NCAA Infractions? | Page 5 | The Boneyard

NCAA Infractions?

Zissou said:
Vacate the national championship or pay the man. (pay the man).

"vacation of records in which men’s basketball student-athletes competed while ineligible"
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Already said it’s the 16-17, 17-18 seasons that are vacated.
 
Dogdeacon said:
What?! Pay 4-6MM for exactly what benefit? Certainly not the benefit of the contract aka bargain to coach the team & run the program diligently and comply by the rules.
A guy did his job so poorly that he got the University and himself penalties, why should he be PAID for that?
If anything UConn should sue this for the pay he took while he wasn't doing his job. The former coach was really fortunate to keep his job for as long as he did and was overpaid for the time he didn't diligently do his job. Honestly this is insane.
The circus left UConn with him and his sides' almost incomprehensible stubbornness in this losing battle is only an embarrassment in so much as the former coach was ever employed at UConn. Ever since he was fired, the persistent legal strategy ONLY made sense if they all knew he would never coach again and committed violations BUT by creating a PR 'circus' or embarrassing the University there exists a possibility to extort some money.
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People and organizations settle lawsuits all the time to avoid a lengthy, drawn out, and embarrassing process. It doesn't mean they're right or wrong, it just means they're being prudent.
This case IS an embarrassment for UConn. One of our greatest player/alums, who represented the school for well for years & is still highly regarded by many, is now involved in this messy issue with his alma mater. Yeah, it sucks to admit, but there are many like Ray Allen who still feel that regardless of the sordid details, Ollie was not treated fairly & was shafted on his compensation.
As BY members we know the dirty details and we can respectfully disagree. But rightly or wrongly that perception will be there for as long as this thing keeps going on. It's not always about being right, sometimes its just about being practical. Find a settlement, get it done, and let's REALLY put this behind us.
 
Dean Wormer said:
People and organizations settle lawsuits all the time to avoid a lengthy, drawn out, and embarrassing process. It doesn't mean they're right or wrong, it just means they're being prudent.
This case IS an embarrassment for UConn. One of our greatest player/alums, who represented the school for well for years & is still highly regarded by many, is now involved in this messy issue with his alma mater. Yeah, it sucks to admit, but there are many like Ray Allen who still feel that regardless of the sordid details, Ollie was shafted on his compensation.
As BY members we know the dirty details and we can respectfully disagree. But rightly or wrongly that perception will be there for as long as this thing keeps going on. It's not always about being right, sometimes its just about being practical. Find a settlement, get it done, and let's REALLY put this behind us.
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A bit of projection there. I don't think you are getting any money, Kevin. It's not the school that has been embarrassed today. Their stance has been propped up by this ruling.
 
crewbear742 said:
Except the authority you will cite to establish cheating is ... the NCAA report. That is the official finding of fact - especially regarding any legal proceeding. There is a principle here: "False in one. False in all." The principle isn't "False in one. False in all, except when I like it."
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I look forward to Kevin's representation in court that the NCAA's findings of cheating must always be disregarded because ... uh because no one likes the NCAA? That concept entertains the heck out of me.
A few quick observations:

Keep in mind that an NCAA finding of violation of rules does trigger a just cause termination. It doesn't matter whether you or anyone feels that the NCAA is an ethical organization.

But a finding of rule violation by the NCAA is not mandated. If UConn finds a violation of NCAA rules (or university rules) that also is sufficient for a just cause termination. Both happened in this case.

Finally, you might want review your understanding of falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus. It isn't a governing principal under these circumstances and in any event really isn't considered a doctrine in most jurisdictions these days.
 
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UConnTrumbull said:
By this logic, EVERYTHING the NCAA does must be bad. Ollie broke rules. You might not agree with the rules, but that’s different. You can be both corrupt and still make some decent decisions.
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If you call the NCAA corrupt in one case, you can't credibly cite it in another. You can't call it corrupt and then say "Its decision in this case (a decision that benefits me, btw, which is TOTALLY a coincidence) is a decent decision." You are the one citing the NCAA. Do so consistently or not at all.

Do I believe KO broke the rules? Yes. Do I think UConn's administration cared about such violations as long as he won? No. Do I think UConn's administration expected him to do what was necessary to win (wink, wink, nod, nod)? Absolutely yes. You don't win in NCAA MBB and stay clean. Do I think UConn's administration hypocritically shot KO to avoid a $10 million buyout. Yes. And so does everyone else with two connected brain cells.
 
Dogdeacon said:
The NCAA is capricious even though it seemingly suspends UConn at any opportunity. The point then might be don't risk their wrath. Maybe put something in coach's contracts to specifically avoid it. We know the NCAA comes down hard on UConn regardless, this hasn't changed.
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... and in fact it is codified (sort of) in the NCAA decision.
 
crewbear742 said:
If you call the NCAA corrupt in one case, you can't credibly cite it in another. You can't call it corrupt and then say "Its decision in this case (a decision that benefits me, btw, which is TOTALLY a coincidence) is a decent decision." You are the one citing the NCAA. Do so consistently or not at all.

Do I believe KO broke the rules? Yes. Do I think UConn's administration cared about such violations as long as he won? No. Do I think UConn's administration expected him to do what was necessary to win (wink, wink, nod, nod)? Absolutely yes. You don't win in NCAA MBB and stay clean. Do I think UConn's administration hypocritically shot KO to avoid a $10 million buyout. Yes. And so does everyone else with two connected brain cells.
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If it’s a rule why wouldn’t UConn use it to their advantage? Of course Ollie was fired for losing. But if you’re gonna lose AND cheat then that just proves you suck at all aspects of coaching. Not sure why we need a morality check here.
 
Yes KO broke some rules, however those transgressions r insignificant compare to what happen before he arrived and what is still happening now in NCAA MBB. This is selective punishment by the NCAA to support a member instititution. KO's lawyers already are planning an appeal outside of the NCAA. When the lawsuit goes to the open court. He will call witnesses that can do alot more harm to the program now that UCONN is on probabtion. Settle it now DB
 
Whtdmd said:
Yes KO broke some rules, however those transgressions r insignificant compare to what happen before he arrived and what is still happening now in NCAA MBB. This is selective punishment by the NCAA to support a member instititution. KO's lawyers already are planning an appeal outside of the NCAA. When the lawsuit goes to the open court. He will call witnesses that can do alot more harm to the program now that UCONN is on probabtion. Settle it now DB
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LOL I was wondering how long it would take for you to chime in. And with a threat on KO’s behalf no less!
 
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Whtdmd said:
Yes KO broke some rules, however those transgressions r insignificant compare to what happen before he arrived and what is still happening now in NCAA MBB. This is selective punishment by the NCAA to support a member instititution. KO's lawyers already are planning an appeal outside of the NCAA. When the lawsuit goes to the open court. He will call witnesses that can do alot more harm to the program now that UCONN is on probabtion. Settle it now DB
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So...I know I robbed a bank but the other guy robbed two banks so you cannot arrest me??
 
Whtdmd said:
Yes KO broke some rules, however those transgressions r insignificant compare to what happen before he arrived and what is still happening now in NCAA MBB. This is selective punishment by the NCAA to support a member instititution. KO's lawyers already are planning an appeal outside of the NCAA. When the lawsuit goes to the open court. He will call witnesses that can do alot more harm to the program now that UCONN is on probabtion. Settle it now DB
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Again this sure sounds an awful lot like extortion.

Are you Michael Avenetti, by any chance?
 
Huskygrad88 said:
So...I know I robbed a bank but the other guy robbed two banks so you cannot arrest me??
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this is the organization that DB is using
 

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I am so upset that I am going to take the rest of the day from work
 
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Whtdmd said:
Yes KO broke some rules, however those transgressions r insignificant compare to what happen before he arrived and what is still happening now in NCAA MBB. This is selective punishment by the NCAA to support a member instititution. KO's lawyers already are planning an appeal outside of the NCAA. When the lawsuit goes to the open court. He will call witnesses that can do alot more harm to the program now that UCONN is on probabtion. Settle it now DB
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Then he will go from beloved, to incompetent, to pathetic, to annoying to truly hated and despised. And deservedly so. He was paid to do a job he didn't do for two years. My settlement would be, pay UConn back only half of the six million you earned to be a lazy bastard and not do your job.
 
HuskyHawk said:
What? You don't think that he can convince a jury that the NCAA collaborated with UConn and penalized them and put them on probation as some elaborate ruse to help UConn avoid paying Ollie? Because that's one winner of a legal position right there. :rolleyes: It's pretty much "the dog ate my homework".
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The dog did eat Ollie's homework! ;)
 
Forde: Are NCAA sanctions against Kevin Ollie a sign of things to come for college coaches?

>>Kevin Ollie could well be the appetizer. Is the main course coming next?

If the NCAA is intent upon devouring head coaches who sit atop rule-breaking programs — holding accountable the richest and most powerful and often most protected people within a program — it may have been signaled Tuesday. That’s when the former University of Connecticut basketball coach was hit much harder than any other element of the school’s men’s basketball program as the NCAA Committee on Infractions announced its sanctions against the Huskies.<<
 
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Dean Wormer said:
People and organizations settle lawsuits all the time to avoid a lengthy, drawn out, and embarrassing process. It doesn't mean they're right or wrong, it just means they're being prudent.
This case IS an embarrassment for UConn. One of our greatest player/alums, who represented the school for well for years & is still highly regarded by many, is now involved in this messy issue with his alma mater. Yeah, it sucks to admit, but there are many like Ray Allen who still feel that regardless of the sordid details, Ollie was not treated fairly & was shafted on his compensation.
As BY members we know the dirty details and we can respectfully disagree. But rightly or wrongly that perception will be there for as long as this thing keeps going on. It's not always about being right, sometimes its just about being practical. Find a settlement, get it done, and let's REALLY put this behind us.
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Your reasoning is faulty & forced (ie lengthy and drawn out mean the same thing), Ollie is at best top-30 on greatest UConn players, maybe 15-ish on best NBA careers. Regardless, Tate George had a great UConn/NBA career but people eventually stopped giving him money to embezzle.

Paying the former coach at this point does nothing, the stain, PR, stigma whatever exists - paying him won't make it vanish. Part of being prudent, as you say is also to NOT pay frivolous lawsuits that invite more lawsuits. Hopefully there are never again MBB coaches to which this applies, but UConn has plenty of employees and doesn't need to settle every time one of them keeps suing without merit and losing (especially the discrimination suit makes this argument).
 
bmayuc said:
C'mon. This is a classic easy out for the NCAA. Nail the guy who is no longer an NCAA coach and will not ever again be an NCAA coach. Looks like they are holding accountability but in reality no impact. CLASSIC NCAA.

The argument for paying Ollie his money, btw, is that Ollie is very well regarded by our incredibly important basketball alums, and not coming to a reasonable agreement with Ollie will poison that relationship and cost us much more than some $$ in the long term.
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Just stop.

We could shoot every miffed basketball alum into the sun and it would not cost us even a tiny fraction of $10,000,000.
 
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Guapo said:
Broad to an attorney.

Clearly vague to Ollie.
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If any of the contract provisions were vague to Ollie, he should have had his attorneys explain them before he signed. My guess is the only thing Ollie saw when he signed it was $$$$$.
 
CL82 said:
I look forward to Kevin's representation in court that the NCAA's findings of cheating must always be disregarded because ... uh because no one likes the NCAA? That concept entertains the heck out of me.
A few quick observations:

Keep in mind that an NCAA finding of violation of rules does trigger a just cause termination. It doesn't matter whether you or anyone feels that the NCAA is an ethical organization.

But a finding of rule violation by the NCAA is not mandated. If UConn finds a violation of NCAA rules (or university rules) that also is sufficient for a just cause termination. Both happened in this case.

Finally, you might want review your understanding of falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus. It isn't a governing principal under these circumstances and in any event really isn't considered a doctrine in most jurisdictions these days.
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I don't care a tinker's dam about legalities and jurisdictions. I care about the ethics of the matter. Lawyers care about legalities and jurisdictions. The overlap between law and ethics is entirely coincidental in any case. I care about simple principles like "Let your 'Yes' be 'Yes' ". As in "Don't look for legal ways to do unethical things." I care about virtue not being made the servant of expediency. I know that is what lawyers do. That doesn't make it any less wrong.
 
crewbear742 said:
I care about simple principles like "Let your 'Yes' be 'Yes' ". As in "Don't look for legal ways to do unethical things." I care about virtue not being made the servant of expediency. I
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Uh is this the argument you really want to be making since the NCAA has issued a finding that Kevin is both unethical and dishonest?
 
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