The House case | Page 3 | The Boneyard

The House case

Out of curiosity, are Oregon St and Washington St still P5 schools as it pertains to this?
 
FfldCntyFan said:
Out of curiosity, are Oregon St and Washington St still P5 schools as it pertains to this?
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Believe so but not solely… they were P5 before NIL was legalized in the summer of 2021 (Believe this was part of the lawsuit against the PAC12).

 
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huskymedic said:


-> The NCAA sent out a four-page memo to all 32 Division I conferences this week detailing how the organization plans to cut back on distribution to leagues in six annual payout categories in order to pay the proposed $2.7 billion in damages.

The memo detailed how the NCAA could split up an expected $1.6 billion that would come from reductions in NCAA distribution, sources told ESPN. The remaining $1.1 billion is expected to come from NCAA reserves, catastrophic insurance, new revenue and budget cuts, sources said.

Of that $1.6 billion, nearly 60 percent is expected to come from leagues outside the Power 5 leagues that are named in the House lawsuit, according to sources. (The NCAA is named, and all of the schools are members.) The other 40 percent will come from the power conferences.

For example, the cost annually for the Big East Conference is projected at between $5.4 million and $6.6 over the next decade, according to a source familiar with the memo. <-
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There is an irony to the P4 schools attempting to pay for their antitrust violations by engaging in more antitrust violations.
 
pepband99 said:
I don't disagree with the post or opinion here, but Mr. "Victory Lap" WaylonJennings saying this is the least self-aware thing I have ever seen. LOL.
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A broken clock is right twice a day should be his motto.
 
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huskymedic said:


-> The NCAA sent out a four-page memo to all 32 Division I conferences this week detailing how the organization plans to cut back on distribution to leagues in six annual payout categories in order to pay the proposed $2.7 billion in damages.

The memo detailed how the NCAA could split up an expected $1.6 billion that would come from reductions in NCAA distribution, sources told ESPN. The remaining $1.1 billion is expected to come from NCAA reserves, catastrophic insurance, new revenue and budget cuts, sources said.

Of that $1.6 billion, nearly 60 percent is expected to come from leagues outside the Power 5 leagues that are named in the House lawsuit, according to sources. (The NCAA is named, and all of the schools are members.) The other 40 percent will come from the power conferences.

For example, the cost annually for the Big East Conference is projected at between $5.4 million and $6.6 over the next decade, according to a source familiar with the memo. <-
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huskymedic said:
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The Big East suing is a certainty if the P5 do not back down, and more conferences will want to join as plaintiffs. That proposal may be the most idiotic thing the P5 leagues have done. How do they even have standing to cut a deal where another third party has to pay their bill?

The Big East and other non-football leagues have a lot of leverage, because the settlement amount is going to be a lot more than $2.8 billion if it goes to court, and the P5 will end up pay almost all of it. The House plaintiffs want a settlement soon or they are going to court, which puts the P5 leagues in a really precarious spot.
 
huskymedic said:
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Val "strongly object mean words" Ackerman strikes again. Gladly participating in the NCAAs basketball revenue model, and then complaining when it's used to fund a settlement, isn't going to go far.

She may have some leverage if she can get a coalition going to strike this down, but the flipside is that this then opens the door to her member schools potentially paying more, if they lose in court. It's not a great hill.
 
huskymedic said:
Damned if she speaks - damned if she doesn’t. It’s all theatre - they have no leverage.
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Which is a sign that she's lost the fan bases of her member schools.
 
huskymedic said:
Damned if she speaks - damned if she doesn’t. It’s all theatre - they have no leverage.
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Which is why it’s hilarious when people say stuff like “you can’t hold the NCAA Tournament without the Big East!!” Or “the Big East is a power conference!!”

The BE is a pretty good men’s basketball league. That is it. They have zero leverage, bargaining power, national brands, etc. The second it is advantageous for the P4 to discard of them (and the other non-football leagues), they will do so, regardless of the changes to the NCAA Tournament it causes
 
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CL82 said:
Which is a sign that she's lost the fan bases of her member schools.
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What leverage does she have honestly to change this? She’s not even invited into the room with the power brokers who are negotiating this
 
Drew said:
What leverage does she have honestly to change this? She’s not even invited into the room with the power brokers who are negotiating this
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Not a heck of a lot, other than vocally opposing it. The heat she's taking is a consequence of her slow and tepid response to Big East teams being given the short shrift in this year's NCAA selection and our mediocre, at best, conference media deal. One could argue that she doesn't have much leverage there either, but having ready justifications for poor performances in areas doesn't improve them and certainly doesn't make them more tolerable.

She needs a success somewhere.
 
CL82 said:
Not a heck of a lot, other than vocally opposing it. The heat she's taking is a consequence of her slow and tepid response to Big East teams being given the short shrift in this year's NCAA selection and our mediocre, at best, conference media deal. One could argue that she doesn't have much leverage there either, but having ready justifications for poor performances in areas doesn't improve them and certainly doesn't make them more tolerable.

She needs a success somewhere.
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I very much agree with your last sentence, it seems as though despite the on-court successes of UConn (and previously Villanova), the league has failed to gain any major traction in viewership growth outside of specific UConn related pockets. The OTA numbers for non-UConn games on FOX are bad and the FS1 numbers are even worse.

Speaking of the media deal, FOX exclusive window ended a month ago and we haven’t heard squat. I am guessing they’ll re-up with FOX (reduced # of games) and some other partners given we haven’t heard about them taking their primary rights to the open market but we will see what it means from a $ and exposure standpoint. The FLO sports type deals need to end- and I wouldn’t be surprised to see Peacock or another streamer engaged for some MBB to also absorb some of the non-revenue sport games too
 
Drew said:
I very much agree with your last sentence, it seems as though despite the on-court successes of UConn (and previously Villanova), the league has failed to gain any major traction in viewership growth outside of specific UConn related pockets. The OTA numbers for non-UConn games on FOX are bad and the FS1 numbers are even worse.

Speaking of the media deal, FOX exclusive window ended a month ago and we haven’t heard squat. I am guessing they’ll re-up with FOX (reduced # of games) and some other partners given we haven’t heard about them taking their primary rights to the open market but we will see what it means from a $ and exposure standpoint. The FLO sports type deals need to end- and I wouldn’t be surprised to see Peacock or another streamer engaged for some MBB to also absorb some of the non-revenue sport games too
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Exchanging revenue for visibility was Aresco's plan in the American. It didn't work out great.

I will say the Big East is in a difficult position. Having the majority of games on FS1 and FS2 means that the ratings are going to be bad on them. But, if we move to ESPN, then a significant amount of those games are going to end up on plus. Even if Ackerman were to double the existing deal, which would be a homerun, it still isn't a meaningful number compared to P4 money. The fact that there wasn't a agreement during the exclusive negotiation period leads me to believe that the number will be less than that.

Connecticut's only way out of that box is to move to a P* conference, which I don't see happening absent the collapse of the ACC and even then it would likely be to a diminished ACC.
 
CL82 said:
Exchanging revenue for visibility was Aresco's plan in the American. It didn't work out great.

I will say the Big East is in a difficult position. Having the majority of games on FS1 and FS2 means that the ratings are going to be bad on them. But, if we move to ESPN, then a significant amount of those games are going to end up on plus. Even if Ackerman were to double the existing deal, which would be a homerun, it still isn't a meaningful number compared to P4 money. The fact that there wasn't a agreement during the exclusive negotiation period leads me to believe that the number will be less than that.

Connecticut's only way out of that box is to move to a P* conference, which I don't see happening absent the collapse of the ACC and even then it would likely be to a diminished ACC.
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Even the diminished ACC is just the OBE reformed. Getting to play Syracuse, Boston College, Pittsburgh, etc again would be awesome. And we would make 3x+ money. Still a no brainer.
 
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nelsonmuntz said:
Walk me through why the Big East has no legal leverage.
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Folks can sue for anything… walk me through what the successful outcome will be - a few less dollars withheld that will wash w/ the legal fees?
 
Drew said:
Even the diminished ACC is just the OBE reformed. Getting to play Syracuse, Boston College, Pittsburgh, etc again would be awesome. And we would make 3x+ money. Still a no brainer.
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Agree. Although three times our current media money is 12 million. A vast improvement, but it still doesn't get us out of the box. It just moves us to a nicer box.
 
CL82 said:
Exchanging revenue for visibility was Aresco's plan in the American. It didn't work out great.

I will say the Big East is in a difficult position. Having the majority of games on FS1 and FS2 means that the ratings are going to be bad on them. But, if we move to ESPN, then a significant amount of those games are going to end up on plus. Even if Ackerman were to double the existing deal, which would be a homerun, it still isn't a meaningful number compared to P4 money. The fact that there wasn't a agreement during the exclusive negotiation period leads me to believe that the number will be less than that.

Connecticut's only way out of that box is to move to a P* conference, which I don't see happening absent the collapse of the ACC and even then it would likely be to a diminished ACC.
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I guess exchanging revenue for visibility didn't work out great, but the AAC was the best of the G5 which is all it could hope for. And it probably helped Cinci, Houston and UCF get the call-ups.

Wouldn't bankruptcy be the way to go for the NCAA? Forgive all debts and reorganize, or something.
 
Kolumbo said:
I guess exchanging revenue for visibility didn't work out great, but the AAC was the best of the G5 which is all it could hope for. And it probably helped Cinci, Houston and UCF get the call-ups.

Wouldn't bankruptcy be the way to go for the NCAA? Forgive all debts and reorganize, or something.
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Bankruptcy wouldn't be possible considering the contract in place for the men's basketball tournament. There is more than sufficient projected future earnings to cover the debts that will arise from this.
 
CL82 said:
Exchanging revenue for visibility was Aresco's plan in the American. It didn't work out great.

I will say the Big East is in a difficult position. Having the majority of games on FS1 and FS2 means that the ratings are going to be bad on them. But, if we move to ESPN, then a significant amount of those games are going to end up on plus. Even if Ackerman were to double the existing deal, which would be a homerun, it still isn't a meaningful number compared to P4 money. The fact that there wasn't a agreement during the exclusive negotiation period leads me to believe that the number will be less than that.

Connecticut's only way out of that box is to move to a P* conference, which I don't see happening absent the collapse of the ACC and even then it would likely be to a diminished ACC.
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We are approaching a major inflection point and we had better be far more prepared than we were 21, 13 and 11 years ago (fortunately it appears we are).

One item that many are ignoring is that if it weren't for what Nova did in the first half dozen years after the split and what we've done the past couple, it would be very easy for the P-whatever to push the BE out and relegate the conference (both financially and in the public eye) to second tier status.
 
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CL82 said:
Not a heck of a lot, other than vocally opposing it. The heat she's taking is a consequence of her slow and tepid response to Big East teams being given the short shrift in this year's NCAA selection and our mediocre, at best, conference media deal. One could argue that she doesn't have much leverage there either, but having ready justifications for poor performances in areas doesn't improve them and certainly doesn't make them more tolerable.

She needs a success somewhere.
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Medicore at best TV deal? No other non FB sponsoring league is anywhere close.
 
noeynox said:
Medicore at best TV deal? No other non FB sponsoring league is anywhere close.
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Who is our non power conference comp? They shouldn’t be anywhere close.

Given collective performance vs anyone deemed a peer, we likely should be worth more.
 
noeynox said:
Medicore at best TV deal? No other non FB sponsoring league is anywhere close.
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I guess it depends on your viewpoint.

If you measure yourself against the weakest of your competition, the odds are pretty favorable that you'll be better than them. While that's potentially comforting, I guess, it doesn't change the reality that the teams which we view as our competition are making roughly 10 times what the average big east team earns in media revenue, minimally, with the best making nearly 20 times that.

So when we are losing coaches and top players to P2 teams, and, in all likelihood, eventually excluded from competing at the highest level of college athletics, I guess some might take comfort in the fact that the big east "makes the most of the non-football conferences." I won't be one of them.
 
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