Griffin and as result we are not 18 anymore but rated something much worse. That matters.

 

[UConnCat]

Interesting that Chris Dailey on the radio post-game show seemed more upbeat than I expected. She said yesterday's loss is and feels different than the UCLA loss. "No moral victories but this feels different . . . we can get better from this and we're going to."