Game of Thrones - Season 5 | Page 4 | The Boneyard

Game of Thrones - Season 5

I haven't read a single word of a book, but I have to think Theon snaps out of his "Reek" state of mind to help Sansa not end up with Ramsey, no?
 
Deepster said:
I haven't read a single word of a book, but I have to think Theon snaps out of his "Reek" state of mind to help Sansa not end up with Ramsey, no?
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I think Jon Snow intervenes in this one somehow as well.
 
Deepster said:
I haven't read a single word of a book, but I have to think Theon snaps out of his "Reek" state of mind to help Sansa not end up with Ramsey, no?
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It was a shocker to the book readers. Though in the end it may not mean anything if the resolution (still unwritten) remains the same.

I'm really curious what they do with this wrinkle.

Much of the entire episode was off book, yet still within the general story framework. An impressive feat by the show producers. The Sansa thing is a bit weird, but the rest is a better version of the story.
 
ZooCougar said:
I think Jon Snow intervenes in this one somehow as well.
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I think tormund does
 
nelsonmuntz said:
With Ygritte gone, no.
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I've been watching unhealthy amounts of GoT these past two weeks to get caught up to the current episodes. Man, Ygritte getting killed off hit me right in the feels. Was my favorite character on the show and probably the hottest as well. Sucks that a kid named Ollie did it, can never look at KO the same.
 
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Very well done. As an FYI for show watchers that have not read the books, I don't see how there are any book spoilers any more. Every key plotline has diverged dramatically from the books.

Baelish's scheme has a few minor holes in it, but overall is solid. I wonder what will happen to him back in Kings Landing. Obviously, something pretty awful is going to happen to Sansa in Winterfell.

Having Loras arrested by the Faith makes a lot more sense than what Martin did in the book. It would have helped to have some explanation of why Cersei allowed the High Sparrow to get an army. I expect the Queen of Thorns to go gangster on the Faith and the Lannisters. Cersei is an idiot, but there should be some explanation of why she is not worried about that risk.

The show is doing a great job of showing the unravelling of the Lannister power without Tywin at the helm.

The Stannis scenes were great. In the book, there are times where I just do not get the character or particularly care. In the show, you get a better picture of a very moral man so desperate for power that he will rationalize almost anything in his pursuit of it.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Very well done. As an FYI for show watchers that have not read the books, I don't see how there are any book spoilers any more. Every key plotline has diverged dramatically from the books.

Baelish's scheme has a few minor holes in it, but overall is solid. I wonder what will happen to him back in Kings Landing. Obviously, something pretty awful is going to happen to Sansa in Winterfell.

Having Loras arrested by the Faith makes a lot more sense than what Martin did in the book. It would have helped to have some explanation of why Cersei allowed the High Sparrow to get an army. I expect the Queen of Thorns to go gangster on the Faith and the Lannisters. Cersei is an idiot, but there should be some explanation of why she is not worried about that risk.

The show is doing a great job of showing the unravelling of the Lannister power without Tywin at the helm.

The Stannis scenes were great. In the book, there are times where I just do not get the character or particularly care. In the show, you get a better picture of a very moral man so desperate for power that he will rationalize almost anything in his pursuit of it.
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I think there are still plenty of spoilers as the major event time line is still very much in play. Most of the changes are replacements for other minor plot points using existing characters instead of new one's or fill in new material to set up the major plot points.

I also see a bit of new material for character journeys that the books stopped short or didn't move forward.

Sansa is the obvious departure that does all three of those things.

Littlefinger is standing in for another character in Kings Landing.

Jamie and Braun are doing the same, with Jamie's story in a new location.

Tryion and Mormont are going to end up in the same place via a different route.

Danny is still on the same path but may absorb the storyline of a missing character or not if that character appears.

Jon Snow and Stannis are still on the book arc, but my bet is they depart from it next season or late this season.

The Dorne scenes are still mostly in addressed but look to be a reasonable adaptation.

I say all this as merely a warning that the night is still dark and full of spoilers. But, I find the divergence entertaining and maddening at the same time.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
The Stannis scenes were great. In the book, there are times where I just do not get the character or particularly care. In the show, you get a better picture of a very moral man so desperate for power that he will rationalize almost anything in his pursuit of it.
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Book Stannis is the equivalent of Les Miserables' Javert. He was deprived as a child of a lot of basic human needs as the least of the 3 Baratheon brothers charisma wise and reacts by making himself into a perfectly rigid paragon of earthly virtue, even at the expense or spiritual morality. I love him.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Having Loras arrested by the Faith makes a lot more sense than what Martin did in the book. It would have helped to have some explanation of why Cersei allowed the High Sparrow to get an army. I expect the Queen of Thorns to go gangster on the Faith and the Lannisters. Cersei is an idiot, but there should be some explanation of why she is not worried about that risk.
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She probably assumes that by having the two primary men of the house as captives with knives at their throats, she has leverage. Seems to be the reason for the departure from the book storyline as it relates to Mace.
 
SubbaBub said:
I think there are still plenty of spoilers as the major event time line is still very much in play. Most of the changes are replacements for other minor plot points using existing characters instead of new one's or fill in new material to set up the major plot points.

I also see a bit of new material for character journeys that the books stopped short or didn't move forward.

Sansa is the obvious departure that does all three of those things.

Littlefinger is standing in for another character in Kings Landing.

Jamie and Braun are doing the same, with Jamie's story in a new location.

Tryion and Mormont are going to end up in the same place via a different route.

Danny is still on the same path but may absorb the storyline of a missing character or not if that character appears.

Jon Snow and Stannis are still on the book arc, but my bet is they depart from it next season or late this season.

The Dorne scenes are still mostly in addressed but look to be a reasonable adaptation.

I say all this as merely a warning that the night is still dark and full of spoilers. But, I find the divergence entertaining and maddening at the same time.
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I re-skimmed ADWD a few weeks ago in advance of this season, and I must not have read it closely enough because I can not figure out who you mean in Kings Landing. In the show, Mace Tyrell is standing in for all the buffoons that Cersei surrounded herself with in the books.

I think in broad terms we will get to similar places at the end of season 5 that we are at the end of ADWD, with a huge difference being the Iron Islands, who are pretty important in the books and have been written out of the show.

Jaime was more interesting when he was a wiseass. The lovesick puppy dog persona is a little annoying.
 
There are a couple HUGE spoilers that I'm positive they are going to use as the season cliff hangers, and yeah one is kings landing,
 
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Spartacus said:
Book Stannis is the equivalent of Les Miserables' Javert. He was deprived as a child of a lot of basic human needs as the least of the 3 Baratheon brothers charisma wise and reacts by making himself into a perfectly rigid paragon of earthly virtue, even at the expense or spiritual morality. I love him.
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While I like Javert, he is a two dimensional character.

HBO Stannis is much more complex. The book makes it sound like cutting off Davos' fingers was an easy decision, but the HBO Stannis is much more conflicted, and almost a little ashamed that he needed a smuggler to survive the siege of Storm's End. Whenever the book characters denigrate Davos, it is about his lowborn birth. Whenever the show characters denigrate Davos, it is about the fact that Davos is in fact a smuggler (see trip to Iron Bank in Season 4).

I am a bit suspicious about the large role Stannis' daughter is getting, and how Selyse really, really hates the daughter. Stannis' monologue about the doll sounded like the combination of a rational for a cookout and a eulogy. The Red Witch has come off the rails.
 
HBO Let Me Show You My Melisandra is even more annoying than Book Melisandra. It's the worst deviation from the book. Thankfully, that list is rather amazingly short.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
I am a bit suspicious about the large role Stannis' daughter is getting, and how Selyse really, really hates the daughter. Stannis' monologue about the doll sounded like the combination of a rational for a cookout and a eulogy. The Red Witch has come off the rails.
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There's a lot of speculation that Shireen is going to be crisped by the end of this season.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
While I like Javert, he is a two dimensional character.

HBO Stannis is much more complex. The book makes it sound like cutting off Davos' fingers was an easy decision, but the HBO Stannis is much more conflicted, and almost a little ashamed that he needed a smuggler to survive the siege of Storm's End. Whenever the book characters denigrate Davos, it is about his lowborn birth. Whenever the show characters denigrate Davos, it is about the fact that Davos is in fact a smuggler (see trip to Iron Bank in Season 4).

I am a bit suspicious about the large role Stannis' daughter is getting, and how Selyse really, really hates the daughter. Stannis' monologue about the doll sounded like the combination of a rational for a cookout and a eulogy. The Red Witch has come off the rails.
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Could be that the purpose of the daughter story and monologue was to show that Stannis is actually a human being that loves what he ought to love. I've always suspected that he was disappointed with his wife's attitude towards her. The doll story was a little gut wrenching. Shows that he feels responsible for it all and that it's something he has been harboring for a while. I thought that was one of the best scenes ever on the show. I'm definitely a Stannis fan now.

So anyone else pretty much convinced that Jon Snow is half Targaryen?
 
nelsonmuntz said:
I re-skimmed ADWD a few weeks ago in advance of this season, and I must not have read it closely enough because I can not figure out who you mean in Kings Landing. In the show, Mace Tyrell is standing in for all the buffoons that Cersei surrounded herself with in the books.

I think in broad terms we will get to similar places at the end of season 5 that we are at the end of ADWD, with a huge difference being the Iron Islands, who are pretty important in the books and have been written out of the show.

Jaime was more interesting when he was a wiseass. The lovesick puppy dog persona is a little annoying.
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I think Littlefinger is a proxy for the more rational aspects of the Lannister clan plus another foil for Cersei. The TV show needs a known face to go with the new faces of the faithful army, now that the show has Veras on the road.

The Iron Islands was a loss, but certainly tangential.

I agree, Jamie still pining for his sister is overdone. I just hope they don't invent a romance with Brieanne. That would be the jumping the shark moment. They did need to give him and Braun something to talk about, so maybe it's that.
 
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Excalibur said:
There's a lot of speculation that Shireen is going to be crisped by the end of this season.
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I could see that happening as part of the divergence I expect to occur. No idea as she and her mother are is a minor character in the books.
 
ZooCougar said:
Could be that the purpose of the daughter story and monologue was to show that Stannis is actually a human being that loves what he ought to love. I've always suspected that he was disappointed with his wife's attitude towards her. The doll story was a little gut wrenching. Shows that he feels responsible for it all and that it's something he has been harboring for a while. I thought that was one of the best scenes ever on the show. I'm definitely a Stannis fan now.

So anyone else pretty much convinced that Jon Snow is half Targaryen?
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Yeah its pretty well known. It was probably the most talked about theory among Book readers, and that was with way less actual clues than the show gives. After last night on TV they handed it to you on a platter.
 
August_West said:
Yeah its pretty well known. It was probably the most talked about theory among Book readers, and that was with way less actual clues than the show gives. After last night on TV they handed it to you on a platter.
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Yeah, I never read the books. But as soon as little finger told Sansa that story a million light bulbs went off in my head.

I need to rewatch the episode, I actually fell asleep in the second half, two soccer games, Avengers, 60 miles on the bike and a Billy Joel concert had me beat on Sunday night. I shouldn't even be reading this thread for the spoilers.
 
ZooCougar said:
Yeah, I never read the books. But as soon as little finger told Sansa that story a million light bulbs went off in my head.

I need to rewatch the episode, I actually fell asleep in the second half, two soccer games, Avengers, 60 miles on the bike and a Billy Joel concert had me beat on Sunday night. I shouldn't even be reading this thread for the spoilers.
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Dont misconstrue me, you shouldn't have seen it before or really thought of it before. I was just making the point that when the show did want to finally address it and throw out clues, that they hit you over the head with them in consecutive scenes. So not only did TV viewers get their first aha with that, but the book readers did too, because it was always a much more subdued hint in the books.
 
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Excalibur said:
Between that and Stannis' comment about whoring not being Ned Stark's way . . .
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HBO Stannis is the first instance of anyone ever actually expressing on-screen skepticism at the official story. I've never doubted the John = Targaryean theory. The big question for me is how will John find out. I don't think it's Stannis who can tell him in the books because Stannis was defending Storms' End during the rebellion when John is being borne in Dorne. Figured it'd be the father of the two tagging along with Bran because he was Ned's companion during the war.

Speaking of Bran, have we seen him this season? When's the last sighting? And do we know when this season will end? There is this and one more season based on the existing books, right? I get confused because the last 2 books were contemporaneous to each other.
 
Spartacus said:
HBO Stannis is the first instance of anyone ever actually expressing on-screen skepticism at the official story. I've never doubted the John = Targaryean theory. The big question for me is how will John find out. I don't think it's Stannis who can tell him in the books because Stannis was defending Storms' End during the rebellion when John is being borne in Dorne. Figured it'd be the father of the two tagging along with Bran because he was Ned's companion during the war.

Speaking of Bran, have we seen him this season? When's the last sighting? And do we know when this season will end? There is this and one more season based on the existing books, right? I get confused because the last 2 books were contemporaneous to each other.
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When the New York rags were doing their previews of Season V, they said that Bran's storyline would be left out this season & revisited next season.
 
August_West said:
Dont misconstrue me, you shouldn't have seen it before or really thought of it before. I was just making the point that when the show did want to finally address it and throw out clues, that they hit you over the head with them in consecutive scenes. So not only did TV viewers get their first aha with that, but the book readers did too, because it was always a much more subdued hint in the books.
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It's such a well known theory that it may very well be a McGuffin. Like the Russian guy in the pine barrens or half of Lost. I wouldn't dwell on it as there is equal book text that won't be in the TV show that suggests it isn't true. There is so much still to cover, even if it is true it hasn't been written yet by Martin, so who knows.

As for Bran, I fully expect him to get the Roseanne "Becky" treatment the season after Winds of Winter comes out.
 
SubbaBub said:
It's such a well known theory that it may very well be a McGuffin. Like the Russian guy in the pine barrens or half of Lost. I wouldn't dwell on it as there is equal book text that won't be in the TV show that suggests it isn't true. There is so much still to cover, even if it is true it hasn't been written yet by Martin, so who knows.
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The only thing more certain is that the sun will rise in the east tomorrow.
 
Lets talk about how much the Sand Snakes suck. The story sucks, the acting sucks, just a terrible addition. The chicks sound like they are doing a promo for an upcoming WWE match.

And lets talk about how the greatest Knight of his generation was killed by some stupid harpies? Or how about the Unsullied? The best fighters money can buy taken down by pocket knifes?

How about the faith militant. From no mention or hint to having them rule kings landing in the space of a scene. That could have built for an episode or two.

I liked that episode at first, but on second viewing and after having it marinate in my brain for a couple days, I am a bit more skeptical of the show divergence than many. The first few seasons were so great because of how faithful they were to the books.

So not only may the show end up sucking, but the shows major plot points going forward are spoiling the upcoming books. Yeah, Im having a bad day. :)
 
August_West said:
Lets talk about how much the Sand Snakes suck. The story sucks, the acting sucks, just a terrible addition. The chicks sound like they are doing a promo for an upcoming WWE match.

And lets talk about how the greatest Knight of his generation was killed by some stupid harpies? Or how about the Unsullied? The best fighters money can buy taken down by pocket knifes?

How about the faith militant. From no mention or hint to having them rule kings landing in the space of a scene. That could have built for an episode or two.

I liked that episode at first, but on second viewing and after having it marinate in my brain for a couple days, I am a bit more skeptical of the show divergence than many. The first few seasons were so great because of how faithful they were to the books.

So not only may the show end up sucking, but the shows major plot points going forward are spoiling the upcoming books. Yeah, Im having a bad day. :)
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The book unsullied would have destroyed those harpies.
 
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