NBA Discussion 2016/2017 | Page 8 | The Boneyard

NBA Discussion 2016/2017

superjohn said:
Jimmy Butler better than Jae Crowder??? No way. You probably think Anthony Davis is better than Taj Gibson as well.
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One thing i would like @temery , seeing who i've blocked in thread , or 'unignore messages'. It gets confusing with people responding in thread, even though most of the time its JSM for me.
 
BUConn10 said:
I'd say the Lakers' real HR hit will be with Ingram. The fact that DLo is just a bonus shows ridiculously lucky they have been.
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i'm wildly skeptical on Ingram, don't you think he looks like a skeleton out there? DLo i'm a big fan of no doubt, but ingram idk. what is his upside? tayshaun prince? this last draft was so trash imo
 
walker11 said:
I wish the Celtics could have gotten Butler but it never made sense for the Bulls. Does anyone think Butler can be the best player on a championship team? I am not sure.
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Probably not but there is just a handful of those guys in the league.
 
superjohn said:
Probably not but there is just a handful of those guys in the league.
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Probably my view as well, especially in the super team era. I want to see a 3rd super team, maybe CP goes to the Spurs.

I will dream he goes to the Knicks, may not be a super team but would love him and KP (and Melo is still very good, for all the hate me and others give him)
 
Can you read clown, wait that was rhetorical.

They wanted Crowder the pick and Bradley.

They draft a guy as a backup to a guy worse than the guy they could have gotten. The Brown pick was terrible, several mocks had him 8-10 or higher.

superjohn said:
Jimmy Butler better than Jae Crowder??? No way. You probably think Anthony Davis is better than Taj Gibson as well.
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pretty even matchup still with wall n walker, though i would say walker is not playing well. has a lot of assists but doing a lot of complaining and not getting back on defense. also not hitting his threes off pnr. theres no way i would leave this game saying wall was a much better player, both are touching the paint a lot but walker is passing better.
 
JSM1970 said:
Can you read clown, wait that was rhetorical.

They wanted Crowder the pick and Bradley.

They draft a guy as a backup to a guy worse than the guy they could have gotten. The Brown pick was terrible, several mocks had him 8-10 or higher.
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I think their rationale was they need a superstar. I would be very surprised if he gets there, but he has the highest upside. None of the other rookies you mentioned moved the needle. I agree though that they should have made the trade, at least they would lock up the 2 seed. Even though who knows if the Bulls agree.

Edit. Didn't see Bradley included. Bradley is very, very good. I don't think they would be better off with Jimmy, unless they think Smart or Rozier are good.
 
James said:
i'm wildly skeptical on Ingram, don't you think he looks like a skeleton out there? DLo i'm a big fan of no doubt, but ingram idk. what is his upside? tayshaun prince? this last draft was so trash imo
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He's too skinny right now, gonna take time but the pieces and skill this early are there in spades, hes still a teenager its crazy.

Also Kemba is getting ABUSED by the refs right now. Multiple no calls and even on a clear hit to his arm shooting a 3 where the ball barely got halfway and no call
 
JSM1970 said:
Can you read clown, wait that was rhetorical.

They wanted Crowder the pick and Bradley.

They draft a guy as a backup to a guy worse than the guy they could have gotten. The Brown pick was terrible, several mocks had him 8-10 or higher.
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Holy cr@p, you can't even read your own posts. By far the angriest and dumbest poster in boneyard history.
 
James said:
pretty even matchup still with wall n walker, though i would say walker is not playing well. has a lot of assists but doing a lot of complaining and not getting back on defense. also not hitting his threes off pnr. theres no way i would leave this game saying wall was a much better player, both are touching the paint a lot but walker is passing better.
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Basing who is a better player off of one regular season game is incredibly silly.
 
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Its just a matchup, numbers say walker, so its interesting to see how wall stacks up. Wall is good as hell, just not close to the shooter kemba is. hornets dont look good at all tonight, a lot of crap minutes from kaminsky, mkg looking like garbage closing the game. statistics show mkg nor beli are as good as lamb yet he struggles to get 10 mpg . its really getting crazy over here, hopefully a beat writer asks why. Lamb started TWO games and they won BOTH in november. while he averaged a double double.
 
James said:
Its just a matchup, numbers say walker, so its interesting to see how wall stacks up. Wall is good as hell, just not close to the shooter kemba is. hornets dont look good at all tonight, a lot of crap minutes from kaminsky, mkg looking like garbage closing the game. statistics show mkg nor beli are as good as lamb yet he struggles to get 10 mpg . its really getting crazy over here, hopefully a beat writer asks why. Lamb started TWO games and they won BOTH in november. while he averaged a double double.
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But like, do the numbers really say walker? Wall looks to have had a better game for sure.
 
Seems like they could have swapped Rozier or Smart instead of Bradley, but who knows.

They will need a home run, the drafts other than Bradley in 2010 haven't been great. Last year was crazy, 3 #1s, 5 #2s and basically have nothing to really be excited about. 2 stashes we may never hear from again.

walker11 said:
I think their rationale was they need a superstar. I would be very surprised if he gets there, but he has the highest upside. None of the other rookies you mentioned moved the needle. I agree though that they should have made the trade, at least they would lock up the 2 seed. Even though who knows if the Bulls agree.

Edit. Didn't see Bradley included. Bradley is very, very good. I don't think they would be better off with Jimmy, unless they think Smart or Rozier are good.
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superjohn said:
Is this a serious question?
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Yes, because when you look at the numbers all year long Kemba's are better to the majority of eyes. So of Kemba has stats on his side and wins a head to head matchup how can you properly assess whose better. Wall won tonight and had a better game and was hitting big shots near the end of the game and Kemba wasn't. I'm saying if head to head matchups and stats can't conclude whose better than how do you suggest it? You still haven't said how you think it should be.
 
Wall and Kemba are tough to compare because one guy's strengths are literally the other's weakness.

They're about the same level as players, but it's too early to definitively say who's better.
 
BUConn10 said:
Yes, because when you look at the numbers all year long Kemba's are better to the majority of eyes. So of Kemba has stats on his side and wins a head to head matchup how can you properly assess whose better. Wall won tonight and had a better game and was hitting big shots near the end of the game and Kemba wasn't. I'm saying if head to head matchups and stats can't conclude whose better than how do you suggest it? You still haven't said how you think it should be.
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You have to consider total body of work. Stats are important, as is the eye test. Head to head matchups can be important. But 1 game head to head is far too small of a sample size. Hell, even 10 games head to head is too small. There really is no way to definitively compare two players (unless the stats are overwhelming IMO). Smart people often hold different opinions on who player comparisons. I value your opinion, but I'm sure there are tons of players we disagree on. It doesn't mean either is necessarily wrong.
 
walker11 said:
You have to consider total body of work. Stats are important, as is the eye test. Head to head matchups can be important. But 1 game head to head is far too small of a sample size. Hell, even 10 games head to head is too small. There really is no way to definitively compare two players (unless the stats are overwhelming IMO). Smart people often hold different opinions on who player comparisons. I value your opinion, but I'm sure there are tons of players we disagree on. It doesn't mean either is necessarily wrong.
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If you guys think my position is that one game determines whose better once and for all then you have me completely wrong.

This is the first head to head matchup between the two since CardiacAndre was arguing his point that Wall is better. My point was that NBA stars of the same tier tend to step up and player harder against each other and I thought that to be true of tonight's game between Kemba and John. It was really meant to be a way to bring up a game for people here to follow closely tonight, it's been taken too seriously.

BUT that being said I will revise my statement. My official position on the matter is this: If I am an NBA GM in a hypothetical league redraft scenario, and I have to choose between Walker and Wall as my franchise point guards to build off of, I am taking Kemba. A PG that doesn't have a consistent jumper is playing way below his and the team's potential in this league right now.
 
walker11 said:
You have to consider total body of work. Stats are important, as is the eye test. Head to head matchups can be important. But 1 game head to head is far too small of a sample size. Hell, even 10 games head to head is too small. There really is no way to definitively compare two players (unless the stats are overwhelming IMO). Smart people often hold different opinions on who player comparisons. I value your opinion, but I'm sure there are tons of players we disagree on. It doesn't mean either is necessarily wrong.
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Well said.
 
James said:
i'm wildly skeptical on Ingram, don't you think he looks like a skeleton out there? DLo i'm a big fan of no doubt, but ingram idk. what is his upside? tayshaun prince? this last draft was so trash imo
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I must disagree... I think his CEILING is Kevin Durant.

His likely place, in my opinion: Not as good as a Durant, McGrady, etc., but he will be a step below a superstar scorer...

I'm trying to think of a player comp on the spot, and I'm too OCD about these things to put out a bad comp, lol.

But I think he'll be an all-star level wing scorer, but I don't know that he reaches that elite status.
 
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Mr. French said:
I must disagree... I think his CEILING is Kevin Durant.

His likely place, in my opinion: Not as good as a Durant, McGrady, etc., but he will be a step below a superstar scorer...

I'm trying to think of a player comp on the spot, and I'm too OCD about these things to put out a bad comp, lol.

But I think he'll be an all-star level wing scorer, but I don't know that he reaches that elite status.
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Paul George but maybe less explosive? He gets a significant amount of assists for a young wing labeled as a scorer coming in.
 
James said:
i'm wildly skeptical on Ingram, don't you think he looks like a skeleton out there? DLo i'm a big fan of no doubt, but ingram idk. what is his upside? tayshaun prince? this last draft was so trash imo
Expand ...

I must disagree... I think his CEILING is Kevin Durant.

His likely place, in my opinion: Not as good as a Durant, McGrady, etc., but he will be a step below a superstar scorer...

I'm trying to think of a player comp on the spot, and I'm too OCD about these things to put out a bad comp, lol.

But I think he'll be an all-star level wing scorer, but I don't know that he reaches that elite status.
 
Geez this dumb thing wasn't loading, then I guess loaded 3x -- Paul George was a first thought, but then I think his game won't be quite as versatile as PG, tho I could be wrong. He rebounds well.
 
His game is unique, so he's tough to compare. Very good midrange like Melo, but obv body type of a KD/PG.
 
Ingram just turned 19 a couple months ago (almost two years younger than Jalen Adams, remarkably), so it makes little sense to cap the potential of a kid that gifted. Not saying he's over-matched or can't contribute at this level as a 19-year-old (though his stats would indicate that might be true), but in a perfect world, he's still playing in college right now. He's literally a kid playing against grown men and man is he built like a kid.

The Durant comparisons were always a bit silly, IMO. Durant posted 25, 7, and 3 on 48/42/86 splits at age 20. He's a generational player and I think Ingram is more than one level below that. I think he's closer to Otto Porter.
 
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