May 2024 WNBA Thread, part II | Page 3 | The Boneyard

May 2024 WNBA Thread, part II

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I expected the Fever to be a top 6 team in the league and I don’t think the Sun are a top 3 team in the league right now with that back court. They might get there but right now they are a good but not great team that had a bad night and the Fever couldn’t get the win desperate on their home floor.

What caused me concern for the Fever is Caitlin was -18 and her team was + 14 without her on the floor. The biggest difference i saw between this game and the last one with CT was that stretch she was out with the twisted ankle and went from down 8-10 to up 3 at the half. Without that I think we see a similar game as the last one where the CT lead is hovers around 8-12 points all game and then they go on a little run in the 4th to extend to 15. Whatever they are doing when Caitlin is on the court isn’t working and a close loss is just hiding that.

Caitlin is a great talent as is Aliyah Boston but the best stretch for the Fever came with both of them on the bench to end the second half.

The most concerning thing for the Fever is Wallace is one of their best 5 players this season and not because she got better. They added one of the greatest rookie talents and still somehow managed to figure out a way to downgrade their roster overall. Perplexing franchise.
Not sure how you conclude that about the Sun. Their backcourt of Harris/Carrington is fantastic. Both fill their role extremely well and allow Alyssa Thomas be the primary distributor. They definitely look like a top team to start the year along with the Liberty.
 
Not sure how you conclude that about the Sun. Their backcourt of Harris/Carrington is fantastic. Both fill their role extremely well and allow Alyssa Thomas be the primary distributor. They definitely look like a top team to start the year along with the Liberty.
Fantastic is overly optimistic. I’d take the Liberty,Aces, Mercury, Dream, Sparks, Fever,
Storm, Lynx, Sky over theirs. I don’t consider a bottom 3 backcourt fantastic nor a recipe for success in the playoffs. I love the Sun so maybe I’m overly critical but they have taken a big step back from the last few season to me eye test wise and roster construction wise. They’ll be better when Jones gets fully healthy I think and hope and pray but I suspect they’ll drop a few of their upcoming games.

Right now I see the WNBA as a league with two top teams and a lot of mess underneath. The Sun might separate themselves to make it three top teams by the seasons end (as might a couple others) but it’s far from a sure thing imo.
 
I expected the Fever to be a top 6 team in the league and I don’t think the Sun are a top 3 team in the league right now with that back court. They might get there but right now they are a good but not great team that had a bad night and the Fever couldn’t get the win desperate on their home floor.

What caused me concern for the Fever is Caitlin was -18 and her team was + 14 without her on the floor. The biggest difference i saw between this game and the last one with CT was that stretch she was out with the twisted ankle and went from down 8-10 to up 3 at the half. Without that I think we see a similar game as the last one where the CT lead is hovers around 8-12 points all game and then they go on a little run in the 4th to extend to 15. Whatever they are doing when Caitlin is on the court isn’t working and a close loss is just hiding that.

Caitlin is a great talent as is Aliyah Boston but the best stretch for the Fever came with both of them on the bench to end the second half.

The most concerning thing for the Fever is Wallace is one of their best 5 players this season and not because she got better. They added one of the greatest rookie talents and still somehow managed to figure out a way to downgrade their roster overall. Perplexing franchise.
The biggest surprise to me so far is the initial incompatibility of Clark and Boston. Everybody is talking about Clark's struggles, but Boston is having a horrible start as well. On paper I thought the addition of Clark would be a major advantage for Boston since Clark is such a good passer.

Clark having to adjust to the WNBA is a major factor of course, but perhaps her new teammates adjusting to her is just as big an issue. WNBA rookies have to adjust to a new system and generally learn to fit in. Caitlin has had systems built around her talents and how much she dominates the ball. Instead of the rookie fitting in and learning the system, the rest of the Pacers roster has to learn how to play with Clark.

I suspect in time that will happen, but the dynamics between Clark and Boston is an interesting subplot to watch. What seemed like a marriage made in heaven when they were paired up, is looking like they are preparing for divorce court instead so far.
 
Prior to this game, I saw a stat she was one of only four rookies to ever amass 50 points and 15 assists in their first 3 games in the league. Think about that. While she was "struggling," she did something only 3 players had done in the previous 25+ years of the league's existence.
And this is why statistics are so deceptive. How many rookies played as many minutes? Took as many shots? Had the ball in their hands so often? Allowed more points than they scored? Played defense? Won games? Maybe Clark will get by excelling only on offense, but she has a long way to go in developing her game to contribute as a winner. She has brought lots of fans to the wnba. Hope those fans can recognize all of the great players in the league.
 
I expected the Fever to be a top 6 team in the league and I don’t think the Sun are a top 3 team in the league right now with that back court. They might get there but right now they are a good but not great team that had a bad night and the Fever couldn’t get the win desperate on their home floor.

What caused me concern for the Fever is Caitlin was -18 and her team was + 14 without her on the floor. The biggest difference i saw between this game and the last one with CT was that stretch she was out with the twisted ankle and went from down 8-10 to up 3 at the half. Without that I think we see a similar game as the last one where the CT lead is hovers around 8-12 points all game and then they go on a little run in the 4th to extend to 15. Whatever they are doing when Caitlin is on the court isn’t working and a close loss is just hiding that.

Caitlin is a great talent as is Aliyah Boston but the best stretch for the Fever came with both of them on the bench to end the second half.

The most concerning thing for the Fever is Wallace is one of their best 5 players this season and not because she got better. They added one of the greatest rookie talents and still somehow managed to figure out a way to downgrade their roster overall. Perplexing franchise.
A lot of good points. Appreciate you expanding on your earlier post.

However, Indiana as a top 6 team this year? Even with the addition of Clark, that seems like a stretch.

Watching the Fever reminds me of last year where it took them some time to get their footing. Their next few games aren't exactly a cake walk either. Feel that judgement at this point is too early until they play against everyone.
 
I am so tired of seeing A. Thomas knocking opponents over like bowling pins on both ends of the court and never getting called for a foul, and if you even think about trying to play defense against her you'll get the whistle. So ridiculously uneven the way refs officiate everything having to do with her. Can she retire already? She is really good, but I don't like her, I don't like the way she plays, and I can't stand what the refs let her get away with.
Yeah. There were several plays, especially on the break, where AT would throw her shoulder into an Indiana Fever player and that defender would fly about 5-10 feet. Katie Lou took a couple of hard shots to the chest by AT and no offensive foul was called.
 
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Indiana played and looked a little better last night. Each game they get better and better, and it showed last night. I love that they are not giving up on themselves or each other, at least not yet and publicly. The schedule did them no favors for the first four games of the season, going up against a top defending team (Connecticut) in the league and against a tough team in New York. However, the schedule did them a favor in giving them the chance to measure their skill and talent level against some pretty tough competition out the gate. Everyone thinks they are good and talented until you run into a team or player who has just a little more talent and just as good as you.

The Fever finish out the month with a slightly favorable schedule, minus the Aces. Seattle and Los Angeles (2 games each). Both LA and Seattle are adjusting and trying to build their chemistry and find their identity. The Fever might split those games or sweep. Nobody really knows until they hit the hardwood. Heck the Fever could catch the Aces sleeping. Nobody knows. But I do like the way the Fever are coming along.
 
A lot of good points. Appreciate you expanding on your earlier post.

However, Indiana as a top 6 team this year? Even with the addition of Clark, that seems like a stretch.

Watching the Fever reminds me of last year where it took them some time to get their footing. Their next few games aren't exactly a cake walk either. Feel that judgement at this point is too early until they play against everyone.
A stretch maybe but they were very competitive with almost every team all season. They almost took down the Aces 4 times, 2 of those games with Candace Parker. They felt like a team last year that was as very close to being a good team in this league that an addition like Clark would get them over the hump. And it still might but they are going to have to figure out what star to play through and craft an identity around that and I’m not totally sure Sides is up for those hard choices yet. I’d have little concerns about this Fever team with a veteran coach, that’s not the situation, however.
 
Scoring isn't a big problem for CC or the team but she (and they) need to cut down on those turnovers. 5 more for her tonight. They won't start winning until they fix that.

CC is not going to cut down on turnovers. This is nothing new for her
 


The omission here is bad--even by ESPN standards. How do you leave off a two-time All-Star (a player who won all four ROM awards her rookie year)?
 
A stretch maybe but they were very competitive with almost every team all season. They almost took down the Aces 4 times, 2 of those games with Candace Parker. They felt like a team last year that was as very close to being a good team in this league that an addition like Clark would get them over the hump. And it still might but they are going to have to figure out what star to play through and craft an identity around that and I’m not totally sure Sides is up for those hard choices yet. I’d have little concerns about this Fever team with a veteran coach, that’s not the situation, however.
We're talking the same coach who was responsible for the team being competitive in the games noted from last season. With new pieces like Samuelson and Clark being added, Mitchell finally on the court and Wheeler getting back into game shape, it's not surprising there are some initial rough patches.

Sides was able to figure some things out last season to help improve the team's win total. I'm willing to see what happens with another full season with this roster before making any predictions as to whether she can handle the job.
 
We're talking the same coach who was responsible for the team being competitive in the games noted from last season. With new pieces like Samuelson and Clark being added, Mitchell finally on the court and Wheeler getting back into game shape, it's not surprising there are some initial rough patches.

Sides was able to figure some things out last season to help improve the team's win total. I'm willing to see what happens with another full season with this roster before making any predictions as to whether she can handle the job.
I mean I thought her coaching is what held them back last year as well. End of game specifically she’s terrible. Drawing up a play for Aaliyah Boston to dribble drive from the logo to get a semi open layup?! That’s not her game. If you wanted that action put Smith up at the top with a Clark because Smith has that skill set.

I don’t think Sides helped them improve their win total as much as the addition of Boston did. It’s impossible to say for sure but this team was less than the sum of their parts last year and I’d imagine it will be the same this year because she does not seem like a good coach.
 
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The omission here is bad--even by ESPN standards. How do you leave off a two-time All-Star (a player who won all four ROM awards her rookie year)?
All four listed -- Plum, Young, Ionescu, and Clark -- are facilitators/playmakers. Rhyne Howard is not a point guard nor was she the primary facilitator (Wheeler in 2022, Robinson/Jones in 2023).
Howard is a SG/SF player.

The language could have been clearer, however.
 
An upgrade...... over last year's pathetic perimeter defense.

Gray was 8-12 (3-4 from 3)
Howard was 7-15 (5-9 from 3)
Young was 6-16

Plum who's been asked to step up and fill the Chelsea roll was 8 for 20.

Massive upgrade? Yes but when you're comparing defense to pathetic massive merely takes you to ineffective.

In their last three games the final preseason and first two regular season games this upgraded personnel has limited opponents to 10-23, 9-29 and 12 - 23 from threeland. Both million dollar coach and these three upgraded personnel appear to lack the consistent effort and were not for the Fever would be at the bottom of the league in points allowed.

The improved defense has proved exhausting for the Mercury as they've been outscored in all second half quarters during the regular season to date, allowing 48 second half points to both Aces and the Dream.

Apparently this improved personnel lacks proper structure and coaching. I'm wondering if the Mercury are reconsidering the ROI on their million dollar coach in spite of his initial w as a woman's coach last week.

As the Aces remain undefeated in their struggle to hit from three land the Mercury were fortunate to survive the Dream and most certainly will go to 1-2 after tomorrow night's double digit loss to the Aces.
I hear ya, but we don't have an actual PG right now. I'm not sure why the bookies keep churning out double-digit lines. We may beat Phoenix again tonight, but I certainly do not see a blowout win in our favor. I'd love to be wrong.
 
I suspect in time that will happen, but the dynamics between Clark and Boston is an interesting subplot to watch. What seemed like a marriage made in heaven when they were paired up, is looking like they are preparing for divorce court instead so far.
I'll preface this statement by saying that Aliyah's play so far this year has been less than inspiring. I don't know if she underestimated the process it would take to get back in tip-top shape, but she's missing the mark by a LOT. Hopefully, this serves as a "lesson learned" and that she will take her ramp-up more seriously in future seasons.

That said, the hate that this young woman has received all over internetland is ridiculous. And for what? Poor play? There are tons of players in the league playing poorly right now. Lack of conditioning? Already addressed above. Bad behavior? AB? No, that's not it. She's one of the sweetest human beings on the planet. Oh, I think I get it. Folks really hate Coach Dawn Staley, don't they--so much so that they'll take out their frustrations of her on one of her players (because they know that Dawn will tell them what they can kiss and where they can go once they've finished that task).

And yes, I do blame overzealous Iowa fans/CC stans for the bulk of the hateful energy towards AB. I don't think all Iowa fans are contributing to the hate, but the loudest voices amongst that group have created this maelstrom. But it's not just them by any stretch. It's LSU fans. It's Tennessee fans. It's Stanford/Pac-12 fans. It's UConn fans. It's any fan base that had to endure getting their cans kicked by a recruiting class that went 129-9 in four seasons. So, your faves missed out on a few championships and individual awards while the centerpiece of the "Freshies" constantly added to her award collection. So what? Get over it.

The CC/AB pairing was exciting on paper and still seems like it could destroy the rest of the league in the future if it pans out, but the process appears to be eroding the mental state of one of the parties involved. If a "divorce" would improve Aliyah's mentals, then I'm all for it. I just hope she lands in a situation that will allow her to flourish both as an athlete and as a young woman. Aww, who are we kidding? Just go to Vegas, Aliyah.
 
We may beat Phoenix again tonight, but I certainly do not see a blowout win in our favor. I'd love to be wrong
I would say the Aces are a lock to beat Phoenix, Given the construction (destruction?) by the clowns in Phoenix a point guard isn't really necessary to take down the Mercury. A lack of coherent roster construction and the inability of the million dollar coach in the valley of the Sun to implement any semblance of defense or effort assures that the top four teams in the w will have little to no problem with Phoenix. In fact the meddling four teams of the w should have little to no problem with Phoenix.

I feel sympathy with you as the Aces await Chelsea's eventual return for the playoffs. With that said the situation in Las Vegas is several magnitudes better than the dumpster fire in Phoenix. We are all waiting for Gadot as well as the acumen of the million dollar coach in Phoenix to reveal itself. Thank God for the Fever.
 
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The biggest surprise to me so far is the initial incompatibility of Clark and Boston. Everybody is talking about Clark's struggles, but Boston is having a horrible start as well. On paper I thought the addition of Clark would be a major advantage for Boston since Clark is such a good passer.

Clark having to adjust to the WNBA is a major factor of course, but perhaps her new teammates adjusting to her is just as big an issue. WNBA rookies have to adjust to a new system and generally learn to fit in. Caitlin has had systems built around her talents and how much she dominates the ball. Instead of the rookie fitting in and learning the system, the rest of the Pacers roster has to learn how to play with Clark.

I suspect in time that will happen, but the dynamics between Clark and Boston is an interesting subplot to watch. What seemed like a marriage made in heaven when they were paired up, is looking like they are preparing for divorce court instead so far.
The interaction between AB and Jones in the first Liberty game was telling. Boston appeared to be not only taken aback but intimidated as Jones towered over her. I don't recall a moment like this during her rookie year
 
The interaction between AB and Jones in the first Liberty game was telling. Boston appeared to be not only taken aback but intimidated as Jones towered over her. I don't recall a moment like this during her rookie year
While her stat line still wasn't great in the second game, to me it looked like competed better against JJ and the Liberty in the second match up. She had some blocks and I saw a bit of fire from her. Hopefully something to build on. She got tangled up a bit w/ JJ as well, which seems to indicate she wasn't backing down.
 
Okay, enough w/ the bashing of the Aces' guards. Young and Plum combined for 16 assists and 4 TOs last game. And 11/3 in the first game. Are either of them Chelsea Gray? No. Are they getting the ball to teammates in scoring position and keeping their TOs to a manageable number? Heck yeah they are.
 
Okay, enough w/ the bashing of the Aces' guards. Young and Plum combined for 16 assists and 4 TOs last game. And 11/3 in the first game. Are either of them Chelsea Gray? No. Are they getting the ball to teammates in scoring position and keeping their TOs to a manageable number? Heck yeah they are.
Yep, Aces second in W in scoring to the Lynx!
 
Yep, Aces second in W in scoring to the Lynx!
Not bad for not being totally in sync. I'd say their issues so far have been more on defense than offense.
 
Is anyone trying to use League Pass tonight? Are you having problems? I get "No Content Available" when I try to use it. I have never seen that before.
 
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What's up w/ the starting 5 for Dallas? Why is McCowan coming off the bench? 3 of the starters had 2 points combined! That is ludicrous. McCowan had 21/14. Ogunbowale and Billings (she's really taking advantage of her opportunity) both scored 20 or more.

Atlanta won by 5. Much more balanced scoring among the starters for the Dream.
 
Is anyone trying to use League Pass tonight? Are you having problems? I get "No Content Available" when I try to use it. I have never seen that before.

Which game? I watched the Dallas @ Atlanta game.
 
Which game? I watched the Dallas @ Atlanta game.
I am not being given the option to see any game. I have sent an email to League Pass Support.
 
I would say the Aces are a lock to beat Phoenix, Given the construction (destruction?) by the clowns in Phoenix a point guard isn't really necessary to take down the Mercury. A lack of coherent roster construction and the inability of the million dollar coach in the valley of the Sun to implement any semblance of defense or effort assures that the top four teams in the w will have little to no problem with Phoenix. In fact the meddling four teams of the w should have little to no problem with Phoenix.

I feel sympathy with you as the Aces await Chelsea's eventual return for the playoffs. With that said the situation in Las Vegas is several magnitudes better than the dumpster fire in Phoenix. We are all waiting for Gadot as well as the acumen of the million dollar coach in Phoenix to reveal itself. Thank God for the Fever.
Aces are up 1 on our home floor at the half against this supposed mess of a Mercury team. If the Top 4 teams aren't supposed to struggle with the Mercury and the meddling four teams aren't, either--then what does that make the Aces right now?

This is very hard to watch. Phoenix just keeps hitting threes at a very high clip (GREAT defense by the Aces) while the Vegas offense looks confused as to what to do when Jackie doesn't play hero ball. The actual mess is in Vegas right now. I shudder to think of what Minnesota is going to do to this team next Wednesday.

I'll keep repeating the following because I want to: if the organization knew that Chelsea's injury was more severe than she let on and did not bother to pursue a PG (even if she's a back-up--think Lindsay Allen or Crystal Dangerfield) in free agency, then they are negligent. They're telling us that Colson and Fair aren't viable options for minutes, so why not pursue someone who can run a team?
 
The interaction between AB and Jones in the first Liberty game was telling. Boston appeared to be not only taken aback but intimidated as Jones towered over her. I don't recall a moment like this during her rookie year
Boston doesn't have a fighting bone in her body. She loves to compete as long as it is within the bounds of the game but is the sweetest person you'll ever meet when the whistle blows. Fighting goes against her principles so she didn't know how to handle the situation when it escalated beyond the game. I think she chose to deescalate by being submissive in the moment. I wouldn't read too much into it.
 
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