Our Fanbase Is Still Conflicted

[Jaker]

Here is the deal, with the new coaches salary and Ollie's buyout, it will cost the program about 12 million dollars to hire a new coach/ So unless AD knows he is going to hit a home run with a "proven" coach, I suspect Ollie will be on the bench for us next season.

 

[JeepCSC]

Current D1 coaches to have won a title: Izzo, K, Williams, Calipari, Ollie, Wright, Self, Boeheim. So that's 8 out of 351.

Of course the fanbase is still conflicted. And I don't buy the "winning with Calhoun's guys" argument. Urban Meyer's first title at UF was with Ron Zook's guys. So what?

Seems weird to be forgetting Tubby here.

And of course having to state which of Urban’s titles were won with Zook’s guys kind of defeats the point.

 

[Waquoit]

Why?

"The kids that ran out on him?"

 

[PAHusky]

Then you also missed the part where I said our guys have also only played college ball for four months.

If you don't think there's a difference between playing freshmen and playing juniors, then that's a "you" thing. I'm done arguing about this, though. I see many of our players improving and that tells me what I need to know at this point.

I never thought I would say the following sentence, but I hope to God we beat Villanova so that the UConn fans can shut up...

I do think there is a huge difference between freshman and juniors. My point remains that KO is responsible for the construction of the roster. We don't have a ton of upperclassmen because he built the roster that way and he had trouble retaining kids in the offseason. Again, holes in the roster are KO's responsibility.

To address your last point - everyone on this board save for an incredibly small and deluded minority want UConn to win on Saturday and then again every game they play for the rest of the year. The insinuation that the "fire Ollie" crowd are somehow lesser fans of the program because we don't "support" KO is laughable and insulting. It's the opposite - I think many of us feel that he's a great guy, and appreciate what he's done for the program, but think that going forward what's best for UConn basketball is a change in leadership.

 

[sportsmatter1]

So I’ve been reading through the threads and am surprised to realize that a significant % are not yet convinced that KO must go. It’s going to take more 20-30 point blowouts to drag over those keep KO’ers. Cincy, Temple and Wichita are all possibilities for those. What’s more important is what our AD and school president need to be convinced? Will there still be a question by season end or is this pretty much a done deal now? After our win the other day I thought Tim Welch was President of the KO fan club which I do not understand.

I was watching the game and not sure if anyone else noticed that Pete G, sighed or said "Oh My, or My Gosh" each time UCONN did something bad or inconsistent.. he might have well said, "Geesh, these guys are horrible!" He didn't but kept saying, "kevin is a great coach, he will figure this out and fix it." Oh boy!

 

[Towney007]

Here is the deal, with the new coaches salary and Ollie's buyout, it will cost the program about 12 million dollars to hire a new coach/ So unless AD knows he is going to hit a home run with a "proven" coach, I suspect Ollie will be on the bench for us next season.

I'm not singling you out, but I can't honestly believe people think this. That when faced to make a choice between deep sixing their program and any and all money making potential it'd have going forward and actively avoiding a buy out - that they'd completely flush it all down the drain on $9 million. The school had no national reputation before the hoops program became big time. Now it's among the best schools in the country.

And people do realize institutions and teams take insurances out on contracts, right? That procurement laws basically dictate that they can't sign these kinds of deals without an ability to pay them, right?

Of course no one WANTS to spend $9 million so that someone doesn't coach your team next year; but when you have to - you have to. And they will and they'll find the money if they don't already have it. It's been one of the best state-funded educational institutions in the entire country even with deep funding cuts and people think they're going to have trouble coming up with $9 million.

And that's all assuming Ollie just doesn't walk away. Or negotiate a settlement. Both of which are possible. So that actual figure might not be anywhere near that much.But if they want to buy him out.. they'll buy him out.

 

[3rdbass]

I'm not singling you out, but I can't honestly believe people think this. That when faced to make a choice between deep sixing their program and any and all money making potential it'd have going forward and actively avoiding a buy out - that they'd completely flush it all down the drain on $9 million. The school had no national reputation before the hoops program became big time. Now it's among the best schools in the country.

And people do realize institutions and teams take insurances out on contracts, right? That procurement laws basically dictate that they can't sign these kinds of deals without an ability to pay them, right?

Of course no one WANTS to spend $9 million so that someone doesn't coach your team next year; but when you have to - you have to. And they will and they'll find the money if they don't already have it. It's been one of the best state-funded educational institutions in the entire country even with deep funding cuts and people think they're going to have trouble coming up with $9 million.

And that's all assuming Ollie just doesn't walk away. Or negotiate a settlement. Both of which are possible. So that actual figure might not be anywhere near that much.But if they want to buy him out.. they'll buy him out.

I really hope KO accepts a buyout so he can hang with Drake and become the true baller he always wanted to be. LOL!

 

[David 76]

It is a lot of money, but if things continue as they are the rest of the season, can UConn afford to keep keep Ollie?
A ton of money has been spent to make us attractive to a P5 conference. Way more than $10 million.
We can't let a decade of work and money go down the toilet.

 

[uconngb]

It is a lot of money, but if things continue as they are the rest of the season, can UConn afford to keep keep Ollie?
A ton of money has been spent to make us attractive to a P5 conference. Way more than $10 million.
We can't let a decade of work and money go down the toilet.

Why people don't see this is beyond me. I guess no one in this board was a business major. Franchise value is WAY more important than short term cost. I think the body of evidence is clear. KO is not a program builder. Time to cut losses and move on. It's very basic. Coca Cola realized they made a major mistake with "new Coke". Were they supposed to stay with it because of all the production costs and advertising dollars they had sunk into it?? No, they realized they made a mistake, took their pain, and moved on. And their franchise remained as strong as ever. This is pretty basic people.

 

[Jaker]

I'm not singling you out, but I can't honestly believe people think this. That when faced to make a choice between deep sixing their program and any and all money making potential it'd have going forward and actively avoiding a buy out - that they'd completely flush it all down the drain on $9 million. The school had no national reputation before the hoops program became big time. Now it's among the best schools in the country.

And people do realize institutions and teams take insurances out on contracts, right? That procurement laws basically dictate that they can't sign these kinds of deals without an ability to pay them, right?

Of course no one WANTS to spend $9 million so that someone doesn't coach your team next year; but when you have to - you have to. And they will and they'll find the money if they don't already have it. It's been one of the best state-funded educational institutions in the entire country even with deep funding cuts and people think they're going to have trouble coming up with $9 million.

And that's all assuming Ollie just doesn't walk away. Or negotiate a settlement. Both of which are possible. So that actual figure might not be anywhere near that much.But if they want to buy him out.. they'll buy him out.

Hey, don't get me wrong, I am all for spending the money. I was never on board with making Ollie the head coach in the first place.

 

[John]

Why people don't see this is beyond me. I guess no one in this board was a business major. Franchise value is WAY more important than short term cost. I think the body of evidence is clear. KO is not a program builder. Time to cut losses and move on. It's very basic. Coca Cola realized they made a major mistake with "new Coke". Were they supposed to stay with it because of all the production costs and advertising dollars they had sunk into it?? No, they realized they made a mistake, took their pain, and moved on. And their franchise remained as strong as ever. This is pretty basic people.

except you're talking about soda and this is an athletic brand......

 

[BlueDogs]

Benedict likely isn’t as conflicted as he is frantically running around looking for $10M.

Benedict has gone mostly dark over the last month. I suspect he is on his way to greener pastures soon.

 

[BlueDogs]

I'm IN those crowds, and you're high if you think we've lost 10M worth of value.

You have to look at lost media coverage and exposure, which is huge. It's free marketing dollars. UConn's rise in academic standing is due in large part to huge increases in applications and greater selectivity statistics. Don't think for second the national championships and tournament exposure hasnt been a key in that rise. Students love associating with brand name and success. There is 10MM in lost coverage easily. Once it starts hitting applications, maybe the admin will wake up and realize the strangled the golden goose.

 

[Hoophound]

Benedict has gone mostly dark over the last month. I suspect he is on his way to greener pastures soon.

Or maybe he's avoiding conversation because he doesn't want the barrage of KO questions that he can't answer.

 

[whaler11]

The kids that ran out on him would now be sophomores. You understand that, right? And it's not speculation to believe that teams perform better with players that are upperclassmen generally speaking. That's pretty much true of most basketball teams not named Kentucky (one-and-dones). So a player like Daniel Hamilton being a senior this year (or a junior last year) changes the complexion of the team. Hell, Larrier playing last night would have changed the complexion of the team.

Looking at this roster, it is easy for me to be excited for next year under at least one assumption; that we have at least one of AG, Adams, or Larrier back. If we get two of the three back, that would be awesome. If we get none of them back, then we battle with a bunch of sophomores and hopefully Akinjo can run the point; the most important spot on a college team...

That era of college basketball is gone.

There is no long term roster planning.

It’s who can you get now and how fast can you get them to produce together.

The final nail in the idea of upper-classmen developing together is the transfer rule.

It’s AAU for 18-23 year olds.

 

[whaler11]

Well then, you're not a serious person.

The top three scorers for Memphis last night were all Juniors. Four of their five starters are juniors. That's the difference, even if you choose not to believe it...

Memphis smells.

Come on.

Tuesday had nothing to do with Memphis.

 

[Edward Sargent]

I'm IN those crowds, and you're high if you think we've lost 10M worth of value.

I don't think he is wrong. We are not getting local fans from BC, PC and our fans are not taking the train to play Johnnies or Seton Hall, nor are they flying out to Wichita or Tulsa or Houston

 

[Edward Sargent]

What great players? Our players with the exception of Adams and Larrier are not worthy of being on a roster for any top 25 team. Our players lack of talent is a big part of our problems as is Ollie being head coach.

Ollie has brought UCONN from the mountaintop to Tulsa. That will be his legacy.

PS: No one on the fanbase is conflicted anymore. Even the Pollyannas know this.

Ollie didn't bring UCONN to Tulsa

 

[noeynox]

Im convinced were the weirdest team in the country. Great players, terrible play but for whatever reason some games they play good. Its Ollies fault but not 100% His players still need to put up on their end

I agree. But he brought them here. He must inspire them. It is 100 percent his fault, because something is happening there that is causing this.

 

[Dogdeacon]

except you're talking about soda and this is an athletic brand.

Bizarre analogy, I'd be entertained to read the case study where New Coke is analogous to coaching decisions in college basketball at a state school. Is UConn planning to sell the basketball team soon? Go public? What is the PE ratio?

The so-called 'business major' reality is look at measurables, record, postseason success, earnings, player retention, recruiting class rank, ticket sales etc. over Ollie's tenure. There are downward trends (obv some attributable to conference, but can't change that on own); does that mean changes lose or create value?! [rhetorical]

The only relevant 'business major' aspect to this decision is the buyout costs and if they have the money or not. I find speculation & discussion on that point tiresome & pointless. Its binary, either they have it or they don't and we won't know until they do it or don't. And no one is going public with this info. We won't hear; "Well we can't afford to pay the buyout so we are keeping the coach" nor "please increase your alumni contributions this year we have a 10M fundraising goal to pay the costs of terminating a bad contract we made and overpaying to make sure we undo the damage that has caused".

P.S. Isn't Ollie 'New Coke' & Calhoun 'Coca Cola Classic'

 

[John]

You have to look at lost media coverage and exposure, which is huge. It's free marketing dollars. UConn's rise in academic standing is due in large part to huge increases in applications and greater selectivity statistics. Don't think for second the national championships and tournament exposure hasnt been a key in that rise. Students love associating with brand name and success. There is 10MM in lost coverage easily. Once it starts hitting applications, maybe the admin will wake up and realize the strangled the golden goose.

100% disagree.

 

[Kemba429]

What great players? Our players with the exception of Adams and Larrier are not worthy of being on a roster for any top 25 team. Our players lack of talent is a big part of our problems as is Ollie being head coach.

Ollie has brought UCONN from the mountaintop to Tulsa. That will be his legacy.

PS: No one on the fanbase is conflicted anymore. Even the Pollyannas know this.

I was referring to Adams and Larrier

 

[Kemba429]

Great players???????? Good players maybe, and even that is a stretch.

Adams and Larrier certainly have the potential to be great

 

[Goat]

The comments about Larrier sitting with headaches is a tribute to KO's commitment to the kids. Head injuries cannot be ignored. Those who suggest he should have chosen or been ordered to tough out headaches are irresponsible.

When Ollie was given the job it was reasonable to expect that he was going to have to learn on the job. Calhoun had 7 modest years at Northeaster before he distinguished himself and part of the basis for his improvement was Northeaster moving to a better conference.

Ollie is still learning in game coaching.

Ollie has also had a learning curve regarding recruiting, particularly distinguishing which kids have toughness and potential for growth and closing the many kids whose families loved KO while the kid went elsewhere. Hopefully, Killings and Chill solve the remaining weaknesses by complimenting the head coach in this aspect of his job. Also, hopefully Ollie is looking for players who want to be in his system and will thrive there.

The 5 kids who came in 2016 were celebrated, but two couldn't play and then there was a scramble we are still recovering from as KO tried to figure out how to earn love and maintain authority.

There is no way the UConn program benefits by its fans talking about sacking the coach on 1/18 any year unless there is some kind of scandal going on. Serial injuries to key players is not a scandal. There is plenty of time to debate whether to replace the coach in March.

When the debate is ripe, I will be pointing out that we are in the AAC. We have a coach with NCAA and NBA experience, NBA connections, whose history of success began in the same kind of hard neighborhoods that many recruits are living in. He has a national championship. Regardless of the qualifications some will assert, that is a big deal. I have zero confidence that we will find a replacement that will come to the AAC and assemble a competitive team faster than he can. I am fully certain that if there is such a coach, he would be gone to a P5 job as quickly as he could earn a bid.

 

[UConnDan97]

That era of college basketball is gone.

There is no long term roster planning.

It’s who can you get now and how fast can you get them to produce together.

The final nail in the idea of upper-classmen developing together is the transfer rule.

It’s AAU for 18-23 year olds.

Well that's just wrong. And Wichita State is the prime example of why it's wrong.

I'm not saying you need an entire roster of juniors and seniors. But we can't do it with just two of them and almost two thirds of our roster being freshmen. That's what makes a team that is 10-8 and has difficulty beating teams in the 50-100 range RPI.

Next year, many of these players will have had a year under their belts and I will expect more from each of them. Again, we're already seeing it with Whaley, Carlton, and a couple others...