UConn basketball....

[6xChamps]

My favorite all time Ollie take is that the 2014 championship is only because of a fluke play by Brimah. Yes -- that was a flukey play and kinda a flukey win, but that doesn't mean that you can just throw away what Ollie did the rest of the tournament, which was honestly remarkable.

He went head to head with more talented teams and HOF coaches and won every game and out coached every team. He had the defense playing at an elite level for the remainder of the tournament.

 

[Waquoit]

Dee Rowe was 18-31 from 70-72 if Ollie does this he will be gone.

Dom Perno had his most talented team in 1982 and lost 7 out of the last 8 games of the season. And we gave him 4 more years.

 

[mauconnfan]

Dom Perno had his most talented team in 1982 and lost 7 out of the last 8 games of the season. And we gave him 4 more years.

So true huh?

 

[metsfan2323]

If Ollie can't figure out how to win in the AAC Benedict will find a coach who can. End of story. We are not blowing up football so we can join the C7 only to find out Ollie can't win there either.

Last year's basketball team before the injuries was very talented and with that talent they lost back to back home games against Wagner and Northeastern. Wagner finished the year 16 -14. Northeastern finished 15 - 16. Like I said we aren't blowing up football to try and rescue this coach. The C7 Pom Pom team can find another team to root for.

 

[Huskymagic]

The program is in trouble right now because we have a captain problem that's why we are having these type of threads and conversations and we all really need to wake up from this 3 year nightmare. The one thing that bothers those of us that are labeled as Ollie haters is when we hear that we should lower or temper our expectations of UCONN basketball now that we have been relegated to the AAC and Ollie is our coach. We truly hope for the best so we can joke about this period of UCONN men's basketball and not lament the beginning of the end.

I and many others cannot do that(lower expectations) or it would be an insult to Jim Calhoun, what has been accomplished, and the pride equity we have in UCONN men's basketball.

#TeamJalenAdams
#TeamChristianVital

 

[LStudfellow]

Mau, excellent OP. Boog2004, strong follow up, except that you and a couple of others on here continue to point to an "inconsistent" regular season in 2013-2014. Really? Go back and look at that year and that team again. They were by far our weakest Final 4/Championship team. With the talent on hand in the front court, there were two games we should not have lost - Stanford at home and Houston on the road. But otherwise... Really? Inconsistent the whole regular season? They went 24-7 and 12-6 in conference play. And DeAndre did not really start to play at a consistently high level until February. Sorry, but to me history shows that KO got that team to play at or near their optimal level in at least 90% of their regular season games. That is about the most you can expect from college kids, and significantly better than your "inconsistent" label.

As for the tournament - on one hand, we did get some luck to prevail against St. Joe's in the first game of the tournament, because they did outplay us for significant stretches of that game. You could even say the Brimah 3-point play was very lucky. By the way, that St. Joe's team was underseeded. A hard-nosed, veteran group who frankly could have easily made it to the Sweet 16 and maybe farther in a different bracket. And from then on KO did as good a coaching job over 5 games as we have ever seen. Period. That is a fact. And the "KO sucks" crowd on here who "assume" Calhoun would have had the same run are just as crazy. And this is coming from someone who loved Coach C; and he did do the greatest building of a program in the history of men's college basketball.

Ollie's first two years here were so far beyond anything any of us could have hoped for with the handicaps (largely created by Calhoun, Jeff Hathaway and our great friends at the NCAA Infractions Committee) he started with. The revisionist history buffs with the "they were Calhoun's players" can blow me. As I recall quite vividly, Alex Oriakhi, Roscoe Smith and Michael Bradley were all "Calhoun players" as well. They all defected from what most every one (including every one of us at the time) thought was a dumpster fire then, with the stain of scandal and frankly a scary immediate future ahead.

But a number of you revisionists like Paesano never, ever bring that up when you bash Ollie at every turn and want to somehow give Calhoun all the credit for the 2014 national title. Seriously? How about if you were completely honest, admitting to the fact that in addition to all the other defections, DeAndre Daniels may well have been part of the transferring group after residing in Calhoun's Chez Bow Wow for the last half of his freshman year. Kevin Ollie had to re-recruit him and practically everyone else (including Shabazz) to get them to stay. Oh yeah, you conveniently never mention those little tidbits of historical fact either. The real truth is, that without the coaching change, the 2014 National Championship most likely never happens.

You say the people on here who try to look for the positives heading toward next year are "Pollyannas"? No. In fact I have not seen one poster on here who has said "everything is great... ALL IS WELL! (ala Kevin Bacon near the end of Animal House)" Not Mau, not Stairmaster, and not pj; not even AntG168 or any of the others who are hopeful of an Ollie-led turnaround. You members who post negative on everything related to Ollie just say that to justify your attempt to ruin practically every recent recruiting thread on here over the last 2 months in which the majority of us would like to have useful information propagated to share and discuss.

Yes, Ollie has made mistakes over the last 3 years. A few of them, obviously. He absolutely needs to recapture the best of what he was those first two years, and then take what he has learned from his mistakes the past 3 years years and be better for it. Pretty much everyone agrees, including every so-called "Pollyanna" on here. But anyone on here who feels he should already be fired without deserving a chance to turn it around after what he did his first two years here (he won a NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP with by far not the best talent in that tournament, YOU UNGRATEFUL IDIOTS!) is a sorry excuse for a fan.

 

[mauconnfan]

The program is in trouble right now because we have a captain problem that's why we are having these type of threads and conversations and we all really need to wake up from this 3 year nightmare. The one thing that bothers those of us that are labeled as Ollie haters is when we hear that we should lower or temper our expectations of UConn basketball now that we have been relegated to the AAC and Ollie is our coach. We truly hope for the best so we can joke about this period of UConn men's basketball and not lament the beginning of the end.

I and many others cannot do that(lower expectations) or it would be an insult to Jim Calhoun, what has been accomplished, and the pride equity we have in UConn men's basketball.

#TeamJalenAdams
#TeamChristianVital

Better be careful with "we" not sure there's a lot more magicians out there.

And you dare to speak of Calhoun and pride while spewing your crap? You are one of a kind magic man.

 

[JMick]

Mau, excellent OP. Boog2004, strong follow up, except that you and a couple of others on here continue to point to an "inconsistent" regular season in 2013-2014. Really? Go back and look at that year and that team again. They were by far our weakest Final 4/Championship team. With the talent on hand in the front court, there were two games we should not have lost - Stanford at home and Houston on the road. But otherwise... Really? Inconsistent the whole regular season? They went 24-7 and 12-6 in conference play. And DeAndre did not really start to play at a consistently high level until February. Sorry, but to me history shows that KO got that team to play at or near their optimal level in at least 90% of their regular season games. That is about the most you can expect from college kids, and significantly better than your "inconsistent" label.

As for the tournament - on one hand, we did get some luck to prevail against St. Joe's in the first game of the tournament, because they did outplay us for significant stretches of that game. You could even say the Brimah 3-point play was very lucky. By the way, that St. Joe's team was underseeded. A hard-nosed, veteran group who frankly could have easily made it to the Sweet 16 and maybe farther in a different bracket. And from then on KO did as good a coaching job over 5 games as we have ever seen. Period. That is a fact. And the "KO sucks" crowd on here who "assume" Calhoun would have had the same run are just as crazy. And this is coming from someone who loved Coach C; and he did do the greatest building of a program in the history of men's college basketball.

Ollie's first two years here were so far beyond anything any of us could have hoped for with the handicaps (largely created by Calhoun, Jeff Hathaway and our great friends at the NCAA Infractions Committee) he started with. The revisionist history buffs with the "they were Calhoun's players" can blow me. As I recall quite vividly, Alex Oriakhi, Roscoe Smith and Michael Bradley were all "Calhoun players" as well. They all defected from what most every one (including every one of us at the time) thought was a dumpster fire then, with the stain of scandal and frankly a scary immediate future ahead.

But a number of you revisionists like Paesano never, ever bring that up when you bash Ollie at every turn and want to somehow give Calhoun all the credit for the 2014 national title. Seriously? How about if you were completely honest, admitting to the fact that in addition to all the other defections, DeAndre Daniels may well have been part of the transferring group after residing in Calhoun's Chez Bow Wow for the last half of his freshman year. Kevin Ollie had to re-recruit him and practically everyone else (including Shabazz) to get them to stay. Oh yeah, you conveniently never mention those little tidbits of historical fact either. The real truth is, that without the coaching change, the 2014 National Championship most likely never happens.

You say the people on here who try to look for the positives heading toward next year are "Pollyannas"? No. In fact I have not seen one poster on here who has said "everything is great... ALL IS WELL! (ala Kevin Bacon near the end of Animal House)" Not Mau, not Stairmaster, and not pj; not even AntG168 or any of the others who are hopeful of an Ollie-led turnaround. You members who post negative on everything related to Ollie just say that to justify your attempt to ruin practically every recent recruiting thread on here over the last 2 months in which the majority of us would like to have useful information propagated to share and discuss.

Yes, Ollie has made mistakes over the last 3 years. A few of them, obviously. He absolutely needs to recapture the best of what he was those first two years, and then take what he has learned from his mistakes the past 3 years years and be better for it. Pretty much everyone agrees, including every so-called "Pollyanna" on here. But anyone on here who feels he should already be fired without deserving a chance to turn it around after what he did his first two years here (he won a NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP with by far not the best talent in that tournament, YOU UNGRATEFUL IDIOTS!) is a sorry excuse for a fan.

barely anyone thinks he should have been fired after this year. they just don't expect any better next year and if that's the case, would like to cut the cord sooner than later.

 

[LStudfellow]

JMick - I have read practically every thread on here over the last few months. It has been dreary, to say the least. And sorry, but there are more than a few who are ready to run the guy out of town.

And then there are also more than a few who cherry pick from the last 5 years to make it seem like KO has done nothing on his own here. I think that is pathetic. The man has been totally loyal to this University and us fans. I think we could show him some of that back now as he has stumbled. But I have read too many people on here that have bashed him time and time again recently. I think he deserves better than that from us. Maybe you do not agree... but that is how I feel. And then the bashing goes on to include anyone who dares support him. Go back and read the threads for yourself. The posts are there, time and time again, in black and white. Frankly, this forum is significantly less enjoyable since that Wagner game... and it has to do with much more than just the 16-17 record, the injuries, or the transfers.

I frankly expected better from this fanbase. Sadly, it seems I over-estimated many of you who call yourselves fellow UConn fans.

 

[UConnNick]

No, I'm saying we might be UConn 1986-1988 for a few years and I accept that because that's where we're at and can't change it. I'll be comfortable if we see steady progress toward becoming UConn 1989-1996.

C'mon, we are never going to be UConn 1986-88 again. That was before we became the most dominant program in an excellent BB conference, before we won four natties and before Calhoun had established himself as a premier college BB coach nationally. With that history, you can only live up to or fail to live up to the expectations, which are dramatically different than they were back in 1986. Remember the mantra back then was simply to avoid having to play in the BET as the lowest seeded team in the tourney. We will never be UConn 1986-88 again.

 

[JMick]

JMick - I have read practically every thread on here over the last few months. It has been dreary, to say the least. And sorry, but there are more than a few who are ready to run the guy out of town.

And then there are also more than a few who cherry pick from the last 5 years to make it seem like KO has done nothing on his own here. I think that is pathetic. The man has been totally loyal to this University and us fans. I think we could show him some of that back now as he has stumbled. But I have read too many people on here that have bashed him time and time again recently. I think he deserves better than that from us. Maybe you do not agree... but that is how I feel. And then the bashing goes on to include anyone who dares support him. Go back and read the threads for yourself. The posts are there, time and time again, in black and white. Frankly, this forum is significantly less enjoyable since that Wagner game... and it has to do with much more than just the 16-17 record, the injuries, or the transfers.

I frankly expected better from this fanbase. Sadly, it seems I over-estimated many of you who call yourselves fellow UConn fans.

He shouldn't be immune to criticism. And a lot of the criticism he has brought upon himself. It's that simple.

 

[UConnNick]

If Ollie can't figure out how to win in the AAC Benedict will find a coach who can. End of story. We are not blowing up football so we can join the C7 only to find out Ollie can't win there either.

Last year's basketball team before the injuries was very talented and with that talent they lost back to back home games against Wagner and Northeastern. Wagner finished the year 16 -14. Northeastern finished 15 - 16. Like I said we aren't blowing up football to try and rescue this coach. The C7 Pom Pom team can find another team to root for.

"The C7 Pom Pom team can find another team to root for."

That is the funniest thing I've read here in a very long time. ROTFLMAO!

 

[Doctor Hoop]

barely anyone thinks he should have been fired after this year. they just don't expect any better next year and if that's the case, would like to cut the cord sooner than later.

You realize that those two sentences contradict each other, right? "Cut the cord sooner" based on expectations means before next year, doesn't it? Or did you really mean to say that you'll see how next year goes, and after seeing the results may feel he should be replaced after in 2018 (i.e., not "sooner")? In which case being this negative now is really pointless.

 

[UConnNick]

Mau, excellent OP. Boog2004, strong follow up, except that you and a couple of others on here continue to point to an "inconsistent" regular season in 2013-2014. Really? Go back and look at that year and that team again. They were by far our weakest Final 4/Championship team. With the talent on hand in the front court, there were two games we should not have lost - Stanford at home and Houston on the road. But otherwise... Really? Inconsistent the whole regular season? They went 24-7 and 12-6 in conference play. And DeAndre did not really start to play at a consistently high level until February. Sorry, but to me history shows that KO got that team to play at or near their optimal level in at least 90% of their regular season games. That is about the most you can expect from college kids, and significantly better than your "inconsistent" label.

As for the tournament - on one hand, we did get some luck to prevail against St. Joe's in the first game of the tournament, because they did outplay us for significant stretches of that game. You could even say the Brimah 3-point play was very lucky. By the way, that St. Joe's team was underseeded. A hard-nosed, veteran group who frankly could have easily made it to the Sweet 16 and maybe farther in a different bracket. And from then on KO did as good a coaching job over 5 games as we have ever seen. Period. That is a fact. And the "KO sucks" crowd on here who "assume" Calhoun would have had the same run are just as crazy. And this is coming from someone who loved Coach C; and he did do the greatest building of a program in the history of men's college basketball.

Ollie's first two years here were so far beyond anything any of us could have hoped for with the handicaps (largely created by Calhoun, Jeff Hathaway and our great friends at the NCAA Infractions Committee) he started with. The revisionist history buffs with the "they were Calhoun's players" can blow me. As I recall quite vividly, Alex Oriakhi, Roscoe Smith and Michael Bradley were all "Calhoun players" as well. They all defected from what most every one (including every one of us at the time) thought was a dumpster fire then, with the stain of scandal and frankly a scary immediate future ahead.

But a number of you revisionists like Paesano never, ever bring that up when you bash Ollie at every turn and want to somehow give Calhoun all the credit for the 2014 national title. Seriously? How about if you were completely honest, admitting to the fact that in addition to all the other defections, DeAndre Daniels may well have been part of the transferring group after residing in Calhoun's Chez Bow Wow for the last half of his freshman year. Kevin Ollie had to re-recruit him and practically everyone else (including Shabazz) to get them to stay. Oh yeah, you conveniently never mention those little tidbits of historical fact either. The real truth is, that without the coaching change, the 2014 National Championship most likely never happens.

You say the people on here who try to look for the positives heading toward next year are "Pollyannas"? No. In fact I have not seen one poster on here who has said "everything is great... ALL IS WELL! (ala Kevin Bacon near the end of Animal House)" Not Mau, not Stairmaster, and not pj; not even AntG168 or any of the others who are hopeful of an Ollie-led turnaround. You members who post negative on everything related to Ollie just say that to justify your attempt to ruin practically every recent recruiting thread on here over the last 2 months in which the majority of us would like to have useful information propagated to share and discuss.

Yes, Ollie has made mistakes over the last 3 years. A few of them, obviously. He absolutely needs to recapture the best of what he was those first two years, and then take what he has learned from his mistakes the past 3 years years and be better for it. Pretty much everyone agrees, including every so-called "Pollyanna" on here. But anyone on here who feels he should already be fired without deserving a chance to turn it around after what he did his first two years here (he won a NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP with by far not the best talent in that tournament, YOU UNGRATEFUL IDIOTS!) is a sorry excuse for a fan.

I keep trying to slam my like button repeatedly but it's unresponsive after the first hit, so LIKE x many zillions! Major props to you, Sir Studfellow!

 

[JMick]

You realize that those two sentences contradict each other, right? "Cut the cord sooner" based on expectations means before next year, doesn't it? Or did you really mean to say that you'll see how next year goes, and after seeing the results may feel he should be replaced after in 2018 (i.e., not "sooner")? In which case being this negative now is really pointless.

the latter. He's not getting fired between now and the season starting barring some weird scandal. he didn't deserve to be fired after last year. but if he's not on the hot seat then I'm not sure why we have an athletic director.

The unfortunate reality is that the longer we suck, with no hope in sight for a P5 bid, the further, and faster, we fall into irrelevancy.

 

[LStudfellow]

He shouldn't be immune to criticism. And a lot of the criticism he has brought upon himself. It's that simple.

Ok - again, neither me nor any other Ollie supporter has said he should be immune to criticism. I guess I need to translate this part of my first post for you:

"Yes, Ollie has made mistakes over the last 3 years. A few of them, obviously. He absolutely needs to recapture the best of what he was those first two years, and then take what he has learned from his mistakes the past 3 years years and be better for it. Pretty much everyone agrees, including every so-called "Pollyanna" on here."

I figured it was pretty clear I was saying exactly that.

And by the way... you and the rest of the bashers need to stop acting like myself and other pro-Ollie people do not think anything is wrong, or that you should not pick on "poor Kevie". Your false narrative on this is beyond tiresome. Kevin Ollie is a coach who deserves criticism for a number of things that happened this year. Last year to a degree, as well. Not as much 3 years ago, as once Shabazz left we saw how shallow the talent level was without him and his leadership (in addition to the huge losses of DeAndre and Niels), thanks in large part to the APR sanctions that of course were 0% of Ollie's fault, no matter how hard you and the other bashers try to change that part of history.

It's posters like you who have built this false narrative of the last 3 years being totally Kevin Ollie's fault, as if Calhoun had nothing to do with the APR ban and its effects on two years of recruiting, that the more reasonable posters find detestable.

Any time you want to have a completely honest debate about it, I am happy to oblige JMick. But I do not think you can do it, since you have shown time and again in a litany of previous posts a propensity to twist the facts of the team's recent history to push your anti-Ollie narrative.

 

[JMick]

Ok - again, neither me nor any other Ollie supporter has said he should be immune to criticism. I guess I need to translate this part of my first post for you:

"Yes, Ollie has made mistakes over the last 3 years. A few of them, obviously. He absolutely needs to recapture the best of what he was those first two years, and then take what he has learned from his mistakes the past 3 years years and be better for it. Pretty much everyone agrees, including every so-called "Pollyanna" on here."

I figured it was pretty clear I was saying exactly that.

And by the way... you and the rest of the bashers need to stop acting like myself and other pro-Ollie people do not think anything is wrong, or that you should not pick on "poor Kevie". Your false narrative on this is beyond tiresome. Kevin Ollie is a coach who deserves criticism for a number of things that happened this year. Last year to a degree, as well. Not as much 3 years ago, as once Shabazz left we saw how shallow the talent level was without him and his leadership (in addition to the huge losses of DeAndre and Niels), thanks in large part to the APR sanctions that of course were 0% of Ollie's fault, no matter how hard you and the other bashers try to change that part of history.

It's posters like you who have built this false narrative of the last 3 years being totally Kevin Ollie's fault, as if Calhoun had nothing to do with the APR ban and its effects on two years of recruiting, that the more reasonable posters find detestable.

Any time you want to have a completely honest debate about it, I am happy to oblige JMick. But I do not think you can do it, since you have shown time and again in a litany of previous posts a propensity to twist the facts of the team's recent history to push your anti-Ollie narrative.

no, it's clear you're out of the loop as to what's going on with the program. I barely scratch the surface and have limited knowledge in terms what I know, but none of it is good.

 

[pj]

C'mon, we are never going to be UConn 1986-88 again. That was before we became the most dominant program in an excellent BB conference, before we won four natties and before Calhoun had established himself as a premier college BB coach nationally. With that history, you can only live up to or fail to live up to the expectations, which are dramatically different than they were back in 1986. Remember the mantra back then was simply to avoid having to play in the BET as the lowest seeded team in the tourney. We will never be UConn 1986-88 again.

We can be a team with one star (e.g. Cliff Robinson or Jalen Adams), some good players ranked in or near the top 100 of their class (Tate George, Phil Gamble, Chris Smith; Christian Vital, Amida Brimah, Kentan Facey, Mamadou Diarra, Vance Jackson), and a bunch of hard-working lunchpail guys (Lyman Depriest, Rod Sellers, Murray Williams; Isaiah Whaley, Josh Carlton, Tyler Polley) that has a record like 9-19 (1986-87), 20-14 (1987-88), 19-13 (1988-89), or 16-17 (2016-17). I think we win 22-24 games next year with Alterique and Terry back, and then 2018-19 and beyond depend on new recruits.

Consider KO's 16-17 mark last year like Calhoun's 9-19 his first year, consider Alterique the second star akin to Chris Smith that brings the program up a level. There are a lot of parallels.

The key issue now is whether KO has matured as a coach as much through 13 years in the NBA and 5 years at UConn as Jim Calhoun had matured through his years at Northeastern. I think JC was smarter than KO and had that indomitable will -- but if KO can learn from his mistakes and keep improving, he can still be great.

I think we fans need to remember that it takes time for a coach to master his craft, and it takes time to build a reputation so that recruits are ready to entrust themselves to you. KO will know he's become a great coach before recruits and rivals do. It won't be an overnight thing. But if it happens, watching it can be a great ride for the fans. If UConn basketball can give me a second experience like the one Jim Calhoun gave me, I'll be a happy man.

And the people who say that we're too good to put up with another 1986-1989 can go suck eggs. No one is too high and mighty to avoid being humbled from time to time.

 

[Stainmaster]

no, it's clear you're out of the loop as to what's going on with the program. I barely scratch the surface and have limited knowledge in terms what I know, but none of it is good.

There's a huge difference between criticizing him for the things you're alluding to and propagating outrageously false narratives about his in-game coaching and PD during his first two seasons.

 

[UConnNick]

Ok - again, neither me nor any other Ollie supporter has said he should be immune to criticism. I guess I need to translate this part of my first post for you:

"Yes, Ollie has made mistakes over the last 3 years. A few of them, obviously. He absolutely needs to recapture the best of what he was those first two years, and then take what he has learned from his mistakes the past 3 years years and be better for it. Pretty much everyone agrees, including every so-called "Pollyanna" on here."

I figured it was pretty clear I was saying exactly that.

And by the way... you and the rest of the bashers need to stop acting like myself and other pro-Ollie people do not think anything is wrong, or that you should not pick on "poor Kevie". Your false narrative on this is beyond tiresome. Kevin Ollie is a coach who deserves criticism for a number of things that happened this year. Last year to a degree, as well. Not as much 3 years ago, as once Shabazz left we saw how shallow the talent level was without him and his leadership (in addition to the huge losses of DeAndre and Niels), thanks in large part to the APR sanctions that of course were 0% of Ollie's fault, no matter how hard you and the other bashers try to change that part of history.

It's posters like you who have built this false narrative of the last 3 years being totally Kevin Ollie's fault, as if Calhoun had nothing to do with the APR ban and its effects on two years of recruiting, that the more reasonable posters find detestable.

Any time you want to have a completely honest debate about it, I am happy to oblige JMick. But I do not think you can do it, since you have shown time and again in a litany of previous posts a propensity to twist the facts of the team's recent history to push your anti-Ollie narrative.

You're on an incredible roll here, Sir. The rest of us here in the so-called "Pollyanna" camp should just get out of your way, read and enjoy.

 

[JMick]

There's a huge difference between criticizing him for the things you're alluding to and propagating outrageously false narratives about his in-game coaching and PD during his first two seasons.

the only hope KO has left is that when he wants to be a good coach he can be. the first two years proved that. let's see if he can learn from his mistakes and get better. but it's hard to ignore people calling him loyal to the program and talk about how he bleeds blue while he's driving us off the cliff because he can't behave like an adult.

 

[LStudfellow]

no, it's clear you're out of the loop as to what's going on with the program. I barely scratch the surface and have limited knowledge in terms what I know, and none of it is good.

"None of it is good"? Wow, then I guess Coach Chillious AND Coach Dixon must be the ultimate in masochists to come here and try and help Ollie turn things around. Those "everything is awful" comments are beyond ridiculous, as well as untrue.

See, that is EXACTLY what I am referring to. Yes, there are obviously some serious problems. But to take "some serious problems" that can be fixed to a "None of it is good" extreme is nonsensical.

If it was THAT BAD - we would not have been in Sid Wilson's final 2, for example. Chillious would not be here. Neither would Dixon. Those are all "undeniable facts" that prove you already to be wrong.

I will give you another "fact". Why do you think Diaco got fired, while Ollie did not? Because when Benedict went to Diaco to try to work with him to improve the situation with the football team, Diaco resisted and refused to listen to his boss. Did Ollie take that same approach? From everything I have heard, Ollie took the criticism to heart and agreed that he needed to do better.

Once again, that does not sound like "none of it is good"

But you keep taking the bad things that make up some of the dynamic, and falsely turn it into the whole thing. Hey, maybe you will get your wish, and next year will be another bad year, and Ollie and the rest of the staff will be gone... Can't wait to see what becomes of the team after that happens. You think we are "irrelevant" now? Wait to you see what happens if your wish comes true and where we are at for the 3 to 5 years (at least) beyond that. Then you will be wishing to God for someone close to as good as Ollie to be coaching this team. I, for one, am more afraid of that scenario than any other you have conjured up in your head, or the other bashers of Ollie, for that matter.

 

[JMick]

"None of it is good"? Wow, then I guess Coach Chillious AND Coach Dixon must be the ultimate in masochists to come here and try and help Ollie turn things around. Those "everything is awful" comments are beyond ridiculous, as well as untrue.

See, that is EXACTLY what I am referring to. Yes, there are obviously some serious problems. But to take "some serious problems" that can be fixed to a "None of it is good" extreme is nonsensical.

If it was THAT BAD - we would not have been in Sid Wilson's final 2, for example. Chillious would not be here. Neither would Dixon. Those are all "undeniable facts" that prove you already to be wrong.

I will give you another "fact". Why do you think Diaco got fired, while Ollie did not? Because when Benedict went to Diaco to try to work with him to improve the situation with the football team, Diaco resisted and refused to listen to his boss. Did Ollie take that same approach? From everything I have heard, Ollie took the criticism to heart and agreed that he needed to do better.

Once again, that does not sound like "none of it is good"

But you keep taking the bad things that make up some of the dynamic, and falsely turn it into the whole thing. Hey, maybe you will get your wish, and next year will be another bad year, and Ollie and the rest of the staff will be gone... Can't wait to see what becomes of the team after that happens. You think we are "irrelevant" now? What to you see what happens if your wish comes true and where we are at for the 3 to 5 years (at least) beyond that. Then you will be wishing to God for someone close to as good as Ollie to be coaching this team.

Look we could do this all night but there is no "false dynamic/narrative" or "made up bad things" here. Sometimes the truth hurts and getting mad because an alumni and fan is not happy with the direction of the program/head coach doesn't make you morally superior or a "better fan" than me or anyone else clued in to our current situation.

 

[Northbound]

Syracuse is worse than us right now. But you made your point anyway.

I'm not so sure, simply because even after a few down years they can sell conference and opponents.

I don't think conference kills you if you're good, but it can speed your decent when things are going poorly.

 

[JMick]

I'm not so sure, simply because even after a few down years they can sell conference and opponents.

I don't think conference kills you if you're good, but it can speed your decent when things are going poorly.

It's even worse when you're a great program, move to weaker conference, and then perform worse outside of your first year in said conference. If we were sucking in the ACC no one would care as much, but moving down a peg and not performing well is not a good look.