Sierra Calhoun eliminates Tennessee (merged thread)

[sofrito]

Am I missing something here? Discussing the rankings of Duke's and UConn's medical and law schools is relevant how? Sierra, will play college ball for 4 years and then probably professional ball in the USA and abroad for another 12 years. Therefore, 16 years from now if Sierra decides to have a career in law or medicine she may be looking at which university has a good law school or medical school. So, how is the rankings of Duke's and UConn's law and medical school relevant to Sierra's decision as to where she should play basketball during her undergraduate years?

Actually it is very relevant because of Duke's CAPE Program:

"Coaches are aware of CAPE's drawing power for female athletes. "It's an amazing recruiting tool, because if you're premed and you're already looking at Duke, you have good grades, time-management skills, and you're a good athlete," Friedman says. "But Duke is the only place that has a program like this." He and Kruger are often asked to meet with top athletes during their recruiting visits. One such recruit was Kimberly Imbesi, now a Duke junior and the starting goalie on the women's lacrosse team. As a high-school All-American out of Bridgetown, New Jersey, Imbesi narrowed her college choices to Georgetown and Duke, both powerhouses in women's lacrosse."

http://www.dukemagazine.duke.edu/issues/050608/depspt.html

 

[cabbie191]

View attachment 3196

TDD: That was so exceptionally gracious and brotherly of you to loft a prayer for Calhoun coming to UConn! No wonder I like you as a guest poster on the BY!

 

[doggydaddy]

I can handle the hot seat as I express my opinions as I see them and have some knowledge that is not commonly known. As far as I'm aware there is nothing in writing about Sierra's willingness to verbal to UConn early in her High School year. Geno's reluctance to accept Taya's verbal has been in print and I'm sure some that doubt what I say can research the web to find it. I'm unwilling to do it at this time.

I happen to believe since Niele Ivey became an assistant coach at ND that they are the second best Women's BB program. They've picked up their recruiting and along with UConn are the best offensive teams in WBB. Their three consecutive Final Fours are no accident and it wouldn't surprise me to see them back at the Final Four again this year even with the loss of Skylar. They missed out on a Championship they should have won when they loss to Texas A&M after beating UConn. Any team that can beat UConn 7 out of 8 times IMHO deserves to be rated as the 2nd best WBB program. I can accept that some would have Stanford or even Duke rated above them. Notre Dame is not going away as long as Muffett and Niele Ivey are coaching at ND and that is why I currently have them rated above Stanford and Duke.

Oh please, you know people? You things that the most informed fan base doesn't?

You have presented the Reimer situation as fact SIX times in the last year without a link. YOU look it up. I'm calling BS until then.

That goes double BS on your Calhoun statement as well.

 

[pinotbear]

Why would Geno not accept verbals?

I don't think that it's Geno won't accept verbals - it's that he doesn't like to accept them too early, like from freshmen and sophomores. Somebody on the 'Yard can quote the exact situation, I suspect, but I believe some years back a sophomore made a verbal .. and, Geno took it at face value, and adjusted his recruiting accordingly...and, then once the prospective had another year of maturity or so under their belt, decided that her decision was premature. In short, I don't think Geno believes that verbals ought to be given too early - it is too often not a good decision, or at least a really well-thought-out one. He'd rather the prospect take a bit more time, so, when they give a verbal, he and she both feel that it's been given a proper consideration.

 

[MilfordHusky]

Pinot: I think it was Jackie Gemelos, who committed at age 15.

 

[doggydaddy]

Here is an article from March of Reiner's soph year. At this point, she had an offer.

http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls-basketball/story/_/id/6266609/confidence-catching-up

 

[UConn990411]

Don't have good feelings about Sierra and UConn. Wouldn't surprise me to see her end up at the 2nd best Women's program which is Notre Dame. I see a similar situation that there was with Taya Reimer who wanted to verbal to UConn and Geno didn't accept it and she ends up at Notre Dame. Sierra was ready to verbal to UConn a year or so ago and Geno didn't accept it. Could history repeat itself, I hope not. Fishy and others have said don't worry Sierra will end up at UConn, I'm not sure. Both Sierra and the Coaching staff may believe that UConn is not the ideal fit for this extremely talented player. I am happy that Sierra has eliminated the Lady Vols.

You don't have a good feeling about any recruits, any games or any seasons.

If your feelings came to fruition, UConn would have 0 national championships.

 

[doggydaddy]

Another article from March of her sophomore year.

http://blogs.courant.com/uconn_womens_basketball/2011/03/indianapolis-star-taya-reimer.html

 

[ASweet3781]

You don't have a good feeling about any recruits, any games or any seasons.

If your feelings came to fruition, UConn would have 0 national championships.

Post of the summer.

 

[Geno-ista]

I can handle the hot seat as I express my opinions as I see them and have some knowledge that is not commonly known. As far as I'm aware there is nothing in writing about Sierra's willingness to verbal to UConn early in her High School year. Geno's reluctance to accept Taya's verbal has been in print and I'm sure some that doubt what I say can research the web to find it. I'm unwilling to do it at this time.

I happen to believe since Niele Ivey became an assistant coach at ND that they are the second best Women's BB program. They've picked up their recruiting and along with UConn are the best offensive teams in WBB. Their three consecutive Final Fours are no accident and it wouldn't surprise me to see them back at the Final Four again this year even with the loss of Skylar. They missed out on a Championship they should have won when they loss to Texas A&M after beating UConn. Any team that can beat UConn 7 out of 8 times IMHO deserves to be rated as the 2nd best WBB program. I can accept that some would have Stanford or even Duke rated above them. Notre Dame is not going away as long as Muffett and Niele Ivey are coaching at ND and that is why I currently have them rated above Stanford and Duke.

I think there is no question N Dame has been more dominant than Stanford and Duke and Tenn since the Skylar years. They look like a mirror image of us for the last 3-4 yrs. Actually, they were more experienced and much deeper than us Maya's senior yr and the yr after.i think they were slightly better than us- but this year we were a better team- and finally won the big game after those earlier games!!!!

 

[EricSD]

I think there is no question N Dame has been more dominant than Stanford and Duke and Tenn since the Skylar years. They look like a mirror image of us for the last 3-4 yrs. Actually, they were more experienced and much deeper than us Maya's senior yr and the yr after.i think they were slightly better than us- but this year we were a better team- and finally won the big game after those earlier games!!!!

Tennessee hasn't really been a blip on the radar for the past 4-5 years. There are at least 10 teams who have been better than Tenn over the past 5 years. Heck, going out in the 1st round of the NCAA's to Ball State indicates there were at least 32 teams better than them (more or less) that season.

UCONN, Baylor, Notre Dame, Duke, Stanford, aTm, Maryland, Louisville, Kentucky, Cal, Penn State, and maybe a few others... In fact, that's probably the order of the top 10 or so programs over the past 5 years.

 

[Vowelguy]

Tennessee hasn't really been a blip on the radar for the past 4-5 years. There are at least 10 teams who have been better than Tenn over the past 5 years. Heck, going out in the 1st round of the NCAA's to Ball State indicates there were at least 32 teams better than them (more or less) that season.

UCONN, Baylor, Notre Dame, Duke, Stanford, aTm, Maryland, Louisville, Kentucky, Cal, Penn State, and maybe a few others... In fact, that's probably the order of the top 10 or so programs over the past 5 years.

Other than the ball st year, Tenn has been a 1 or 2 seed. Definitely would have them ahead of penn st, cal.

 

[jplotinus]

Not truly relevant when discussing undergrad.

That said, Duke (8) and ND (17) both rank higher than UConn (63) in the most recent US News and World Report undergrad college rankings, FWIW.

The above is rather telling. The information shows:

1- an important area where improvement is needed; and
2- a factor to be reckoned with in conference affiliation lamentation.

To put it plainly and positively, UCONN is working on improving its academic standing and is having success in doing so. It ranks higher now than it did in the past. It has a good chance of reaching the top 30 within <5 years.

For an elite recruit, like Sierra Calhoun, basketball is obviously important to her. That is her defining skill as a teenager. Athletic skills generally, and bb skills specifically, diminish as a person ages. Skills beyond athletic skills need to be developed in order to increase one's social utility beyond basketball.

The difference between the rankings are probably rather trivial in terms of what a student actually learns. UCONN has, I believe , close to a 100% graduation rate for its wbb players.

Perhaps it would be good to research life outcomes for former players as a way of demonstrating the value of a UCONN degree and as a way of countering the USNews ranking disparity.

 

[Ozzie Nelson]

The above is rather telling. The information shows:

1- an important area where improvement is needed; and
2- a factor to be reckoned with in conference affiliation lamentation.

To put it plainly and positively, UCONN is working on improving its academic standing and is having success in doing so. It ranks higher now than it did in the past. It has a good chance of reaching the top 30 within <5 years.

For an elite recruit, like Sierra Calhoun, basketball is obviously important to her. That is her defining skill as a teenager. Athletic skills generally, and bb skills specifically, diminish as a person ages. Skills beyond athletic skills need to be developed in order to increase one's social utility beyond basketball.

The difference between the rankings are probably rather trivial in terms of what a student actually learns. UCONN has, I believe , close to a 100% graduation rate for its wbb players.

Perhaps it would be good to research life outcomes for former players as a way of demonstrating the value of a UCONN degree and as a way of countering the USNews ranking disparity.

"Athletic skills generally, and bb skills specifically, diminish as a person ages"

Hold the presses!!!

 

[jplotinus]

Further to college comparison, here's a listing that differs dramatically from USNews, but which still has Uconn at a middling #105. Fret not, Tenn is #267.

Source:

http://blog.lumosity.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Lumositys-Smartest-Colleges.pdf

 

[doggydaddy]

Perhaps it would be good to research life outcomes for former players as a way of demonstrating the value of a UCONN degree and as a way of countering the USNews ranking disparity.

Gee, I wonder if Geno has thought of this when he recruits players and trys to sell them on coming to UConn. Using former players success as a recruiting tool. I sure hope Geno sees this.

 

[JS]

To put it plainly and positively, UCONN is working on improving its academic standing and is having success in doing so. It ranks higher now than it did in the past. It has a good chance of reaching the top 30 within <5 years.

Yes, UConn has been rising steadily on the overall list that includes the likes of Duke and ND.

However, I prefer to compare UConn's academic standing with that of its peers among public universities, not with the picky-choosy, highly endowed per student, smaller class private schools.

Among the public national universities, UConn is already highly ranked at #21. Basketball-wise, of the public universities that finished in the top 25 last season, only Cal, UCLA and (by a skootch) Maryland outranked UConn academically.

 

[jplotinus]

"Athletic skills generally, and bb skills specifically, diminish as a person ages"

Hold the presses!!!

No, let the presses run, Ozzie. You are badly missing the point and what was posted was not obvious by any means.

Let me put this a little more plainly, so that it can be more readily understood by all.

Elite athletes, even as adults, let alone as teenagers, have a heck of a lot of difficulty in grasping the temporary nature of their athletic gifts.

Making plans for post athletic life does not come easy. As you may know the vast majority of retired professional bb players are broke, busted and bankrupt within 5 years after retirement, no matter how much money they may have made.

 

[jplotinus]

Yes, UConn has been rising steadily on the overall list that includes the likes of Duke and ND.

However, I prefer to compare UConn's academic standing with that of its peers among public universities, not with the picky-choosy, highly endowed per student, smaller class private schools.

Among the public national universities, UConn is already highly ranked at #21. Basketball-wise, of the public universities that finished in the top 25 last season, only Cal, UCLA and (by a skootch) Maryland outranked UConn academically.

Quite true, JS. The problem with your analysis, as I see it, is not that it demonstrates a comparative advantage for UCONN, but rather, it says, if read closely, that a kid who has received an offer from one-a-them "picky-choosy, highly endowed per student, smaller class private schools" would be wise to accept it.

That is what I would advise my granddaughters to do.

Just sayin'

 

[Ozzie Nelson]

No, let the presses run, Ozzie. You are badly missing the point and what was posted was not onvious by any means.

Let me put this a little more plainly, so that it can be more readily understood by all.

Elite athletes, even as adults, let alone as teenagers, have a heck of a lot of difficulty in grasping the temporary nature of their athletic gifts.

Making plans for post athletic life does not come easy. As you may know the vast majority of retired professional bb players are broke, busted and bankrupt within 5 years after retirement, no matter how much money they may have made.

"Let me put this a little more plainly, so that it can be more readily understood by all. "

Thanks for the literary explanation needed to overcome my cognitive impairment. Unfortunately, this intellectual deficit does not, apparently, diminish with age…so please be patient with me, and any of the “all” here at The BoneYard.

 

[jplotinus]

"Let me put this a little more plainly, so that it can be more readily understood by all. "

Thanks for the literary explanation needed to overcome my cognitive impairment. Unfortunately, this intellectual deficit does not, apparently, diminish with age…so please be patient with me, and any of the “all” here at The BoneYard.

Ozzie,

Get over it. Do you wish to engage on the factors that make UCONN the best choice, overall, for Sierra, despite some areas of advantage for her other finalists, or would you prefer to discuss something else entirely?

 

[Ozzie Nelson]

Just having some fun. It just seems to me that you need a poke in your overblown balloon.

As for SC’s recruiting, I avoid posting on the topic since I am clueless...the choice is hers and I have no idea what the personal
parameters of consideration might be. Let me know when she decides…

 

[jplotinus]

Just having some fun. It just seems to me that you need a poke in your overblown balloon.

As for SC’s recruiting, I avoid posting on the topic since I am clueless...the choice is hers and I have no idea what the personal
parameters of consideration might be. Let me know when she decides…

Ok, fair enough. Of the recent postings, the one that jumps out a me the most and the one I find most thought provoking is that of JS:


"...the picky-choosy, highly endowed per student, smaller class private schools."

That is a tuffy. Quite literally, a scholarship at a school of the quoted sort IS more valuable than one from a state school. Tuition room/board costs more at such schools--a lot more.

It is to be recalled that [name on tip of tongue] From Oklahoma promised to repay her $60,000 scholarship if Oklahoma didn't win a NC. I think she meant her entire 4 year scholarship. That sum is about the value of 1 year at an Ivy or other elite private school.

The only way I know of to counter that advantage is to point out that not everyone is comfortable in an environment that includes kids who, to put it politely, have grown up in circumstances of wealth and privilege and entitlement.

On the other hand, a top notch state school can be and often is a much more comfortable and rewarding environment to be in.

 

[Ozzie Nelson]

Ok, fair enough. Of the recent postings, the one that jumps out a me the most and the one I find most thought provoking is that of JS:


"...the picky-choosy, highly endowed per student, smaller class private schools."

That is a tuffy. Quite literally, a scholarship at a school of the quoted sort IS more valuable than one from a state school. Tuition room/board costs more at such schools--a lot more.

It is to be recalled that [name on tip of tongue] From Oklahoma promised to repay her $60,000 scholarship if Oklahoma didn't win a NC. I think she meant her entire 4 year scholarship. That sum is about the value of 1 year at an Ivy or other elite private school.

The only way I know of to counter that advantage is to point out that not everyone is comfortable in an environment that includes kids who, to put it politely, have grown up in circumstances of wealth and privilege and entitlement.

On the other hand, a top notch state school can be and often is a much more comfortable and rewarding environment to be in.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Courtney_Paris

 

[JS]

a kid who has received an offer from one-a-them "picky-choosy, highly endowed per student, smaller class private schools" would be wise to accept it.

That is what I would advise my granddaughters to do.

'

Please note that we reserve the right to lord it over certain other public universities on the basis of academics, while denying academics are the end all and be all when comparing UConn with the Stanfords and Dukes of this world.

Yeah, I'm threading the needle here, but even looking at it solely from academics (which is rarely the case when we're talking recruiting), it depends on the student.

I've known kids who chose a public university (including UConn, including in my own family) over a highly selective private college because they wanted a bigger school that they perceived as having a more relaxed and diverse social scene and/or less ultra-competitive academic pressure.

Also know of an excellent basketball player who transferred out of an academically elite private school in part for similar reasons (students there were "snobby, full of themselves"). Not meant as a broad indictment, but that can be the perception for some.

For a student-athlete who wants great basketball combined with highly rated (but not rarified level) public university academics, UConn is an outstanding choice.

That's my advertisement, currently running in selected markets. Am always working on the next campaign.

 

[Harry Mangurian]

Re. comments made in the Sierra Calhoun thread: (I will now run for cover)

You can get an excellent education at UCONN and most anywhere if you are willing to work but
please let's not kid ourselves about where we stand. I think UCONN is the best place for a top player in WCBB if they want a NC or a pro career, but let's concede one thing:

UCONN vs DUKE


#63
University of Connecticut
Storrs, CT
A public institution, University of Connecticut was founded in 1881. University of Connecticut offers a Greek system, where 11.0 percent of the student body is involved in a sorority and 9.0 percent is involved in a fraternity.The University of Connecticut has many graduate offerings, including the highly ranked Neag School of Education,


Duke University
#8

Durham, NC
Located in Durham, N.C., Duke University is a private institution that has liberal arts and engineering programs for undergraduates. Its graduate programs include the highly ranked Fuqua School of Business, Pratt School of Engineering, School of Law, School of Medicine, Sanford School of Public Policy, and School of Nursing.

 

[DavidinNaples]

JS.....agree completely...would add that IMO not every student at Duke or Stanford gets the same "rarified" education..in fact, Duke offers an Art History major....my daughter goes to Univ. of South Florida (USF), is in the Honors College, has had fabulous professors, Econ and Public Admin. double major w/ minor in business, probably will get a masters, 4.0 gpa... (my apologies for being such a proud dad)...my point is she turned down Ivy League to stay closer to home and still getting a superior education from a "lower ranked" school....

 

[UConnCat]

This information appeared in the other, ongoing thread, no? UConn is not the equivalent of Duke academically. We get it.

 

[Harry Mangurian]

I looked at the S. Calhoun thread early on and only saw the post saying UCONN = Duke.

p.s. I have an irrational dislike for Duke BB sparked by:

- my daughter went to grad school at UNC and I saw the Duke fans in action at their favorite rooftop haunt in Chapel Hill.
- Christian Laettner

 

[EricSD]

Other than the ball st year, Tenn has been a 1 or 2 seed. Definitely would have them ahead of penn st, cal.

In 2009 they went out in the first round. the following year the sweet 16. since then they have not made it past the elite 8. you may be right about PSU and Cal, altho at least Cal made it to a final 4. But there are still 8-9 other programs that have more success in the past 5 years than Tennessee. But you are right - I totally did over-exaggerate with saying they weren't a "blip" on the radar...

With regards to the whole UCONN vs. Duke/ND thing - I can't believe the argument has gone on as long as it has. As Cat said, EVERYONE knows those 2 schools are ranked academically higher than UCONN. It was one reason Williams chose Duke over UCONN. But as people have posted over the years, there are tons of reasons a kid chooses a college.

Coaching, teammates, chance to win a NC, proximity to home, education, best chance to develop, weather, campus, town the school is in, TV coverage, pressure from coaches, friends, parents, promises of playing time and other promises from the coaching staff, etc etc etc. A kid really can't go wrong with any of those choices (UCONN, Duke, ND). Frankly, I'd be sad if she chooses one of those other schools, but she's not a Wilson, Turner, Mitchell, or Tuck, Jefferson, Stewart type of player.