NY Times article on CR effect on non-revenue sports

[SouthronCross]

They aren't here because even they can't defend how bad they are from an academic standpoint. And they likely can't read or write.

And Nebraska is not as bad as Louisville is academically. Did the B1G suck it up a little to take them because of their football, yes. But the ACC did more holding their nose than the B1G did when they took Louisville. For a conference that pimps out the USN&WR as much as the ACC does, their addition was laughable from an academic standpoint.

Let's put it this way.
If UConn got the invite ahead of Louisville, where do you think both schools athletic programs would be five years from now? With Louisville in the AAC and UConn in the ACC? And with Strong and Bridgewater and Pitino possibly all gone from the program with no TV money coming....and compared to UConn with Diaco (or Narduzzi if he was afraid of conference realigment), and with Ollie and Geno and the other olympic sports UConn paticipates in and with more TV money than UConn has ever had before?

It was a stupid short term decision by the ACC and there's no one who can really debate that. Here's hoping that someday we get an invite to the B1G. F* the ACC, F* the NE schools BC and Cuse who are afraid of us and F* the Duck Dynasty football schools in the SE..

Never said Nebraska was as bad as Louisville, academically speaking, but, to say that the B1G did not alter the standards that they put out in order to accept them is not the least bit true.

 

[B1GALUM]

It may not be a requirement, as you say, but, what they put out to the media says otherwise. They make it sound like it is.

Yes. You and I are in agreement on that point. Delany et. al. have certainly spoken about the importance of AAU membership on numerous occasions. However, I think it is worth noting, when it comes to conference realignment, that it is not an official requirement. Delany would have welcomed Notre Dame and its lack of AAU membership with open arms had Notre Dame desired to join the B1G as full members. I think Oklahoma, and for the sake of this discussion disregard the Big 12 GOR, is another university that the B1G would consider despite lack of AAU membership. I am pleased with the move to east and west football divisions in the B1G but there is concern about the divisions being unbalanced. The acceptance and then placement of Oklahoma into the west division of the B1G would alleviate some of that concern and provide the B1G with another football "brand" as well as rekindle the historic Nebraska-Oklahoma rivalry. For these reasons, I think the B1G wound consider non AAU member Oklahoma if the Big 12 GOR were not in place and Oklahoma had interest in the B1G.

 

[CAHUSKY]

It may not be a requirement, as you say, but, what they put out to the media says otherwise. They make it sound like it is.

Well, except for the press release saying it wasn't.

 

[SouthronCross]

Well, except for the press release saying it wasn't.

Yeah, no national organisation has ever put out a press release saying one thing, while that same organisation is doing something else out in the field.

Right?

 

[SouthronCross]

Yes. You and I are in agreement on that point. Delany et. al. have certainly spoken about the importance of AAU membership on numerous occasions. However, I think it is worth noting, when it comes to conference realignment, that it is not an official requirement. Delany would have welcomed Notre Dame and its lack of AAU membership with open arms had Notre Dame desired to join the B1G as full members. I think Oklahoma, and for the sake of this discussion disregard the Big 12 GOR, is another university that the B1G would consider despite lack of AAU membership. I am pleased with the move to east and west football divisions in the B1G but there is concern about the divisions being unbalanced. The acceptance and then placement of Oklahoma into the west division of the B1G would alleviate some of that concern and provide the B1G with another football "brand" as well as rekindle the historic Nebraska-Oklahoma rivalry. For these reasons, I think the B1G wound consider non AAU member Oklahoma if the Big 12 GOR were not in place and Oklahoma had interest in the B1G.

Agree. The B1G would for sure make an exception for Notre Dame, and, that'd be a very smart move.

I have not followed CR where Oklahoma is concerned, but, they'd be a HUGE get for the B1G, too. Absolute dynasty on the football field, solid baseball and basketball, and, a large and loyal traveling fanbase. They'd strenghten the B1G West Division immediately. It'd certainly leave Texas in an odd position if they were chosen. What I am not so sure about is whether or not they could be separated from fellow state institution Oklahoma State.

 

[NEforceUConn]

They aren't here because even they can't defend how bad they are from an academic standpoint. And they likely can't read or write.

Let's put it this way.
If UConn got the invite ahead of Louisville, where do you think both schools athletic programs would be five years from now? With Louisville in the AAC and UConn in the ACC? And with Strong and Bridgewater and Pitino possibly all gone from the program with no TV money coming....and compared to UConn with Diaco (or Narduzzi if he was afraid of conference realigment), and with Ollie and Geno and the other olympic sports UConn paticipates in and with more TV money than UConn has ever had before?

It was a stupid short term decision by the ACC and there's no one who can really debate that. Here's hoping that someday we get an invite to the B1G. ....

This post totally shares my beliefs as well. I can not tell you how frustrating it is to be a UConn fan right now with our "limbo"status for the next 3 or 3 1/2 years. If it were June 2017 and we were still in the AAC then great - for me its turn the UConn lights out and I will become an ND fan (god I said it). I 100% agree that the ACC blew it when they invited UL - really st thinking. When UL hits the skids what will the ACC teams think? Like Viking said if it was UConn and not UL the future of the ACC would look awesome.

But I digress. UConn needs a home within 3 years and unless the Big 12 goes boom ( a 20% possibility) all that's left is the B1G going temporarily to 15 (that's got to be less than a 10% shot) or the ACC (perhaps upon a FSU national championship this year) saying screw it lets tap UConn and Cincy and go to 16 and be done with it ( a 20% possibility).

The only 2 events that can change this rather dismal future is the inside four Big 12 teams going to the PAC 10 (2% possibility) or WVU leaving and sueing the Big 12 for misrepresentation. If the ACC can accept UL then a UConn/WVU addition should go down just as easily . All they have to sell FSU, UM, and Clemson is that a 16 team conference (even with a UConn and WVU/Cincy) is a major FB conference and one where FSU/UM/ or Clemson can win a national championship.

On another angle I apply a 45% to 55% probability of UConn getting a bid to a major conference if Oprah gets her power base to question why college's most successful womens bb team program is getting screwed by male college academia/athletic department heads. Come on Gail you are from Hartford, get this done. Come on Oprah - this would be your first big time successful step to really make change.

 

[B1GALUM]

Agree. The B1G would for sure make an exception for Notre Dame, and, that'd be a very smart move.

I have not followed CR where Oklahoma is concerned, but, they'd be a HUGE get for the B1G, too. Absolute dynasty on the football field, solid baseball and basketball, and, a large and loyal traveling fanbase. They'd strenghten the B1G West Division immediately. It'd certainly leave Texas in an odd position if they were chosen. What I am not so sure about is whether or not they could be separated from fellow state institution Oklahoma State.

The B1G completed "homework" on Oklahoma (http://sports.omaha.com/2013/04/22/realignment-expansion-not-out-of-the-question/#.UrYa0UaA2Un) but there really are a number of factors that make a move of Oklahoma to the B1G a long shot even if the Big 12 GOR did not exist. The political pressure to remain tied to Oklahoma State as you mentioned is one and the relationship Oklahoma has with Texas is another; these factors may be more of an impediment for an Oklahoma to B1G scenario than lack of AAU membership.

All that aside, the B1G really seems most intent on looking toward the east rather than southwest unless Texas all of sudden decides a move to the B1G is in their interest. The comments Delany has made on multiple occasions about being a bi-regional conference, having a presence in NYC and along the east coast, etc. as well as multiple B1G ADs commenting about a 16 team conference makes me think UConn is at least on the B1G radar. The status of UConn as a state flagship public research university in New England, the presence of initiatives such as Next Generation Connecticut, proximity to NYC, being a national basketball power, etc. seem to me to be a fit for the B1G as it pushes eastward.

 

[CAHUSKY]

If it were June 2017 and we were still in the AAC then great - for me its turn the UConn lights out and I will become an ND fan (god I said it).

Really? Wow.

 

[pj]

Yeah, no national organisation has ever put out a press release saying one thing, while that same organisation is doing something else out in the field.

Right?

When has a national organization ever had actual standards higher than its professed standards? Standards only get compromised downward, not upward.

 

[SouthronCross]

This post totally shares my beliefs as well. I can not tell you how frustrating it is to be a UConn fan right now with our "limbo"status for the next 3 or 3 1/2 years. If it were June 2017 and we were still in the AAC then great - for me its turn the UConn lights out and I will become an ND fan (god I said it). I 100% agree that the ACC blew it when they invited UL - really st thinking. When UL hits the skids what will the ACC teams think? Like Viking said if it was UConn and not UL the future of the ACC would look awesome.

Why is that? I am personally excited about the league, and, where its headed.

I also wholeheartedly wish UConn was already a member.

I do agree that it was UL's great luck to have put together an 11-2, BCS bowl-winning season, and, basketball national championship, when they did.

But I digress. UConn needs a home within 3 years and unless the Big 12 goes boom ( a 20% possibility) all that's left is the B1G going temporarily to 15 (that's got to be less than a 10% shot) or the ACC (perhaps upon a FSU national championship this year) saying screw it lets tap UConn and Cincy and go to 16 and be done with it ( a 20% possibility).

The only 2 events that can change this rather dismal future is the inside four Big 12 teams going to the PAC 10 (2% possibility) or WVU leaving and sueing the Big 12 for misrepresentation. If the ACC can accept UL then a UConn/WVU addition should go down just as easily . All they have to sell FSU, UM, and Clemson is that a 16 team conference (even with a UConn and WVU/Cincy) is a major FB conference and one where FSU/UM/ or Clemson can win a national championship.

That is a great point. Best point of the entire thread, in this ACC fan's opinion.

FSU, UM, and, CU were all worried that they could miss a possible playoff because of the makeup of the ACC, from a football perspective. This season's performance from FSU shows that to be untrue. If they put together a good enough season, they will get an invite. And, a UConn/WVU combo is a win-win for both FB and BB. UConn/Cincinnati would work, too.

On another angle I apply a 45% to 55% probability of UConn getting a bid to a major conference if Oprah gets her power base to question why college's most successful womens bb team program is getting screwed by male college academia/athletic department heads. Come on Gail you are from Hartford, get this done. Come on Oprah - this would be your first big time successful step to really make change.

That approach would raise quite a few eyebrows, for sure.

 

[SouthronCross]

The B1G completed "homework" on Oklahoma (http://sports.omaha.com/2013/04/22/realignment-expansion-not-out-of-the-question/#.UrYa0UaA2Un) but there really are a number of factors that make a move of Oklahoma to the B1G a long shot even if the Big 12 GOR did not exist. The political pressure to remain tied to Oklahoma State as you mentioned is one and the relationship Oklahoma has with Texas is another; these factors may be more of an impediment for an Oklahoma to B1G scenario than lack of AAU membership.

Oklahoma State has Boone Pickens, and, he wields great influence with that state. He will almost singlehandedly see to it that OSU goes wherever OU does, should the Big 12 come apart.

OU splitting from Texas is less of an issue, IMHO. After all, they played for more than 80 years as members of different leagues. As long as they maintain their Red River Rivalry each October, they do not NEED to be in the same league together.

All that aside, the B1G really seems most intent on looking toward the east rather than southwest unless Texas all of sudden decides a move to the B1G is in their interest. The comments Delany has made on multiple occasions about being a bi-regional conference, having a presence in NYC and along the east coast, etc. as well as multiple B1G ADs commenting about a 16 team conference makes me think UConn is at least on the B1G radar. The status of UConn as a state flagship public research university in New England, the presence of initiatives such as Next Generation Connecticut, proximity to NYC, being a national basketball power, etc. seem to me to be a fit for the B1G as it pushes eastward.

Agreed. I do think UConn is in both the B1G's and ACC's future plans. Which is of little consolation to them at present. Right now, the B1G has the advantage, IMO, since the ACC voted them down...quite foolishly...in 2011.

 

[SouthronCross]

When has a national organization ever had actual standards higher than its professed standards? Standards only get compromised downward, not upward.

That is true enough, but, to my memory, that was not what was put before us here in NC when all of the CR nonsense was going on in summer of 2012. It was AAU members ONLY, located in contiguous states.

 

[NEforceUConn]

Really? Wow.

I grew up Catholic in Wethersfield and there was only one college fb team that we cheered for , ND. ND against USC, ND against UM, ND against Oklahoma, or Texas. Its all we knew. No one in Wethersfield gave a toss about BCU. Flutie may have caught one year's interest but it was never a school you could back. The evolution of UConn bb and the uptake in UConn fb, think Dan O, made everyone I knew a UConn Husky.

I wear my Husky gear with prominance down here in ACC country and get many compliments, however 3 1/2 more years in the AAC will send us to UNLV pergutory. I will reluctantly put up my UConn gear and take out that lepracon Tshirt that has been sitting at the bottom of my drawers for close to 25 years.

Of course before this happens you will read on ESPN how a father and 2 children were arested for spraypainting UConn all over ACC headquarters at Grandover down here in Greensboro.

 

[UConnDan97]

I grew up Catholic in Wethersfield and there was only one college fb team that we cheered for , ND. ND against USC, ND against UM, ND against Oklahoma, or Texas. Its all we knew. No one in Wethersfield gave a toss about BCU. Flutie may have caught one year's interest but it was never a school you could back. The evolution of UConn bb and the uptake in UConn fb, think Dan O, made everyone I knew a UConn Husky.

I wear my Husky gear with prominance down here in ACC country and get many compliments, however 3 1/2 more years in the AAC will send us to UNLV pergutory. I will reluctantly put up my UConn gear and take out that lepracon Tshirt that has been sitting at the bottom of my drawers for close to 25 years.

Of course before this happens you will read on ESPN how a father and 2 children were arested for spraypainting UConn all over ACC headquarters at Grandover down here in Greensboro.

So let me see if I'm understanding this post correctly: You're willing to get arrested for UConn's honor if we are still in the AAC, but you are unwilling to keep the jersey on, due to the "alternate" Notre Dame gear you have laying around your place?

Ummm.....okay...

 

[btstimpy]

I grew up Catholic in Wethersfield and there was only one college fb team that we cheered for , ND. ND against USC, ND against UM, ND against Oklahoma, or Texas. Its all we knew. No one in Wethersfield gave a toss about BCU. Flutie may have caught one year's interest but it was never a school you could back. The evolution of UConn bb and the uptake in UConn fb, think Dan O, made everyone I knew a UConn Husky.

I wear my Husky gear with prominance down here in ACC country and get many compliments, however 3 1/2 more years in the AAC will send us to UNLV pergutory. I will reluctantly put up my UConn gear and take out that lepracon Tshirt that has been sitting at the bottom of my drawers for close to 25 years.

Of course before this happens you will read on ESPN how a father and 2 children were arested for spraypainting UConn all over ACC headquarters at Grandover down here in Greensboro.

Right now there is support in the ACC for UConn. It wasn't enough on the last vote to get the invite. Similar to 2002 when there wasn't enough for Syracuse, they sat tight and got in in 2011. UConn may be very confident that the Big Ten will take UConn soon. They may. But please don't burn bridges in the meantime. I know what Virginia is thinking, and we want UConn. But don't alieanate everyone else. UConn should try to court both leagues.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Right now there is support in the ACC for UConn. It wasn't enough on the last vote to get the invite. Similar to 2002 when there wasn't enough for Syracuse, they sat tight and got in in 2011. UConn may be very confident that the Big Ten will take UConn soon. They may. But please don't burn bridges in the meantime. I know what Virginia is thinking, and we want UConn. But don't alieanate everyone else. UConn should try to court both leagues.

UConn has spent the last 10 years in play nice mode. It hasn't worked for us.

The reality is that we have probably seen the last lifeboat push off for the foreseeable future. UConn needs to figure out a way to survive and thrive in its new reality, because the Big 10 and ACC are both better likely done with expansion for the next 10+ years. I don't think making business decisions around what makes the ACC happy will work for UConn. If UConn is successful in the AAC and figures out a way to increase revenue and survive, then conferences will want us no matter what we have done or said. There is no one else to pick. If UConn allows itself to get further marginalized, then no on is inviting us no matter how much butt we kiss.

Where I think UConn has to be prepared to fight for its life is if the P5 try to split off or even further marginalize the non-P5.

 

[NEforceUConn]

Right now there is support in the ACC for UConn. It wasn't enough on the last vote to get the invite. Similar to 2002 when there wasn't enough for Syracuse, they sat tight and got in in 2011. UConn may be very confident that the Big Ten will take UConn soon. They may. But please don't burn bridges in the meantime. I know what Virginia is thinking, and we want UConn. But don't alieanate everyone else. UConn should try to court both leagues.

UConn can survive 3 maybe 4 more years in the AAC. However the $ and exposure gap between a P5 team and UConn after those cummulative 3 or 4 years will be devistating. Hence the clock is ticking. I really hope that UConn is in the B1G or ACC by 2017, if not then its basically over - maybe wbb can maintain its position but fb would be toast and it would be very difficult for mbb to maintain its current status which is traditionally one of the top 10 programs in the nation.

The UConn brand compared to P5 schools will be strong for 2 or 3 more years, after that the gap will exponentially increase (not in UConn's favor).

Dan - As a fan I appreciate UConn's overall competitiveness, especially in conference or on the national stage. 4 years in the AAC will destroy that and we will be described more like a current day program (athletic wise) such as maybe UNLV or UMass. I doubt UNLV or UMass have the broad pationate fan support and national prestige that UConn currently does.

 

[UConnDan97]

Dan - As a fan I appreciate UConn's overall competitiveness, especially in conference or on the national stage. 4 years in the AAC will destroy that and we will be described more like a current day program (athletic wise) such as maybe UNLV or UMass. I doubt UNLV or UMass have the broad pationate fan support and national prestige that UConn currently does.

I'll fill you in on a little tidbit about me that some here already know. Much like yourself, I grew up Catholic in East Hartford, and therefore my football team was also Notre Dame (oh, the irony of the avatar!). I was able (at the time) to root for both UConn (on a 1-AA basis) and ND (on a 1-A basis). I had both shirts as well. Although I often found it unfair that ND always got the "benefit of the doubt" in the polls even when they seemingly did nothing to deserve it.

Then UConn made the jump to 1-A. There was no more ND lovin'. The ND shirt is residing somewhere in a landfill in Hartford county. I grew increasingly hateful of the ND perks, especially when a 9-3 UConn team couldn't find a friggin' bowl to play in! Suffice it to say that I have only ONE team in college football. Whether they are 0-13 or 13-0, whether they are 1-A or 1-AA or D3....I'M A HUSKY!!!

 

[NEforceUConn]

I'll fill you in on a little tidbit about me that some here already know. Much like yourself, I grew up Catholic in East Hartford, and therefore my football team was also Notre Dame (oh, the irony of the avatar!). I was able (at the time) to root for both UConn (on a 1-AA basis) and ND (on a 1-A basis). I had both shirts as well. Although I often found it unfair that ND always got the "benefit of the doubt" in the polls even when they seemingly did nothing to deserve it.

Then UConn made the jump to 1-A. There was no more ND lovin'. The ND shirt is residing somewhere in a landfill in Hartford county. I grew increasingly hateful of the ND perks, especially when a 9-3 UConn team couldn't find a friggin' bowl to play in! Suffice it to say that I have only ONE team in college football. Whether they are 0-13 or 13-0, whether they are 1-A or 1-AA or D3....I'M A HUSKY!!!

And I right there with you for the next 3 years! If that makes me a fair weather fan then so be it. Colleges are rising and falling in America. There was a point in time when PC mbb was miles ahead of UConn, and the start of the BE and JC changed that. I don't even want to think of Uconn being in the AAC come 2017.

 

[UConnDan97]

And I right there with you for the next 3 years! If that makes me a fair weather fan then so be it. Colleges are rising and falling in America. There was a point in time when PC mbb was miles ahead of UConn, and the start of the BE and JC changed that. I don't even want to think of Uconn being in the AAC come 2017.

I think you missed my point. My point was that I'm not leaving. Not in 3 years. Not ever. Good or bad, irrespective of league level, I'm a Husky...

 

[NEforceUConn]

I know your point, you're in it forever, and I have a 2017 sell by date.

 

[UConnDan97]

I know your point, you're in it forever, and I have a 2017 sell by date.

Yeesh! I really wish you were pasteurized...

 

[CAHUSKY]

If that makes me a fair weather fan then so be it.

Yes, that would be the text book definition.

 

[NickyNewark]

I would like to go back in the daytime to see the campus at Yale. I couldn't really see much at night, and got sidetracked in a neighborhood that didn't look so good. So I aborted. I'll get back there at some point. I've been to Bridgeport too for work. It just seemed like a very industrial area.

Industrial city? Any opening's for employment ?? Clothecutter's or silkscreener? Arc welder?

 

[Gfunk]

The fact that you are basing whether a school is elite or subpar strictly off a single publication's list....and whether that school is below or above number 50.... is about the single dumbest thing I have ever read on theses boards. First off, USN&WR is just one of many different publications that ranks schools, and that publication is known to cater to smaller private schools.

So Miami is worthy of attracting elite students at #47, but Tulane and U of Texas (Austin) are subpar at #52 (tied)? Just plain asinine. I really hope for the sake of UVA that you are not that stupid. I would bet better than 90 percent of people in this country think both Tulane and UT are far better schools than Miami, despite not being as high on USNWR's list.

So you are honestly going to put Louisville (161) in the same academic category as Tulane (52) Texas (52) because after 50 "they all start to run together?"

No one in the country would agree with you, and way to mock UCONN (57) for being no better than Louisville, since both are below your magical #50.

By the way, you forgot Wisconsin at #41...not that it matters.

Thank you Bugsy, for partially slapping a little reality into this debate. I'd like to also throw in the fact that graduate school rankings matter more to someone like me & certainly a graduate degree weighs more than an undergraduate degree to most employers. In my field of urban-regional planning, you can't even enter most firms without a graduate degree. So now compare the BIG to the ACC. It's not even close, BIG schools are significantly ahead, overall, than ACC schools. The gap is huge. Some nice examples below: UVa vs the "subpar" schools of UofMN and UofWisky.

Maybe some of you, esp btstimpy, should pay attention to the other US News Rankings (Best Graduate Schools). When you compare UVa to the subpar UofMn (graduate school rankings), ouch! Huge difference in top 25 graduate programs, Minnesota is way ahead. So I'll let btstimpy do his own math and live with the fact that he opened up the "US News" can of worms. Btw, I went to UW-Madison for graduate school, and "on Wisconsin" has more top 25 graduate programs than Minnesota, considerably more.

Minnesota:

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandr...minnesota-twin-cities-174066/overall-rankings

Virginia:

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandr...-virginia-main-campus-234076/overall-rankings

Wisconsin:

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandr...-of-wisconsin-madison-240444/overall-rankings

 

[Bobol]

It depends on your definition of subpar. I say ranked lower than 50 is subpar. The ACC now has 7 subpar. The Big Ten now has 10 subpar for comparison. Northwestern, Michigan, Illinois, and Penn State are good academic institutions. The rest all run together.

It depends on your definition of subpar. I say ranked lower than 50 is subpar. The ACC now has 7 subpar. The Big Ten now has 10 subpar for comparison. Northwestern, Michigan, Illinois, and Penn State are good academic institutions. The rest all run together.

Hey "btstimpy" you posts regarding what schools are "subpar" display a level of ignorance but are nevertheless entertaining if nothing else.

Your self serving definition of what constitutes a "subpar" school is comparing apples,to oranges. UMiami (of which I am more than a little familiar with) bears little in common with a research institution like Penn State or any of the other Land Grant research Universities much like Brown University, (another school I am very very familiar with), ranked USNWR #14 with a mere 6100 undergrads lacks little in common with public school University of NorthCarolina with its 19000+/- undergrads despite the fact the 2 schools have sub 50 USNews rankings.

You seemingly don't understand that theBig Ten schools, together with past member University of Chicago, maintain the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (the "CIC")(you may want to google it since you apparently have never heard of the CIC).

The CIC schools are research orientated universities which annually award approximately 15% of the Doctoral degrees each year in the US each year, 16% of the engineering Ph.D degrees each year, nearly 25% of the agricultural Ph.D degrees each year, conduct a combined $8billion (that's billion with a "b") in funded research, receive approximately 12% of federal research funds annually.

So yes, your opinion that the CIC schools are "subpar" is entertaining and displays you ignorance of higher education.

The reality is that Maryland when given the option of staying in the ACC or bolting to the Big Ten did not hesitate despite the fact that it knew that litigation would ensue because the advantages offered by the Big Ten outweigh those of the ACC not to mention that in addition to membership in the CIC Maryland will make nearly double,the money which the ACC.

I hope that UConn is offered membership in the Big Ten and am confident thatUconn would select the Big Ten over the ACC.

Capisce?

 

[Gfunk]

AAU is not about academics. It's about Graduate Research. If UConn wants to go be in the Big Ten in the Midwest, go be in the Big Ten in the Midwest. The Big Ten says that they only want AAU schools. But they invited Nebraska, and then Big Ten schools led the charge to kick Nebraska out of the AAU. The Big Ten also invited Notre Dame, who would be ranked second academically in the Big Ten and is not AAU. They call AAU a requirement when it is convenient to call it a requirement. But you are correct in that all but 1 Big Ten school is AAU.

That's because the BIG separates academics from athletics, and is willing to uphold academic integrity.

You also don't seem to get the Midwest, it's not just one lumped region. The western BIG is a bit different than the Rust Belt BIG (which is pretty much Chicago to Ohio & then eastern Pa, which is definitely the Rust Belt). Moreover, Rutgers, Md and PSU combined also make the BIG far beyond Midwestern at this point - certainly Mid-Atlantic / Eastern. Just as ND, Syracuse and Pitt bring a Rust Belt and somewhat Midwestern influence to the ACC.

Personally, I think this thread has proven you are wasting too much time on so-called academic arguments & you put way too much emphasis on US News Undergraduate Rankings in order to justify your ACC homerism - as you get older you realize that the undergraduate experience is a mere 4-5 years of your life, the significance fades, so maybe you should stop clinging to it so much.

I've now told you a handful of times that US News also publishes Graduate School Rankings, the BIG simply jumps far ahead of the ACC when these rankings are considered - go ahead and do top-t0-bottom, overall comparisons, I've left you some trails in previous posts. At the end of the day, national universities are measured for undergraduate and graduate performance, esp transferrable, real world research AND because of this simple, factual reality - the BIG prevails over the ACC as a whole. But don't misunderstand me here, the ACC is a great collection of institutions, and some of its upper schools are fantastic, among the best in the world, while the rest are plenty good enough, even Lville, same goes for Neb. To lump this into conference pride, well it's becoming immature reality on these CR boards, count me as one who has grown tired of it. But I needed to point out the obvious to you.

 

[NickyNewark]

Hey "btstimpy" you posts regarding what schools are "subpar" display a level of ignorance but are nevertheless entertaining if nothing else.

Your self serving definition of what constitutes a "subpar" school is comparing apples,to oranges. UMiami (of which I am more than a little familiar with) bears little in common with a research institution like Penn State or any of the other Land Grant research Universities much like Brown University, (another school I am very very familiar with), ranked USNWR #14 with a mere 6100 undergrads lacks little in common with public school University of NorthCarolina with its 19000+/- undergrads despite the fact the 2 schools have sub 50 USNews rankings.

You seemingly don't understand that theBig Ten schools, together with past member University of Chicago, maintain the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (the "CIC")(you may want to google it since you apparently have never heard of the CIC).

The CIC schools are research orientated universities which annually award approximately 15% of the Doctoral degrees each year in the US each year, 16% of the engineering Ph.D degrees each year, nearly 25% of the agricultural Ph.D degrees each year, conduct a combined $8billion (that's billion with a "b") in funded research, receive approximately 12% of federal research funds annually.

So yes, your opinion that the CIC schools are "subpar" is entertaining and displays you ignorance of higher education.

The reality is that Maryland when given the option of staying in the ACC or bolting to the Big Ten did not hesitate despite the fact that it knew that litigation would ensue because the advantages offered by the Big Ten outweigh those of the ACC not to mention that in addition to membership in the CIC Maryland will make nearly double,the money which the ACC.

I hope that UConn is offered membership in the Big Ten and am confident thatUconn would select the Big Ten over the ACC.

Capisce?

I capisce paisan but I doubt even you're well laid out post will help "school him"?He claim's the ACC has the "equivalent" to offset the lack of CIC membership ? I just think he's stubbornly arrogant when it comes to the ACC or at least I hope so !?! That's the only thing I can relate too with him, loyalty.

 

[upstater]

Yes. You and I are in agreement on that point. Delany et. al. have certainly spoken about the importance of AAU membership on numerous occasions. However, I think it is worth noting, when it comes to conference realignment, that it is not an official requirement. Delany would have welcomed Notre Dame and its lack of AAU membership with open arms had Notre Dame desired to join the B1G as full members. I think Oklahoma, and for the sake of this discussion disregard the Big 12 GOR, is another university that the B1G would consider despite lack of AAU membership. I am pleased with the move to east and west football divisions in the B1G but there is concern about the divisions being unbalanced. The acceptance and then placement of Oklahoma into the west division of the B1G would alleviate some of that concern and provide the B1G with another football "brand" as well as rekindle the historic Nebraska-Oklahoma rivalry. For these reasons, I think the B1G wound consider non AAU member Oklahoma if the Big 12 GOR were not in place and Oklahoma had interest in the B1G.

Delaney might say it, but when Presidents have been asked point blank (in relation to Nebraska being added) they said it wasn't discussed.

 

[upstater]

I have to stick with the way USN&WR separates the National Universities out from the small regional schools that don't have Doctoral Majors. There is an athletics component here too. Forbes includes every little liberal arts college from everywhere in their comparisons. Most of them I've never heard of. That's no help.

As a Virginia grad, you are downplaying the quality of your school by following those ratings. There are some second rate schools in your conference that are very highly ranked in USNWR but they are nowhere near the quality of Virginia. USNEWS also has some AAU schools with billion dollar budgets and half a billion dollars in research budgets and great international reputations ranked in the low 130s.

It flies in the face of everything I know of rankings from solid sources. There are schools in the top 50 that have no business there. #62s BYU and Clemson are laughable that high.