Rumor from CSNBBS Conference Realignment board

[SouthronCross]

I think what's happened is that FSU has turned out to be an ACC team--i.e., a good fanbase, but not a deep fanbase composed of people who think FSU represents them in a blood and soil sort of way like your upper tier B1G and SEC fandoms. Deep fanbases can sell out a an 80000 seat stadium on a Duke, Wake, BC, etc. diet. ACC fanbases cannot. Without the Bowden mojo FSU is in the process of reverting back to their new baseline--not the pre-Bowden irrelevance, but not Alabama or LSU either. (Still that's a better baseline than their old enemy Miami, who, it turns out, doesn't have _any_ fans post their glory years. I mean BC might have a bigger longterm fandom.)

One ACC team can, and, that is Clemson. They are the best fanbase in the ACC, hands down. I do not hear any excuses coming from them about attendance. Back when the ACC was a 7- and 8-team league, they BEGGED UNC, NCSU, UVA, and, UMD to invest more money into football. That the league as a whole would benefit from it. Nobody listened then, and, the league paid for it.

FSU seem to be back on the road to becoming a regualr 10-win team. They've made good strides over the past 2-3 seasons, and, I expect that again this season. What they do not have anymore, is the element of fear that they used to strike into their opponents, especially on offense. They could explode for 21 points almost at the drop of the hat in those early days (as could Miami).

Miami could do much better if they had an on-campus stadium. But, the city of Coral Gables won't have anything to do with that. Heck, if they still had the old Orange Bowl around, that'd stand them in better stead than what they have now. Which is nothing. Playing in the Dolphins' stadium is a major hindrance for them. Even if they had just a 40,000-seat facility, it'd be WAY better than playing in one 20 miles from campus.

 

[junglehusky]

Awwww man you woke up the beast now we'll have a 40 page thread on why can't UConn have an on campus stadium!

 

[hthusky74]

That is a good explanation, though I think geography counts against us, at least with FSU / Clemson / Miami. Not that the area around louisville is a recruiting hotbed that much more than CT / NE / NYC, maybe a bit, but its geography a) somewhat reinforces the (recent) positive perception around louisville's football program b) can't hurt them as far as being closer to a southern cultural fit. Having not spent time in the South apart from trips to Orlando and New Orleans, I can't say whether Lou-uh-vuhl is considered authentically southern by those schools, but I'll bet it's at least not as authentically Yankee as CT.

As someone who went to grad school at Tennessee and whose brother went to GT and lives outside of Atlanta, I can assure you that Louisville is considered southern. If nothing else, they fought on the right side in the war.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

As someone who went to grad school at Tennessee and whose brother went to GT and lives outside of Atlanta, I can assure you that Louisville is considered southern. If nothing else, they fought on the right side in the war.

Kentucky like Maryland although slave States officially fought for the north. These states provided soldiers for both sides.

They were part of the brother against brother aspect of the war.




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[AZHuskiePop]

I understand that POV, I just don't agree with it is all. There is no guarantee that if we ever need a No 16, that UConn will still be available.

Once it was clear that PSU would no longer have been an option, then, Swofford could have convinced the league to add both UL and UConn. The football schools get something that they want, and, ACC basketball adds two more national powers. Win-win for the league, and, any possible future ACCN gets even more content.

Just my two cents.

Tha
Well the ACC commissioner made that very statement.
Not knowing whether it was s lie or not I will take him at face value.

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[hthusky74]

Kentucky like Maryland although slave States officially fought for the north. These states provided soldiers for both sides.

They were part of the brother against brother aspect of the war.




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You make an excellent point. You might find this article about Knoxville interesting. Yet all that said, if you don't think UT is a southern school, you'd be sadly mistaken. Same goes for UK and UL. http://knoxcotn.org/about-knox-county/31-history/221-lincolnites-and-rebels

 

[SouthronCross]

Awwww man you woke up the beast now we'll have a 40 page thread on why can't UConn have an on campus stadium!

Sorry, dude.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

Perception?

Rutgers sucks. Where are they now?

It's about $. And other stuff.

in their case they gave the perception that they could deliver a good chunk of NY plus 9,5000,000 NJ residents.
Don't assume perception is based on only one criteria.l

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[jdb50]

There was a perception that if the ACC didn't act on Louisville the Big 12 would.
The perception was also that UConn would be available if ever that needed them.
UConn leadership made a huge mistake in giving this impression.


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Pop, Our leadership has been criticized for many things but saying if you take Louisville not us that's fine we'll wait by the phone for the next call is not one of them. Other than continuing to upgrade our academics and win on the field and court we have no play here, we aren't doing the inviting. I think that our hoops upside is going to be the main factor in us getting a call. There is a huge opportunity for PP and his team to make a statement this year that will reinforce the thing that we all know, UConn football is just getting started and hasn't topped out.

 

[SouthronCross]

in their case they gave the perception that they could deliver a good chunk of NY plus 9,5000,000 NJ residents.
Don't assume perception is based on only one criteria.l

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We all know that Rutgers is only in the B1G because of geography. It sure isn't because of their great athletic accomplishments.

OTOH, Maryland at least has some hardware in their trophy case to show for their efforts.

 

[Adios]

UMD certainly doesn't have any powerhouse or historic programs. Besides maybe lacrosse.

 

[coachcap]

UMD certainly doesn't have any powerhouse or historic programs. Besides maybe lacrosse.

Cuing Lefty Driesell & Gary Williams...

 

[SouthronCross]

UMD certainly doesn't have any powerhouse or historic programs. Besides maybe lacrosse.

UMD might not have the national titles in hoops that UConn does, but, while Lefty Drisell was there in the '70s and '80s, the Terps were one of the ACC's best programs, and, they were relevant nationally. Gary Williams did win a title for them. And, I think they'll do more than ok in the B1G with Mark Turgeon. The Terps' lacrosse program speaks for itself. Their football program does have two national titles. Granted, they are from the 1950s, but, they still have them. And, the Baltimore-Washington corridor produces good talent in football and basketball, so, they have those recruiting grounds going for them, too.

So, they have at least something to show for their efforts over time, unlike Rutgers.

 

[Waquoit]

I believe this is called the "Bargaining" stage. Next up is Depression.

I'm already at acceptance.

 

[RegisteredUconn]

UMD certainly doesn't have any powerhouse or historic programs. Besides maybe lacrosse.

Maryland is the only school to have won national championships in football (mythical, though it may be), men's basketball, and women's basketball.

 

[SubbaBub]

I'm already at acceptance.

You need to learn to multi-task. I've only moved off denial (this can't happen to us). Anger (at the whole mess), Bargaining (for something good to happen), Depression (at the thought that it might not) and Acceptance (that we are stuck in the AAC until something does) are still at full burn.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

UMD certainly doesn't have any powerhouse or historic programs. Besides maybe lacrosse.

True but in terms of college basketball, after the top dozen programs (where we fall) they can claim to be as relevant and significant as any. Also, the top dozen doesn't cover 20% of the power five. Add a football title to the mix and they can claim some gravitas and veritas. If we had done in football over the past dozen years that they had, most of our fan base would have us as equal to the top third of B1G football programs. More importantly, if we had done in football over the past dozen years that they had, we'd be in the B1G today.

 

[CL82]

Slightly updated:

The Seven Stages of Conference Realignment

1. SHOCK & DENIAL-
You will probably react to learning that the "Big 5" is leaving the rest of the football schools behind with numbed disbelief. You may deny the reality of the loss at some level, in order to avoid the pain. Belief in a secret plan that will bring UConn to the Big 10 is typical in this stage. This may last for weeks.
2. PAIN & GUILT-
As the shock wears off, it is replaced with the suffering of unbelievable pain. Although excruciating and almost unbearable, it is important that you experience the pain fully, college sport scheduling seems chaotic and scary during this phase. Expect very little productivity during this stage as reading the Boneyard replaces normal functions such as work, talking with your spouse and bathing.
3. ANGER & BARGAINING-
Frustration gives way to anger, and you may lash out and lay blame for the lack of a decent conference on someone else. Many choose Warde Manual or Jeff Hathaway, others "UConn's friend Mark Emmert." This is a time for the release of bottled up emotion. You may rail against fate, questioning "Why UConn ?" You may also try to bargain in vain with the powers that be for a way out of your despair ("I will not complain about Syracuse’s cupcake basketball schedule anymore, if you just bring back the original Big East members.")
4. "DEPRESSION", REFLECTION, LONELINESS-
Just when your friends may think you should be getting on with your life, a long period of sad reflection will likely overtake you. During this time, you finally realize the true magnitude of your loss, and it depresses you. You may isolate yourself on purpose, and talk of “going independent in football” becomes the norm.
5. THE UPWARD TURN-
As you start to adjust to life without a meaningful conference affiliation, your life becomes a little calmer and more organized. Your physical symptoms lessen, and your "depression" begins to lift slightly. You actually start working at work again and your boss decides that he doesn’t need to fire you or upgrade the internet firewall.
6. RECONSTRUCTION & WORKING THROUGH-
As you become more functional, your mind starts working again, and you will find yourself seeking realistic solutions to problems posed by life without a decent conference. You will start to work on practical and financial problems and reconstructing your program, such as stadium expansion and focusing on third tier TV rights.
7. ACCEPTANCE & HOPE-
During this, the last of the seven stages of conference realignment, you learn to accept and deal with the reality of your situation. Acceptance does not necessarily mean instant happiness. Given the pain and turmoil you have experienced, you can never return to the carefree, untroubled YOU that existed before this tragedy. But you will find a way forward, unfortunately that may involve trips to Greenville, North Carolina, but you will survive.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

The interesting thing about this thread is I think most of us thought HFD's post was credible until we realized it was HFD. If another person had posted the same thing without the telltale evidence of HFD, we would still be discussing it gleefully right now. Which means that despite coming from HFD, this idea is not completely off the wall. BYU, Idaho and New Mexico State need opponents, which means if Cincinnati and us both bailed on the AAC, which I think is the smart move, there would be 4 teams locked in for scheduling, 2 of which were pretty strong programs. Could we assemble 8 games a year after that? You would need 5 more against quality competition, which would be difficult but not impossible.

The A10 would take us for all other sports if the Big East did not, which would probably force the Big East to take the 2 of us for all other sports. The A10 is a better basketball league than the AAC even with Memphis and Temple in the AAC.

Most importantly, get the rights to sell the whole schedule. Get a Boise deal with the A10. I don't think we would get $25MM, but $10 to $15MM is not out of the question.

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

If another person had posted the same thing without the telltale evidence of HFD, we would still be discussing it gleefully right now.

Speak for yourself. Some of us aren't gullible, suggestable, and prone to knee-jerk reactions.

 

[pj]

I think what's happened is that FSU has turned out to be an ACC team--i.e., a good fanbase, but not a deep fanbase composed of people who think FSU represents them in a blood and soil sort of way like your upper tier B1G and SEC fandoms. Deep fanbases can sell out a an 80000 seat stadium on a Duke, Wake, BC, etc. diet. ACC fanbases cannot. Without the Bowden mojo FSU is in the process of reverting back to their new baseline--not the pre-Bowden irrelevance, but not Alabama or LSU either. (Still that's a better baseline than their old enemy Miami, who, it turns out, doesn't have _any_ fans post their glory years. I mean BC might have a bigger longterm fandom.)

Don't forget that UCF and USF are emerging as major competitors for FSU. They are located in major media markets - Orlando and Tampa - close to Florida's population center. FSU is located in Tallahassee, far from the population centers. As the quality of USF/UCF football improves, they'll take fans away from FSU. These are large state schools with many alumni. FSU is a big but declining name.

 

[pj]

The interesting thing about this thread is I think most of us thought HFD's post was credible until we realized it was HFD. If another person had posted the same thing without the telltale evidence of HFD, we would still be discussing it gleefully right now. Which means that despite coming from HFD, this idea is not completely off the wall. BYU, Idaho and New Mexico State need opponents, which means if Cincinnati and us both bailed on the AAC, which I think is the smart move, there would be 4 teams locked in for scheduling, 2 of which were pretty strong programs. Could we assemble 8 games a year after that? You would need 5 more against quality competition, which would be difficult but not impossible.

The A10 would take us for all other sports if the Big East did not, which would probably force the Big East to take the 2 of us for all other sports. The A10 is a better basketball league than the AAC even with Memphis and Temple in the AAC.

Most importantly, get the rights to sell the whole schedule. Get a Boise deal with the A10. I don't think we would get $25MM, but $10 to $15MM is not out of the question.

It would be plausible if the money was a little lower, the university were located closer to NYC to give the Pac/SEC a more plausible NYC presence, and if the schedule were 4-5 years out. I think $6 mn for comprehensive cable rights plus $1 mn per game for national rights to 4 bball games and 2-3 football games gets us to $12-13.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

Speak for yourself. Some of us aren't gullible, suggestable, and prone to knee-jerk reactions.

There were elements of fact in that post. You don't believe fact?

There were elements of plausible events. I suppose a true sceptic would never accept these no matter how possible . It is a constraint on your intellect to reject the possible out of shear scepticism.
However there was the HFD flight of fancy which took fact and plausibility into the realm of fiction. The latter is what a true intellectual should beware of.
In a certain way a sceptic is no different than the gullable.
One rejects what may be possible and the other accepts fantasy.



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[Mr. Wonderful]

There were elements of fact in that post. You don't believe fact?

I'm wondering which facts you're referring to?

The presence of factual information does not make this plan easier to accept. It's not the facts that make me doubt.

There were elements of plausible events. I suppose a true sceptic would never accept these no matter how possible . It is a constraint on your intellect to reject the possible out of shear scepticism.

Plausible? Some of it was plausible. Some of it wasn't. Some key elements were implausible. I'm being kind by saying some of the key elements were merely implausible, by the way.

 

[babysheep]

In a certain way a sceptic is no different than the gullable.
One rejects what may be possible and the other accepts fantasy.



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That's like religious apologists asserting that atheism is basically a religion. It demonstrates a lack of understanding of the semantics.

The gullible person accepts something with no (or bad) evidence, while the skeptic will only be convinced by what they determine to good evidence. Obviously, none of us have seen any decent evidence that would lead us to get our hopes up because, since this all started, literally nothing has gone UConn's way. The only evidence that will make some yarders more apt to positive thinking (i.e. good evidence) will be Delaney personally inviting UConn to the B1G, and I think that's fairly understandable. This is a basic defense mechanism we're talking about here.