Tennessee goes down to... wait for it... Virginia Tech

[DobbsRover2]

UTenn has now dropped back to #35 in Massey with Miss. State the team right ahead of them, and even further back in Sagarin to #43 with Arkansas State, Ohio and Syracuse rated just ahead. But for those who worship the brain-damaged RPI, the Vols are still a fairly powerful #6, one spot ahead of Baylor and five ahead of #11 ND.

Still, these are unprecedented times in UTenn's ratings. At this point even the AP and Coaches Poll voters may drop the Vols out of the Top 10, though they could of course point to the RPI rating to move them up two spots in the rankings.

 

[Bigpetunia]

I said before the season this LV team had disaster written all over it. I thought disaster meant them riding the Sweet 16/Elite 8 line. Now I am feeling I over under estimated the extent of the problems.

Well, you were obviously pretty prescient! I, on the other hand, never very good at prognosticating, really thought this was going to be a breakout year for them, or, at the very least, the ultimate proving ground for Holly because of all the apparent talent on the roster. I knew DD was likely uncoachable, but I saw the Cooper kid play over the summer and was quite impressed. I figured with Mercedes coming back healthy, etc., etc., adding it all up, they really had the basis for something special. Now I know we UConn fans are spoiled by great coaching. But I have to say I've been shocked by Holly's ineffectiveness, especially on the offensive end. Anyway, if you saw this horror show in advance, more power to you!

 

[Rocket009]

Has anyone ever seen any indication that Catchings wants to or can coach. Many great players have been tremendous failures as coaches. Trying to find an untested and no experience alum to coach the LV is not an approach I would take.

Anne Donovan is looking for a job. She could start next week.

 

[Wbbfan1]

Monday almost Noon Time and still no Margo video. She must really need to unwind, relax and gather her thoughts after yesterday's Lady Vol loss. Usually her videos would be up by now.

 

[EricLA]

I'm with BigP - I never predicted that a team with this much talent might not even make the sweet 16. Heck, we had Tenn fans on here all summer and early in the year talking about how incredible the team was and that not only did they expect to make the FF, but with all that talent, they expected to possibly win the NC next season (given that most agreed UCONN was the team to beat this year).

Getting back to Tony's point and tangentially Ice's, I think most would agree that coaching is a huge problem there, but also, they have recruited top players who reportedly aren't that team oriented. DD and Cooper have been reported as more "me first" players. I'm not saying they aren't capable of passing the ball, but when you 2, or even 3 or 4, players on a team who are more interested in "me" and less in "team", combined with a weak head coach, it's a recipe for disaster.

The kids on Tenn probably never would have come to UCONN (or ND or Baylor), but I find it hard to imagine Geno or Muffet or Kim being unable to exert control over the kids. Over the years Geno has benched superstars like Diana, Sveta, Tina and even Stewie and Morgan when they did not play the way he expected/wanted. I don't recall if he ever got on Maya like that but point is he's done it.

I've read that Holly is more interested in being "friends" with the players than being their coach. I can't speak to that but it appears that there may be at least a little truth to that. If she's more concerned about keeping players happy than in coaching the team, then Tennessee will continue to be dysfunctional, and it will get worse once Russell and Deshields leave.

Is this a program that Harper really wants to be part of? What about other top recruits? if the team is this bad with the AA's currently on the roster, I can't imagine why a top kid would want to go there...

 

[CocoHusky]

Catchings needs to coach the Lady Vols. Period. She is retiring and could really bring the fire back. THE BEST LADY VOL EVER!

Love Catchings but she's not better than Parker.

 

[Icebear]

Well, you were obviously pretty prescient! I, on the other hand, never very good at prognosticating, really thought this was going to be a breakout year for them, or, at the very least, the ultimate proving ground for Holly because of all the apparent talent on the roster. I knew DD was likely uncoachable, but I saw the Cooper kid play over the summer and was quite impressed. I figured with Mercedes coming back healthy, etc., etc., adding it all up, they really had the basis for something special. Now I know we UConn fans are spoiled by great coaching. But I have to say I've been shocked by Holly's ineffectiveness, especially on the offensive end. Anyway, if you saw this horror show in advance, more power to you!

There has been absolutely no cohesiveness in the team for several years. Diamond was only going to add to that issue. No one at TN for a decade or more has known how to coach a modern offensive scheme. Pat struggled with it the last 6-8 years and sought help from Harry and then some NBA types. Even the Parker era was marked by less than great offensive flow and play. Clearly the team has not been listening to the coaching staff if the staff has any idea about what to do because it isn't showing up on the floor. The final straw was when I saw them struggle against a not very good PSU team to an 8 point win. Ever since across 8 home games to start the season the team has struggled and looked worse.

 

[HuskyNan]

as someone who sits in the stands, I will say this: give the ball to Diamond and let do what she wants. the other guards, aside from cooper, are as timid as a mouse. at least DD isn't scared to fail. they are.

That may win you a bunch of regular season games but no league or national championship.

 

[msf22b]

Well, they're going to Wichita State for their next game
A team even more dysfunctional then they are (if that is possible).
Four members quit over the summer over abuse claims.
All of last season's starters are gone.
And the team is hard pressed to win anything.
Of course, if the UTenn mob is determined to demonstrate its collective passivity
Anything could happen.

Still no Margo (12:07)

 

[VAMike23]

Well, they're going to Wichita State for their next game A team even more dysfunctional then they are (if that is possible). Four members quit over the summer over abuse claims. All of last season's starters are gone. And the team is hard pressed to win anything. Of course, if the UTenn mob is determined to demonstrate its collective passivity Anything could happen. Still no Margo (12:07)

I love it -- we're on "Margo watch" LOL



She's probably still being revived with smelling salts after watching that LV performance. I'm confident, however, that when she comes to, she'll make a great commentary on this one.

 

[DobbsRover2]

Another rating for UTenn comes in at #72 in the Warren Nolan index, though early in each season Nolan is always a bit crazy, and any ratings that would have Missouri, Stanford, and USC (the Cal one) following UConn in the 2-3-4 spots has some data to work through. But the Vols' #72 rating coupled with a current #8 ranking in AP\Coaches is a bit jarring.

The big question entering the season for the Vols was how the team would integrate DD on a team with a very bendable and not terribly astute coach. The optimistic analogy pushed by all the Vol fans here was Parker and her loyal coterie, but those circumstances were very different, and something more akin to hyper Simmons-ball seemed just as likely a scenario. Actions and non-actions speak louder than the optimistic words of preseason, and the chances of avoiding a double-digit loss season based on the SEC gauntlet of away games alone against teams that have a lot of payback stored up seems remote, and of course TBA is no longer a safe haven and there's some guaranteed OOC losses. Hitting rock bottom is often the best way to turn the direction forcefully around to get back to the top, but the Vols will likely also be denied that too as they will be just productive enough to allow some ivy league types down south to always proclaim that the team is one rebound away from being able to compete successfully against UConn.

And yes, playing a 1-5 #224 rated Wichita State team is just the antidote needed for fixing all problems and getting everything sorted out for the rest of the season. The following games at OSU and Stanford may be a little more problematic.

 

[Nuyoika]

I kind of feel bad for Graves. She seems like she works so hard.

 

[Gus Mahler]

Wasn't it just last spring that people were commending Holly for keeping the program at the same level it was in Pat's final years? And that last year's team was the best one she'd had, with FF potential till Izzy got hurt? Then she got a contract extension?

Fame is fleeting.

 

[msf22b]

I kind of feel bad for Graves. She seems like she works so hard.

Always liked that kid, especially when she teamed up with Stewie, Mo and Morgan on the National team.
I remember a wonderful pix of them palling around in some hallway, tight as brothers and happy as heck.

What a disaster her college experience has been, what a shame.

 

[UcMiami]

Love Catchings but she's not better than Parker.

Talent wise it is a close run thing, but heart, leadership, sweat, and never taking a second off in any game she has ever played tilts the balance in favor of Catchings - one of the all time greats in both college and the pros.

I kind of feel bad for Graves. She seems like she works so hard.

Agree - she is the one Vol player who I think has been 'destroyed' by the circus at TN and that I really feel for. She wants to be a great team player in a way that I don't sense many of the other players do.

 

[pinotbear]

Anne Donovan is looking for a job. She could start next week.

yeah, she could bring her "Larry Brown Revolving Door" punch card with her - one more job, and she gets a free gallon of milk!

 

[pinotbear]

I love it -- we're on "Margo watch" LOL



She's probably still being revived with smelling salts after watching that LV performance. I'm confident, however, that when she comes to, she'll make a great commentary on this one.

I think she's still prepping her notes and doing her research - as part of her work, she's running the comments in this thread through her computer, and Tony's post is making things difficult, what with spell-check and auto-correct. Margo's computer is an advanced model with artificial intelligence (probably an Apple), and has recommended some nice ESL classes for Tony.

(jes' kidding, jes' kidding, Tony: today's post is a classic in Tony-ese, and I just wanted to acknowledge it, somehow.)

 

[Nuyoika]

Talent wise it is a close run thing, but heart, leadership, sweat, and never taking a second off in any game she has ever played tilts the balance in favor of Catchings - one of the all time greats in both college and the pros.

Agree - she is the one Vol player who I think has been 'destroyed' by the circus at TN and that I really feel for. She wants to be a great team player in a way that I don't sense many of the other players do.

Yeah, Graves is a Vol player I have always liked.

 

[Waquoit]

As a lifetime Lady Vol fan, I'm embarrassed honestly. To have so many highly ranked recruits, and still look this awful is just wholly disappointing...I'm thinking now maybe 12-13 regular season losses and possibly missing out on the tournament..things will get worse before they get better I'm afraid

So why don't you guys just apologize to Geno and UConn already? You'll feel better and it may turn things around.

 

[EricLA]

So why don't you guys just apologize to Geno and UConn already? You'll feel better and it may turn things around.

I won't address the first part of your quote - Tenn fans feel that they did nothing wrong and there's nothing to apologize for. Instead I want to address the "turn things around" comment... Just my $.02 of course...

2017 is pretty much a make or break year for recruiting for Tennessee. After landing Graves, Tucker, Nared, Russell, Deshileds and Cooper (and I think there are 1 or 2 more AA's on the current team as well), they completely struck out in 2016. Not just struck out, but flamed out. They were on the short list for a whole slew of top kids, and ended up with none. In fact, they don't have a single recruit for 2016 - not even one outside the top 100.

I would not be surprised to see them go the JUCO route - they had some great success in the past with Bobbitt and Auguste, but even if they land one, she would generally only have 2 years eligibility and would effectively be part of the Dunbar, Middleton, Nared (and RS Deshields/Russel) class. That's a class of 5 and a JUCO won't last any longer than those kids at Tennessee.

Their freshman class really only consists of Cooper and Jackson, a Georgia kid, and a local Tennessee kid. With no one in 2016 this means they have 2 kids over a 2 year time period. To make matters worse, they are in danger (IMHO) of becoming a regional recruiting program. They have 3 kids on the roster from Tennessee, Georgia, and Oregon of all places. Then 2 from Illinois (perhaps Jolette Law's influence?). Tennessee and Georgia are still fairly talent rich places, especially Georgia, but if I were a Tenn fan, I'd be right on the edge of the cliff...

Aside from top 5 Kushkituah, I'm not sure who else Tenn is after, but I suspect the list is extensive. Given Tennessee's horrible season thus far even with all 3 of their superstars playing major minutes, if I'm a high school player, I'd be saying to myself "If I want to compete for NC's, I'm not sure that even I can resurrect that program". I have no idea what other top kids Tenn is looking at but I'm assuming it's almost all of them. Not a good time to be a LV fan...

 

[ricky]

Are the players protesting something? What do they want. I remember Diamond wanted to run the show. Why not let her have it?

 

[EricLA]

Are the players protesting something? What do they want. I remember Diamond wanted to run the show. Why not let her have it?

What makes you say that?

 

[Nuyoika]

I'd be more worried about some of the current players jumping ship than next years recruiting. If people start to leave it could look even worse than it does now. For all we know this could be a set up for a come back. The Lord only knows.

 

[ricky]

What makes you say that?

I faintly remember some article or anouncer quoting her indicating that she wanted to coach there.

 

[Bayareahusky]

Hard to believe that against Va Tech, the LVs scored 2 points total the last 8 1/2 minutes of the game... Wow