Katie Lou for NPOY

[Buzzyboy]

In all reality she will need to will her team to another championship this year as well as next to even BEGIN discussion in Stewart's league. Stewie has 4, she's in a league of her own right now. And she had the chutzpah to predict it before she even stepped foot on campus.

Lou can end her career in the same breathe as players like Sue, Kara, Swin, etc. Equal offensive players, differences in defense of course.

But hey, we have a long tourney ahead and other year of appreciating Lou's stellar play. I wouldn't count her out just yet...

I am a Lou fan and we will see her reach the potential Geno knows she has this tourney that will carry all thru the next season.

IMHO of course

I personally think it is silly to suggest that KLS is less than Stewie based on national championships. I seem to remember reading KML had on a few occasions put UConn on her back and saved UConn from a loss that would have eliminated them from the Big Dance. Stewie is marvelous but so isn't KLS and that's almost to suggest that Ernie Banks or Carl Yastrezemski or countless other fantastic athletes that never won the big one were less! Stupid argument! For a good part of her freshman year there were a lot of people wondering why Stewie had been considered the number 1 recruit in her class because she was mediocre, AT BEST, but she did redeem herself in the post season by playing very well indeed. I personally enjoy watching the multi dimensional game of KLS over Stewie because I thought for most of her time in Storrs she had great results but looked very awkward and gangly doing it. JMHO but I really am a big fan of Stewie's, honestly. It didn't hurt to have Mo and KML and Morgan and Kia helping along the way. The way UConn plays team ball, it isn't always possible to pin the success or failure of a team on one player. My favorite two UConn players every are Maya and probably now KLS with Sue Bird right there, as well. So many great choices, aren't there!

 

[Buzzyboy]

A few days ago when Geno was lauding KLS's NPOY candidacy, he specifically mentioned 5 aspects of her game:

shooting
ball handling
passing
smarts
making team mates better

Now, there are 2 things really revealing what Geno said: (1) only the shooting aspect will fully show up in her stats; the other 4 can only be appreciated fully by watching her play; (2) no mention of KLS's defensive skills.

I'm as big a fan of KLS as anyone on this board, but she is in my view still some ways off from being put in the same sentence as Stewie. At present, KLS is merely an above average defender, but as bags27 said, perhaps she would take the leap next season.

I think that KLS is a better shooter, ball handler, passer and is at least even, in smarts and making teammates better but I concede because of Stewie's length and wing span, KLS is nowhere near the defender Stewie is.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Old dude I agree with all except your last paragraph.
My main problem is unless A'Ja Wilson is capable of carrying her team on her back to a least the FF, she doesn't deserve the award. Yes she's pretty much a one woman team. I just don't think you give it to someone who takes her team from likely mediocrity to a very good team, unless her stats and play are off the charts. Again, her game this year against U Conn (pretty much like last year) indicate to me she's a very, very good player not a great one.
I've stated this before that I believe KLS is already the 4th best player in U Conns amazing history and she will only continue to get better.
The closest in style to her amongst the top 3 is Stewie and KLS while maybe as good as Stewie offensively still has a long ways to go defensively, shot blocking and rebounding to reach her level. Even to be mentioned in the same sentence says so much! KLS work ethic and total team focus, will only take her further. How much further, I can't wait to see!
Bronx23

Insofar as your referring to Stewie's big advantage in rebounding, you know that KLS plays a completely different position and is in nowhere near the position typically on the court to garner rebounds. Beyond that, in her first two years especially, there was a lot of remarks here on the Boneyard about Stewie's hands and her lack of strength which adversely affected her rebounding and even holding onto passes down low. She drastically improved in her final two seasons but those first two years her rebounding was a bit suspect.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Which 5 players would you place on the list instead of her?

I honestly think that had she gone to UConn instead of South Carolina and allowed Geno and staff to push her to (and beyond) her limits, she would unanimously be the player of the year. There's no doubt in my mind that no one develops their players as well as does the Huskie hierarchy. I'm not trying to demonize South Carolina's staff but as has been proven by the Huskies success over the years, it's making good players better and better players great!

 

[DefenseBB]

Which 5 players would you place on the list instead of her?

I can answer that question-there may be only 1...Katie Lou Samuelson. Anyone else who says A’ja Wilson is not one of the top 3 players in WCBB is ignorant. While we on the BY nitpick her deficiencies, mostly due to either our bitterness over her picking SC over UConn or due to our passion for ou UConn players, she is worthy of much praise and will win a few if not the majority of the NPOY awards, which she will have deserved. I also think Mister2 nailed it in that with so many awards and Geno advocating, KLS will win at least one if she’s continues her part.

 

[Los24]

Just different players with different skill sets IMO. KLS is a more like a poor man's Elena Delle Donne IMO. Perimeter oriented, lights out shooter, good all around game. Stewart doesn't have the perimeter skill set that KLS does, but is much much better putting the ball on the floor and finishing from 15 feet and in than KLS will ever be. Defensively I don't think it's a comparison, Stewart was Griner-like defensively her senior season.

I don't think KLS ever hits Big 3 status, but when she graduates I think she'll be right there with Bird/Jefferson/Lobo/Charles in the 2nd crop of players.

Poor man Elena is a bit strange to say about a sophomore that started majority of freshman games and was dropping 20 points a game towards the end of the season. Then goes on to score 20pts a game and make AA her sophomore year. She dropped 40 in conference final while setting the record for 3s without a miss 10 for 10. She actually shot 50% in MSST loss. Time will tell but just taking college careers, and yes the level of competition matters, I would not be so quick to sell Lou short on being as impactful during her collegiate career.

Moving to Stewie .... she was awesome and arguably the best ever. However, you have said some things that I feel are just not correct. Lou can hit within 15 feet every bit as good as Stewie. Look at her curl play around the key. She is one of the few on the team that actually has a pull-up jumper and hits it pretty consitently as well. If you said posting up and with in 4-5 feet you would have been correct.

Lou is a better ball handler and passer too. 3pt shooting is not close at comparative stages either. As I posted on another thread, Lou is the only player over 6'1" in top 50 3pt% shooting (#1) and also only player in top 50 over 6' in A/T ratio (was top 10 don't know where currently.) This shows a diversity that literally no one else in the county has for a 6'3" player.

Defensively, I agree with you 100%. I am not sure athletically she is able to ever get there regarding blocks and possibly rebounding compared to Stewie, but quite honestly neither have most.

Below is comparing Apples to Apples, their Junior seasons:

So Lou has better Scoring avg, FG%, 3p%, FT%, A/T ratio not even close and Lou may catch her in total assists by end of year despite missing 5 games. All this to say I take Stewie and she is the better player, but we often remember the final year and not the progression to get there.

## Player GP-GS Min--Avg FG-FGA Pct 3FG-FGA Pct FT-FTA Pct Off Def Tot Avg PF FO A TO Blk Stl Pts Avg
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
30 Stewart, Breanna... 39-39 1104 28.3 264-490 .539 30-96 .313 128-159 .805 83 220 303 7.8 65 0 122 76 104 61 686 17.6

## Player GP-GS Min--Avg FG-FGA Pct 3FG-FGA Pct FT-FTA Pct Off Def Tot Avg PF FO A TO Blk Stl Pts Avg
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
33 Katie Lou Samuelson 24-24 683 28.5 154-283 .544 72-147 .490 59-72 .819 29 74 103 4.3 30 0 92 33 4 33 439 18.3

 

[Los24]

In what way does Stewie not have the same perimeter skills as Lou? I guess her lack of perimeter skills is the reason that she was the most feared WCBB offensive player her last 3 years at UConn and never won any major awards. Do you just state your "opinion" on this forum just to stir the pot?

Look at my post right above. Comparing same junior seasons, perimeter play Lou is better. Let's not forget that Stewie usually had a big on her where Lou has perimeter defenders. I like to restate that in no way am I saying Lou is better than Stewie as an overall player, post player, defensive player, etc... but Stewie had holes in her game and was not perfect in every single area. Shooting .313 from three does not comapre to leading the country. Also the A/T ratio is not close. Geno did not rely (as much) for Stewie to handle the ball.

 

[wallman]

Whenever I see a lot of comparing players white to white, black to black, I think that is just some kind of well unnecessary stereotyping. Then you have the comparison of players that actually play different rolls which is also unnecessary. It seems that because KLS is 6' 3", some don't like to call her what she plays, they like to pigeon hole players into forwards due to their height. One thing is for sure, there are no players her height who can do the things she does in college basketball.

 

[Los24]

Whenever I see a lot of comparing players white to white, black to black, I think that is just some kind of well unnecessary stereotyping. Then you have the comparison of players that actually play different rolls which is also unnecessary. It seems that because KLS is 6' 3", some don't like to call her what she plays, they like to pigeon hole players into forwards due to their height. One thing is for sure, there are no players her height who can do the things she does in college basketball.

Man I wish I could have been as concise in my response. Nicely done.

 

[bballnut90]

In what way does Stewie not have the same perimeter skills as Lou? I guess her lack of perimeter skills is the reason that she was the most feared WCBB offensive player her last 3 years at UConn and never won any major awards. Do you just state your "opinion" on this forum just to stir the pot?

She flat out isn’t as good a perimeter shooter as KLS is. I think KLS is a better passer too and at the same stage in their career, she was much better hitting pull-up jumpers and finishing perimeter shots that aren’t just catch and shoot. It’s not a knock on Stewart—they’re different players. KLS plays primarily on the perimeter, Stewart wasn’t primarily a perimeter player.

 

[bballnut90]

Whenever I see a lot of comparing players white to white, black to black, I think that is just some kind of well unnecessary stereotyping. Then you have the comparison of players that actually play different rolls which is also unnecessary. It seems that because KLS is 6' 3", some don't like to call her what she plays, they like to pigeon hole players into forwards due to their height. One thing is for sure, there are no players her height who can do the things she does in college basketball.

No stereotyping here—I think their games are similar. They’re both big guard/forwards who are lights out shooters and can score in a variety of ways. I was tempted to say her game reminds me of KML with her shooting ability, but I think KLS is much stronger all around and Delle Donne was a better comparison.

 

[Mister2]

She flat out isn’t as good a perimeter shooter as KLS is. I think KLS is a better passer too and at the same stage in their career, she was much better hitting pull-up jumpers and finishing perimeter shots that aren’t just catch and shoot. It’s not a knock on Stewart—they’re different players. KLS plays primarily on the perimeter, Stewart wasn’t primarily a perimeter player.

Mmm, this is not quite true anymore. KLS's points have come almost equally between inside and outside the arc. As I have shown in another thread, she leads the 30 players on the earlier Naismith watch list in terms of this balance.

 

[bballnut90]

Poor man Elena is a bit strange to say about a sophomore that started majority of freshman games and was dropping 20 points a game towards the end of the season. Then goes on to score 20pts a game and make AA her sophomore year. She dropped 40 in conference final while setting the record for 3s without a miss 10 for 10. She actually shot 50% in MSST loss. Time will tell but just taking college careers, and yes the level of competition matters, I would not be so quick to sell Lou short on being as impactful during her collegiate career.

Moving to Stewie .... she was awesome and arguably the best ever. However, you have said some things that I feel are just not correct. Lou can hit within 15 feet every bit as good as Stewie. Look at her curl play around the key. She is one of the few on the team that actually has a pull-up jumper and hits it pretty consitently as well. If you said posting up and with in 4-5 feet you would have been correct.

Lou is a better ball handler and passer too. 3pt shooting is not close at comparative stages either. As I posted on another thread, Lou is the only player over 6'1" in top 50 3pt% shooting (#1) and also only player in top 50 over 6' in A/T ratio (was top 10 don't know where currently.) This shows a diversity that literally no one else in the county has for a 6'3" player.

Defensively, I agree with you 100%. I am not sure athletically she is able to ever get there regarding blocks and possibly rebounding compared to Stewie, but quite honestly neither have most.

Below is comparing Apples to Apples, their Junior seasons:

So Lou has better Scoring avg, FG%, 3p%, FT%, A/T ratio not even close and Lou may catch her in total assists by end of year despite missing 5 games. All this to say I take Stewie and she is the better player, but we often remember the final year and not the progression to get there.

## Player GP-GS Min--Avg FG-FGA Pct 3FG-FGA Pct FT-FTA Pct Off Def Tot Avg PF FO A TO Blk Stl Pts Avg
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
30 Stewart, Breanna... 39-39 1104 28.3 264-490 .539 30-96 .313 128-159 .805 83 220 303 7.8 65 0 122 76 104 61 686 17.6

## Player GP-GS Min--Avg FG-FGA Pct 3FG-FGA Pct FT-FTA Pct Off Def Tot Avg PF FO A TO Blk Stl Pts Avg
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
33 Katie Lou Samuelson 24-24 683 28.5 154-283 .544 72-147 .490 59-72 .819 29 74 103 4.3 30 0 92 33 4 33 439 18.3

Poor man’s EDD was I meant skill wise and style of play, not in terms of collegiate success or greatness. If UCONN wins a title this year, I’d put KLS over EDD for “greatness” factor even though I think Elena is more skilled...does that make sense? Poor man Delle Donne is not an insult. She’s one of the most prolific scorers in NCAA history and is one of the best players in the WNBA.

With Stewart, I agree with your correction. I think Stewart is much better on the block and around the basket than KLS. KLS is automatic with any sort of jumpshot, whether it be 8 feet or 22 feet. Stewart’s post moves, back to the basket play and ability to finish inside give her a big edge in that category.

Stewart’s junior year was honestly somewhat underwhelming after her terrific sophomore season. I might blasted for that comment, but I thought she played better as a sophomore. She picked up her play as the season went onC and obviously her senior season was ridiculous. I’d say this is definitely KLS’s best season so far after a great sophomore year and a productive freshman season.

To me, the greatness factor for Stewart is that she truly dominated both ends of the court unlike anyone in NCAA history. That, plus 4 titles and being the star player on 2 (almost 3) undefeated teams. No one could match up with her defensively, and no one could regularly score on her inside. She did everything well.

KLS is a great player but isn’t a dominating threat like Stewart. She’s incredibly efficient and might be the best pure shooter and scorer in the country. Different players, different skill sets, and different abilities.

 

[bballnut90]

Mmm, this is not quite true anymore. KLS's points have come almost equally between inside and outside the arc. As I have shown in another thread, she leads the 30 players on the earlier Naismith watch list in terms of this balance.

Stewart’s role was to be a true inside out threat, KLS’s role isn’t. KLS is scoring inside the arc but she isn’t a post player with back to the basket moves like Stewart. That’s what I meant by differentiating them in that post.

 

[EricLA]

Stewie and Lou are similar enough in size and skill that comparisons are going to be inevitably made, but they are different with strengths and weaknesses the other does not have...

Stewie has a baby hook shot with both hands that Lou does not. Lou has a superior spin move under the basket for a reverse layup that I don't believe I've seen Stewie do. But in general, Stewie is better in close to the basket.

Stewie has longer arms and uses them well on defense. Lou is better, IMHO, at moving her body and gets into passing lanes somewhat better in spite of her shorter reach, but Stewie is a far superior blocking threat. Stewie is more athletic and is taller and longer, but IMHO Lou has really improved her defense.

Lou is better with the ball and has a better mid range and long distance game. But not by much. Stewie is a darn good shooter as well. IMHO Lou is also a better passer and I'll bet her A/TO ratio is better than Stewie's at this point in their careers.

In a way it's like comparing Sue to Moriah, or Dee to Maya. Certainly some similarities, but also some big differences. Geno says Lou is the best all around player in the nation and I agree with him. But Stewie was NPOY for 3 seasons - and has more college accolades than probably any other player in history. Lou will never have 3 NPOY's. Doesn't mean Lou isn't great, or one of the best in the nation, it just means that Stewie was a freak when it came to WCBB.

 

[Centerstream]

Stewart’s role was to be a true inside out threat, KLS’s role isn’t. KLS is scoring inside the arc but she isn’t a post player with back to the basket moves like Stewart. That’s what I meant by differentiating them in that post.

That's because this team does not need Lou to be a back to the basket player but she can certainly post up when she has the opportunity to.
And if Lou and Stewie were in an old fashioned horse game outside the arc, I would be willing to bet that 9 out of 10 times, it would go to overtime!!!! I'm done supporting a tr...!

 

[CBear01]

I personally think it is silly to suggest that KLS is less than Stewie based on national championships

I did not say that. I said she would need to will her team to a championship this year as well as next. Stewie was MVP all 4 years. Every championship was due mostly bc of her play. She willed her team to a championship every year. Diana did the same. Her final 2 years were championship seasons bc she willed her team to win.

There is a difference between that and just national championships. I mean we don't put Saniya in the same breathe yet she has 3 championships. It's not the number. It's the way it's won and the effort willed to your team and your coach to win them a championship. Don't get me wrong, Lou is possibly on the way there. But yeah I do have to contend that she just can't be mentioned yet with a player like Stewie, and perhaps never can. Ahhhh the joys and pains of Husky Nation!

Otherwise, I think you make excellent points. I love your favorite players too! KML will always be one of my fondest. We may be the only program in all of sports that can have fans appreciate and debate the greatness of all involved. I love being a Husky!

 

[Bronx23]

We all want her to win every award possible, but let's not get carried away. Stewie is one of the planet's best basketball players like Maya and DT in her prime. Lou will never be in that lofty category. It's a very hard club to join.

I agree with your last sentence.
But, while I'm not sure KLS will ever be in that lofty category, right now she is just below it (with a ways to go) but based upon everything I've seen in so many different ways of her play, improvement, personality, drive, leadership, her choices, I'd be careful about the never. Her time at UConn is hardly done.
Time will tell!
Bronx23

 

[Los24]

I did not say that. I said she would need to will her team to a championship this year as well as next. Stewie was MVP all 4 years. Every championship was due mostly bc of her play. She willed her team to a championship every year. Diana did the same. Her final 2 years were championship seasons bc she willed her team to win.

There is a difference between that and just national championships. I mean we don't put Saniya in the same breathe yet she has 3 championships. It's not the number. It's the way it's won and the effort willed to your team and your coach to win them a championship. Don't get me wrong, Lou is possibly on the way there. But yeah I do have to contend that she just can't be mentioned yet with a player like Stewie, and perhaps never can. Ahhhh the joys and pains of Husky Nation!

Otherwise, I think you make excellent points. I love your favorite players too! KML will always be one of my fondest. We may be the only program in all of sports that can have fans appreciate and debate the greatness of all involved. I love being a Husky!

Just a side note, their junior year even Stewie said Mo should have been the MOP and most did too. I say that because WNBA picks #2 and #3 helped Stewie "will her team." I actually think Stewie's freshman year was the best example of willing the team to a NC despite the other talent on the team.

 

[Charliebball]

Stewie had the ability to score 30+ points a game if Geno would have allowed it...................she was virtually unstoppable once she got the ball within 15 feet of the basket...................defensively her shot blocking and help defense was devastating to the opposition.....................as great as KLS is, I don't see her having the ability to dominate the game at both ends of the floor the way Stewie could..............that's no slight on KLS as she will be remembered as one of the best UConn players ever.

 

[Bronx23]

Just different players with different skill sets IMO. KLS is a more like a poor man's Elena Delle Donne IMO. Perimeter oriented, lights out shooter, good all around game. Stewart doesn't have the perimeter skill set that KLS does, but is much much better putting the ball on the floor and finishing from 15 feet and in than KLS will ever be. Defensively I don't think it's a comparison, Stewart was Griner-like defensively her senior season.

I don't think KLS ever hits Big 3 status, but when she graduates I think she'll be right there with Bird/Jefferson/Lobo/Charles in the 2nd crop of players.

I agree with your analysis but think KLS is already there with those four. It will take a lot more work for her to bridge the significant gap to join the top three, but I believe she likely falls somewhere in between, and don't think it's impossible!
Bronx23

 

[bballnut90]

I agree with your analysis but think KLS is already there with those four. It will take a lot more work for her to bridge the significant gap to join the top three, but I believe she likely falls somewhere in between, and don't think it's impossible!
Bronx23

I think that’s a fair statement. I think she’s right there with those players. She may emerge as the best of those players, but I think she’ll be the best of the 2nd group rather than a “4th great” if that makes sense.

 

[hugefan]

EDD could use some Uconn training, she is the poor mans Uconn player. Doesn’t have the always play hard or bust your butt attitude that Uconn players have and although she can shoot, she shouts a set shot, lucky she is so tall.

 

[Bronx23]

I think that’s a fair statement. I think she’s right there with those players. She may emerge as the best of those players, but I think she’ll be the best of the 2nd group rather than a “4th great” if that makes sense.

I think that’s a fair statement. I think she’s right there with those players. She may emerge as the best of those players, but I think she’ll be the best of the 2nd group rather than a “4th great” if that makes sense.

Yes it makes sense to me!
This maybe splitting hairs but I think she likely will not become the 4th great, as that puts one amongst the greats of the game all time.
But I do think she will separate herself from that second tier. Again this might just be semantics. And we are essentially saying the same thing.
Bronx23

 

[warbler1055]

I will make this short and sweet. She can handle the ball, pass, shoot the trey, go inside, go outside, and rebound and play defense. She is the best all round player in WCBB and their aint nobody close. I know who the media favors but Lou does so much more with efficiency.

Did you have a private line to Geno? Something about the best player on the best team!!!!