Kim Mulkey's Comments about Scandal

[Fairfield Fan]

Yes that Pepper Hamilton and, yes, that appeared to be the plan. But, as evidenced by the stuff Baylor recently released, they did an exhaustively thorough job. They and Baylor just didn't release it publicly - until this month. The Pepper material Baylor itself finally released was extremely damning.

Pepper Hamilton didn't do the job it needed to do:

"As if all of that wasn’t bad enough, they also disclose that Pepper Hamilton, who were responsible for the purportedly unprecedented mea culpa, not only didn’t find every report of sexual assault, but weren’t even tasked with doing so. Here is how Thursday’s court filing describes what Pepper Hamilton did (emphasis added is mine):

"Pepper Hamilton was not assigned to probe every single sexual assault allegation at Baylor. It was not charged with determining the total number of alleged sexual assaults that were reported or allegedly occurred during a set time period. And it was not asked to determine the guilt or innocence of any or all of those accused of sexual assault. For this reason, Pepper Hamilton did not interview any of the accused.

"The vehicle for Pepper Hamilton’s task was a “stress test” of Baylor’s institutional response under Title IX. To conduct this stress test, Pepper Hamilton would identify and review a subset of specific cases focusing on Baylor’s institutional response and compliance (or lack thereof) with Title IX. The court document later states: “Again, it is important to note that this did not mean the law firm had identified all alleged sexual assaults.”

"Regents previously said that 17 women reported sexual or domestic assaults involving 19 players, including four alleged gang rapes, since 2011. Those numbers are different than those given in a recent Title IX suit, which said that football players committed 52 acts of rape, including five gang rapes, by 31 different football players in four years. Now consider both sets of numbers knowing that Pepper Hamilton was doing a “stress test.” Even the recent court filing from Baylor adds some fudging, now saying it’s 'at least' 17 women and 'at least' 19 football players..."

Pepper Hamilton helped contain the scandal, they didn't fully expose it. What they released was "damning," but what they didn't release was probably far worse.

If your alma mater hires Pepper Hamilton, you know that the fix is in!

 

[Stinger92860]

Wow, I hope she gets called on this big time. So Kim, would it be ok for a Baylor football player to punch a girl in the mouth if she refused sex with said player?

 

[Fairfield Fan]

Please read the comments on this board, where you are posting this reply. I didn't read single one that mentioned the State of Texas. I think the tone of all the posters was more than civil!

I google searched news on the issue and happily found the Dallas paper reported her statements and the overwhelming tone of comments there condemn Kim too!

I am a UConn fan. I am disgusted by Mulkey's comments. I feel that Baylor is guilty of gross hypocrisy. I believe that the rape culture that Baylor encouraged and then covered up is symptom of the corrosive culture of big-time football.

I would be one of those parents trying hard to dissuade my daughter from attending Baylor, one of those parents whom Mulkey urged to be hit in the face.

But you somehow believe what she said was right? That Baylor's cover-up was OK? If Texas culture is not to be condemned, I would like to hear from the millions of Texans who are outraged by this. Somehow, I'm not hearing it.

 

[Bronxjeff]

I am a UConn fan. I am disgusted by Mulkey's comments. I feel that Baylor is guilty of gross hypocrisy. I believe that the rape culture that Baylor encouraged and then covered up is symptom of the corrosive culture of big-time football.

I would be one of those parents trying hard to dissuade my daughter from attending Baylor, one of those parents whom Mulkey urged to be hit in the face.

But you somehow believe what she said was right? That Baylor's cover-up was OK? If Texas culture is not to be condemned, I would like to hear from the millions of Texans who are outraged by this. Somehow, I'm not hearing it.

I don't see how you read into my comments that I think what she said was right?
I was I believe correctly interpreting this board's overall tone of focusing condemnation on her statements and not spreading that to the entire State of Texas.

Please read my earlier posting as well.

 

[Zorro]

I am a UConn fan. I am disgusted by Mulkey's comments. I feel that Baylor is guilty of gross hypocrisy. I believe that the rape culture that Baylor encouraged and then covered up is symptom of the corrosive culture of big-time football.

I would be one of those parents trying hard to dissuade my daughter from attending Baylor, one of those parents whom Mulkey urged to be hit in the face.

But you somehow believe what she said was right? That Baylor's cover-up was OK? If Texas culture is not to be condemned, I would like to hear from the millions of Texans who are outraged by this. Somehow, I'm not hearing it.

I think that Bronxjeff was referring to the comments following the article (some of which, as msf pointed out, were pretty raw, and not the comments on this board. However, I saw very few, if any, of those comments holding the State of Texas responsible for the situation at Baylor.

 

[OldAlum]

"Knock them right in the face"? Wow, a college coach advocating violence if somebody voices an opinion different from yours? How can anyone defend that?
I understand defending your school and program, but this was wrong on so many levels and ultimately harmful. This is not something that should have been addressed at a senior game. And when it was, something more like "I can assure everyone that Baylor is a safe place for its students. We have new leadership that are working hard to ensure that the incidents in the past will be prevented as much as possible and addressed quickly and strongly if they do occur." would have worked much better. I might not believe it, but it is a better pitch than suggesting you hit them in the face

 

[BroadwayVa]

http://deadspin.com/baylors-kim-mul...source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

Poor choice of words by Kim. Must be hearing from some Recruits and/or Families why they won't attend Baylor or send their kids to Baylor

A few women came forward a few years ago at Uconn with similar complaints. i wonder how Geno would have been greeted had he said, as Ms Kim said: Knock them . (assume she meant punch them).
First I don't believe Geno is that stupid to make those comments on Senior nite.
My thoughts run from really really bad choice of words and time and place. To Thinking Kim was only protecting her turf--but badly. My question is: When is a scandal over? It happened, it shall by some always perceived as Scandal for some always a non issue, apparently Kim fits in the latter category.

 

[Wbbfan1]

Rape victims advocate: Baylor coach Kim Mulkey 'like Art Briles in a woman's body' after comments | SportsDay

 

[bags27]

The first step to healing is an apology. Kim absolutely needs to apologize. Because of electronic media, she can manage her message carefully that way. She (meaning her agent or Baylor's PR chief) can post or tweet in her name her love for and confidence in Baylor while condemning the actions of former football players.

This is a critical time for Mulkey. I listened to her comments after that last minute win against TX, and her emotional comportment was, frankly, worrisome. Nothing precisely what she said, but it was evident that she was on an emotional edge. As much as possible, she needs to stay away from the camera and live performance and let her people do the work for her.

Otherwise, if she lets the press hound her because of her statements last night, she will speak extemporaneously and, pugnacious as she is, she may well double down on her remarks and compound her problems to the point where things could get very bad for her.

 

[JellyBean]

Just glad that she realized that it was a poor choice of words. I now do not have to worry about her post game comments to her players.

 

[housekeys]

This is the basketball coaching equivalent of getting a technical foul called on her, with 10 seconds left, with her team down 1, with the ball. Not smart. BTW, I believe the above scenario, or similar, has happened to her in a game. I get her love and support for the school, but when the fire is burning, you do not throw gasoline on it.

 

[tomcat]

From what I can see, the folks who claim Kim's critics were dissing the State of Texas are simply tossing a straw man out there, hoping to deflect the arguments to something else. The criticism has little to do with the State of Texas itself, except, of course, that Texas is where Baylor happens to be located. Baylor defenders may feel that their best hope is to rally Texans around them by claiming that Texas itself is being criticized, but more discerning Texans will see through this tactic.

From a PR perspective, this is just one more thing for Baylor to deal with. Having worked at an educational institution for a number of years, I know that Baylor, like all of them, has many decent employees who do their best to make that university the best place it can possibly be. I'm sure they are hurting now and that their situation (thanks to stupidities like Kim's) won't b getting better any time soon.

 

[UcMiami]

I am not defending either Baylor or Kim her, but people need to realize that the sexual assault numbers at Baylor are not out of line with numbers reported by conscientious colleges and universities around the country. There is a real problem on college campuses everywhere. That does not let Baylor off the hook for the absolutely outrageous way they handled their cases, nor Kim for failing to recognize that the situation at Baylor is way out of line with issues at other institutions, and that the national spotlight is well deserved and that she should be having to field those questions on the recruiting trail. And if she is punching any off her recruits parents ... well, I suspect she isn't taking her own advice! And neither should her audience.

 

[Waquoit]

Just Baylor being Baylor

 

[FanHam]

I am not defending either Baylor or Kim her, but people need to realize that the sexual assault numbers at Baylor are not out of line with numbers reported by conscientious colleges and universities around the country. There is a real problem on college campuses everywhere. That does not let Baylor off the hook for the absolutely outrageous way they handled their cases, nor Kim for failing to recognize that the situation at Baylor is way out of line with issues at other institutions, and that the national spotlight is well deserved and that she should be having to field those questions on the recruiting trail. And if she is punching any off her recruits parents ... well, I suspect she isn't taking her own advice! And neither should her audience.

I beg to differ. 17 victims involving 19 football players, including four gang rapes, since 2011 CANNOT be "in line" with "numbers reported by conscientious colleges and universities". Can you provide comparable statistics for any university?

 

[bags27]

I am not defending either Baylor or Kim her, but people need to realize that the sexual assault numbers at Baylor are not out of line with numbers reported by conscientious colleges and universities around the country. There is a real problem on college campuses everywhere. That does not let Baylor off the hook for the absolutely outrageous way they handled their cases, nor Kim for failing to recognize that the situation at Baylor is way out of line with issues at other institutions, and that the national spotlight is well deserved and that she should be having to field those questions on the recruiting trail. And if she is punching any off her recruits parents ... well, I suspect she isn't taking her own advice! And neither should her audience.

wise, as always, UcMiami. The fact, FanHame, is that all statistics about assault are a guess, and I agree with UcMiami that we shouldn't inculpate Baylor as having a higher rape culture just because of discovery.

The issue in discovery about rape culture (and we need to appreciate that there is one sexual assault of men for every 3 of women, so that needs to be acknowledged as well) is heavily conditioned by reporting: both reporting by the victim to the university and then the university's assessment of that reported incident and its own report in turn. So, absolutely, we can't say for certain that anyone's number of actual assaults are higher than other schools.

The link below was much discussed on the BY earlier, because UConn (along with Brown) led the nation in reporting assaults. But even here, interpreting what the data means--assuming it accurately reflects something--is messy. Some universities have much larger graduate student populations and I wonder whether sexual assault is as prevalent within that population. If not, it skews the statistics about percentage of assaults and therefore of reported assaults.

And of course, some college cultures are more activist than others, and those student populations are more emboldened to report their assaults.

These colleges have the most reports of rape

Whatever one says about the incident of sexual assaults, however, Kim's remarks were a terrible setback to the cause of reporting and therefore of prevention. She absolutely needs to apologize and reframe what she means, because she defended the indefensible.

 

[jonson]

I am not defending either Baylor or Kim her, but people need to realize that the sexual assault numbers at Baylor are not out of line with numbers reported by conscientious colleges and universities around the country. There is a real problem on college campuses everywhere. That does not let Baylor off the hook for the absolutely outrageous way they handled their cases, nor Kim for failing to recognize that the situation at Baylor is way out of line with issues at other institutions, and that the national spotlight is well deserved and that she should be having to field those questions on the recruiting trail. And if she is punching any off her recruits parents ... well, I suspect she isn't taking her own advice! And neither should her audience.

I agree that this is a major problem at most, if not all, college campuses. However, I also believe that Baylor is "special" in this regard--both in terms of the staggering numbers, what we know about the coverup, and the claims the university makes as a Baptist institution. And there is a history as well. It's not that long ago that Dave Bliss tried to cover up the murder of a Baylor basketball player by one of his teammates.

COLLEGE BASKETBALL; Death and Deception

It might also be worth noting that in a poll of men's basketball coaches, the current Baylor coach, Scott Drew, came in second only to John Calipari as the biggest "cheater" in the sport.

Critical Coaches: Who is perceived to be the biggest cheater in the sport?

Perhaps this is all just bad luck or (in Drew's case) envy--but perhaps not.

 

[j66kicker]

Pepper Hamilton didn't do the job it needed to do:

"As if all of that wasn’t bad enough, they also disclose that Pepper Hamilton, who were responsible for the purportedly unprecedented mea culpa, not only didn’t find every report of sexual assault, but weren’t even tasked with doing so. Here is how Thursday’s court filing describes what Pepper Hamilton did (emphasis added is mine):

"Pepper Hamilton was not assigned to probe every single sexual assault allegation at Baylor. It was not charged with determining the total number of alleged sexual assaults that were reported or allegedly occurred during a set time period. And it was not asked to determine the guilt or innocence of any or all of those accused of sexual assault. For this reason, Pepper Hamilton did not interview any of the accused.

"The vehicle for Pepper Hamilton’s task was a “stress test” of Baylor’s institutional response under Title IX. To conduct this stress test, Pepper Hamilton would identify and review a subset of specific cases focusing on Baylor’s institutional response and compliance (or lack thereof) with Title IX. The court document later states: “Again, it is important to note that this did not mean the law firm had identified all alleged sexual assaults.”

"Regents previously said that 17 women reported sexual or domestic assaults involving 19 players, including four alleged gang rapes, since 2011. Those numbers are different than those given in a recent Title IX suit, which said that football players committed 52 acts of rape, including five gang rapes, by 31 different football players in four years. Now consider both sets of numbers knowing that Pepper Hamilton was doing a “stress test.” Even the recent court filing from Baylor adds some fudging, now saying it’s 'at least' 17 women and 'at least' 19 football players..."

Pepper Hamilton helped contain the scandal, they didn't fully expose it. What they released was "damning," but what they didn't release was probably far worse.

If your alma mater hires Pepper Hamilton, you know that the fix is in!

They found enough to justify getting rid of the head coach, A.D. and University President. How much more did they need to find? They found enough detail to fend off Briles' wrongful termination suit without even a fight. As you indicated, they did what they were hired to do by their employer, the Baylor Board of Regents.

 

[Adesmar123]

So was Griner following Mulkey's rule when she took a swing at Jordan Barncastle? So maybe Jordan Barncastle didn't foul Griner, she just said "don't send your daughter to Baylor"?

And Griner proceeded to knock her in the face.

 

[drweo]

I had gotten a kick out of Ms. Mulkeys shenanigans in the past. I had tried to give her the benefit of the doubt and guessed that Baylor 's homophobic treatment of Britney was an institutional issue beyond her control. This is so out of line its certifiable.

Kudos to Bags for taking a genuinely golden rule view of her situation, but I myself have to condemn her statements. She is acting reprehensibly.

It is completely possible and legitimate to take the golden rule view AND to condemn her statements! I think that is the best route to go on this incredibly awful incident. But I dont know what to say about Baylor's fans supporting this outrageous statement by their coach. I guess the football side's attitudes pervade athletics at Baylor. Sad.

 

[UcMiami]

I beg to differ. 17 victims involving 19 football players, including four gang rapes, since 2011 CANNOT be "in line" with "numbers reported by conscientious colleges and universities". Can you provide comparable statistics for any university?

These colleges have the most reports of rape

43 rapes reported in a single year at Brown and at UConn. Like I said the numbers are not pretty. Was looking for another article that had more detail and over a number of years, but couldn't find it. The issue exists across the country, and I suspect the 'official' reported statistics vary more based on reporting criteria and PR attempts and on seriousness of victim support structure and personnel, than on actual occurrences. Certainly the blind surveys come back pretty uniformly as a straight percentage of population of women who experience assault or rape.
Again - the Baylor scandal has only a little to do with raw numbers, the big issue is the cover-up and denial and victimization of the victims.

 

[Bonpland]

The article was very interesting.

Most commentators felt that disparaging the entire state of Texas was somehow appropriate.

There are 28 Million people here spread out over 268,000 Square Miles.

The hate and vitriol spewing out of their mouths must make everyone who is disparaging Kim M, for trying to defend her school (Not that I agree with her choice of words, but I understand her passion), look very sick. Nice group to be part of. Hope you are proud.

If you have to hate Kim, Choose your words with care lest you show the extremely poor judgement shown by the commentators on this article. AND make Kim look like a saint in comparison.

I found the comments MUCH more offending than what Kim said. I very much hope that UConn fans were not a part of this group. If the rest of the country feels Texas is to blame for Baylor's actions and Kim's words, then I'd rather live in Texas, even with Baylor, than in any one of your states.

Ed: had to spell correct then, from than

Exhibiting pride in one's state or region is appropriate and oft-times admirable, and I think we all can recognize that the responses that follow almost any internet story often range from the ludicrous to the vitriolic, but you should not confuse or attempt to diffuse the impact of Mulkey's truly unfortunate comments.

You react to the cowardice of the anonymous who vent their anger from the comfort of their own homes and, as you point out, should be roundly criticized for it. I've had the same reaction to political, social, and cultural stories over the years so much so that I now rarely bother to read those entries.

Kim however is not operating in the shadows, she is a the coach of a perennially ranked and two time National Champion WOMEN'S basketball team. Her responsibilities to the sport, her program, and most importantly to her players should be obvious to her.

Many of us here on the BY are parents of current or former scholastic and colligiate althletes, in my own case a son and two daughters. I find it incomprehensible that a college level head coach, anywhere in this country, would be offended by the reasonable inquiries of the parents of their potential recruits.

All three of my children were college athletes playing for both Division I and Division III shools, and at every stop during the recruiting process I was equally as interested to learn what I could of the cultural and social atmosphere of the university as I was of the athletic department's record of success. Did I warrant a "punch in ther face" for talking to on-campus students about how they felt about their relative comfort levels socially while working for their degrees?

In the end should a parent not expect a coach to have a reasonable level of concern for the safety and security of the children that we entrust to their programs?

I don't know if Kim Mulkey is a tiger in defense of her girls or not but knowing what has transpired over the past few years at Baylor should have given her cause to speak up on behalf of the women on that campus, and not to instead lash out at the parents who have come to wonder about their daughter's relative safety at a school the at first ignored and then later covered-up 58 reported cases of sexual assault.

I am, along with thousands of others, a rabid UCONN WBB fan, but I would lose interest in the program if Geno made similar comments. Mulkey represents the program at Baylor. She has a responsibilty to stand by the women attending the university and the girls on her team. Her comments yesterday did nothing to distinguish her in that capacity.

At a time when treating women merely as the "objects of desire" has become fashionably acceptable by some segments of our society, a high profile (highly paid) coach should do more than blame those who expect more for their daughters.

It's a shame that Mulkey doesn't see it that way

 

[Buzzyboy]

Yeah great Kim; and if people persist in lending their voices against rape and violence, kill them. If their families complain, beat them up too. I'm with Coco here. My stance on Kim here is rapidly evolving.

Isn't it nice to know that she's so much more interested in maintaining her blessed program by getting top level recruits than she is concerned about their safety or the message that her ridiculous statement says. People concerned about the violence that permeated the Baylor campus should now be attacked and beaten, according to Mulkey???? She should be fined and disciplined by the Baylor hierarchy for this ridiculous statement because does violence begot violence? What little respect I had for this woman is gone. I had issues pertaining to Britney Griner and this cements her as a coach who I'd never want to send my daughter, granddaughter, niece or anyone young woman I care about to play for.

 

[UConnNick]

wise, as always, UcMiami. The fact, FanHame, is that all statistics about assault are a guess, and I agree with UcMiami that we shouldn't inculpate Baylor as having a higher rape culture just because of discovery.

The issue in discovery about rape culture (and we need to appreciate that there is one sexual assault of men for every 3 of women, so that needs to be acknowledged as well) is heavily conditioned by reporting: both reporting by the victim to the university and then the university's assessment of that reported incident and its own report in turn. So, absolutely, we can't say for certain that anyone's number of actual assaults are higher than other schools.

The link below was much discussed on the BY earlier, because UConn (along with Brown) led the nation in reporting assaults. But even here, interpreting what the data means--assuming it accurately reflects something--is messy. Some universities have much larger graduate student populations and I wonder whether sexual assault is as prevalent within that population. If not, it skews the statistics about percentage of assaults and therefore of reported assaults.

And of course, some college cultures are more activist than others, and those student populations are more emboldened to report their assaults.

These colleges have the most reports of rape

Whatever one says about the incident of sexual assaults, however, Kim's remarks were a terrible setback to the cause of reporting and therefore of prevention. She absolutely needs to apologize and reframe what she means, because she defended the indefensible.

Kim's remarks were insensitive, and I agree she should apologize for having trivialized the seriousness of what happened at Baylor, but I think it's quite a leap from that to accusing her of defending rape. I'm reasonably sure she probably intended her remarks to refer to the present day situation at Baylor, not the past. You can argue the semantics, but I doubt her intent was along the same lines as former Texas gubenatorial candidate Clayton Williams, who had the election wrapped up until he said this only a week before election day: "If rape is inevitable, why not just lie back and enjoy it?"

And Kim was correct about one thing. There are other schools that have a very bad track record of handling rape cases. Many schools, including UCONN, have come under fire for attempting as much as possible to cover up or minimize publicity regarding rape investigations, to the detriment of the victims. Many collegiate rape victims have won large settlements against these schools. No school wants to be in Baylor's shoes, becoming known as Rape U. On the positive side, many schools, like UCONN, have revised their rules for handling rape accusations, and are doing a much better job of effectively dealing with the problem.

 

[Buzzyboy]

These colleges have the most reports of rape

43 rapes reported in a single year at Brown and at UConn. Like I said the numbers are not pretty. Was looking for another article that had more detail and over a number of years, but couldn't find it. The issue exists across the country, and I suspect the 'official' reported statistics vary more based on reporting criteria and PR attempts and on seriousness of victim support structure and personnel, than on actual occurrences. Certainly the blind surveys come back pretty uniformly as a straight percentage of population of women who experience assault or rape.
Again - the Baylor scandal has only a little to do with raw numbers, the big issue is the cover-up and denial and victimization of the victims.

What's significant is that the staff did nothing about it