OT: Florida State to sue ACC over GOR

[huskymedic]

ACC schools have a new path to more revenue: Just win... in the postseason

Atlantic Coast Conference schools have a new path to more revenue tied to their own postseason success.

apnews.com

-> This is the first sports season under a new model allowing ACC schools to keep more of the money generated by their own postseason success, a departure from decades of equal distributions among full league members. That “success initiative” could mean $20 million to $25 million more for a school in a big year, based primarily on football like everything else in college athletics.

It also could incentivize more investments in those revenue-driving programs, with the aim of generating their own bump to the bottom line alongside winning championships.

“We’re seeing more and more of a movement toward if you generate it, you get it,” North Carolina athletic director Bubba Cunningham said in an interview with The Associated Press. <-

-> The ACC’s model centers around the expanded 12-team College Football Playoff. Teams could earn $4 million for an appearance, another $4 million for reaching the second round, $6 million for the semifinals and $6 million for the title game — a total of $20 million.

Teams also can earn success money by finishing in the top 25 of the CFP rankings and reaching a bowl game. And football money is positioned to climb.

“That grows as we go forward because those other numbers grow, and the CFP dollars grow,” ACC Commissioner Jim Phillips said. <-

 

[traitor71]

Norvell absolutely fleeced them. I'm a Miami Hurricanes fan in football, so my knowledge/hatred of the Nole is profound. FSU has started 0-2 5 times since 1976, and 3 of them are Mike Norvell. And yet, after last season, they extended him with a contract worth roughly 10 Mil a year. His buyout is quite large. He'll be at FSU for the foreseeable future. Keep in mind, FSU had to pony up a large buyout for Jimbo a few years back.

Norvell had a big year at the perfect time. The threat of another program pursuing him allowed him to score big, and I give him credit for that. I'm just surprised that a lot of people were so all in on their team this year. They had a great group of transfers last year, but it was 6th year Jordan Travis who was the reason for that season. They had quite a few escapes last year, and when he went down they were not even close to the team that was winning. And that was before the bowl game they didn't bother to show up for. It's really hard to hit that big in the portal year after year, but I guess people just expected it. They may get things together as the season goes on, but they look really weak so far.

 

[huskymedic]

Squeeze is on: Stadium Advertisements Dominate Over Fan Traditions at FSU

 

[BlueHen]

ACC schools have a new path to more revenue: Just win... in the postseason

Atlantic Coast Conference schools have a new path to more revenue tied to their own postseason success.

apnews.com

-> This is the first sports season under a new model allowing ACC schools to keep more of the money generated by their own postseason success, a departure from decades of equal distributions among full league members. That “success initiative” could mean $20 million to $25 million more for a school in a big year, based primarily on football like everything else in college athletics.

It also could incentivize more investments in those revenue-driving programs, with the aim of generating their own bump to the bottom line alongside winning championships.

“We’re seeing more and more of a movement toward if you generate it, you get it,” North Carolina athletic director Bubba Cunningham said in an interview with The Associated Press. <-

-> The ACC’s model centers around the expanded 12-team College Football Playoff. Teams could earn $4 million for an appearance, another $4 million for reaching the second round, $6 million for the semifinals and $6 million for the title game — a total of $20 million.

Teams also can earn success money by finishing in the top 25 of the CFP rankings and reaching a bowl game. And football money is positioned to climb.

“That grows as we go forward because those other numbers grow, and the CFP dollars grow,” ACC Commissioner Jim Phillips said. <-

I find it amusing that FSU was part of the reason that this new revenue sharing model was adopted, and in the first year of the models existence FSU might earn less money as a result. Awesome.

 

[CL82]

I find it amusing that FSU was part of the reason that this new revenue sharing model was adopted, and in the first year of the models existence FSU might earn less money as a result. Awesome.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I find it amusing that FSU was part of the reason that this new revenue sharing model was adopted, and in the first year of the models existence FSU might earn less money as a result. Awesome.

I love how after the merit based revenue distribution was approived, FSU began complainiing about the value of their football brand and how that was what the revenue distributions should have been based on.

 

[dayooper]

Norvell had a big year at the perfect time. The threat of another program pursuing him allowed him to score big, and I give him credit for that. I'm just surprised that a lot of people were so all in on their team this year. They had a great group of transfers last year, but it was 6th year Jordan Travis who was the reason for that season. They had quite a few escapes last year, and when he went down they were not even close to the team that was winning. And that was before the bowl game they didn't bother to show up for. It's really hard to hit that big in the portal year after year, but I guess people just expected it. They may get things together as the season goes on, but they look really weak so far.

Michigan State was the same in 2021. Mel Tucker had a Heisman candidate he pulled from the portal. Kenneth Walker had a dream season, won the Walter Camp and Doak Walker award and was a unanimous All American. Mel Tucker beat Michigan and was signed to a $100 million contract. The team was not good in ‘22 and ‘23 and was fired with cause in ‘23 for something he should not have been doing over a conference call. They are afraid he would go to a bigger team, so they signed him for 10 years and $100 million.

 

[huskymedic]

Shortcut <<

 

[Husky92]

I find it amusing that FSU was part of the reason that this new revenue sharing model was adopted, and in the first year of the models existence FSU might earn less money as a result. Awesome.

I’m not a fan of unequal revenue sharing, but i can get behind it if it is merit based. This brand based revenue is a crock. That’s just a beauty contest at that point.

 

[Kolumbo]

They'd like us to believe that

"when it comes to the ACC adding SMU, California, and Stanford, ESPN’s messaging is that the conference did it of its own volition. That’s according to Jeramy Michiaels, an ESPN senior director who oversees the ACC Network and manages ESPN’s relationship with the league."

"“We’re very careful to not be part of the expansion discussion,” Michiaels said. “So the conference will come to us and ask us questions that are more about what markets are advantageous, but we’re very, very careful to not be part of talking about specific schools."

ESPN executive says network didn't drive ACC expansion talks

According to an ESPN executive, the ACC's decision to add SMU, California, and Stanford was solely the conference's own initiative.

awfulannouncing.com

 

[huskymedic]

 

[CL82]

The second key point was Maryland’s withdrawal in 2013. There was a 10-2 vote in the conference to increase the withdrawal penalty in 2012 to three times the ACC’s operating budget, opposed by Maryland and Florida State but supported by Clemson. However, all members except Maryland voted to approve litigation against Maryland for the withdrawal fee and accepted payment from it. Therefore, the ACC claims, FSU and Clemson can’t have a problem with the same withdrawal penalty and process now. The withdrawal penalty is now around $140 million. The grant of rights was created after Maryland’s departure.

 

[Zissou]

All members except Maryland voted to approve litigation against Maryland for the withdrawal fee and accepted payment from it. Therefore, the ACC claims, FSU and Clemson can’t have a problem with the same withdrawal penalty and process now. The withdrawal penalty is now around $140 million. The grant of rights was created after Maryland’s departure.

Makes perfect sense.

 

[uconndogs]

Yeah, but they're FSU....like the greatest football program of all time....ever! Hell, they don't even bother ot show up to major bowl games if they feel shunned for the FBS championship.

 

[billybud]

Don't blame the guys...work hard all year.....they go 13-0 and are an undefeated P4 conference champion ....and of course, Bama in Saban's last season could not be locked out...

The FSU starters opted out...13 went to NFL rosters...others transferred.

 

[KryHavok]

Don't blame the guys...work hard all year.....they go 13-0 and are an undefeated P4 conference champion ....and of course, Bama in Saban's last season could not be locked out...

The FSU starters opted out...13 went to NFL rosters...others transferred.

Maybe not blame, but they are rightly criticized. When UCF went undefeated and wasn't invited for the playoffs, they still showed up for their bowl game to prove that yes, even under duress of being looked over, they had the mental and physical toughness to beat their opponent whoever it was (besting a fairly competent Auburn team in the process). If only bowl playoff games have any meaning, then why bother playing all these other bowls? I grew up loving these bowls from mid-December to early Jan, so I'd like to see teams happy to be playing in one. I get not wanting to get injured prior to the draft, but come on, how many of these opt-out players would have been seriously injured to the extent that their lottery number would fall? Totally agree that they got shafted so that King Saban could be given the red carpet.

 

[billybud]

When you see your QB go out with an ACL…why jeopardize earnings of millions of dollars by playing a meaningless game ?

It is a sound business decision for those kids going to the NFL. Since 95 percent of college players do not make the NFL, they can afford to be rah-rah. But half of FSU’ starters (offensive and defensive) have NFL careers.

 

[billybud]

I just read that 39 percent of the 2023 MAC All Conference First Team (that.had a remaining year), transferred to a P4. Why? They thought the rah-rah factor was less important than their personal goals.

 

[uconndogs]

Georgia showed up……….big time!

 

[billybud]

Yep. I still think that the FSU starters made the right business decision by moving on

And it was an ugly game. But like UConn can’t let the ugly Maryland game define them, the Seminoles need to try to build and get on track.

 

[Exit 4]

helpful summation

 

[HuskyHawk]

Read the tweet above that explains why that would be a catastrophic and far reaching expansion of "sovereign immunity".

Yes. I'd add that it would make anyone else reluctant to contract with the state. State wants to buy police cars? Computers? Are those contracts now voidable? We already see appropriation language in multi-year state contracts that says that the following year's legislature could decide not to fund the contract, which is ok if performance is then excused.

FSU isn't going to win this one and the state of Florida shouldn't want it to.

 

[KryHavok]

helpful summation

Maybe I'm misinterpreting this, but this statement "Why would anyone enter a contract with a state entity when it can claim sovereign immunity to undo a deal?" has me thinking if the state believes it can unilaterally back out of deal, aren't they in affect empowering the other party to have the right to also undo the terms of deal? Not like this is valid, but if ESPN says "viewership for ACC games is down, therefore we reduce the contract by x million dollars" as a counterbalance to sovereign immunity. Seems to be an indefensible slippery slope.

 

[Exit 4]

Retired Bob quick to comment. This guy always seems to have sunshine for west coast stuff.

 

[Kolumbo]

Read the tweet above that explains why that would be a catastrophic and far reaching expansion of "sovereign immunity".

I sees that, but the thing is, states aren't commercial enterprises. Florida has over 22 million people who didn't vote for anyone at FSU, the ACC, or espn. Yet they are affected by all of these agreements.

Maybe I'm misinterpreting this, but this statement "Why would anyone enter a contract with a state entity when it can claim sovereign immunity to undo a deal?" has me thinking if the state believes it can unilaterally back out of deal, aren't they in affect empowering the other party to have the right to also undo the terms of deal? Not like this is valid, but if ESPN says "viewership for ACC games is down, therefore we reduce the contract by x million dollars" as a counterbalance to sovereign immunity. Seems to be an indefensible slippery slope.

That's a fair argument. The answer is don't do it if you don't want to do it. The reason they will enter into agreements is profit. Creating a business relationship with a state is a huge money maker but you shouldn't be able to hold the state residents hostage when the terms of the contract become egregiously unfavorable to one side.

You have a contract with a business and if the business starts suffering, you would rather adjust the contract than have the business go bankrupt.

You have a contract with a state and if the state starts suffering you just expect to fleece the state because it can simply raise taxes. In this case it's as if espn wants the ACC to be 2nd tier and there is something very wrong with that tactic.

 

[JohnFSilver]

helpful summation

Where are our lawyers. FSU claiming sovereign immunity? I mean, that’s novel.

 

[CL82]

I sees that, but the thing is, states aren't commercial enterprises. Florida has over 22 million people who didn't vote for anyone at FSU, the ACC, or espn. Yet they are affected by all of these agreements

I'm not sure that this really enters the analysis one way or the other, except perhaps to weeken FSU's claim of sovereign immunity.

For a lot of reasons, which are explained well in that tweet it would be a catastrophic decision. Essentially, it would be giving a get out of jail free card to the state of Florida to leave any contract it doesn't like, even after enjoying its benefits for decades. That change in leverage would make the state of Florida a very unattractive business partner, which, in turn, would cause businesses not to enter contracts with the state, at least without a very, very, significant premium.

But setting all that aside for the moment, the easy decision is for the court to say that by entering into a interstate contract which has incorporated, liquidated damages positions, the state waives any sovereign immunity claim to the extent of those provisions.

Of course, an even easier decision would be to to note that sovereign immunity is a "tort" concept that isn't applicable in a contract action.

 

[Kolumbo]

I'm not sure that this really enters the analysis one way or the other, except perhaps to weeken FSU's claim of sovereign immunity.

"Sovereign immunity, or crown immunity, is a legal doctrine whereby a sovereign or state cannot commit a legal wrong and is immune from civil suit or criminal prosecution, strictly speaking in modern texts in its own courts. State immunity is a similar, stronger doctrine, that applies to foreign courts."

 

[Hamms30]

Where are our lawyers. FSU claiming sovereign immunity? I mean, that’s novel.

Lethal Weapon 2.5

 

[CL82]

"Sovereign immunity, or crown immunity, is a legal doctrine whereby a sovereign or state cannot commit a legal wrong and is immune from civil suit or criminal prosecution, strictly speaking in modern texts in its own courts. State immunity is a similar, stronger doctrine, that applies to foreign courts."

Thank you. I am familiar with the term.

Your quote was that "no one voted for FSU". My comment was that I didn't think that particularly mattered, but if you gave it any credence at all, it would tend to weaken its claim as a sovereign entity, essentially saying it was more of a "quasi private entity."