McCallie steps in it; no "lessons learned;" UConn mention [merged thread]

[Vowelguy]

Its amazing how the Student Athlete was very gracious in her statement for leaving , and the coach comes off as a jerk.

Yes, but you know what they say about glass houses ...

The transfer of Liz Sherwood was not among Geno's best moments.

 

[Phillyconn]

Yes, but you know what they say about glass houses ...

The transfer of Liz Sherwood was not among Geno's best moments.

What about it?

 

[Vowelguy]

What about it?

Geno said a few less-than-gracious things about Liz when she left.

I only bring it up to point out that every coach, even Geno, makes mistakes.

 

[Rocket009]

Geno said a few less-than-gracious things about Liz when she left.

I only bring it up to point out that every coach, even Geno, makes mistakes.

I think this is what you are referring to:

"We knew Liz was lazy,'' Auriemma said. "Everybody knew. But everyone knew she had potential, too. What you're hoping is you can get her there and change her, make her do some things she hasn't done up to that point. And it didn't work out. But you take a chance."

You can read the full article here, but in context it is not particularly bad. It could have been said better, or perhaps better off not said at all, but then that's not really Geno's style.

He Saw It Coming

 

[BigBird]

To me The Muffett at ND...has come up short every time but one, and that one can be argued she and ND wouldn't have beaten UCONN in 2001 FF semi's if UCONN had both Svet & Shea healthy! And yes ND had beaten UCONN earlier in the season WITH Svet & Shea healthy, but the FF is a different type of animal, look up UCONN 11-0 in FF Finals! Svet & Shea would as seniors have settled an unnerved Huskies after 1/2 time, and they would have played with DT on the bench not shooting 1 for 15! Cinching the victory then beating Purdue in the Finals giving UCONN eventually 5 titles in a row!

I get it, but this "coulda-woulda-shoulda" seems somehow a bit out of place when discussing UConn WBB. But, yeah.

 

[CocoHusky]

I think this is what you are referring to:

"We knew Liz was lazy,'' Auriemma said. "Everybody knew. But everyone knew she had potential, too. What you're hoping is you can get her there and change her, make her do some things she hasn't done up to that point. And it didn't work out. But you take a chance."

You can read the full article here, but in context it is not particularly bad. It could have been said better, or perhaps better off not said at all, but then that's not really Geno's style.

He Saw It Coming

Seems like not much has change.
"Kids, all they talk about now is playing time. We've got to find kids that want to win national championships"
Geno 2004

 

[CL82]

I think this is what you are referring to:

"We knew Liz was lazy,'' Auriemma said. "Everybody knew. But everyone knew she had potential, too. What you're hoping is you can get her there and change her, make her do some things she hasn't done up to that point. And it didn't work out. But you take a chance."

You can read the full article here, but in context it is not particularly bad. It could have been said better, or perhaps better off not said at all, but then that's not really Geno's style.

He Saw It Coming

Slightly expanded version of that quote:

``We knew Liz was lazy,'' Auriemma said. ``Everybody knew. But everyone knew she had potential, too. What you're hoping is you can get her there and change her, make her do some things she hasn't done up to that point. And it didn't work out. But you take a chance.

``We thought once we got Kiana here, we [could] get her to do the things we needed her to do.

``That doesn't mean the players that don't make it here or don't want to come here are bad kids or bad players or we're making mistakes. The bottom line is, the kid's got to do what you ask her to do. If she doesn't ... this program's not for everybody.''

I see that as a frank assessment rather than a parting shot, but I may be jaded.

 

[Dillon77]

For all the negatives, you have to appreciate McCallie for providing such a spicy topic for the off-season. Perhaps she will make regular statements about once every couple of weeks just to keep us entertained.

Seriously though, her statement farther reveals her cold indifference/bitterness to others that seems to be her trademark. She's trying to point the finger elsewhere when it's pretty obvious that she is not able to build a team (not just on the court but with her staff too).

Well, I picked an interesting weekend to go away.
Regarding the "cold indifference" you refer to: One of the main picking points on the ND Board is that McCallie would never refer to another player by name, but by the person's number, even if the stat sheet she had in front of her nose had the two next to each other.

Well, since she was referring -- largely -- to her own players (graduated, transfers out, transfers in) in this article, she used names. But the seemingly indifferent but lookiing-down-on-you disdain in which the comments are made is still there. Uggh.

I never wish anyone ill will (save for getting on a plane to Bermuda Triangle), but I'll join my fellow Domer fan, Orangutan, and hope that ND keeps pounding Duke during the regular season and post-season tournament. Whew....

 

[CocoHusky]

You can read the full article here, but in context it is not particularly bad. It could have been said better, or perhaps better off not said at all, but then that's not really Geno's style.

Yup .

I see that as a frank assessment rather than a parting shot, but I may be jaded.

She had already decided to leave the program. A frank assessment is not going to help you or her at that point. There is no recovery from an assessment that starts with " Liz was lazy.."

 

[EricLA]

Slightly expanded version of that quote:

``We knew Liz was lazy,'' Auriemma said. ``Everybody knew. But everyone knew she had potential, too. What you're hoping is you can get her there and change her, make her do some things she hasn't done up to that point. And it didn't work out. But you take a chance.

``We thought once we got Kiana here, we [could] get her to do the things we needed her to do.

``That doesn't mean the players that don't make it here or don't want to come here are bad kids or bad players or we're making mistakes. The bottom line is, the kid's got to do what you ask her to do. If she doesn't ... this program's not for everybody.''

I see that as a frank assessment rather than a parting shot, but I may be jaded.

I would have preferred he use a different word rather than "lazy". It's a very broad word with highly negative connotations in this situation. But I do agree, when you look at the quote in its' entirety, he explains exactly what he wanted to say. UCONN isn't a program for everyone. As much as kids are told what to expect when they arrive, nothing can prepare them. I bet almost all kids say a version of Brianna Banks quote - "with regards to going hard in practice, their hard and my hard were 2 different things."

Kids will learn, or they will ride the pine, or they will transfer. Geno and CD will do all they can to help, but sometimes... there isn't anything you can do...

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

Comparing Duke/McCallie (stated above posts) with UCONN/Geno to developing fringe players- - -
Liz Sherwood wound up at Vandy where she had 3 quiet years, sometimes starting, sometimes not, she played just hard enough to get by and in the games I saw she was an average player! Nothing she did stood out and made her a special player.
She did have some ability that with harder effort could have made her a much better player! But that would have meant she'd have to worked harder.
Kiana Robinson that transferred out same time as Liz S. She went to GA where she disappeared from view.
Everyone has potential but some never reach theirs because of many reasons and it's a shame that it doesn't mean much to those players and they settle for mediocrity!
Charde Houston was another that at UCONN she never sustained the top ability that was inside her! In the WNBA she had a few very good years that pointed out how much she didn't do in college!
Ann Strother was an interesting case that she was thrilled to be the 2nd or 3rd option to team mates, DT and Barbara Turner, but when DT graduated Ann was a reluctant star! Meanwhile Barb Turner shined!
Then you have Kara Wolters, Stef Dolson, Maria Conlon, Jessica Moore, Kelly Faris, Kelly Schumacher,Ketia Swanier, Kalana Greene, and Ashley Battle, that were not highly recruited and had very good to Star Quality careers at UCONN and some in the WNBA!

 

[CL82]

Yup .


She had already decided to leave the program. A frank assessment is not going to help you or her at that point. There is no recovery from an assessment that starts with " Liz was lazy.."

It was a 'frank assessment' of the state of UConn recruiting at the time, not a to do list for Liz who had terminated her relationship with program.

 

[cabbie191]

LOL, what a great comment from the Duke Basketball Report:

You know, of all the people to get into a media scrap with, Auriemma is one to avoid. First, he's good at it. Second, he enjoys it. And third, no matter who you are, he's better than you are.

See all you naysayers - there is value in a Duke education!

 

[cabbie191]

I agree with her on the part about U Conn being down on talent at the 4 and 5 spot. Butler is the only true 5 and she has had her struggles. If Tuck stayed they would of been fine. They did what they had to do to fix their weakness. I see nothing wrong with that. Object of the game is to win right? Any transfer would be a fool not to go to U Conn if given the chance. I have to admit i am a little curious as to how Staley is getting all these quality transfers? It does look a little fishy when girls she is coaching in summer ball end up leaving to play for her the next year. They could just like playing for her. But if she is using it as a tool to recruit and get in players ears to sway them her direction then that is kind of shady.

Seems to me that some of South Carolina's fellow SEC travelers are pretty quick to cry foul if they think there's even a snowball's chance of freezing in Hades that one of their rivals has done anything amiss.

The fact they have been silent tells me everything Dawn has done regarding recruiting and transfers is on the up and up.

 

[CL82]

See all you naysayers - there is value in a Duke education!

...well that and their grads are servers at better restaurants...

 

[meyers7]

This latest episode didn't help her. I'd counsel her to be silent. A few more of these may cause them to rethink their decision.

Maybe she's trying to get fired, tired of coaching and wants the buy out.

 

[iamcbs]

Duke's a great school in its way; UConn's a great school in its way. No need to compare or compete. That's playing someone else's game (U.S. News & World Report).

As to the purity of Duke's athletics, well, Coach K really changed his tune about recruiting the one-and-go-pro kids when he discovered he couldn't compete with Kentucky.

Lesson: don't throw stones.

The biggest hypocrites in the world are coaches of athletic teams and the worst of those are coaches of NCAA athletic teams. Coach P. seems frustrated and angry and she has only herself to blame. I guess that's what happens when have a little success too early or when you're just an(insert expletive here).

 

[CocoHusky]

It was a 'frank assessment' of the state of UConn recruiting at the time, not a to do list for Liz who had terminated her relationship with program.

Then no need for Geno to mention Liz's name since Liz had terminated her relationship with the program.

 

[HuskyNan]

Sigh.

"RSHERMVIKES, post: 1734716, member: 2251"]Comparing Duke/McCallie (stated above posts) with UCONN/Geno to developing fringe players- - -
Liz Sherwood wound up at Vandy where she had 3 quiet years, sometimes starting, sometimes not, she played just hard enough to get by and in the games I saw she was an average player! Nothing she did stood out and made her a special player.

Liz was not a "fringe player". She was ranked #4 by Blue Star and was seen as the heir apparent to Jess Moore. Liz's leaving left UConn really thin in the post (Ann Strother had to play center at times), which is why Geno was so angry with her. He really, really wanted her to stay. She was also named to the All-Big East Rookie team, despite sitting out several games with a knee injury.

At Vandy, she won the SEC Sixth Woman of the Year in only her first season there. She won it again the next year. She was a key player for the Commodores.

She did have some ability that with harder effort could have made her a much better player! But that would have meant she'd have to worked harder.

Near the end of the season, Liz was diagnosed with a hypothyroidism, which can cause feelings of fatigue. I know this because her father, who was upset at reading Boneyarders trash his daughter, emailed me and told me. He gave me the ok to share the info because Liz is NOT lazy, she was ill.

Ann Strother was an interesting case that she was thrilled to be the 2nd or 3rd option to team mates, DT and Barbara Turner, but when DT graduated Ann was a reluctant star!

In addition, both Liz and Annie, who played for the same AAU team, the Colorado Hoopsters, were deeply affected by questioning by Colorado authorities about their former AAU coach, the pedophile Rick Lopez. They underwent extensive, and emotionally painful, questioning. Lopez was finally arrested a few months after the end of Liz's freshman season and he committed suicide a few months after that. Anyone who thinks a couple of young women could remain unaffected by that is quite heartless.

As to why she left, I don't have permission to share everything but I can tell you that Liz always wanted to go to Vanderbilt but chose UConn to please the adults in her life. She loved UConn and her teammates but it wasn't where her heart was so she was unhappy, a situation made worse by her injury and illness.

I hope people will stop and think that, maybe, they don't know everything and that they shouldn't make assumptions about people, especially based on one ill-considered word used by Geno 12 years ago. You never know what's going on in someone else's life.

 

[CL82]

Then no need for Geno to mention Liz's name since Liz had terminated her relationship with the program.

No, because he was asked about her departure, so he explained it.

 

[CL82]

Maybe she's trying to get fired, tired of coaching and wants the buy out.

Maybe, but I still go back to my Capt. Queeg analogy.


I suspect she's feeling the pressure on the transfers so she's constructed a (tortured) scenario where she bears no blame.

 

[Buckaroobanzai]

The penchant for moral equivalency, which infects our political discourse, has spread to the Boneyard. Certainly, Geno's "lazy" characterization of Liz Sherwood was inappropriate. However, that comment falls far short of JPM's implication that Azura Stevens (and her parents) either lied to or deceived JPM. And, of course, whatever academic component impacted on Azura's decision to defect from Duke was absolutely none of JPM's business or concern. Finally, when Geno commented on Liz Sherwood's departure, he did not attack her parents and said nothing about how morally reprehensible Vanderbilt was in accepting Sherwood's transfer. Gene may too often be acerbic in his comments. With the exception of the Sherwood episode, he has been uniformly appropriate in his comments about transfers from his program.

 

[Vowelguy]

The penchant for moral equivalency, which infects our political discourse, has spread to the Boneyard.

There also is a penchant on the Boneyard to believe that everything about UConn is purer than the driven snow, and thereby cast aspersions on anything and everything that happens elsewhere, from scheduling to transfers and everything in between. But that is folly. UConn clearly makes fewer mistakes than most, but it is _not_ perfect.

I raised the Sherwood issue specifically and solely in response to and to provide context to the comment:

"Its amazing how the Student Athlete was very gracious in her statement for leaving , and the coach comes off as a jerk"​

Again the implication is that would _never_ happen at UConn. The Sherwood case provides a counterexample.

 

[Carnac]

It would be suicide to do that on a U Conn board LOL. Not at all . I do think for the first time in awhile they were thin on bigs and they saw a few quality players who fit their need. Like i said i see nothing wrong with it. My team needs another big and wish they would take in a transfer or two .

Welcome to the Boneyard southbendcane. It's always nice to get some "fresh meat" here in the yard. We look forward to more posts and comments from you. It's always nice to get the thoughts and perspectives from others outside of our program.
You're right, we are a bit biased with respect to our girls, our staff and our program. What true fan isn't? Go Huskies.

 

[Phillyconn]

I think this is what you are referring to:

"We knew Liz was lazy,'' Auriemma said. "Everybody knew. But everyone knew she had potential, too. What you're hoping is you can get her there and change her, make her do some things she hasn't done up to that point. And it didn't work out. But you take a chance."

You can read the full article here, but in context it is not particularly bad. It could have been said better, or perhaps better off not said at all, but then that's not really Geno's style.

He Saw It Coming

Not really bad. Just being honest.