Non-Key Tweets

[businesslawyer]

Who is the ACC's presence in NYC? Here's a clue, it's not Syracuse. We are closer to NYC than they are.

They have market presence. Not anywhere near a dominating one but market presence. Syracuse easily could be the second most popular eastern program in the City (behind Penn State, although in Metro NY they are clearly behind Ru and may be behind us). And, like us, it is a major player in college hoops in the City, whether you think it is somewhat ahead of or behind us. And Duke and UNC and UVA clearly have fanbases in NYC and environs on the hoop siide.

To argue that we're critical in Netro New YOrk for the Big XII but Syracuse is useless in Metro NY for the ACC is just dumb.

 

[CL82]

They have market presence. Not anywhere near a dominating one but market presence. Syracuse easily could be the second most popular eastern program in the City (behind Penn State, although in Metro NY they are clearly behind Ru and may be behind us). And, like us, it is a major player in college hoops in the City, whether you think it is somewhat ahead of or behind us. And Duke and UNC and UVA clearly have fanbases in NYC and environs on the hoop siide.

To argue that we're critical in Netro New YOrk for the Big XII but Syracuse is useless in Metro NY for the ACC is just dumb.

I was with you till the last sentence. I had to think about it though.

We are critical for the Big 12 presence in NYC (an argument that I hadn't made but now endorse) because it has no presence currently but would gain one with us, including improved tier 1 pricing from cable providers.

As you rightly point out, Syracuse's impact in NYC is matched by several other ACC schools. They aren't critical for the ACC to maintain a presence in NYC.

Yep Syracuse is in the same state, but they are further from, say MSG, that either Rutgers or Connecticut. Particularly after Beoheim leaves, their impact will be waning.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

MH ver3 ‏@MH ver3 May 1
I haven't forgotten about you guys I'm just being silenced again by my source in WVU. I will share when I get the ok.

BrewDog ‏@BrewDog44 3h3 hours ago
@MH ver3 hearing UT, TT, TCU will not vote for B12 expansion. One more vote will block it

MH ver3 ‏@MH ver3 19m19 minutes ago
@BrewDog44 if what I'm hearing is correct TCU is starting to lean towards a "yes". Takes a super majority so we need them.

MH ver3 ‏@MH ver3 17m17 minutes ago
Interesting. Several schools in ACC pushing hard for ESPN to make ACCN now. Threatening litigation and moving elsewhere.

 

[NYUConn]

But you are just naming schools without any reason behind naming them. It is not possible that the ACC's road to a national conference network is made easier by the Big XII coming into metro New York and establishing a network. And it is not possible that the ACC -- or any of its members -- could not care if the Big XII is the first to get a network established, and established in the northeast to boot, because that greatly increases the odds that the ACC will be raided by other players.

You offered a hypothetical scenario that posits that the reason we haven't been invited to the ACC is that we aren't a legit candidate for the Big 12.

I'm offering one that says we aren't getting that invite right now because we don't have the votes irrespective of whether we are a serious candidate for the Big 12.

That's all.

 

[NYUConn]

Dude -- WTF does it mean that the ACC "let" the Big Ten take New Jersey and Maryland? The bigger bull came into the pasture and screwed with their cows. Nothing they can do about it. No more than they could stop the Big from taking UNC and UVA today if those schools wanted out and the Big Ten wanted them.

College sports is a business. They had a valuable property in Maryland and a foot in the door of NYC with Syracuse. Instead of taking steps forward to protect their property in Maryland and cut the B1G out of NYC by grabbing RU and/or UConn they let the B1G move first and they lost.

As the first movers in CR back in 2004 the ACC should of had an inside track towards a conference network and future stability, but to my point earlier they bungled it and the B1G pounced.

 

[Dooley]

Syracuse is definitely important to the ACC. Combining them with Notre Dame gives the conference definite secondary status in NYC well behind the B1G. UConn's elevation into a power status for the B12 would give the B12 a definite presence in NYC but it would fall well below the B1G and ACC in the pecking order. That said, I have to think that brands as big as Texas, Oklahoma and even Kansas would love some exposure in the northeast to expand without sacrificing too much of their midwest/southwestern culture. If Notre Dame ever jumped from the ACC, then the gap between ACC and B12 shrinks significantly and leads to even more national exposure.

 

[billybud]

The Big bungled with Notre Dame, got nervous about Penn State being isolated in the east...so added Maryland and Rutgers as a bolster.

Maryland isn't near the property that Louisville is....the ACC grabbed Louisville to the later consternation of Boren and Bowlsby.

 

[NYUConn]

The Big bungled with Notre Dame, got nervous about Penn State being isolated in the east...so added Maryland and Rutgers as a bolster.

Maryland isn't near the property that Louisville is....the ACC grabbed Louisville to the later consternation of Boren and Bowlsby.

Maryland was the ACC DC footprint and has a history of Athletic success that is stronger to Louisville. Academically they aren't even in the same Galaxy.

No way you can argue that Louisville is a more valuable property than Maryland.

 

[dwalks93]

The ACC has never been strategic in its approach. Why do we think they would suddenly reverse course and add UConn now?

Past additions show the ACC football powers focus on 2 things for expansion candidates:
1. Will an addition allow a larger immediate payout
2. Will an addition increase the ACC football portfolio thus allow a better chance for the playoff.

If you doubt the above decision matrix for FSU just look at Billybud's above post which argues Louisville is a better add than Maryland.

Based on the above 2 questions, UConn would likely not be endorsed by FSU, Clemson, Miami and haters like BC.

I do not believe a majority of members in the ACC would accept less money to add UConn now even if it thwarted another conference. Remember the ACC does not have the automatic increased TV per team payout for additions the way the Big12 does....A decision which requires considering second order effects or patience is not something the ACC has demonstrated yet.

If adding UConn allowed the ACC to form a network it would make sense to add us now. But the ACC probably needs more than UConn for a network.

As prior BY posters pointed out, the ACC would be wise to prevent another conference acquiring an interest in partially controlled ACC territory. But the ACC has never exhibited the ability to think beyond the now.

 

[billybud]

When you play in a sports conference...no one is asking about the academics...MIT would be a great addition for an academics conference..so would Harvard. I understand why UConn focuses on such...when you play questionable football, focus on the academics.

When you are watching Alabama vs LSU...you are watching football and you do not look up their academic rating.

Louisville has a good AD...a good fan base...plays competitively. Maryland was in decline. Their football was in the bottom third of the conference and their basketball had faded..?

Academics? Yep...people turn the dial to watch a game because of academics.

The problem with UConn? Folks wanted to push them into the Atlantic division with Cuse and BC...enough with that for Clemson and FSU who already are mismatched with northeast non rivals.

 

[billybud]

As a thought....why aren't you guys castigating Boren and Bowlsby for saying regretfully that the Big 12 missed the boat on Louisville...while UConn sits in waiting?

Could they have seen the same thing that the ACC did?

Boren....

"You know, I was for adding Louisville (when the Big 12 instead added West Virginia and TCU in 2012)," he said. "I obviously did not prevail, and they have now gone into another conference and they're not available now. But they'd have been a good fit.

 

[Hoophound]

Well, we weren't exactly an obvious choice for the B12. Location was a big issue then. Now, our market has become more important. Time has shown markets matter. The ACC and B12 need markets and both conferences screwed the pooch on that. Both conferences also got caught up in the Paul Pasqualoni era of UConn football. We've had far more success than failure and with the school's record of winning big in sports, it was logical that we'd right the ship in football.

I suspect our Northeast rivals played a valuable role in our missing the cut when Cuse and Pitt were added to the ACC. They claim they were against us and we were the clear logical choice. UConn has had a perfect storm of things go against it in realignment but ultimately, the ACC and Big 12 are better off with UConn in the fold. I suspect a do over in the ACC would break our way and that the B12 will see the light on this subject shortly.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Syracuse and BCU should want us either in the AAC or the ACC. The last thing they should want is UConn in a different major conference, because it makes both of them less valuable in future realignment.

BC will always have their tiny piece of the Hub, which would not be impacted at all by UConn's inclusion of a P5/4 conference, though it may impact their ability recruit basketball and football wise, especially when looking at facilities and program success. Syracuse is a another story. Syracuse anchor's is (TV) brand on being NYC's city, actual distance be damned, and that brand has already been hurt by Rutgers joining the B1G from a market perspective. Through UConn with the power of a P5/4 conference behind it and Syracuse is in a lot of trouble. Afteral, Syracuse being the school of 'Upstate New York' just doesn't have the cache as being to so-called school of 'NYC.' They know it, too. Just look at the amount of money they have put into athletic facilities lately - Carmelo Center (Basketball), Ensley Center (Football), Iocolano-Petty (Football), which I give them credit for in comparison to BC.

 

[Chin Diesel]

The Civil ConFLiCT doesn't seem so stupid now does it ?

I refuse to believe I'm the only person who has thought on more than one occasion that this series doesn't go beyond AAC.

When it's announced that UConn and UCF are going to the same P5 conference, it'll all make sense.

 

[NYUConn]

When you play in a sports conference...no one is asking about the academics...MIT would be a great addition for an academics conference..so would Harvard. I understand why UConn focuses on such...when you play questionable football, focus on the academics.

When you are watching Alabama vs LSU...you are watching football and you do not look up their academic rating.

Louisville has a good AD...a good fan base...plays competitively. Maryland was in decline. Their football was in the bottom third of the conference and their basketball had faded..?

Academics? Yep...people turn the dial to watch a game because of academics.

The problem with UConn? Folks wanted to push them into the Atlantic division with Cuse and BC...enough with that for Clemson and FSU who already are mismatched with northeast non rivals.

I'm not sure how you can argue "Academics don't matter" when the conference with the highest pay day requires all of it's members to be accepted into the AAU.

Guess what? Academics mattered because if Maryland wasn't AAU, they wouldn't be in the B1G right now and wouldn't be diving into a pool of golden coins Scrooge McDuck style, while Louisville is stuck in the ACC with Florida State wondering if they will ever get their payday.

 

[NYUConn]

As a thought....why aren't you guys castigating Boren and Bowlsby for saying regretfully that the Big 12 missed the boat on Louisville...while UConn sits in waiting?

Could they have seen the same thing that the ACC did?

Boren....

"You know, I was for adding Louisville (when the Big 12 instead added West Virginia and TCU in 2012)," he said. "I obviously did not prevail, and they have now gone into another conference and they're not available now. But they'd have been a good fit.

The argument isn't that Louisville doesn't have value. The argument is that Louisville's value to the ACC was nowhere near that of which they had to replace: Maryland.

For all the reasons I've already laid out (DC DMA, Academics, fanbase and atheltic history), Maryland was a key piece to what the ACC needed to move forward and build a network and the ACC lost them.

However, just as egregious as it is that they lost Maryland, they went out and added a program that did absolutely nothing to address their needs as a conference. It got them a football program that rattled off a couple good seasons after spending a generation in obscurity, but didn't replace their missing DC DMA program and did nothing to counter the B1G's major incursion into NYC.

Sure, the Big 12 should of added Louisville when they had the chance but they definitely didn't lose any ground because they decided not to. In fact, when all the dust settles and if the Big 12 ends up getting a conference network before the ACC does in part because of UConn's television sets, it may end up being a blessing in disguise that the ACC was so out clueless during CR.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

When you play in a sports conference...no one is asking about the academics...MIT would be a great addition for an academics conference..so would Harvard. I understand why UConn focuses on such...when you play questionable football, focus on the academics.

When you are watching Alabama vs LSU...you are watching football and you do not look up their academic rating.

Louisville has a good AD...a good fan base...plays competitively. Maryland was in decline. Their football was in the bottom third of the conference and their basketball had faded..?

Academics? Yep...people turn the dial to watch a game because of academics.

The problem with UConn? Folks wanted to push them into the Atlantic division with Cuse and BC...enough with that for Clemson and FSU who already are mismatched with northeast non rivals.

Academics are very important to the B1G's Presidents, who make conference alignment decisions, and their parallel organization, the CIC. The CIC, which is the B1G plus U Chicago (and maybe Johns Hopkins now), manages over $8 billion (more that than the Ivy League) in research grants annually. How much are those college TV sport contracts worth? While the ACC has stated that academics are important to it, also, adding Louisville just showed how hollow that stand is.

Yes, Louisville has a very good fan base; but, it is small - #50 nationally (Hartford/New Haven is #30) and they don't even own all of it due to the number of U Kentucky grads who flood Louisville looking for jobs. So far all intent market-wise, the ACC traded away a 50% share of 9th largest TV market (DC) and 75% of the 26th largest market (Baltimore) for 75% share of the 50th largest market.

As for athletics themselves, Louisville has had a few good years; but, some of their questionable practices on and off the court look like they may come back to haunt them. Louisville's well publicized profit with respect to their basketball program, which are then used to pay for a wide-range of items, could be in trouble. Should the agency that run the Yum Center fall into bankruptcy, which has been rumored for 2 years now, the sweetheart deal that the Cardinals have would be toast. Talk is that alone would cut in half their basketball program profits. Now, what happens if the NCAA hammers the basketball program over using school funds to provide adult entertainment to basketball players and recruits, some of whom were under 18?

 

[CoastAtlantic]

The Bad Guy ‏@snoopdoug44 3h3 hours ago
The Bad Guy Retweeted Tim Brando

@theDudeofWV @geoffmitchell @BlatantHomerism

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 2h2 hours ago
@snoopdoug44 @geoffmitchell @BlatantHomerism @TimBrando Hearing the same about ACCN & ND jumping all in...


Bluevod ‏@Bluevodreal 2h2 hours ago
Bluevod Retweeted Omega Supreme

End goal is 20 per super conference. May not happen this round but eventually.

Corneilus Green ‏@CGreen63 1h1 hour ago
@Bluevodreal Any updates on the 2nd half of Big Ten rights?

Bluevod ‏@Bluevodreal 1h1 hour ago
@CGreen63 last info was ESPN. Had to get it. But CBS /NBC fighting. I think NBC get's CG

Corneilus Green ‏@CGreen63 1h1 hour ago
@Bluevodreal Any updates on FSU, GT, UVA, and UNC to Big 10? What about Duke, ND, and UCONN?

Bluevod ‏@Bluevodreal 1h1 hour ago
@CGreen63 same 4 with ND in play and smoke on Okl

Corneilus Green ‏@CGreen63 38m38 minutes ago
@Bluevodreal No smoke with UCONN and Duke?

Bluevod ‏@Bluevodreal 12m12 minutes ago
@CGreen63 no I have heard nothing on uconn one source told me Duke to the big10 but I do not buy it unless the NC scandal is a deal breaker

HUGE‏@Hugeshow
Rumblings Notre Dame Could Have Eye On Joining Big Ten

][\/][ Eric ][\/][ ‏@EMznSanders 36m36 minutes ago
][\/][ Eric ][\/][ Retweeted HUGE

@Bluevodreal looks like they are onto you!

Bluevod ‏@Bluevodreal 16m16 minutes ago
@EMznSanders lucky guess

Bluevod ‏@Bluevodreal 5m5 minutes ago
Bluevod Retweeted HUGE

Who is this BlueVod character


ME: Good Gawd!

 

[jostar1]

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 5h5 hours ago
Thinking out loud: What if the U of Houston is the best chance for the long term viability of the B12? Don't react emotionally. Think...

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 5h5 hours ago
Maybe the best chance to have a network & expand would be for the Texas State govt to force UT to play nice. That means UH in the Big 12.

Christopher Lambert ‏@theDudeofWV 5h5 hours ago
Don't react emotionally. Think how best to change UT's hard no to a yes.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Can we drop the Dude from the thread? Do we quote random message board posters' opinions in this thread? That is all the Dude is.

 

[CL82]

As a thought....why aren't you guys castigating Boren and Bowlsby for saying regretfully that the Big 12 missed the boat on Louisville...while UConn sits in waiting?

Could they have seen the same thing that the ACC did?

Boren....

"You know, I was for adding Louisville (when the Big 12 instead added West Virginia and TCU in 2012)," he said. "I obviously did not prevail, and they have now gone into another conference and they're not available now. But they'd have been a good fit.

'Ville was a more logical choice for the big 12, UConn FG or thecACC. FSU threw its weight as around and got Louisville. That was the its all about football, academics be damned choice. They may end up regrettting that decision.

 

[Kgun7]

As a thought....why aren't you guys castigating Boren and Bowlsby for saying regretfully that the Big 12 missed the boat on Louisville...while UConn sits in waiting?

Could they have seen the same thing that the ACC did?

Boren....

"You know, I was for adding Louisville (when the Big 12 instead added West Virginia and TCU in 2012)," he said. "I obviously did not prevail, and they have now gone into another conference and they're not available now. But they'd have been a good fit.

Let me get this straight: This thread is full of examples defining exactly how the SEC and B1G clearly out maneuvered the ACC and B12 in conference realignment thus far. And you purposely chose to use an example of the ACC and B12 both coveting the same expansion candidate ... to bolster your argument???

 

[billybud]

The ACC had good basketball match ups.....what was needed was a few more compelling football match ups.....and there were few left to add in the east that could give that.

What was not needed was more Wake vs Duke, BC vs Virginia, Cuse vs BC, NC State vs Cuse type football games. That's why the shoring up of schedules with Notre Dame was a good thing.

I do understand the thought about "markets" and revenue...but as a fan of a football school, first and foremost, I want exciting football matchups.

A UConn guy might be excited about playing Kansas....I am excited about playing Louisville.

 

[billybud]

Let me get this straight: This thread is full of examples defining exactly how the SEC and B1G clearly out maneuvered the ACC and B12 in conference realignment thus far. And you purposely chose to use an example of the ACC and B12 both coveting the same expansion candidate ... to bolster your argument???

What basketball school would the SEC add? The SEC added credible football schools.

The problem with the ACC is that it was neither fish nor foul...thinking basketball while football pays the bills. Forgetting geographic compactness and rivalries and having divisions with a team in Florida in the same division as a team in Boston and Syracuse. No North-South divisions...just an ungainly mix.

The ACC finally started to figure out that football was important while Coach K and Roy Williams fought tooth and nail to keep a basketball first league. The ACC is now caught in a transitional stage but football still needs to improve and have a couple more teams ranked end of year.

If the ACC becomes a place that is not a fit for a good football program, those programs will a find a way to move on to where their needs are more adequately met.

 

[TRest]

The ACC had good basketball match ups.....what was needed was a few more compelling football match ups.....and there were few left to add in the east that could give that.

What was not needed was more Wake vs Duke, BC vs Virginia, Cuse vs BC, NC State vs Cuse type football games. That's why the shoring up of schedules with Notre Dame was a good thing.

I do understand the thought about "markets" and revenue...but as a fan of a football school, first and foremost, I want exciting football matchups.

A UConn guy might be excited about playing Kansas....I am excited about playing Louisville.

UL has a historically mediocre football program. Most of that time was spent playing home games in a minor league baseball park. Let's see what direction it goes the further it gets away from the Strong and Bridgewater years.