Irish fan on why UConn belongs in the ACC

[btstimpy]

Louisville over Uconn.

I still want UConn, but academics is not why. Athletics is why. I'm impressed with the UConn athletics department and basketball programs. And the ACC is a good fit in that geographic region for rivalries and competition.

Louisville coaches will probably be going out recruiting with the same sales pitch as FSU. I don't think FSU was ranked much better academically in 1992 than Louisville is in 2014. I don't have those old rankings, but FSU has moved up the chart in the past 20 years.

 

[upstater]

Well, they are behind. And they did not add anything to help catch up either. Here is a good analysis for you. It leaves out Notre Dame from the ACC because it only focuses on football. The Louisville addition alters it very little.

http://voices.yahoo.com/the-first-comprehensive-academic-rankings-major-12331684.html

Top 100 Schools: Three American Athletic Conference schools rank in the Top 100 of the USN&WR Best National Universities list, all of them between #51 and #100: University of Connecticut (#57), Southern Methodist University (#60), and Rutgers (#69).

Sub 100 Schools: Seven of the American Athletic Conference's schools fail to crack the Top 100 academically: Temple (#121), University of Cincinnati (#135), Louisville (#161), University of Central Florida (#170), University of South Florida (#170), University of Houston (#190), and University of Memphis (RNP - Rank Not Published).

Clearly, if the ACC cared at all about academics, it wouldn't have taken the #161 school over the #57 school when the #57 school has better basketball and is 4-6 in the last 10 games of football against the #161 school.

Academics don't matter.

In fact, according to your link, UConn is ranked ahead of 8 of the ACC schools.

But about the B1G, they clearly want AAU schools. They have the CIC to think about, so there is an academic element, whereas there isn't one in the ACC. Besides, the USNWR are crazy. Anyone who ranks Clemson ahead of B1G schools like U. Minnesota doesn't know the first thing about Higher Education in America.

 

[upstater]

I still want UConn, but academics is not why. Athletics is why. I'm impressed with the UConn athletics department and basketball programs. And the ACC is a good fit in that geographic region for rivalries and competition.

Louisville coaches will probably be going out recruiting with the same sales pitch as FSU. I don't think FSU was ranked much better academically in 1992 than Louisville is in 2014. I don't have those old rankings, but FSU has moved up the chart in the past 20 years.

Louisville is light years behind where FSU was in 1992. FSU in the mid 1990s was 54th nationally among public schools in federal research, ahead of schools like Clemson (86th). Louisville is currently nowhere near the top 100.

 

[itgoeslike]

Well, they are behind. And they did not add anything to help catch up either. Here is a good analysis for you. It leaves out Notre Dame from the ACC because it only focuses on football. The Louisville addition alters it very little.

http://voices.yahoo.com/the-first-comprehensive-academic-rankings-major-12331684.html

The analysis has Louisville in the American. Per the analysis (football only), if you replace Maryland with Louisville the rankings for the ACC and Big Ten are virtually the same.

 

[buddy]

My assumption is that you did not read my response to this on this thread above. I stated that none of the schools make decisions based upon academics despite their remarks to the contrary.. they ALL make their decisions as to where to place their football programs based upon the level of revenues they anticipate coming to their school. People in colleges and universities sometimes are not entirely upfront and truthful when they speak ( not just in college sports either, of course). This is no revelation to you regarding what somebody at a college or university tells you on something..... or is it ? You've gone to college, and nobody there ( professors, financial aid office, career center, AD offiice, Security, Housing, Pres and / or Administration etc) ever gave you anything but the complete and unvarnished Truth ? ( What school was THAT, as that school certainly isn't on planet Earth )

So you are saying that a priest was lying?

 

[btstimpy]

The analysis has Louisville in the American. Per the analysis (football only), if you replace Maryland with Louisville the rankings for the ACC and Big Ten are virtually the same.

Then Add Notre Dame to the ACC since we actually aren't football only. And Notre Dame will be playing five football games anyway.

 

[upstater]

Then Add Notre Dame to the ACC since we actually aren't football only. And Notre Dame will be playing five football games anyway.

So the American gets to add Navy?

 

[btstimpy]

So the American gets to add Navy?

When the American adds them, sure. The Service acadamies aren't national universities though, I don't think. There is a Post Graduate Naval School in California, but I'm not sure it's part of the US Naval Academy. That's an interesting one, but the Naval Academiy is good academically. But the AAC should truly add Navy for everything to actually add them. This comparison was for football though.

 

[Seaa Blue]

Well, they are behind. And they did not add anything to help catch up either. Here is a good analysis for you. It leaves out Notre Dame from the ACC because it only focuses on football. The Louisville addition alters it very little.

http://voices.yahoo.com/the-first-comprehensive-academic-rankings-major-12331684.html

Once again... the ACC's private universities give the ACC an advantage in any study that includes undergraduate studies, and in particular, incoming freshmen rankings.

 

[btstimpy]

Once again... the ACC's private universities give the ACC an advantage in any study that includes undergraduate studies, and in particular, incoming freshmen rankings.

OK. We're talking about athletic conferences here, and 99% of the athletes are undergraduate with 25% of those freshmen. So that's where the focus should be.

 

[upstater]

When the American adds them, sure. The Service acadamies aren't national universities though, I don't think. There is a Post Graduate Naval School in California, but I'm not sure it's part of the US Naval Academy. That's an interesting one, but the Naval Academiy is good academically. But the AAC should truly add Navy for everything to actually add them. This comparison was for football though.

Are all the ACC schools national universities? No.

 

[btstimpy]

Clearly, if the ACC cared at all about academics, it wouldn't have taken the #161 school over the #57 school when the #57 school has better basketball and is 4-6 in the last 10 games of football against the #161 school.

Academics don't matter.

In fact, according to your link, UConn is ranked ahead of 8 of the ACC schools.

But about the B1G, they clearly want AAU schools. They have the CIC to think about, so there is an academic element, whereas there isn't one in the ACC. Besides, the USNWR are crazy. Anyone who ranks Clemson ahead of B1G schools like U. Minnesota doesn't know the first thing about Higher Education in America.

I get that you don't like the USNWR rankings. But they are the gold standard in the industry, and they are what anyone in the media will use to analyze this subject. I can't help with that.

And you probably would expect me to say by now that out of the 4 categories this writer used, the Top 100 and Sub 100 ones wouldn't be the ones to focus on. Focus on the Top 25 and Top 50 categories. I can't help that the SEC and Big XII don't have much to offer in those, but we are talking academics here.

 

[Yawkey Way]

No, I actually am a little concerned for you......

Lol!.. no, you're not !

 

[Seaa Blue]

Then Add Notre Dame to the ACC since we actually aren't football only. And Notre Dame will be playing five football games anyway.

Can we take Chicago and Johns Hopkins then?

 

[btstimpy]

Can we take Chicago and Johns Hopkins then?

As soon as either plays 5 football games against the Big Ten Teams per season, yes you may. Until then, it wouldn't make any sense.

 

[upstater]

I get that you don't like the USNWR rankings. But they are the gold standard in the industry, and they are what anyone in the media will use to analyze this subject. I can't help with that.

And you probably would expect me to say by now that out of the 4 categories this writer used, the Top 100 and Sub 100 ones wouldn't be the ones to focus on. Focus on the Top 25 and Top 50 categories. I can't help that the SEC and Big XII don't have much to offer in those, but we are talking academics here.

They are not the gold standard in the industry. Not at all. Any industry insider is going to look at Carnegie or NRC. They won't even bother with USNWR, a rag that has been embarrassed so often in that same news media you reference. For instance, they had to admit a few years ago that they were copying the Carnegie classification system back when USNWR used tiers, but they didn't understadn what the tiers were, so they had to apologize and stop using them. Carnegie basically admonished them for getting it all wrong. Not only that, but when the USNWR surveys have made it into the media, they have been incredibly embarrassing. The president of FSU was dropping Ivy league schools into the 3rd tier and elevating his former institution into the top 10. Hell, Reed College is way down in the rankings simply because they don't adhere to USNWRs reporting system. What does that tell you? If you're going to punish a really good school because it reports things differently, then that tells me your system is rubbish.

Let me tell you: if you really believe Clemson is better than Minnesota, you are totally lost, and if you think Louisville is as good as Minnesota, you're impossible to help.

 

[BlueHen]

As soon as either plays 5 football games against the Big Ten Teams per season, yes you may. Until then, it wouldn't make any sense.

About as much sense as coming to a UConn message board to talk up the ACC.

 

[Yawkey Way]

.

Academics don't matter.

quote]
So true. All one has to do is line up all the schools in all the conferences on a sheet of paper,then beside each school, using any measuring stick one prefers to use, write the academic rankings beside each school in that conference. Do this with all the conferences ( except for the Ivies of course ), and the exercise clearly should convince one that these league alignments were contructed with little to no consideration to academic standings whatsoever. Vanderbilt is in a league with Mississippi State. West Virginia with BC. Navy will be in a league with Memphis. Northwestern with Michigan State... ND just joined a hockey league with Umass- Lowell. Duke is in a league with NC State. Stanford with Washington State, and on and on.

 

[MSNDfan]

Louisville over Uconn.

One thing that marks how serious and well set up a university is for future academic reputation enhancement is endowment. I believe Louisville's is about 1.2 billion dollars. And I think I have read somewhere that UConn's is about 370 million.

 

[Yawkey Way]

So you are saying that a priest was lying?

Good grief.. do I have to spell it out for you now ? look, I'm not trying to be rude here, but did you read what I wrote above ?. Why then are you asking me a question for an answer that should seem readily apparent to you if you so much as even did a quick and cursory read of my remarks ?. But since its apparently unclear STILL to you... Yes, it appears the Priest was less than completely truthful. Are you under some assumption that a Priest ( or Rabbi, Minister, Judge, etc ) don't skirt around the truth sometimes ... and yes, on occasion even lie? The school presidents all talk about " academics ", when we all know ( or should by now ) that revenues drive just about every single decision a school president makes regarding their football program. What do we expect a school president of all these schools to say ?... " I made this decision to make a lot of money for myself and the school ? " Com'on ( haha! ).. they all talk about the" academics" angle with the press when called upon. ALL of 'em. Everybody knows ( or most do anyway ) what the gig is with all these schools that play in the P5 Conferences, and the ones on the outside that want a future piece of that money up for grabs.

 

[upstater]

One thing that marks how serious and well set up a university is for future academic reputation enhancement is endowment. I believe Louisville's is about 1.2 billion dollars. And I think I have read somewhere that UConn's is about 370 million.

Already addressed. The amount of state support UConn receives blows away Louisville's endowment + state support out of the water. It receives 2x as much support as Louisville's support + endowment combined.

Louisville's endowment is 788 million. Apparently, according to you, Louisville's future is brighter than the futures of Georgia, Miami, Rutgers, Brandeis (all AAU), Colgate, Oberlin, Lafayette, Pepperdine, William & Mary, Bucknell, Virginia Tech, RPI, Northeastern, etc.

And, Texas A&M is going to pound Notre Dame into the sand academically in the future.

What is it about you ACC people that you know very little about academic reputation?

 

[Yawkey Way]

What is it about you ACC people that you know very little about academic reputation?

Its probably hereditary, or genetics.... or bad schooling, bad teachers, floride in our water,... a combination... or something else entirely, who knows.

And this " academic reputation " of these P5 and non P5 football league schools has to do with what again ?

 

[Seaa Blue]

One thing that marks how serious and well set up a university is for future academic reputation enhancement is endowment. I believe Louisville's is about 1.2 billion dollars. And I think I have read somewhere that UConn's is about 370 million.

Is it then significant that Louisville is #3 in Kentucky? Can you guess who's #1?

U of L’s endowment ranked third-largest in the state, behind Berea College (No. 82, $1.01 billion) and the University of Kentucky (No. 84, $992.4 million). Centre College ranked No. 262 in the study, with endowment assets of $231.2 million.​

 

[Yawkey Way]

t Texas A&M is going to pound Notre Dame into the sand academically in the future.

quote]

And I and others should care about this....... beacuse ?

 

[upstater]

Because you are responsible for your fellow conference mates' idiocy.