Jose Iglesias

[The Viking]

I think that's the point though. With him they get to the playoffs. Other narrative emerging is that Buccholz is out indefinitely so they were somewhat forced to make a deal to stay in contention.

That's also what I don't like about it. It seems to be a deal to be competitive, not necessarily to be champions. But if they call up Xander and truly go for it then I think it'll prove to be worth it for at least this year.

Mostly what I think fans miss out on is getting to watch a talented prospect emerge. If they can replace him immediately with an equal or greater talented prospect with better odds to emerge, then of course I'm good.

If you get to the playoffs you have a shot at being WS champions. Who would have thought SF would have won 2 in 3 years?
I sure as hell trust Peavy to help us down the stretch than Dempster. I just hope Dempster doesn't suck enough down the stretch where we get to trade him for some kind of value to an NL team in the offseason.

 

[The Viking]

I think the Sox got a little desperate and I'm not a big fan of Peavy. He hasn't been healthy 3 of the last 4 years and pitching in late fall in the Northeast is a lot different than San Diego in August. I think Chicago sold high on him and got potentially got a very good SS out of it.

Additionally....

1) The Sox banked on Middlebrooks being ready and that hasn't worked out as planned.
2) The Sox kept Bradley up to start the season, lost some contract fluff and timing and that hasn't worked out as planned.
3) Here, they now hope Bogaerts will be MLB ready very soon on a contending team. We'll see how it turns out.

He pitched in Chicago, which can be cold in spring and fall. I'm not sure the weather thing is as big a deal as you're making it. No hitter likes to hit in the cold either. I dont remember too many instances where a GM backed away from a player because of how the player would handle the weather in the new city.

I agree with you he has health issues, although the one good thing for Sox fans is that last year he put up 219 innings and had a hell of a year. 3.37 era, 1.09 whip and he finished 10th in the AL in FIP, just ahead of Weaver and Kuroda.
As for this year, yes his era is 4.28. But if you take out his worst start of the year - the one in which he pitched with a fractured rib- his ERA isn't quite as bad. Going into that start, he had a 3.62 era and a 1.09 whip through the first 10 starts of the year.

So in closing with Peavy, he is still a very good pitcher, a very solid 3 and if healthy down the stretch maybe even a 2. Health will be the question. The good news is his injury this year wasn't arm related.

Also keep in mind that they also have him under control for all of 2014 AND the fact that they can give him a qualifying offer and get a draft pick out of it should he leave after 2014, that makes it even better. Neither of those things apply to the rangers who traded for Garza, who will be a FA in a few months. And they can't offer him a QO and will get no draft pick when he leaves.

 

[mauconnfan]

He pitched in Chicago, which can be cold in spring and fall. I'm not sure the weather thing is as big a deal as you're making it. No hitter likes to hit in the cold either. I dont remember too many instances where a GM backed away from a player because of how the player would handle the weather in the new city.

I agree with you he has health issues, although the one good thing for Sox fans is that last year he put up 219 innings and had a hell of a year. 3.37 era, 1.09 whip and he finished 10th in the AL in FIP, just ahead of Weaver and Kuroda.
As for this year, yes his era is 4.28. But if you take out his worst start of the year - the one in which he pitched with a fractured rib- his ERA isn't quite as bad. Going into that start, he had a 3.62 era and a 1.09 whip through the first 10 starts of the year.

So in closing with Peavy, he is still a very good pitcher, a very solid 3 and if healthy down the stretch maybe even a 2. Health will be the question. The good news is his injury this year wasn't arm related.

Also keep in mind that they also have him under control for all of 2014 AND the fact that they can give him a qualifying offer and get a draft pick out of it should he leave after 2014, that makes it even better. Neither of those things apply to the rangers who traded for Garza, who will be a FA in a few months. And they can't offer him a QO and will get no draft pick when he leaves.

Viking throw all the numbers and FIP's you want out Peavy is a decent starter with good experience. He has an ERA closer to Phil Hughes than Kuroda so please give that a rest!! They needed another solid guy and they got one. He's like Dempster, some nice games some rough games. But he'll give you innings.......the hope is always he gets a shot of adrenaline by joining a good team for the run!

 

[mauconnfan]

Do you actually think Iglesias is a better prospect than Bogaerts? If so, you might the only person on earth.

Iglesias is great with the glove and he was showing a little bit of improvement in the strike zone and in making contact but he still wasn't even a doubles guy let alone HR guy. If Bogaerts wasn't knocking on the door they would have held on to Iglesias, but between Bogaerts, Middlebrooks, Cecchini and Iglesias, there was a squeeze coming up on the left side of the infield in the next 1-2 years. Someone had to go. Of the 4, I would have preferred to send Middlebrooks, but Detroit wanted a SS so they got one.

Really have no clue - think I ever watched either of them before Inglesias came to the majors? "potential" is always that until they get there! Most of you guys were singing Jose's praises after that great start so now he's traded and it's Bogaerts.........you're Sox fans I'm good with that!

 

[The Viking]

Viking throw all the numbers and FIP's you want out Peavy is a decent starter with good experience. He has an ERA closer to Phil Hughes than Kuroda so please give that a rest!! They needed another solid guy and they got one. He's like Dempster, some nice games some rough games. But he'll give you innings.......the hope is always he gets a shot of adrenaline by joining a good team for the run!

Here are some more numbers, if you take out the game where he pitched with a broken rib, his ERA is 3.73. I'll take my chances with him the rest of this year and next year.

 

[The Viking]

Really have no clue - think I ever watched either of them before Inglesias came to the majors? "potential" is always that until they get there! Most of you guys were singing Jose's praises after that great start so now he's traded and it's Bogaerts.........you're Sox fans I'm good with that!

You can sing someones praises and still think someone's better.

All scouts and GM's drool over Bogaerts. All the minor league "experts" put him in top 5, some in the top 2 or 3 prospects in all of baseball. This isn't some kid who is still 2-3 years away. He could be called up tomorrow.

Of course you never know til someone proves it on the field but if that were the case teams would be trading all their top prospects for any decent major leaguer. Why don't you see that happen? Because their is a projection for prospects on what their ceiling could be and the risk of an elite prospect flaming out is much less than some guy rated 80th or 90th in the minors. Xander is a top 5 guy. And Keith Law thinks his fielding is actually pretty good and now thinks he'll stick at SS where his offensive value is much higher.

Bogaerts is the youngest player to play at Pawtucket ever and he's doing pretty damn good. In 158 at bats he's got a .380 OBP with 8 HR's. He's still 20 freaking years old. The average age in AAA is 27.

I mean at some point it's OK to make a safe evaluation that Bogaerts is going to have a much better career than Iglesias regardless of how great Iglesias's glove is. And I was a huge fan of Jose's glove. But watching him hit the past month has been painful. I think he had the worst or second-worst OPS in the majors. Eventually his hitting luck was going to run out as many expected and he came crashing down to earth.

 

[60'sfan]

You can sing someones praises and still think someone's better.

All scouts and GM's drool over Bogaerts. All the minor league "experts" put him in top 5, some in the top 2 or 3 prospects in all of baseball. This isn't some kid who is still 2-3 years away. He could be called up tomorrow.

Of course you never know til someone proves it on the field but if that were the case teams would be trading all their top prospects for any decent major leaguer. Why don't you see that happen? Because their is a projection for prospects on what their ceiling could be and the risk of an elite prospect flaming out is much less than some guy rated 80th or 90th in the minors. Xander is a top 5 guy. And Keith Law thinks his fielding is actually pretty good and now thinks he'll stick at SS where his offensive value is much higher.

Bogaerts is the youngest player to play at Pawtucket ever and he's doing pretty damn good. In 158 at bats he's got a .380 OBP with 8 HR's. He's still 20 freaking years old. The average age in AAA is 27.

I mean at some point it's OK to make a safe evaluation that Bogaerts is going to have a much better career than Iglesias regardless of how great Iglesias's glove is. And I was a huge fan of Jose's glove. But watching him hit the past month has been painful. I think he had the worst or second-worst OPS in the majors. Eventually his hitting luck was going to run out as many expected and he came crashing down to earth.

I think Bogaerts is going to be a star. Sometimes you have to listen to the scouts and not necessarily look at the stats. Hanley Ramirez in his last full year in the minors hit a modest .271 with only 6 HR's at AA Portland. In fact the most he hit in the minors in one season was 8 even though the scouts were saying he was a five-tool player. Bogaerts is a year younger and an inch taller at the same stage of his career as Hanley.

 

[Deepster]

For me, it was never a matter of Bogaerts vs Iglesias. It's a matter of giving up a solid, young SS with good potential and possible Gold Gloves in his future....for Jake Peavy.

The comments, from Sox fans, on Peavy are things like: If he can stay healthy....if he can eat innings...he's a decent 3 starter. Meh.

 

[sinkhole]

I don't like the move for Boston. An injury prone #3 making 16 mil for a top 50 ss. Cliff Lee was the move I was dreading. He's 7-3 2.52 in the playoffs and owns Tampa. ts

 

[mauconnfan]

Here are some more numbers, if you take out the game where he pitched with a broken rib, his ERA is 3.73. I'll take my chances with him the rest of this year and next year.

He's okay I agree, but that's it. Better than Dempster by a slight margin, maybe one better outing every 4-5 starts......he'll help I agree.

 

[mauconnfan]

I don't like the move for Boston. An injury prone #3 making 16 mil for a top 50 ss. Cliff Lee was the move I was dreading. He's 7-3 2.52 in the playoffs and owns Tampa. ts

If I were in sinkholes spot I would agree with him. Lee would've made me go "Awww duckk"......but Peavy probably has him thinking okay let's go!

 

[Waquoit]

Sox fans who's opinions I respect like the deal. They improved the team for the final push without mortgaging the future. Good job.

 

[sinkhole]

If I were in sinkholes spot I would agree with him. Lee would've made me go "Awww duckk"......but Peavy probably has him thinking okay let's go!

I don't think any team in the AL is scared of Boston's starters in a short series. The team that's scares me is Detroit, not real thrilled with the Sox sending a gold glove caliber SS to solidify the Tiger infield.

 

[Jerry1714]

I don't like the move for Boston. An injury prone #3 making 16 mil for a top 50 ss. Cliff Lee was the move I was dreading. He's 7-3 2.52 in the playoffs and owns Tampa. ts

Cliff lee was never happening, too much salary too high of an asking price. The sox were not giving up bogearts plus more prospects that the phillies wanted.

Adding peavy also allowed the sox to add workman to the bullpen in long relief, a spot they needed after losing miller.

I'll take the sox offense with Lester, Buch, peavy and lackey versus any team.

 

[Waquoit]

I don't think any team in the AL is scared of Boston's starters in a short series. The team that's scares me is Detroit, not real thrilled with the Sox sending a gold glove caliber SS to solidify the Tiger infield.

I get the feeling Rays fans think a 23-4 streak is their true team.

 

[sinkhole]

I get the feeling Rays fans think a 23-4 streak is their true team.

Give me Price, Moore, Cobb, Hellickson and Archer all day. I don't see another 23-4 run but I do think they are the best team in the AL.

 

[mauconnfan]

Cliff lee was never happening, too much salary too high of an asking price. The sox were not giving up bogearts plus more prospects that the phillies wanted.

Adding peavy also allowed the sox to add workman to the bullpen in long relief, a spot they needed after losing miller.

I'll take the sox offense with Lester, Buch, peavy and lackey versus any team.

Who's Buch? That's funny vs the Rays starters.....but good for you. Someone has to be a Sox fan!

 

[The Viking]

For me, it was never a matter of Bogaerts vs Iglesias. It's a matter of giving up a solid, young SS with good potential and possible Gold Gloves in his future....for Jake Peavy.

The comments, from Sox fans, on Peavy are things like: If he can stay healthy....if he can eat innings...he's a decent 3 starter. Meh.

Peavy's rankings last year among AL starters
WHIP - 3rd
IP - 5th
ERA - 9th

I think it's safe to say he is def. a 3 and he might even be a 2 for the Sox. I'm not gonna sweat trading Iglesias for potentially a year and a half of that when replacements are waiting in the wings. Maybe we are undervaluing Peavy.

 

[mauconnfan]

Peavy's rankings last year among AL starters
WHIP - 3rd
IP - 5th
ERA - 9th

I think it's safe to say he is def. a 3 and he might even be a 2 for the Sox. I'm not gonna sweat trading Iglesias for potentially a year and a half of that when replacements are waiting in the wings. Maybe we are undervaluing Peavy.

Okay since 201o.........stats

201o......... 7-6 107 IP 4.63 era
2011......... 7-7 111.2 IP 4.92 era
2012........ 11-12 219 IP 3.37 era
2013........ 8-4 80 IP 4.28 era

Is someone "undervaluing" him or is possible people are overvaluing him?? Just asking.............

 

[Jerry1714]

Who's Buch? That's funny vs the Rays starters.....but good for you. Someone has to be a Sox fan!

I think you know who clay buchholz is.

Their starters are not better than the rays, but Moore is hurt and price has been as well, but their offense is a lot better than tampas.

One team has won consistently all year, one had a nice month and think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread. I'll take the team that has been consistent and we actually know what they are. Someone has to defend those cute rays though, since they have 0 actual fans.

 

[mauconnfan]

I think you know who clay buchholz is.

Their starters are not better than the rays, but Moore is hurt and price has been as well, but their offense is a lot better than tampas.

One team has won consistently all year, one had a nice month and think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread. I'll take the team that has been consistent and we actually know what they are. Someone has to defend those cute rays though, since they have 0 actual fans.

Their offense has been very "timely" and better than anyone could have imagined, a lot seems like a spurt of luck with such average at best players like Napoli, Gomes and Nava playing a big part. That may wear off and I believe it has to because those guys just aren't that good.......but hey ride the wave can't blame you there! If you believe you know "what they are" then more power to you. sinkhole makes it 1 fan for sure by the way!

 

[sinkhole]

I think you know who clay buchholz is.

Their starters are not better than the rays, but Moore is hurt and price has been as well, but their offense is a lot better than tampas.

One team has won consistently all year, one had a nice month and think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread. I'll take the team that has been consistent and we actually know what they are. Someone has to defend those cute rays though, since they have 0 actual fans.

How hurt did Price look in beating the Sox twice at Fenway last week going 16.1 innings giving up 2 runs, 7 hits, o walks and 12 k's. One of those runs came off a 302 ft homer off the Pesky pole. The shortest homer hit in the majors this year, now that's cute.

Interesting that you left out defense. The Rays infield d is among the best I've ever seen.

 

[The Viking]

Okay since 201o.........stats

201o......... 7-6 107 IP 4.63 era
2011......... 7-7 111.2 IP 4.92 era
2012........ 11-12 219 IP 3.37 era
2013........ 8-4 80 IP 4.28 era

Is someone "undervaluing" him or is possible people are overvaluing him?? Just asking.............

That's nice. In 2012 he was good enough to be an ace for some teams and a #2 for most. And like I said before take out the start this year where he pitched with a broken rib and his era is a much better 3.74.

Keep in mind that virtually all Sox starters have question marks, so they did need to add an arm. Lee's asking price was off the charts and the Cubs got a haul for a rental in Garza. The Sox price in comparison was pretty good. And they have Bogaerts coming up at SS and either Cecchini or Middlebrooks over the next 2 years at 3B. Numbers crunch. If Iglesias didn't revert to being horrific offensively in the month of July maybe they decide to stand pat. But he did.

Good trade for all in my book.

 

[The Viking]

I think you know who clay buchholz is.

Their starters are not better than the rays, but Moore is hurt and price has been as well, but their offense is a lot better than tampas.

One team has won consistently all year, one had a nice month and think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread. I'll take the team that has been consistent and we actually know what they are. Someone has to defend those cute rays though, since they have 0 actual fans.

Jerry as a Sox fan I'll even say this is the best all around Rays team in a while. Maybe ever.

The top 3 teams in any order are Detroit, Boston and Tampa. If it plays out like that into the playoffs there will be some damn good matchups.

 

[mauconnfan]

Jerry as a Sox fan I'll even say this is the best all around Rays team in a while. Maybe ever.

The top 3 teams in any order are Detroit, Boston and Tampa. If it plays out like that into the playoffs there will be some damn good matchups.

There's something about Detroit that makes me think Boston and the Rays are better overall........not sure why but in a 7 game series you both beat the Tigers.........

As a fan would love for the Indians or Royals to make some noise!!!