Irish fan on why UConn belongs in the ACC

[btstimpy]

Probably one of the biggest surprises when I started reading cfb sites was that VA was in the top 10 states for football recruiting. There's no excuse for UVA's history or lack thereof.

UVA didn't take football seriously until George Welsh came in 1982. And UVA's recruiting and performance has been good since 1982 until 2007. It's not glorious, but decades of winning seasons in a row is positive. Mike London's current recruiting is good. One thing UVA has to be careful of in recruiting Virginia, especially Tidewater, is to bring in kids that can stay in the school. George Welsh was good at this. Al Groh had a hard time. Al Groh had a couple of top 10 recruiting classes of 25 kids where 12 failed out before sophomore season ended. He'd put them in Peidmont Community College to try to recover, but mostly to no avail. UVA literally kicks them out, and it is hard to get back in. Mike London brought in Phillip Sims from Va Beach (5 Star QB) signed with Alabama. But he transfered to UVA after AJ McCarron won the job at Alabama. He's already failed out of the school. Took 2 seasons.

A lot of the other schools around that recruit these kids have mechanisms to keep them No one fails out of Virginia Tech. No one. Ditto Maryland, NC State, etc. SEC is even worse. UVA has to win with the more academically inclined football players. They exist, and a coach that will succeed at UVA will understand how to find them and develop them. Ditto for Duke. It can be done. David Cutcliffe is doing it at Duke.

 

[Yawkey Way]

No it doesn't. I've been very clear. My point is that the schism could end up being enormous and permanently insurmountable depending on what the monsters choose to do. A world that is different than today's world.

Tiresome....

You could ultimately be proven right on this future prediction too... I will readily acknowledge this. There are no right or wrong answers when it comes to crystal ball gazing, as nobody has a crystal ball that is all knowing into the future on this stuff

 

[Yawkey Way]

Agree, but BC does, there a "football school" you know......

BC is not a football school.. who has said they are ? Anyone thats a BC alum or fan that says this is just being silly. ( Uconn is not a " football school " in the eyes of the public either. That would be equally silly to state as well, of course )

 

[uconndogs]

Man, that's a dim duck*ing light.

 

[Yawkey Way]

Think FSU is really keen on the share that BC and Wake get relative to what they perceive they bring to the table? .

It would appear so. FSU liked the ACC TV contract negotiated by the league, sufficient enough to sign the GOR. So FSU isn't going anywhere any time soon, and the school seems satisfied with the revenue streams it receives now from their ACC league membership .

 

[buddy]

Agree, but BC does, there a "football school" you know......

UVA didn't take football seriously until George Welsh came in 1982. And UVA's recruiting and performance has been good since 1982 until 2007. It's not glorious, but decades of winning seasons in a row is positive. Mike London's current recruiting is good. One thing UVA has to be careful of in recruiting Virginia, especially Tidewater, is to bring in kids that can stay in the school. George Welsh was good at this. Al Groh had a hard time. Al Groh had a couple of top 10 recruiting classes of 25 kids where 12 failed out before sophomore season ended. He'd put them in Peidmont Community College to try to recover, but mostly to no avail. UVA literally kicks them out, and it is hard to get back in. Mike London brought in Phillip Sims from Va Beach (5 Star QB) signed with Alabama. But he transfered to UVA after AJ McCarron won the job at Alabama. He's already failed out of the school. Took 2 seasons.

A lot of the other schools around that recruit these kids have mechanisms to keep them No one fails out of Virginia Tech. No one. Ditto Maryland, NC State, etc. SEC is even worse. UVA has to win with the more academically inclined football players. They exist, and a coach that will succeed at UVA will understand how to find them and develop them. Ditto for Duke. It can be done. David Cutcliffe is doing it at Duke.

Academics are meaningless. You won't be able to compete with Louisville.

 

[NotreDameJoe]

UVA didn't take football seriously until George Welsh came in 1982. And UVA's recruiting and performance has been good since 1982 until 2007. It's not glorious, but decades of winning seasons in a row is positive. Mike London's current recruiting is good. One thing UVA has to be careful of in recruiting Virginia, especially Tidewater, is to bring in kids that can stay in the school. George Welsh was good at this. Al Groh had a hard time. Al Groh had a couple of top 10 recruiting classes of 25 kids where 12 failed out before sophomore season ended. He'd put them in Peidmont Community College to try to recover, but mostly to no avail. UVA literally kicks them out, and it is hard to get back in. Mike London brought in Phillip Sims from Va Beach (5 Star QB) signed with Alabama. But he transfered to UVA after AJ McCarron won the job at Alabama. He's already failed out of the school. Took 2 seasons.

A lot of the other schools around that recruit these kids have mechanisms to keep them No one fails out of Virginia Tech. No one. Ditto Maryland, NC State, etc. SEC is even worse. UVA has to win with the more academically inclined football players. They exist, and a coach that will succeed at UVA will understand how to find them and develop them. Ditto for Duke. It can be done. David Cutcliffe is doing it at Duke.

Your school is going to need a come to Jesus moment like Stanford had with the Harbaugh hire. Generally that involves a 'safe' major that sounds suspiciously like physical education. ND didn't have one but we have liberal arts tracks where you only have to write one paper at the end.

 

[Yawkey Way]

Academics are meaningless. .

Absolutely..... I even said on this very thread above that the football league alignments have nothing at all to do with academics considerations on how all these school presidents chose their teams sports leagues for their school.. and they never have at the major levels in college football in all these leagues... and going back for decades now too ( no matter what any of them might have said to the contrary ). Their decision was all driven by how much revenue would come back to their schools. Period.

 

[upstater]

Absolutely.. We agree... I even said on this very thread above that the football league alignments have nothing at all to do with Academics.. and they never have at the major levels in college football in all these leagues... and going back for decades now too.

The B1G is the exception.

 

[uconndogs]

The B1G is the exception.

Jimminy Crickets!!!!!!

Don't you guys listen! The good father at BC specifically state, and I quote, "the primary reason for our move to the ACC was for academic reasons".

 

[Yawkey Way]

The B1G is the exception.

I don't know.. even the BIG has private Northwestern, and the public Michigan State. There's not much academic parallels between these schools at all, and I'd imagine we'd see few high school non athlete applicants to each school making application to the other school simultaneously. They are completely different schools academically, and each serves a completely different undergraduate student body by and large.

 

[Yawkey Way]

Jimminy Crickets!!!!!!

Don't you guys listen! The good father at BC specifically state, and I quote, "the primary reason for our move to the ACC was for academic reasons".

My assumption is that you did not read my response to this on this thread above. I stated that none of the schools make decisions based upon academics despite their remarks to the contrary.. they ALL make their decisions as to where to place their football programs based upon the level of revenues they anticipate coming to their school. People in colleges and universities sometimes are not entirely upfront and truthful when they speak ( not just in college sports either, of course). This is no revelation to you regarding what somebody at a college or university tells you on something.................... or is it ? You've gone to college, and nobody there ( professors, financial aid office, career center, AD offiice, Security, Housing, Pres and / or Administration etc) ever gave you anything but the complete and unvarnished Truth ? ( What school was THAT, as that school certainly isn't on planet Earth )

 

[SouthronCross]

Most of the de-emphasis will never happen. If it does it will be mostly in FCS type schools that had only their own parochial following.

Probably one of the biggest surprises when I started reading cfb sites was that VA was in the top 10 states for football recruiting. There's no excuse for UVA's history or lack thereof.

Except that other schools were coming into VA and snapping up their best players. If you were to look at a list of UNC's all-time best players, quite a few of them were from Virginia. Especially, the Tidewater region.

UNC has a similar problem. There is deent talent here, but, SEC schools, or Clemson, come in and take them away.

 

[SouthronCross]

Some part of me also believes that Virginia is not at all keen to jump into bed with the likes of Tennessee in an arrangement with absolutely no supervision from the NCAA.

And, you would be correct, too.

 

[uconndogs]

My assumption is that you did not read my response to this on this thread above. I stated that none of the schools make decisions based upon academics despite their remarks to the contrary.. they ALL make their decisions as to where to place their football programs based upon the level of revenues they anticipate coming to their school. People in colleges and universities sometimes are not entirely upfront and truthful when they speak ( not just in college sports either, of course). This is no revelation to you regarding what somebody at a college or university tells you on something..... or is it ? You've gone to college, and nobody there ( professors, financial aid office, career center, AD offiice, Security, Housing, Pres and / or Administration etc) ever gave you anything but the complete and unvarnished Truth ? ( What school was THAT, as that school certainly isn't on planet Earth )

It's called sarcasm and it went flying so fast and far over your head I'm a little concerned for you.

You might need another hobby? Job?

 

[Yawkey Way]

It's called sarcasm and it went flying so fast and far over your head I'm a little concerned for you.

You might need another hobby? Job?

Oh, you're just pulling my leg.. you're not concerned for me at all. I get THAT sarcasm reply anyway.( haha!)

 

[uconndogs]

Oh, you're just pulling my leg.. you're not concerned for me at all. I get THAT sarcasm reply anyway.( haha!)

No, I actually am a little concerned for you...........

 

[btstimpy]

Jimminy Crickets!!!!!!

Don't you guys listen! The good father at BC specifically state, and I quote, "the primary reason for our move to the ACC was for academic reasons".

I have the ACC 50th Anniversary "Golden Glory" DVD from 2003, and in the documentary Florida State Football Coach Bobby Bowden says emphatically that FSU chose to join the ACC over the SEC because of academics. And Chuck Amato, who was the FSU offensive coordinator chimes in and says the he personally used to go out on the football recruiting trail telling kids to come to FSU because it is in the best Athletic and Academic Conference in America. So these guys believe it to be the primary reason FSU joined. There is no question about that. Don't know about BC.

 

[upstater]

I have the ACC 50th Anniversary "Golden Glory" DVD from 2003, and in the documentary Florida State Football Coach Bobby Bowden says emphatically that FSU chose to join the ACC over the SEC because of academics. And Chuck Amato, who was the FSU offensive coordinator chimes in and says the he personally used to go out on the football recruiting trail telling kids to come to FSU because it is in the best Athletic and Academic Conference in America. So these guys believe it to be the primary reason FSU joined. There is no question about that. Don't know about BC.

Louisville over Uconn.

 

[btstimpy]

The B1G is the exception.

Well, they are behind. And they did not add anything to help catch up either. Here is a good analysis for you. It leaves out Notre Dame from the ACC because it only focuses on football. The Louisville addition alters it very little.

http://voices.yahoo.com/the-first-comprehensive-academic-rankings-major-12331684.html

 

[btstimpy]

Louisville over Uconn.

I still want UConn, but academics is not why. Athletics is why. I'm impressed with the UConn athletics department and basketball programs. And the ACC is a good fit in that geographic region for rivalries and competition.

Louisville coaches will probably be going out recruiting with the same sales pitch as FSU. I don't think FSU was ranked much better academically in 1992 than Louisville is in 2014. I don't have those old rankings, but FSU has moved up the chart in the past 20 years.

 

[upstater]

Well, they are behind. And they did not add anything to help catch up either. Here is a good analysis for you. It leaves out Notre Dame from the ACC because it only focuses on football. The Louisville addition alters it very little.

http://voices.yahoo.com/the-first-comprehensive-academic-rankings-major-12331684.html

Top 100 Schools: Three American Athletic Conference schools rank in the Top 100 of the USN&WR Best National Universities list, all of them between #51 and #100: University of Connecticut (#57), Southern Methodist University (#60), and Rutgers (#69).

Sub 100 Schools: Seven of the American Athletic Conference's schools fail to crack the Top 100 academically: Temple (#121), University of Cincinnati (#135), Louisville (#161), University of Central Florida (#170), University of South Florida (#170), University of Houston (#190), and University of Memphis (RNP - Rank Not Published).

Clearly, if the ACC cared at all about academics, it wouldn't have taken the #161 school over the #57 school when the #57 school has better basketball and is 4-6 in the last 10 games of football against the #161 school.

Academics don't matter.

In fact, according to your link, UConn is ranked ahead of 8 of the ACC schools.

But about the B1G, they clearly want AAU schools. They have the CIC to think about, so there is an academic element, whereas there isn't one in the ACC. Besides, the USNWR are crazy. Anyone who ranks Clemson ahead of B1G schools like U. Minnesota doesn't know the first thing about Higher Education in America.

 

[upstater]

I still want UConn, but academics is not why. Athletics is why. I'm impressed with the UConn athletics department and basketball programs. And the ACC is a good fit in that geographic region for rivalries and competition.

Louisville coaches will probably be going out recruiting with the same sales pitch as FSU. I don't think FSU was ranked much better academically in 1992 than Louisville is in 2014. I don't have those old rankings, but FSU has moved up the chart in the past 20 years.

Louisville is light years behind where FSU was in 1992. FSU in the mid 1990s was 54th nationally among public schools in federal research, ahead of schools like Clemson (86th). Louisville is currently nowhere near the top 100.

 

[itgoeslike]

Well, they are behind. And they did not add anything to help catch up either. Here is a good analysis for you. It leaves out Notre Dame from the ACC because it only focuses on football. The Louisville addition alters it very little.

http://voices.yahoo.com/the-first-comprehensive-academic-rankings-major-12331684.html

The analysis has Louisville in the American. Per the analysis (football only), if you replace Maryland with Louisville the rankings for the ACC and Big Ten are virtually the same.

 

[buddy]

My assumption is that you did not read my response to this on this thread above. I stated that none of the schools make decisions based upon academics despite their remarks to the contrary.. they ALL make their decisions as to where to place their football programs based upon the level of revenues they anticipate coming to their school. People in colleges and universities sometimes are not entirely upfront and truthful when they speak ( not just in college sports either, of course). This is no revelation to you regarding what somebody at a college or university tells you on something..... or is it ? You've gone to college, and nobody there ( professors, financial aid office, career center, AD offiice, Security, Housing, Pres and / or Administration etc) ever gave you anything but the complete and unvarnished Truth ? ( What school was THAT, as that school certainly isn't on planet Earth )

So you are saying that a priest was lying?

 

[btstimpy]

The analysis has Louisville in the American. Per the analysis (football only), if you replace Maryland with Louisville the rankings for the ACC and Big Ten are virtually the same.

Then Add Notre Dame to the ACC since we actually aren't football only. And Notre Dame will be playing five football games anyway.

 

[upstater]

Then Add Notre Dame to the ACC since we actually aren't football only. And Notre Dame will be playing five football games anyway.

So the American gets to add Navy?

 

[btstimpy]

So the American gets to add Navy?

When the American adds them, sure. The Service acadamies aren't national universities though, I don't think. There is a Post Graduate Naval School in California, but I'm not sure it's part of the US Naval Academy. That's an interesting one, but the Naval Academiy is good academically. But the AAC should truly add Navy for everything to actually add them. This comparison was for football though.

 

[Seaa Blue]

Well, they are behind. And they did not add anything to help catch up either. Here is a good analysis for you. It leaves out Notre Dame from the ACC because it only focuses on football. The Louisville addition alters it very little.

http://voices.yahoo.com/the-first-comprehensive-academic-rankings-major-12331684.html

Once again... the ACC's private universities give the ACC an advantage in any study that includes undergraduate studies, and in particular, incoming freshmen rankings.

 

[btstimpy]

Once again... the ACC's private universities give the ACC an advantage in any study that includes undergraduate studies, and in particular, incoming freshmen rankings.

OK. We're talking about athletic conferences here, and 99% of the athletes are undergraduate with 25% of those freshmen. So that's where the focus should be.