The B1G adding Rutgers & Maryland could be a major problem when cable dies.

[huskymedic]

Medic, as you say you are trying to figure out the technical side...

Nah, I was trying to be less "pompous". I knew exactly what I was talking about.

All evidence appears to show that you are wrong in this case. FSU has invested millions upon millions to do exactly what you continue to say they and other schools can't do.

 

[huskyrob1]

Nah, I was trying to be less "pompous". I knew exactly what I was talking about.

All evidence appears to show that you are wrong in this case. FSU has invested millions upon millions to do exactly what you continue to say they and other schools can't do.

Lol, but with all due respect I think you are incorrect here. I mean having a an FCC license for transmission of the TV signal of their signal broadcast over central Florida is fine, and the more power (the wattage) the transmitter has the bigger the footprint. It's free tv so to speak. For example, WFSB has a very powerful transmitter, and it's signal covers the whole state, while the old channel 20 in Waterbury had a weaker signal that only covered the western half of the state. But having a TV station broadcasting content Does Not give said station the ability to beam signals point to point directly to Galaxy 1 or 2 transponders orbiting the earth 26 miles up and then feeding it to Bristol for a national live broadcast. You need an earth station or uplink truck for that, and I've yet to see any evidence yet you've presented that shows that they have that capability. Earth stations and broadcasting TV stations are two different animals. What is possible is maybe an earth station under Seminoles broadcasting footprint in middle Florida picks up that signal and beams it to Bristol, but then Seminole has to pay for the satellite time and outsourcing fees to the earth station which runs into big bucks. I'm sure that down the road the ACC will build their own ES or fiber link at some point. You seem like a pretty resourceful internet detective so if I'm wrong go do some digging that shows FSU has it's own ES or uplink truck, or just call Seminole Productions and ask them. Lol

 

[huskymedic]

Lol, but with all due respect I think you are incorrect here. I mean having a an FCC license for transmission of the TV signal of their signal broadcast over central Florida is fine, and the more power (the wattage) the transmitter has the bigger the footprint. It's free tv so to speak. For example, WFSB has a very powerful transmitter, and it's signal covers the whole state, while the old channel 20 in Waterbury had a weaker signal that only covered the western half of the state. But having a TV station broadcasting content Does Not give said station the ability to beam signals point to point directly to Galaxy 1 or 2 transponders orbiting the earth 26 miles up and then feeding it to Bristol for a national live broadcast. You need an earth station or uplink truck for that, and I've yet to see any evidence yet you've presented that shows that they have that capability. Earth stations and broadcasting TV stations are two different animals. What is possible is maybe an earth station under Seminoles broadcasting footprint in middle Florida picks up that signal and beams it to Bristol, but then Seminole has to pay for the satellite time and outsourcing fees to the earth station which runs into big bucks. I'm sure that down the road the ACC will build their own ES or fiber link at some point.

>>WFSU-TV’s facilities include KU and C Band satellite uplink and downlink capabilities which enable the station to transmit programs around the world<< (If I'm not incorrect as you believe I am - isn't Galaxy 1 C band?)

>>WFSU-TV operates two uplinks, a steerable KU-band analog uplink and a steerable C-band analog uplink. WFSU-TV's KU band uplink can also do digital uplinks if the downlink has a Digicypher II to take the feed.<<

There's more but that should do it... you are underestimating FSU's capacity and skill set in this regard.

 

[huskyrob1]

>>WFSU-TV’s facilities include KU and C Band satellite uplink and downlink capabilities which enable the station to transmit programs around the world<<

>>WFSU-TV operates two uplinks, a steerable KU-band analog uplink and a steerable C-band analog uplink. WFSU-TV's KU band uplink can also do digital uplinks if the downlink has a Digicypher II to take the feed.<<

There's more but that should do it... you are underestimating FSU's capacity and skill set in this regard.

Nice job, ok you proved it. I was wrong, just didn't think they had the financial resources to pull that off. I still wonder though if every school in the conference has the funds to do the same thing, or maybe just 4 or 5 schools need to do that with each one serving as a transmission hub once the ACC network signs on.

 

[pj]

Nice job, ok you proved it. I was wrong, just didn't think they had the financial resources to pull that off. I still wonder though if every school in the conference has the funds to do the same thing, or maybe just 4 or 5 schools need to do that with each one serving as a transmission hub once the ACC network signs on.

How expensive can it be? A few million dollars? I would think every ACC school would have the wherewithal to pull it off.

 

[huskyrob1]

How expensive can it be? A few million dollars? I would think every ACC school would have the wherewithal to pull it off.

One broadcast production truck with 4 or 5 high definition cameras, 2 or 3 mobile cameras, production switcher, chyron graphics equipment, video recording and playback equipment, tbc's, electrical generator, air conditioning equipment, lighting equipment, can cost well over $3 million, and a C band sat truck well over $1 million to $2 million. With all that equipment, production costs for just one college football game runs about $150,000.

 

[Fishy]

I'm not sure you need the production truck any more.

The PAC 12 uses Internet2 to send their 'broadcasts' to the central office in San Francisco - it's then broadcast from there.

Must save a lot of money over having to maintain a truck and satellite time at every campus.

 

[pj]

One broadcast production truck with 4 or 5 high definition cameras, 2 or 3 mobile cameras, production switcher, chyron graphics equipment, video recording and playback equipment, tbc's, electrical generator, air conditioning equipment, lighting equipment, can cost well over $3 million, and a C band sat truck well over $1 million to $2 million. With all that equipment, production costs for just one college football game runs about $150,000.

The costs of a fixed installation with the same equipment will be cheaper than to put it all in a truck. If you're producing a conference network, you're doing enough production on campus to warrant having a fixed site in a room, rather than a truck that you drive around between campuses for occasional productions.

If your cost estimate of $3-5 mn is correct, it might be $3 mn on each campus, probably repeated once every 20 years, so on the order of $200,000 per year amortized. That's about 1% of what ESPN is paying the ACC schools for their ACC network and other media rights. It's a small expense.

Moreover, as Fishy says, the Internet infrastructure has grown so that you can send high-definition video reliably throughout the US, especially if you build in a 7-second delay before broadcast. You can get dedicated bandwidth between the campus and ESPN so there's never any competition for bandwidth. You don't need satellite uplinks, though in some cases you may want to use it.

 

[huskyrob1]

I'm not sure you need the production truck any more.

The PAC 12 uses Internet2 to send their 'broadcasts' to the central office in San Francisco - it's then broadcast from there.

Must save a lot of money over having to maintain a truck and satellite time at every campus.

I can see that for pre recorded stuff, or for PAC 12 sports news, but for live sports even a one or two second lag might be a problem, I mean if the games director and technical director are in San Fran directing the floor directors and cameramen in Los Angeles or Phoenix. The director has to instruct the TD to take camera 2 from camera 1 on the switcher (also in SF), during a critical play and a split second before talks to the cameraman on 2 over IFB to prepare him to frame the shot just right. With the small time lag, that's a problem, maybe there's a fix for it but still. Instant replay would be headache also, especially if the refs need to see a play. If they lose IFB with the field (cameras, refs, on site talent) they're f ****d. They wouldn't even be able to count them down out of commercials. Having the production truck on site, all those potential problems don't happen. I will say that using fiber or internet2 does away with the satellite truck and probably saves money.

 

[Ha Who]

What does all this have to do with us being screwed?

 

[huskyrob1]

The costs of a fixed installation with the same equipment will be cheaper than to put it all in a truck. If you're producing a conference network, you're doing enough production on campus to warrant having a fixed site in a room, rather than a truck that you drive around between campuses for occasional productions.

If your cost estimate of $3-5 mn is correct, it might be $3 mn on each campus, probably repeated once every 20 years, so on the order of $200,000 per year amortized. That's about 1% of what ESPN is paying the ACC schools for their ACC network and other media rights. It's a small expense.

Moreover, as Fishy says, the Internet infrastructure has grown so that you can send high-definition video reliably throughout the US, especially if you build in a 7-second delay before broadcast. You can get dedicated bandwidth between the campus and ESPN so there's never any competition for bandwidth. You don't need satellite uplinks, though in some cases you may want to use it.

Probably cheaper to build a studio on site at every school but if the studio is on the other side of campus then the signal from stadium would have to be microwaved over. Hi definition baseband camera cables degrade the signal after about 800 or 900 yards. I've been out of the business for a while now so maybe they're better, but still.

 

[huskyrob1]

The costs of a fixed installation with the same equipment will be cheaper than to put it all in a truck. If you're producing a conference network, you're doing enough production on campus to warrant having a fixed site in a room, rather than a truck that you drive around between campuses for occasional productions.

If your cost estimate of $3-5 mn is correct, it might be $3 mn on each campus, probably repeated once every 20 years, so on the order of $200,000 per year amortized. That's about 1% of what ESPN is paying the ACC schools for their ACC network and other media rights. It's a small expense.

Moreover, as Fishy says, the Internet infrastructure has grown so that you can send high-definition video reliably throughout the US, especially if you build in a 7-second delay before broadcast. You can get dedicated bandwidth between the campus and ESPN so there's never any competition for bandwidth. You don't need satellite uplinks, though in some cases you may want to use it.

You can get used production and C band trucks for much much less, there are tons of them for sale with older equipment of course. In that case a school could go that route and save a ton over a studio building and uplink costs.

 

[pj]

Probably cheaper to build a studio on site at every school but if the studio is on the other side of campus then the signal from stadium would have to be microwaved over. Hi definition baseband camera cables degrade the signal after about 800 or 900 yards. I've been out of the business for a while now so maybe they're better, but still.

Microwave links provide up to 10 Gbps in perfect weather, but bandwidth is reduced by humidity or rain (http://www.microwave-link.com/). Fiberoptic can provide 10 Gbps on a single cable with a range of 3 km (http://www.itcom.itd.umich.edu/cabling/fibopt.html). The downside of fiberoptic is frequent amplification, so over long distances microwaves can be more efficient, but over the 3 km scale of a campus, fiberoptic is far cheaper and higher quality. Also less likely to be disrupted by storms, although more likely to be cut by construction crews; but if you make a fiber ring so there are multiple paths, that risk goes away too.

The one big advantage of microwave is that it is more portable -- as the first link says, "Speed of deployment and flexibility – the ability to move sites or provision rapidly – are greatly in favour of MW radio over fibre and cabled alternatives." You can put microwave on a truck, but you can't tether a truck to a studio with a fiberoptic cable and have it drive very far. But if you have fixed stadium sites, fixed campus uplink site, and fixed central ESPN studio, you don't need mobility.

You can get used production and C band trucks for much much less, there are tons of them for sale with older equipment of course. In that case a school could go that route and save a ton over a studio building and uplink costs.

Better yet, buy one of those used trucks and put the equipment in a room connected to the stadiums by fiberoptic cable. Presto!

 

[huskyrob1]

Microwave links provide up to 10 Gbps in perfect weather, but bandwidth is reduced by humidity or rain (Microwave Link - Gigabit Microwave Connectivity). Fiberoptic can provide 10 Gbps on a single cable with a range of 3 km (Fiber Optic Cable). The downside of fiberoptic is frequent amplification, so over long distances microwaves can be more efficient, but over the 3 km scale of a campus, fiberoptic is far cheaper and higher quality. Also less likely to be disrupted by storms, although more likely to be cut by construction crews; but if you make a fiber ring so there are multiple paths, that risk goes away too.

The one big advantage of microwave is that it is more portable -- as the first link says, "Speed of deployment and flexibility – the ability to move sites or provision rapidly – are greatly in favour of MW radio over fibre and cabled alternatives." You can put microwave on a truck, but you can't tether a truck to a studio with a fiberoptic cable and have it drive very far. But if you have fixed stadium sites, fixed campus uplink site, and fixed central ESPN studio, you don't need mobility.



Better yet, buy one of those used trucks and put the equipment in a room connected to the stadiums by fiberoptic cable. Presto!

Yes fiber is doable also across campuses. I don't think it's cheaper though even if it's just across campus, but definitely it's not effected by weather, birds, trees, etc.

 

[billybud]

The ACC schools are building production capability...investing money:

FSU:

Seminole Productions will soon undergo an additional $2 million in state-of-the-art upgrades that include two more control rooms at the Moore Athletic Center. Last summer, the department completed $3 million in renovations that have enhanced the work flow for FSU sporting events.

Louisville:

The University of Louisville athletics department plans to build an $8 million production studio by 2019 to help meet the television broadcast needs of U of L's membership in the Atlantic Coast Conference and the soon-to-launch ACC Network.

NC State:

— North Carolina State is spending $6 million in part to turn a space inside its football headquarters — including ex-coach Chuck Amato’s old racquetball court — into a broadcast and production center, complete with a studio and control rooms for producing game day video and programming for the channel.

Wake:

— As part of its upgrades to Joel Coliseum, Wake Forest is building multiple control rooms so it won’t need those production trucks.


Duke:

— Built into Duke’s new five-story, 90,000-square-foot tower of luxury suites at the football stadium is room for production facilities for both the school’s online Blue Devil Network and the ACC’s. More than $10 million was spent on projects related to video production, including infrastructure, wiring, equipment and a video scoreboard that debuted last year, Duke deputy athletic director Mike Cragg said.

etc...etc...

Miami, Clemson, FSU and others have already completed studios/production spaces...all others have to be ready by 2019 according to contract (as announced by fSU AD).

 

[Rufus]

Two days, two national championships for the University of Maryland................Women's Lacrosse and Men's Lacrosse.

Doesn't seem like a bad addition to me.

 

[huskyrob1]

The ACC schools are building production capability...investing money:

FSU:

Seminole Productions will soon undergo an additional $2 million in state-of-the-art upgrades that include two more control rooms at the Moore Athletic Center. Last summer, the department completed $3 million in renovations that have enhanced the work flow for FSU sporting events.

Louisville:

The University of Louisville athletics department plans to build an $8 million production studio by 2019 to help meet the television broadcast needs of U of L's membership in the Atlantic Coast Conference and the soon-to-launch ACC Network.

NC State:

— North Carolina State is spending $6 million in part to turn a space inside its football headquarters — including ex-coach Chuck Amato’s old racquetball court — into a broadcast and production center, complete with a studio and control rooms for producing game day video and programming for the channel.

Wake:

— As part of its upgrades to Joel Coliseum, Wake Forest is building multiple control rooms so it won’t need those production trucks.


Duke:

— Built into Duke’s new five-story, 90,000-square-foot tower of luxury suites at the football stadium is room for production facilities for both the school’s online Blue Devil Network and the ACC’s. More than $10 million was spent on projects related to video production, including infrastructure, wiring, equipment and a video scoreboard that debuted last year, Duke deputy athletic director Mike Cragg said.

etc...etc...

Miami, Clemson, FSU and others have already completed studios/production spaces...all others have to be ready by 2019 according to contract (as announced by fSU AD).

ESPN must be loving this, cuts down on their overhead by tens of millions. Hey maybe they didn't have to layoff the overpaid talking heads after all. Lol

 

[The Funster]

What does all this have to do with us being screwed?

UConn being screwed can be broadcast live to anywhere in the world, immediately.

 

[billybud]

ESPN must be loving this, cuts down on their overhead by tens of millions. Hey maybe they didn't have to layoff the overpaid talking heads after all. Lol

Probably been their model since rolling out the SECN...with the SEC schools producing...

They did put Paul Finebaum on the SEC Channel..

 

[Zissou]

Of the teams currently in the B1G, which is the last to win a Basketball Championship?

 

[4in16]

Of the teams currently in the B1G, which is the last to win a Basketball Championship?

Maryland in 2002 (Obviously ACC), Michigan St in 2000, 89 Michigan. PAC 12 drought is longer AZ in 97 and UCLA in 95 are only titles post Wooden.

 

[Zissou]

Maryland in 2002 (Obviously ACC), Michigan St in 2000, 89 Michigan. PAC 12 drought is longer AZ in 97 and UCLA in 95 are only titles post Wooden.

Maryland is correct! (see title of thread)

 

[billybud]

Sooo...17 years since a B1G BB championship? Did not realize it has been so long.

UConn has won three in that interim, as has UNC.

 

[huskyrob1]

Sooo...17 years since a B1G BB championship? Did not realize it has been so long.

UConn has won three in that interim, as has UNC.

Yeah but how many final fours or final eights have Big Ten teams been to since the breakup of the Big East, compared to the Big East as it is now.

 

[billybud]

In the short years of the New Big East BB play...They have one national championship with Nova...and Nova was their lone entrant into final fours...

Wisconsin (X2) and Michigan State have made the final four in that period.